USC Master of Addiction Science Program?

[childpsych2022]

Hi all - an undergraduate mentee recently expressed interest in applying to a master of addiction science program at USC: Master of Addiction Science - USC Institute for Addiction Science

I expressed concerns to her about this program due to the lack of marketable skills that she would have upon degree completion; while it has a clinical track, it does not seem to qualify for licensure. The $60k+ price tag (not to mention the cost of living in SoCal) is another source of concern. While I mentioned these things to her, the student seems very excited about the opportunity to learn about addiction science. She also stated that she is unsure about whether she wants to pursue a research (e.g., PhD) or clinical (masters in counseling, etc.) career path in the future, and I get the sense that this would be buying her time/hopefully helping her to gain clarity about next steps.

Does anyone know more about this program? Thoughts on alternatives that would not be so financially crippling?

---

Members don't see this ad.

 

[Fan_of_Meehl]

Hi all - an undergraduate mentee recently expressed interest in applying to a master of addiction science program at USC: Master of Addiction Science - USC Institute for Addiction Science

I expressed concerns to her about this program due to the lack of marketable skills that she would have upon degree completion; while it has a clinical track, it does not seem to qualify for licensure. The $60k+ price tag (not to mention the cost of living in SoCal) is another source of concern. While I mentioned these things to her, the student seems very excited about the opportunity to learn about addiction science. She also stated that she is unsure about whether she wants to pursue a research (e.g., PhD) or clinical (masters in counseling, etc.) career path in the future, and I get the sense that this would be buying her time/hopefully helping her to gain clarity about next steps.

Does anyone know more about this program? Thoughts on alternatives that would not be so financially crippling?

My experience/ understanding of compensation for bachelor's or master's level people in the substance abuse field is that the pay is extremely poor and the workload generally high (and the use of 'science' of any sort extremely rare/punished). I mean, if it's a genuine 'calling' then that may be acceptable to this person. But if you want to work with this population in a mental health capacity (or THINK you do), I'd be hard pressed not to recommend pursuit of a different clinical degree (MD, RN, PhD/PsyD, LCSW) that would allow you to work in that subfield of MH (SUDS) but also allow flexibility and pay advantages.

I can't conceive of ANY advantages to a 'master's of science in addiction' above even an LCSW (which would be FAR more compensable, flexible, and associated with licensure...this is if the person want to practice in SUDS). If they are more interested in teaching/research, they should go for a PhD in clinical psychology.

Not sure how much experience you or this mentee has had with the substance use treatment field but...those trained in 'science' don't tend to be very welcomed or valued by the rank and file practitioners and admins at most of these facilities (outside of rare or elite settings like academic medical centers, med schools, grad schools). Just a word to the wise.

 

[childpsych2022]

My experience/ understanding of compensation for bachelor's or master's level people in the substance abuse field is that the pay is extremely poor and the workload generally high (and the use of 'science' of any sort extremely rare/punished). I mean, if it's a genuine 'calling' then that may be acceptable to this person. But if you want to work with this population in a mental health capacity (or THINK you do), I'd be hard pressed not to recommend pursuit of a different clinical degree (MD, RN, PhD/PsyD, LCSW) that would allow you to work in that subfield of MH (SUDS) but also allow flexibility and pay advantages.

I can't conceive of ANY advantages to a 'master's of science in addiction' above even an LCSW (which would be FAR more compensable, flexible, and associated with licensure...this is if the person want to practice in SUDS). If they are more interested in teaching/research, they should go for a PhD in clinical psychology.

Not sure how much experience you or this mentee has had with the substance use treatment field but...those trained in 'science' don't tend to be very welcomed or valued by the rank and file practitioners and admins at most of these facilities (outside of rare or elite settings like academic medical centers, med schools, grad schools). Just a word to the wise.

Thanks for your thoughts. I completely agree with all of your points, and I do have expertise in this area. I think that this student is hoping to gain some "expertise" in understanding the development and treatment of addiction that is a bit deeper than what would be taught in a general MSW program, for example, and at the same time is not ready to commit to pursuing a PhD. Still, I'm skeptical that this path would be worth the 60-100k debt.

 

[Fan_of_Meehl]

Thanks for your thoughts. I completely agree with all of your points, and I do have expertise in this area. I think that this student is hoping to gain some "expertise" in understanding the development and treatment of addiction that is a bit deeper than what would be taught in a general MSW program, for example, and at the same time is not ready to commit to pursuing a PhD. Still, I'm skeptical that this path would be worth the 60-100k debt.

I just perused that program website and I rarely am this forward, lol, but tell the mentee not to do it...it is a BAD idea. If they are truly interested in and motivated to learn the clinical science in the SUDS area I'd recommend pursuit of an MD (psychiatry/ addiction medicine) or PhD/PsyD (clin psych) or, heck, even get an LCSW and max out on quality conferences, CEU/training (in motivational interviewing, CBT, etc) or even invest in high quality texts or hit the empirical literature.

That program lists MD and psychologist as 'outcomes' (careers) of their program which obviously means 'rack up 60-100k debt completing our program and THEN apply to medical or grad school...this would be a ridiculously unwise and foolish career path/decision IMHO.

 

[childpsych2022]

I just perused that program website and I rarely am this forward, lol, but tell the mentee not to do it...it is a BAD idea. If they are truly interested in and motivated to learn the clinical science in the SUDS area I'd recommend pursuit of an MD (psychiatry/ addiction medicine) or PhD/PsyD (clin psych) or, heck, even get an LCSW and max out on quality conferences, CEU/training (in motivational interviewing, CBT, etc) or even invest in high quality texts or hit the empirical literature.

That program lists MD and psychologist as 'outcomes' (careers) of their program which obviously means 'rack up 60-100k debt completing our program and THEN apply to medical or grad school...this would be a ridiculously unwise and foolish career path/decision IMHO.

Thanks so much for validating my concerns/initial impressions of the program. I will definitely have a follow-up conversation with this mentee to reiterate my concerns and recommendation to NOT pursue this program.

 

[summerbabe]

She also stated that she is unsure about whether she wants to pursue a research (e.g., PhD) or clinical (masters in counseling, etc.) career path in the future, and I get the sense that this would be buying her time/hopefully helping her to gain clarity about next steps.

Spending a small fortune to buy time/gain clarity seems like a terrible idea unless they are independently wealthy already (it would still be a bad idea but at least they won't notice the financial hit).

I had no idea what I wanted to do career wise when I finished undergrad so I found myself a fun job that paid terrible but one where I thought I could learn a lot of stuff, grow as a person and work on figuring out the next step.

Maybe your mentee would be open to brainstorming how else they can gain research experience, work experience, and more. I imagine there are plenty of entry level behavioral tech jobs, paid and unpaid research options, and more if they are open to a less structured path.

 

[childpsych2022]

Spending a small fortune to buy time/gain clarity seems like a terrible idea unless they are independently wealthy already (it would still be a bad idea but at least they won't notice the financial hit).

I had no idea what I wanted to do career wise when I finished undergrad so I found myself a fun job that paid terrible but one where I thought I could learn a lot of stuff, grow as a person and work on figuring out the next step.

Maybe your mentee would be open to brainstorming how else they can gain research experience, work experience, and more. I imagine there are plenty of entry level behavioral tech jobs, paid and unpaid research options, and more if they are open to a less structured path.

Totally agree. Thank you!!

 

[Fan_of_Meehl]

Spending a small fortune to buy time/gain clarity seems like a terrible idea unless they are independently wealthy already (it would still be a bad idea but at least they won't notice the financial hit).

I had no idea what I wanted to do career wise when I finished undergrad so I found myself a fun job that paid terrible but one where I thought I could learn a lot of stuff, grow as a person and work on figuring out the next step.

Maybe your mentee would be open to brainstorming how else they can gain research experience, work experience, and more. I imagine there are plenty of entry level behavioral tech jobs, paid and unpaid research options, and more if they are open to a less structured path.

They should DEFINITELY 'test drive' working in SUDS field before committing to that subfield of mental health...it has it's own unique subculture, draws, drawbacks, and challenges.

 

[summerbabe]

They should DEFINITELY 'test drive' working in SUDS field before committing to that subfield of mental health...it has it's own unique subculture, draws, drawbacks, and challenges.

100% agree. And these opportunities should be ample based on my limited experiences in this subfield.

The only option that I would definitely put below USC is developing your own addiction, spending years kicking the habit, and then becoming a peer support/addiction counselor as a way of working your own sobriety.

Whether that’s still less expensive than USC is probably up for debate.