USMLE or COMLEX?

[Ki-100]

Hi I am a second year DO and wondering if i target FM and IM residency in Michigan, do i take USMLE and COMLEX or just COMLEX? Thank you.

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[JimBone905]

Always take usmle if you can

 

[Ki-100]

Always take usmle if you can

But if only FM in MI USMLE is not needed right?

 

[JimBone905]

But if only FM in MI USMLE is not need it right?

If you do not take usmle you will close doors for yourself, including IM/FM programs. No its not necessary to take step for them, but you will limit yourself.

 

[DrStephenStrange]

But if only FM in MI USMLE is not need it right?

No one can tell you that. The only thing we can tell you is to make yourself as competitive as you can, so you can have the choice when the time comes. Residency application is only getting more competitive with the steady increase in graduates every year. And USMLE makes you more competitive period.

 

[ReaDoc]

I'm starting to get the sense that programs will initially sort out on the basis of whether or not we've taken the USMLE or just COMLEX in the app cycles after step 1/comlex 1 p/f change. But this is only what I gather from conversations with people in and around academic IM so YMMV. It's the biggest reason I'm still grinding Anking and focusing on boards

But I'm also just an M2 so take this with a grain of salt lol

 

[PapaGuava]

Don't limit yourself. If you feel strong enough to take both, you most certainly should do it.

 

[scoopdaboop]

def take both step 1 and step 2. Step 2 is a requirement anyways for a lot of programs to take to be considered for interviews.

 

[AlteredScale]

Hi I am a second year DO and wondering if i target FM and IM residency in Michigan, do i take USMLE and COMLEX or just COMLEX? Thank you.

Take both.

 

[TragicalDrFaust]

I’m only an OMS-2 but our academic dean has been discouraging us from taking USMLE. It will be pass/fail for my year. Their rationale is that passing won’t make us look better (seems like that’s up for debate here) but failing will make us look bad. I’m curious to hear a counter point to this argument. Note I’m not at a new school and our COMLEX pass rates are high.

 

[scoopdaboop]

I’m only an OMS-2 but our academic dean has been discouraging us from taking USMLE. It will be pass/fail for my year. Their rationale is that passing won’t make us look better (seems like that’s up for debate here) but failing will make us look bad. I’m curious to hear a counter point to this argument. Note I’m not at a new school and our COMLEX pass rates are high.

Passing is simple, you can take 4 weeks dedicated and pass.

 

[futuredoc90138]

Take both.

i know that having any usmle is better than having none but my question is regarding the filters. do you think ill still be filtered out without a step 1 but i will a step 2 score. im an oms-3 for reference and i didnt do enough of my own research when i was a 2nd year.

 

[AlteredScale]

i know that having any usmle is better than having none but my question is regarding the filters. do you think ill still be filtered out without a step 1 but i will a step 2 score. im an oms-3 for reference and i didnt do enough of my own research when i was a 2nd year.

Very hard to say as programs are not completely explicit regarding "we want step 1 but if you don't have it step 2 will be enough". Likely, yes there will be programs that will screen you out without a step 1 score but having the step 2 may keep you in the running for other programs. Best thing to do is just email the programs you are planning to apply to.

 

[DOVinciRobot]

I’m only an OMS-2 but our academic dean has been discouraging us from taking USMLE. It will be pass/fail for my year. Their rationale is that passing won’t make us look better (seems like that’s up for debate here) but failing will make us look bad. I’m curious to hear a counter point to this argument. Note I’m not at a new school and our COMLEX pass rates are high.

Not having a P on Step 1 is an extremely easy and convenient screening tool. You WILL miss out on some interviews if you don’t have a P on Step 1.

Rule #1 of DO school is to ignore all advice that the school gives you.

 

[KirksvilleKrunk]

USMLE is a different beast than Comlex and I wouldn't go into Step 2 without having taken Step 1 to at least see what you're in for

 

[TragicalDrFaust]

Not having a P on Step 1 is an extremely easy and convenient screening tool. You WILL miss out on some interviews if you don’t have a P on Step 1.

Rule #1 of DO school is to ignore all advice that the school gives you.

Tracks as far as "studying for class is the same as studying for boards" and being given an 85-hour/week study plan for first year by our academic success office. But what's the motivation behind giving us bad advice?

 

[JimBone905]

Tracks as far as "studying for class is the same as studying for boards" and being given an 85-hour/week study plan for first year by our academic success office. But what's the motivation behind giving us bad advice?

Keep us in Rural FM d/t bad board scores

 

[ReaDoc]

Tracks as far as "studying for class is the same as studying for boards" and being given an 85-hour/week study plan for first year by our academic success office. But what's the motivation behind giving us bad advice?

I get the feeling that many of the admin and profs telling DO students this stuff comes from the age old "well that's how we did it back in my day!"

I remember an attending looking at me like I was crazy when I told him I was doing flashcards (explaining what Anki was) and that I started them my second semester of M1 and he says "oh that's insane! You only really need 2 months of actual studying for boards!"

Like maybe back when you were my age that was acceptable but medical education is a completely different beast now

 

[DOVinciRobot]

I get the feeling that many of the admin and profs telling DO students this stuff comes from the age old "well that's how we did it back in my day!"

I remember an attending looking at me like I was crazy when I told him I was doing flashcards (explaining what Anki was) and that I started them my second semester of M1 and he says "oh that's insane! You only really need 2 months of actual studying for boards!"

Like maybe back when you were my age that was acceptable but medical education is a completely different beast now

This. You'll get the same issues when it comes to applying to residency. "I only applied to 7 residencies and got 5 interviews. I signed the contract for my residency at the interview at my top pick. You don't need to apply to 60 programs, that's insane!" and all sorts of other gems. They are simply out of touch with how things work now.

I do also give credence to the idea that DO schools intentionally shunt people into primary care by some of the terrible advice they give.

 

[futuredoc90138]

Very hard to say as programs are not completely explicit regarding "we want step 1 but if you don't have it step 2 will be enough". Likely, yes there will be programs that will screen you out without a step 1 score but having the step 2 may keep you in the running for other programs. Best thing to do is just email the programs you are planning to apply to.

thank you, i will definitely do that then!

 

[drducky.]

I’m only an OMS-2 but our academic dean has been discouraging us from taking USMLE. It will be pass/fail for my year. Their rationale is that passing won’t make us look better (seems like that’s up for debate here) but failing will make us look bad. I’m curious to hear a counter point to this argument. Note I’m not at a new school and our COMLEX pass rates are high.

Their JOB is to have a high comlex pass rate. Weaker students that divert their attention to step will have a real chance of failing comlex, which makes them and the school look bad. They don’t care if you don’t match at your dream specialty or close to your family as long as the match rate and comlex pass rate is high.

 

[genessis42]

Their JOB is to have a high comlex pass rate. Weaker students that divert their attention to step will have a real chance of failing comlex, which makes them and the school look bad. They don’t care if you don’t match at your dream specialty or close to your family as long as the match rate and comlex pass rate is high.

I'm not sure if studying for step is really diverting attention though. Their questions still help for level 1. Even the folks who only took 1 test in my class did uworld/amboss as opposed to the comlex-specific banks.

 

[JimBone905]

I'm not sure if studying for step is really diverting attention though. Their questions still help for level 1. Even the folks who only took 1 test in my class did uworld/amboss as opposed to the comlex-specific banks.

Did better on comlex than most people in my class and I took step1 and only used uworld lol

 

[genessis42]

I just wish the nbome would at least offer better resources. There aren't too many comlex-specific things unless if you buy Comquest. I remember even the comsae practice tests were expensive, and you couldn't even see your wrong answers. My classmates only took one if the school provided it

 

[JW4Gdud]

I am OMS4. You should take both USMLE steps 1 & 2 and COMLEX levels 1 & 2. Most programs require USMLE steps 1 & 2 and some do not even accept COMLEX. You really limit your application and interview chances with only COMLEX. You should see a lot of posts here about applying broadly, but you cannot apply broadly if you only take COMLEX. COMLEX is a requirement for DO graduation.

 

[Ho0v-man]

I’ve seen a few classmates go comlex-only because they wanted something less competitive. Really sucked when they got to the end of third realizing they wanted something else but didn’t have the time to study for it.

Always take step unless you think you’ll fail.

 

[drducky.]

I’ve seen a few classmates go comlex-only because they wanted something less competitive. Really sucked when they got to the end of third realizing they wanted something else but didn’t have the time to study for it.

Always take step unless you think you’ll fail.

Even if you 100% decide on something non competitive like fm, it’s still better to have options on where you train instead of the middle of nowhere in a malignant program that works their residents to death.

 

[FutureDoctor5000]

Even if you 100% decide on something non competitive like fm, it’s still better to have options on where you train instead of the middle of nowhere in a malignant program that works their residents to death.

Nahhhh in FM good programs all take DO students without step all the time, same for PMR, same for low tier university IM.. outside of that though yea a step score is required to match somewhere decent.

 

[genessis42]

Some DO students will probably start writing Step 2 CK since you can take it without Step 1. But I wonder how long they will allow us to take it like that.

I also get the impression that we should not listen to everything our med school advises us. Same could be said for MD schools, but the advising seems to be worst in DO schools

 

[cloud_wolfbane]

Honestly if you want to do FM or IM why would your take Step? It seems so stupid to me. Like why put yourself through extra studying, and extra $600, and another 8 hour test for no reason? Unless you want to go to a big academic center that’s particularly DO unfriendly, I really don’t understand why people on here push it so much. I’m applying family med, Comlex scores only and I’m perfectly happy with the amount of interviews I’ve got so far, including all my top picks. If you want to do something competitive yes, okay, I get taking it, but family med, why?!

 

[drducky.]

I can't believe the advice here. If you're 100000% sure you want FM in a place like Michigan then you just need a pulse and pass COMLEX by your third try. If you want community IM try to pass comlex by the second try and 400-450 will be fine. Even at the great MSUCOM only about 55% of the class takes USMLE. COMLEX in the midwest/south will suffice for IM/FM/PM&R/PSYCH and even some surg programs. Heck, I know several people with 470-550 comlex only who matched rads and gas, no research or anything amazing on their app.

Ahhh the “i know people” that did x argument. If you know someone that won the lottery, should you sell your house to but lottery tickets. If someone had a 20% chance to match rads/gas with only comlex, should we all just take a 20% gamble too?