Using GIBill with HPSP...
- Thread starter Mazz
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Under the current G.I. Bill the money will go directly into your account. Under the new G.I. Bill (Post 9/11), the VA will not pay for something that is already paid for (tuition), and the money will not go to you; however you will still be eligible for the book stipend and monthly housing allowance, subject to the rules and regulations that govern those two benefits. Please check with http://www.gibill.va.gov. to verify my statements.
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In my oppinion HPSP can be counted same as loan that you repay with your service, not with money. You still have bill, and nor HPSP, nor Post 9/11 Bill will actually make it go away.
Lets say: Tuition $63,000 (NYU)
1) You do not participate in HPSP. Your bill is 63,000 and you take loan for same amount. Then you fill claim with VA, and Post 9/11 Bill reimburses aprox 10,000 (for New York state). You account has $63,000 from loan and 10,000 overpayment from Post 9/11 bill. School must return overpayment to you. You can reduce your loan by those 10,000 or keep amount for living expenses ending with higher loan at the graduation.
2) You participate in HPSP. Your bill is still $63,000. Now HPSP (instead of private or federal loan) pays this bill in full. You fill the claim with VA and Post 9/11 Bill pays aprox $10,000 (for New York state). So your school gets 63,000 from HPSP and 10,000 from VA. Your account again has 10,000 overpayment, that should go back to your account.
As for VA not paying for something that is already paid (tuition). it's not quite true https://www.gibill2.va.gov/vba/vba....2VhcmNoX3RleHQ9cG9zdC05LzEx&p_li=&p_topview=1:
Q: Do I get the full Post-9/11 GI Bill benefit I am eligible for if my state already has a free tuition and fees/books program?
A:The VA cannot pay for something that isn't charged, however the individual is still eligible for the books stipend and monthly housing allowance, subject to the rules and regulations that govern those two benefits.
As I understand, VA will not pay for something that is not on the bill, but with HPSP you still have full bill, that is paid by military not by private/federal loans. But still tuition bill is there, school is not free, and you still need to repay this bill (with your service)
P.S. I wish my idea is true, but most likely it is not...
I went to the GI Bill website and officially asked the question for the FAQ page. They should get back to be next week with an official answer.
Here is the crap answer they gave me. Im not even sure they know what HPSP is.
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You mentioned that the HPSP is military funded and that it has to be repaid through service to the military. Generally, if a student receives federal money for school through the military and is eligible for the GI Bill, this is considered double dipping into federal funds and the student is not allowed to receive both benefits at the same time.
The Department of Veterans Affairs cannot determine eligibility over the telephone or Internet. You must submit an application for the Department of Veterans Affairs to determine eligibility for an education benefit. However, the Department of Veterans Affairs is currently NOT accepting applications for the Post-9/11 GI Bill. You should check the GI Bill website regularly to get the most up-to-date information about the program and to determine when VA will begin accepting Post-9/11 GI Bill applications. You will be able to submit an application online or by mail.
If your active duty service falls under one of the following, it may not count towards eligibility for the Post-9/11 GI Bill. The following are types of active duty that do NOT count towards qualifying active duty for the Post-9/11 GI Bill.
- Public Health Service (PHS), National Oceanic and Atmospheric Administration (NOAA) service
- Active Guard Reserve (AGR) under Title 32 USC orders
-Any period during which the individual
- Was assigned full-time to a civilian institution to pursue a program of education;
- Served as a cadet or midshipmen at one of the service academies;
- Served under 10 USC 12103(d) pursuant to an enlistment in one of the Reserve components
(ARNG, ANG, AR, NR, AFR, MCR, or CGR).
- A period of service:
- ROTC under 10 USC 2107(b);
- ROTC under 10 USC 4348, 6959, or 9348;
- Terminated because individual considered a minor by the Armed Forces, was erroneously enlisted, or received a defective enlistment;
- Counted for Loan Repayment Plan.
- A period of Selected Reserve service used to establish eligibility under Chapter 30, Chapter 1606, or Chapter 1607.
Please remember that Post-9/11 GI Bill information is preliminary and is subject to change.
Thank you for contacting the Department of Veterans Affairs.
Muskogee RPO
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I wrote them back telling them that answer was inadequate.
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You mentioned that the HPSP is military funded and that it has to be repaid through service to the military. Generally, if a student receives federal money for school through the military and is eligible for the GI Bill, this is considered double dipping into federal funds and the student is not allowed to receive both benefits at the same time.
The Department of Veterans Affairs cannot determine eligibility over the telephone or Internet. You must submit an application for the Department of Veterans Affairs to determine eligibility for an education benefit. However, the Department of Veterans Affairs is currently NOT accepting applications for the Post-9/11 GI Bill. You should check the GI Bill website regularly to get the most up-to-date information about the program and to determine when VA will begin accepting Post-9/11 GI Bill applications. You will be able to submit an application online or by mail.
If your active duty service falls under one of the following, it may not count towards eligibility for the Post-9/11 GI Bill. The following are types of active duty that do NOT count towards qualifying active duty for the Post-9/11 GI Bill.
- Public Health Service (PHS), National Oceanic and Atmospheric Administration (NOAA) service
- Active Guard Reserve (AGR) under Title 32 USC orders
-Any period during which the individual
- Was assigned full-time to a civilian institution to pursue a program of education;
- Served as a cadet or midshipmen at one of the service academies;
- Served under 10 USC 12103(d) pursuant to an enlistment in one of the Reserve components
(ARNG, ANG, AR, NR, AFR, MCR, or CGR).
- A period of service:
- ROTC under 10 USC 2107(b);
- ROTC under 10 USC 4348, 6959, or 9348;
- Terminated because individual considered a minor by the Armed Forces, was erroneously enlisted, or received a defective enlistment;
- Counted for Loan Repayment Plan.
- A period of Selected Reserve service used to establish eligibility under Chapter 30, Chapter 1606, or Chapter 1607.
Please remember that Post-9/11 GI Bill information is preliminary and is subject to change.
Thank you for contacting the Department of Veterans Affairs.
Muskogee RPO
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I wrote them back telling them that answer was inadequate.
This is the final answer from the VA. notice the highlighted portion.
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The policies for the Post-9/11 GI Bill have not been finalized. Currently, information about how a HPSP scholarship will specifically affect the Post-9/11 GI Bill benefits has not been released.The most current information that is available regarding the Post-9/11 GI Bill is on the GI Bill website, www.gibill.va.gov.
If you are eligible for the Post-9/11 GI Bill and if the HPSP scholarship does not affect Post-9/11 GI Bill benefits, you may be entitled to a percentage of the cost of tuition and fees, not to exceed the most expensive in-state undergraduate tuition at a public institution of higher education (payable to the school).
Please continue to check the GI Bill website for Post-9/11 GI Bill information as it becomes available.
The Department of Veteran Affairs cannot validate information found on websites other than www.gibill.va.gov.
Please remember that Post-9/11 GI Bill information is preliminary and is subject to change.
Thank you for contacting the Department of Veterans Affairs.
Muskogee RPO
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What do you think?
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The policies for the Post-9/11 GI Bill have not been finalized. Currently, information about how a HPSP scholarship will specifically affect the Post-9/11 GI Bill benefits has not been released.The most current information that is available regarding the Post-9/11 GI Bill is on the GI Bill website, www.gibill.va.gov.
If you are eligible for the Post-9/11 GI Bill and if the HPSP scholarship does not affect Post-9/11 GI Bill benefits, you may be entitled to a percentage of the cost of tuition and fees, not to exceed the most expensive in-state undergraduate tuition at a public institution of higher education (payable to the school).
Please continue to check the GI Bill website for Post-9/11 GI Bill information as it becomes available.
The Department of Veteran Affairs cannot validate information found on websites other than www.gibill.va.gov.
Please remember that Post-9/11 GI Bill information is preliminary and is subject to change.
Thank you for contacting the Department of Veterans Affairs.
Muskogee RPO
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What do you think?
Doesn't the HPSP scholarship pay tuition directly to the school?
If the post 9-11 GI Bill also pays directly to the school, then what would be the point of having tuition paid twice?
I would doubt that the school would refund you the difference.
If the post 9-11 GI Bill also pays directly to the school, then what would be the point of having tuition paid twice?
I would doubt that the school would refund you the difference.
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School has to refund the difference. Not sure about HPSP and GI Bill, but when you take loans, and you get more then your bill is, school keeps the amount to cover your bill and the rest goes back to student. Don't think there should be any different approach to HPSP and GI Bill money.
No they don't. That makes ZERO sense. The 10,000 grand gets paid, then the Military reimburses you the remaining 53,000. It's essentially getting paid either way. Your better bet is to save the HPSP for 15 years from the time you get out, and use it on one of your kids.
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What about if I get money from HPSP first? What about if I wait while miltary pays the bill before submitting request for Post 9/11 bill? School is not free, tuition still applies, just it was paid by other source?
Lets say I take loan and pay my bill. Then after I submit request for Post 9/11 bill, I should get part of my tuitionreimbursed and overpayment should go back to me (I can choose to repay part of loan or spend on living expenses)? So what is the difference between HPSP (money that I have to repay with service) and regular loan (money I have repay with money)?
Another thing about HPSP: it says when school submits bill, it must include any prepayments student made (like security deposit, loans from other sources). For example my school starts June 1st, and I dont expect to get papers signed before August 1st or even October 1st (if FY limits apply). So I will have to take loans and military later will pay school full bill, and overpaymet will go back to me (to repay loan or use for living expenses)
As it stands right now with GI bill: HPSP does not affect GI bill. Money comes from different sources: DOD and VA, and not form the same pocket.
Of course rules can be changed any time
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You're not even technically active-duty while on the HPSP. So I still fail to see how you would get GI BIll entitlements while on the HPSP. But even if you were, the HPSP REIMBURSES your bills. So after the school sorts out it's payments via the military, you're still going to get the same bills paid the same way, just now you've lost your GI BIll priviledges for a later time. Take the HPSP now, and save up your GI Bill for a later time, it's good for 15 years after you're done, I'm sure you'll have a kid going to college in 15 years + 4-5 years payback + 3-4 years of dental school. That's 22-24 years down the road.
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I think we misunderstood each other: I was talking about people who are eligible for GI bill based on prior service. For example I have 4.5 years of service as enlisted, and now will be going to dental school. I applied for HPSP and same time I am eligible for GI bill (based on prior service). HPSP instruction allows use HPSP and GI bill simultaneously. And the problem that arises here is: if HPSP pays full tuition and GI bill (Post 9/11) pays part of it, is there a loop-hole that allows to get free tuition from HPSP and extra money from Post 9/11 Bill?
You can only get GI Bill based on service, not being in HPSP program. So if you don't have GI bill prior going to school, you cannot use HPSP and GI Bill same time.
Aye, prior service here as well. 6 years in the Navy.
Thanks to everyone who has taken the time to write about their experiences on this topic, it has been very informative. Mazz and kalvydas, it sounds like you guys are in a similar situation to me. I've been in the AF, enlisted, for 11 years. I'll be applying to med and dental schools this summer.
I have also asked the VA, through their Q&A process, about this issue. I've attached my exchange with them as a word doc (it's a little long) if you care to read it. When I asked for their regulations so I could look up the info for myself, they said (after trying to BS me a little) there weren't any, and that more info would be available on 1 May. This basically tells me that anything you get from the VA until then is worthless.
My years in the AF have taught me that if you want the job done right, you sometimes have to do it yourself, and I think that this will be the case with finding a "loophole" to "double dip". I put those in quotes because, as mentioned above, neither of these programs is given out of the grace of Uncle Sam, but must be repaid before (GI Bill) or after (HPSP) they are used. I feel fully entitled to both of these benifits, and if I can't use both at the same time, when I need them, I'm the one being cheated. I'll wait till the regs come out (still researching the "congressional review" the VA cited), put together a well reasoned case with references, and teach the VA reps how to do their job.
As far as saving the GI Bill for my kids, I'd much rather use the extra cash while I'm struggling to FEED my family (wife and 2 kids) on the HPSP stipend while in school. I'm sure in 12 years when my kids are about to start college I'll be able to scrape up enough as an AF Major for them to get through school.
I have also asked the VA, through their Q&A process, about this issue. I've attached my exchange with them as a word doc (it's a little long) if you care to read it. When I asked for their regulations so I could look up the info for myself, they said (after trying to BS me a little) there weren't any, and that more info would be available on 1 May. This basically tells me that anything you get from the VA until then is worthless.
My years in the AF have taught me that if you want the job done right, you sometimes have to do it yourself, and I think that this will be the case with finding a "loophole" to "double dip". I put those in quotes because, as mentioned above, neither of these programs is given out of the grace of Uncle Sam, but must be repaid before (GI Bill) or after (HPSP) they are used. I feel fully entitled to both of these benifits, and if I can't use both at the same time, when I need them, I'm the one being cheated. I'll wait till the regs come out (still researching the "congressional review" the VA cited), put together a well reasoned case with references, and teach the VA reps how to do their job.
As far as saving the GI Bill for my kids, I'd much rather use the extra cash while I'm struggling to FEED my family (wife and 2 kids) on the HPSP stipend while in school. I'm sure in 12 years when my kids are about to start college I'll be able to scrape up enough as an AF Major for them to get through school.
They need to get somebody semi knowledgeable to answer these questions. The people answering our questions are just spouting gibberish or predetermined responses.
N
NAVY DDS 2010
Not to be a jerk, but why don't you go to the source (call them) or call your local finacial aid office instead of asking here where NO ONE has benefited from the new GI Bill program yet since it doesn't go into effect until later this year. Why don't you call the VA and get the word from them and report back to us? Everything mentioned here regarding the new program is only done so by word of mouth and not through actual experience. Based on what people have said in other threads here, they are getting different info from the VA regarding the program. Until the program takes effect, I really don't believe you can really trust what anyone here says since you cannot get a straight answer from the VA themselves. Why would you think otherwise in this situation?
That's just the point, Navy. Those of us who have contacted the VA regarding this have not had our questions answered. It's not for lack of trying, the information just isn't there yet. I wasn't really looking for information, just venting to other people with the same problem!
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Mazz, et al.
Have you guys heard anything new yet? I'm in the same boat; 10 years commissioned navy and entering my second year of HPSP. I'm working on the application for the GI bill, but I'm hoping I'm not wasting my time.
Thanks,
Have you guys heard anything new yet? I'm in the same boat; 10 years commissioned navy and entering my second year of HPSP. I'm working on the application for the GI bill, but I'm hoping I'm not wasting my time.
Thanks,
Nothing definitive. The guys answering questions over at the VA dont have a clue.
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The number to call is: 1-888-442-4551...I spoke with them today on other issues not pertaining to these..
Also...keep in mind that you have to be on active duty on August 1st to utilize these benefits...if you served before and got out, you cannot use them if you are not on active duty now..
So...if you served...got the HPSP...and are now in school...you can't use it..
Also...keep in mind that you have to be on active duty on August 1st to utilize these benefits...if you served before and got out, you cannot use them if you are not on active duty now..
So...if you served...got the HPSP...and are now in school...you can't use it..
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it is not correct: eligibility for Post 9/11 states: "The Post-9/11 GI Bill is for individuals with at least 90 days of aggregate service on or after September 11, 2001, or individuals discharged with a service-connected disability after 30 days. You must have received an honorable discharge to be eligible for the Post-9/11 GI Bill. The Post-9/11 GI Bill will become effective for training on or after August 1, 2009."
you need to have at least 90 days after September 11, 2001. As for August 1, 2009 - Post 9/11 bill will pay only for school after this date, so if you started school before this day, you will not get reimbursed (back dated), but you can claim tuition and fees that is charged after August 1, 2009
Sorry...you are right...that is only for people wanting to pass the benefits to their children or spouse...those people must still be on Active Duty on August 1st..
