Value of "audition" rotations?

[k's mom]

Ok, I tried this question a while back, but didn't get any takers. For those of you currently in residency/in practice, how many of you actually matched at a program where you did an "audition" rotation? My husband and I are pondering his MS4 schedule, and he wants to do at least two out-of-state rotations. Most of our friends have families, and last year I watched many of them make serious financial and family sacrifices to make these "audition" rotations happen. Out of six students, NONE of them matched where they did these rotations. I certainly don't mind my husband doing away rotations, and I understand the value of getting a feel for how different institutions do things, and a variety of + rec.'s, but I want to be realistic...plus there are some great places, such as Mayo-Scottsdale that have very interesting rotations, but not in EM. Advice?

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[dlung]

I won't know until March how it worked out for me, but I can say that my away rotations got me interviews at programs where my application would have otherwise gotten thrown out with the first batch. Also, having regional letters of rec are supposed to help if you're looking to try places remote from where you're at. Good luck.

 

[margaritaboy]

I've said this before, and I'll remind everyone who reads this that it is strictly my opinion, but I think an away rotation is really more for an applicant to 'interview' a program and location so much as the other way around.

True, if you land an away rotation somewhere competitive you might land an interview you might not have otherwise earned, but at significant expense of time and money. What will open the interview doors more than away rotations or thank you letters etc. is the holy EM residency application triad: Good grades, Good USMLE, Good letters of rec.

On the other hand, if the applicant is himself/herself interested in locations or programs and wants to check them out for his/her own benefit then I think they are great. You can get a flavor of the residents, attendings, institution, and most importantly the city. If you are an average candidate that really shines on the rotation, then you may be helped.

I think there is a significant amount of pressure to do audition rotations for people interested in EM, as if it is the norm and you will be hurting yourself if you don't pursue it. However, I did zero audition rotations for some of the financial and logistical reasons that the OP listed and received interview invitations from 23/24 programs, and ultimately matched #1 in a region far away from my home medical school.

There is hope for all the slackers out there....

In summary, if you do it, then do it for yourself to get a feel for the area/program.

 

[margaritaboy]

...plus there are some great places, such as Mayo-Scottsdale that have very interesting rotations, but not in EM. Advice?

Oh. If you were interested in the Scottsdale area, you could try St. Joe's Hospital, Desert Good Samaritan, Phoenix Children's Hospital, or Maricopa Medical Center for rotations (I think only MMC and PCH have EM & Peds EM rotations?). Those hospitals are about 10 minutes from my house, which is about 12 minutes from Scottsdale. It's a small world out here....

 

[beyond all hope]

Audition rotations don't always help you.

One of my away rotations at Jacobi I got a great experience and a kick-butt LOR that many PDs mentioned expressly when inviting me for the interview.

However, I went to an audition rotation at a certain program that I was gunning for and I liked everyone EXCEPT the woman who ran the student rotation. She was a real b*tch and didn't make it a secret that she didn't like me. I ended up getting a High Pass in the rotation (kiss of death), got an interview but didn't match.

Probably I'm getting a better education where I'm at, but I'm still a little sore about that experience.

 

[jazz]

Ok, I tried this question a while back, but didn't get any takers. For those of you currently in residency/in practice, how many of you actually matched at a program where you did an "audition" rotation? My husband and I are pondering his MS4 schedule, and he wants to do at least two out-of-state rotations. Most of our friends have families, and last year I watched many of them make serious financial and family sacrifices to make these "audition" rotations happen. Out of six students, NONE of them matched where they did these rotations. I certainly don't mind my husband doing away rotations, and I understand the value of getting a feel for how different institutions do things, and a variety of + rec.'s, but I want to be realistic...plus there are some great places, such as Mayo-Scottsdale that have very interesting rotations, but not in EM. Advice?

i know this seems like an obvious question, but are you sure that the six students who had outside rotations ranked that particular one first?

i did an away rotation. i'm not sure if it was an audition rotation. i had interests in going there but did not rank it first in the end. really, i needed another letter and thought that seeing a program i might be interested in was good. also, i did my away rotation in a different part of the country and thought it might help with regional offers for interviews. in the end, i liked one of the places i interviewed at much better.

the reason for the away letter, is because ER is different than other fields. You may do an entire block and work with each attending only one or two times. a lot of times your letter is a CORD letter and thus is compiled. i needed a second letter from a second institution.

if the six people you are refering too all ranked their audition rotation number one, then it seems that it may not have helped too much. plus, i know this sounds crazy, but when you do an audition rotation you meet all the residents and attendings. one of those individuals may find some little quirk of yours really irritating, unprofessional, etc and thus may be a negative against you. however, if you had just applied with your good letters, grades, and scores, then you might have matched more successfully. when you are "auditioning" you really have to be careful -- little comments can be blown out of proportion -- never look uninterested, never decline procedures, don't tell them somewhere else is your number one, don't be late (even one minute for a shift) etc.... it seems obvious but can really work against you.

 

[Jeff698]

For me, the real value of the away rotation (I did two, my home school is program-less) was to help with the county vs community program decision. I rotated at one of each and it really, really helped solidify that distinction in my head.

For what it's worth, I got interviews at both rotations. I'll see in March if it helped me match there or not.

Take care,
Jeff

 

[dlung]

My thinking is, if you have compelling reasons to get into a particular program that also happens to be very competitive, might as well go b***s out for it... that's why I did my away rotations. I don't expect to match there, but I won't have any regrets either.

 

[k's mom]

Oh. If you were interested in the Scottsdale area, you could try St. Joe's Hospital, Desert Good Samaritan, Phoenix Children's Hospital, or Maricopa Medical Center for rotations (I think only MMC and PCH have EM & Peds EM rotations?). Those hospitals are about 10 minutes from my house, which is about 12 minutes from Scottsdale. It's a small world out here....

Thanks. I'm actually sitting in Scottsdale right now in my mother's living room...we know (and love) the area!