Vitamin D

[lobelsteve]

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How an increasingly popular supplement landed a man in the hospital | CNN

A private nutritionist told a British man to take large doses of vitamin D along with other supplements. It didn't go well.

www.cnn.com

vs

Daily oral dosing of vitamin D3 using 5000 TO 50,000 international units a day in long-term hospitalized patients: Insights from a seven year experience - PubMed

Vitamin D3 is a secosteroid hormone produced in the skin in amounts estimated up to 25,000 international units (IUs) a day by the action of UVB radiation on 7-dehydrocholesterol. Vitamin D deficiency is common due to both lack of adequate sun exposure to the skin, and because vitamin D is...

pubmed.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov

I take 5000u per day and recommend my patients do the same.

Thoughts?

 

[hyperalgesia]

I guess everyone is supposed to use sunblock and/or work indoors all day. It makes sense to supplement vit D.

I didn't realize they made a gummy version - makes all the difference 🙂

 

[RoloTomassi]

I take a 50k once a month or so

 

[clubdeac]

I took 5000 IU/day during the winter and spring but switched to 2000 IU after reading several papers which argued that 5000 IU may be too much and could possibly be detrimental

 

[MitchLevi]

4000 QD for me.

 

[Ducttape]

much better to get out and work in yard or walk outdoors a couple of times a week.

however, where i live, not really an option 8 months out of the year.


i take 2000 IU a day in my multivit gummy.

 

[Pain Applicant1]

Something strange to me in isolating vitamins. I know Vit D is the big thing these days but wasn't it Vit E yesterday until it was thought to do more harm than good.

I say try to get it from food or the sun but I'm personally staying away from vitamins.

 

[pastafan]

5000 daily. I was surprised that my calcium and Vitamin D levels were low despite what I would have thought to be adequate sun exposure. Tried 2000 U daily but it didn't do the trick. I have always been anti-vitamin prior to this but now I know this needs to be tested more routinely.

 

[epidural man]

How an increasingly popular supplement landed a man in the hospital | CNN

A private nutritionist told a British man to take large doses of vitamin D along with other supplements. It didn't go well.

www.cnn.com

vs

Daily oral dosing of vitamin D3 using 5000 TO 50,000 international units a day in long-term hospitalized patients: Insights from a seven year experience - PubMed

Vitamin D3 is a secosteroid hormone produced in the skin in amounts estimated up to 25,000 international units (IUs) a day by the action of UVB radiation on 7-dehydrocholesterol. Vitamin D deficiency is common due to both lack of adequate sun exposure to the skin, and because vitamin D is...

pubmed.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov

I take 5000u per day and recommend my patients do the same.

Thoughts?

I take a VIT D a day (when I remember) - I should probably look at the bottle and figure out how much it is.

What is very surprising to me is how many people are Vit D deficient.

 

[pastafan]

I was having non-radicular back pain. Couldn’t figure out what was causing it. Provocative hip maneuvers etc. no help. Really driving me crazy. Fixed Vit D level pain disappeared.

 

[drusso]

How an increasingly popular supplement landed a man in the hospital | CNN

A private nutritionist told a British man to take large doses of vitamin D along with other supplements. It didn't go well.

www.cnn.com

vs

Daily oral dosing of vitamin D3 using 5000 TO 50,000 international units a day in long-term hospitalized patients: Insights from a seven year experience - PubMed

Vitamin D3 is a secosteroid hormone produced in the skin in amounts estimated up to 25,000 international units (IUs) a day by the action of UVB radiation on 7-dehydrocholesterol. Vitamin D deficiency is common due to both lack of adequate sun exposure to the skin, and because vitamin D is...

pubmed.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov

I take 5000u per day and recommend my patients do the same.

Thoughts?

In the PNW everyone is deficient. The naturopaths dunk people in it.

 

[KateFan]

Vitamin D requires Gut-microbiome activation to work

Supplementing Vitamin D with butyrate ensures that we get all the benefits of Vitamin D to promote a sound mind and body while maintaining a favourable gut microbiome to support our immunity and overall well-being.

redoxbox.com

 

[hyperalgesia]

LifeProTip: Gummy vitamins should be picked up from the store and NOT shipped to your mailbox.

Unless you want to eat one 300,000 IU Vit D gummy.

 

[macman]

5000 qd in the winter, qod summer

 

[Pain Applicant1]

Something strange to me in isolating vitamins. I know Vit D is the big thing these days but wasn't it Vit E yesterday until it was thought to do more harm than good.

I say try to get it from food or the sun but I'm personally staying away from vitamins.

Looks like I've been vindicated. I don't think vitamins will ever live up to the marketing hype.

I question this guy from the article:

"Dr. Sundeep Khosla, a professor of medicine and physiology at the Mayo Clinic, said that since vitamin D 'will do little or no harm and may have benefits,' he would continue to advise his patients with osteoporosis to take it,"
_________

My prediction for the future is that vitamin d supplementation, the fat soluble hormone, will be shown to do more harm than good in the upcoming years. Stay tuned.

Study Finds Another Condition That Vitamin D Pills Do Not Help (Published 2022)

The vitamin pills do not prevent bone fractures in most people or protect against many other diseases, adding to questions about medical guidance many now take for granted.

www.nytimes.com

 

[Ducttape]

https://www.nejm.org/doi/full/10.1056/NEJMoa2202106

CONCLUSIONS​

Vitamin D3 supplementation did not result in a significantly lower risk of fractures than placebo among generally healthy midlife and older adults who were not selected for vitamin D deficiency, low bone mass, or osteoporosis.

 

[KateFan]

Looks like I've been vindicated. I don't think vitamins will ever live up to the marketing hype.

I question this guy from the article:

"Dr. Sundeep Khosla, a professor of medicine and physiology at the Mayo Clinic, said that since vitamin D 'will do little or no harm and may have benefits,' he would continue to advise his patients with osteoporosis to take it,"
_________

My prediction for the future is that vitamin d supplementation, the fat soluble hormone, will be shown to do more harm than good in the upcoming years. Stay tuned.

Study Finds Another Condition That Vitamin D Pills Do Not Help (Published 2022)

The vitamin pills do not prevent bone fractures in most people or protect against many other diseases, adding to questions about medical guidance many now take for granted.

www.nytimes.com

https://onlinelibrary.wiley.com/doi/full/10.1111/acel.13670#:~:text=Consistently%2C%20our%20population%2Dbased%20longitudinal,those%20not%20taking%20the%20supplements.

 

[Pain Applicant1]

https://onlinelibrary.wiley.com/doi/full/10.1111/acel.13670#:~:text=Consistently%2C%20our%20population%2Dbased%20longitudinal,those%20not%20taking%20the%20supplements.

Interesting article. This is why it's so hard to trust data. It always changes.

 

[10KHertz]

When I was in the ICU during fellowship , I wasn’t getting any sun and was additionally lactose intolerant. I was lethargic for years. Finally checked my vit D level = 3…. Supplements ever since, life changer . Great supplement for chronic disease (indeterminate for lbp).

 

[hyperalgesia]

I doubt vit d supplements do much for people who work outside or hunt for food like our distant ancestors.

But many of us live unnaturally. We spend most of our time indoors and buy food in the grocery store or get it from uber eats. When we do get exposed to sunlight, we already smeared titanium/zinc over our bodies.

With this unnatural lifestyle, vitamin d supplements make sense to me.

 

[pastafan]

When I was in the ICU during fellowship , I wasn’t getting any sun and was additionally lactose intolerant. I was lethargic for years. Finally checked my vit D level = 3…. Supplements ever since, life changer . Great supplement for chronic disease (indeterminate for lbp).

Reminds me of surgery rotation in medical school. I didn’t see daylight for 2 months.

 

[Pain Applicant1]

When I was in the ICU during fellowship , I wasn’t getting any sun and was additionally lactose intolerant. I was lethargic for years. Finally checked my vit D level = 3…. Supplements ever since, life changer . Great supplement for chronic disease (indeterminate for lbp).

That nyt article did mention that it would be an appropriate treatment for some populations but not for most.

 

[10KHertz]

That nyt article did mention that it would be an appropriate treatment for some populations but not for most.

Additionally there are studies for chronic LBP in the Asian population(me) . So yes there is literate out there , but like most things indeterminate.

 

[powermd]

Low vitamin D is associated with a number of chronic diseases that I don't want, so I supplement to keep my level 30+. Generally 4K/day in the darker months keeps me there. I pop some sporadically in the summer.

 

[PikminOC]

Additionally there are studies for chronic LBP in the Asian population(me) . So yes there is literate out there , but like most things indeterminate.

Lbp? Low back pain?

 

[Pain Applicant1]

I think you guys are right. Low Vit D probably isn't good for you but I don't think that's the correct issue. The right question to ask, IMO, is if vit D supplementation is the correct approach? Does isolating vit D and supplementing it do more good than harm? As it is with other vitamin supplementations, probably not, at least not for most people. Reality just doesn't live up to the marketing hype.

 

[Pain Applicant1]

I guess everyone is jumping on the NEJM article. Here's an article a couple of days ago from Forbes. Highlights are below if you don't have an account or know how to use incognito. The biggest takeaway quote for me is "low levels of vitamin D are a result of bad health, not the cause."

Stop Taking Vitamin D Already!

Way back in 2014, I wrote a column about vitamin D supplements, explaining that they don’t work. A huge new study shows that (surprise!) I was right.

www.forbes.com

"In 2014, I wrote about two studies, both published in The Lancet. The first paper, a massive review of 462 other studies, concluded that taking supplemental vitamin D did not help to prevent heart disease, weight gain, mood disorders, multiple sclerosis, and metabolic disorders, all of which had been linked to lower vitamin D. Nope, they said: it appears that low levels of vitamin D are a result of bad health, not the cause."

"...the second study that I wrote about in 2014 looked precisely at that question. That paper concluded that vitamin D supplements do not improve bone density, and they do not reduce the risk of osteoporosis."

"In other words, vitamin D supplements are a complete waste of money."

"Cummings and Rosen put it bluntly: “providers should stop screening for 25-hydroxyvitamin D levels or recommending vitamin D supplements, and people should stop taking vitamin D supplements to prevent major diseases or extend life.” Or as my Hopkins Eliseo Guallar, Lawrence Appel, and Edgar Miller wrote back in 2013, “Enough is enough: stop wasting money on vitamin and mineral supplements.”

"At the top of this article I mentioned that my list of useless vitamin supplements has 6 vitamins on it, so here they are:

1. Vitamin C
2. Vitamin A and beta carotene
3. Vitamin E
4. Vitamin B6
5. Multi-vitamins
6. Vitamin D

If you want to know the science behind the other 5, take a look at my column on The Top Five Vitamins You Should Not Take."

"routine supplementation is worthless and megadoses of vitamins can be harmful"

 

[RoloTomassi]

I've read so many mixed things on if multivitamin is helpful

 

[kstarm]

There has been a number of studies showing vitamin supplementation decreases violent/antisocial behavior. There was some podcast I heard where it was like a 30% decrease in violent acts in incarcerated individuals that got supplement multivitamins. Seems like there is something there, but like most things very tough to isolate and study.

 

[pastafan]

Vitamin D Supplementation Protects Telomeres in VITAL

Dr JoAnn Manson reports on the latest VITAL trial results, which provide new insight into the relationship between vitamin D supplementation and biological measures of aging.

www.medscape.com

 

[hyperalgesia]

Vitamin D Supplementation Protects Telomeres in VITAL

Dr JoAnn Manson reports on the latest VITAL trial results, which provide new insight into the relationship between vitamin D supplementation and biological measures of aging.

www.medscape.com

I doubt they will be able to replicate this tbh.

 

[Ligament]

I have taken too much on two different occasions and got weird(er). Got less weird within 2 days of going back to a much lower dose.

 

[bedrock]

I've read so many mixed things on if multivitamin is helpful

I guess everyone is jumping on the NEJM article. Here's an article a couple of days ago from Forbes. Highlights are below if you don't have an account or know how to use incognito. The biggest takeaway quote for me is "low levels of vitamin D are a result of bad health, not the cause."

Stop Taking Vitamin D Already!

Way back in 2014, I wrote a column about vitamin D supplements, explaining that they don’t work. A huge new study shows that (surprise!) I was right.

www.forbes.com

"In 2014, I wrote about two studies, both published in The Lancet. The first paper, a massive review of 462 other studies, concluded that taking supplemental vitamin D did not help to prevent heart disease, weight gain, mood disorders, multiple sclerosis, and metabolic disorders, all of which had been linked to lower vitamin D. Nope, they said: it appears that low levels of vitamin D are a result of bad health, not the cause."

"...the second study that I wrote about in 2014 looked precisely at that question. That paper concluded that vitamin D supplements do not improve bone density, and they do not reduce the risk of osteoporosis."

"In other words, vitamin D supplements are a complete waste of money."

"Cummings and Rosen put it bluntly: “providers should stop screening for 25-hydroxyvitamin D levels or recommending vitamin D supplements, and people should stop taking vitamin D supplements to prevent major diseases or extend life.” Or as my Hopkins Eliseo Guallar, Lawrence Appel, and Edgar Miller wrote back in 2013, “Enough is enough: stop wasting money on vitamin and mineral supplements.”

"At the top of this article I mentioned that my list of useless vitamin supplements has 6 vitamins on it, so here they are:

1. Vitamin C
2. Vitamin A and beta carotene
3. Vitamin E
4. Vitamin B6
5. Multi-vitamins
6. Vitamin D

If you want to know the science behind the other 5, take a look at my column on The Top Five Vitamins You Should Not Take."

"routine supplementation is worthless and megadoses of vitamins can be harmful"

It’s hard to know what’s best to do with vitamins. I ended up taking a multivitamin that is cheap but confirmed by independent consumerlab.com to contain what it says.

I take that MVI daily and otherwise I eat a lot of organic veggies, pasture raised meat/fresh caught fish and only drink spring water in glass bottles.

 

[lobelsteve]

The clinician’s guide to prevention and treatment of osteoporosis
M. S. LeBoff1 & S. L. Greenspan2 & K. L. Insogna3 & E. M. Lewiecki4 & K. G. Saag5 & A. J. Singer6 & E. S. Siris7
Received: 4 September 2020 /Accepted: 19 February 2021 /Published online: 28 April 2022

Recommend a diet with adequate total calcium intake
(1000 mg/day for men aged 50–70 years; 1200 mg/day
for women ≥ 51 years and men ≥ 71 years), incorporating
calcium supplements if intake is insufficient.
& Monitor serum 25-hydroxyvitamin D levels.
& Maintain serum vitamin D sufficiency (≥ 30 ng/mL but
below ≤ 50 ng/mL) [1–3]. Prescribe supplemental vitamin
D (800–1000 units/day) as needed for individuals aged 50
years and older to achieve a sufficient vitamin D level.
Higher doses may be necessary in some adults, especially
those with malabsorption. (Note: in healthy individuals a
serum 25(OH) vitamin D level ≥ 20 ng/mL may be sufficient,
but in the setting of known or suspected metabolic
bone disease ≥ 30 ng/mL is appropriate.)

Multivitamin Use and Mortality Risk in 3 Prospective US Cohorts​

Erikka Loftfield, PhD, MPH1; Caitlin P. O’Connell, MPH1; Christian C. Abnet, PhD, MPH1; et alBarry I. Graubard, PhD2; Linda M. Liao, PhD1; Laura E. Beane Freeman, PhD3; Jonathan N. Hofmann, PhD3; Neal D. Freedman, PhD, MPH1; Rashmi Sinha, PhD1
Author Affiliations Article Information
JAMA Netw Open. 2024;7(6):e2418729. doi:10.1001/jamanetworkopen.2024.18729

Discussion
In this cohort study of 390 124 generally healthy US adults with more than 20 years of follow-up, daily MV use was not associated with a mortality benefit. In contrast, we found that daily MV use vs nonuse was associated with 4% higher mortality risk. The results of the time-varying analysis, incorporating a second MV use assessment, were consistent with the pooled baseline estimates and support our conclusion of no mortality benefit. Finally, by pooling data from 3 large cohorts, we could explore heterogeneity across key population subgroups, including understudied sociodemographic subgroups, which was identified as a research gap in the 2022 USPSTF.

Based on Jama review: 4% more likely to die if taking MVI, despite lower BMI and a better diet.