Wags and Express Scripts reach deal?

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Makes me real curious about the details on the reimbursement rates. Walgreen's took the most damage here. I am just glad I bought walgreens stock at 30 bucks when I did cuz they were a bargain :meanie:
 
3boooda said:
So, is that good for the pharmacists? More profit, more jobs?
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lol not more jobs but just a shift from one place to another. As for profit it's the same thing shift from mostly CVS to WAG. So walgreens is the one on top plus they look better now as a company to not mess with. All this transition will take months and results for Walgreens from this deal will probably be seen till end of the year.
 
Pharmpills said:
lol not more jobs but just a shift from one place to another. As for profit it's the same thing shift from mostly CVS to WAG. So walgreens is the one on top plus they look better now as a company to not mess with. All this transition will take months and results for Walgreens from this deal will probably be seen till end of the year.
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Actually since reimbursement details weren't released I don't think you can say Walgreens came out on top or that they are a company not to mess with.

They might have went back to Express with their hat in hand.
 
hereticmnk said:
Makes me real curious about the details on the reimbursement rates. Walgreen's took the most damage here.
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How do you know? Maybe Walgreens is going to get great rates, and ESI doesn't want CVS doing the same thing.
 
iFarm said:
How do you know? Maybe Walgreens is going to get great rates, and ESI doesn't want CVS doing the same thing.
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In this breakdown of negotiations, Walgreens was to lose in the short term (people going to different places to buy RX's) and ESI in the long term (when people had to renew their contract). So pretty much, Walgreens lost the patients and ESI renewed their contract before any damage was done. Now this is from a purely consumer level. It was in the best interest of both parties to sign the contract because other entities would have more leverage if they didn't (like another ins. with Walgreens or another provider with ESI).
 
Pharmpills said:
lol not more jobs but just a shift from one place to another. As for profit it's the same thing shift from mostly CVS to WAG. So walgreens is the one on top plus they look better now as a company to not mess with. All this transition will take months and results for Walgreens from this deal will probably be seen till end of the year.
Click to expand...

Are you for real? Walgreens took a pasting. It's been so long since they posted an increase in sales compared to last year. Even with todays big increase for Walgreens and big decrease for CVS, CVS is still up 31% over last year and Walgreens stock price is down almost 27%.

Did you notice that it came after Walgreens realized that when their contracts with Medco expired, they were going to lose 25% of their business? They may have gotten a few pennies from ESI, but even if they did, it wouldn't make up for the customers they lost. Do you think 100% of them will now run back to Walgreens? They went to CVS or Indies or some other local chain. They will never get them all back. This was a loser for Walgreens no matter how you slice uit.
 
Old Timer said:
Are you for real? Walgreens took a pasting. It's been so long since they posted an increase in sales compared to last year. Even with todays big increase for Walgreens and big decrease for CVS, CVS is still up 31% over last year and Walgreens stock price is down almost 27%.

Did you notice that it came after Walgreens realized that when their contracts with Medco expired, they were going to lose 25% of their business? They may have gotten a few pennies from ESI, but even if they did, it wouldn't make up for the customers they lost. Do you think 100% of them will now run back to Walgreens? They went to CVS or Indies or some other local chain. They will never get them all back. This was a loser for Walgreens no matter how you slice it.
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Idk... I see people paying cash to avoid CVS and others begging to know whenever we'll take Express Scripts again. In my area, this whole contract renewal thing is huge!
 
PharmDstudent said:
Idk... I see people paying cash to avoid CVS and others begging to know whenever we'll take Express Scripts again. In my area, this whole contract renewal thing is huge!
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ditto. i only worry that with flu season around the corner and no way to predict how many will come back, we're likely to be grossly understaffed till late late in the year.
 
Wags pharmacists and staff are most directly affected by the number of prescriptions filled, which determines our staffing hours. Reimbursement rates, profit margins, etc come after.

Not having ESI caused a reduction in scripts of about 10%, which really sucked for months, worrying about whether we would get our hours cut or get laid off.

So this is a great relief. Right now, Wags staff just need to concentrate on getting ESI customers back, and script volume back up. At least from here, they are ours to gain, and our competitors' to lose. 🙂
 
pezdispenser said:
Wags pharmacists and staff are most directly affected by the number of prescriptions filled, which determines our staffing hours. Reimbursement rates, profit margins, etc come after.

Not having ESI caused a reduction in scripts of about 10%, which really sucked for months, worrying about whether we would get our hours cut or get laid off.

So this is a great relief. Right now, Wags staff just need to concentrate on getting ESI customers back, and script volume back up. At least from here, they are ours to gain, and our competitors' to lose. 🙂
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Psssh. My staff is most directly affected by new to therapy calls and flavor rxs 🙄😛
 
Old Timer said:
Are you for real? Walgreens took a pasting. It's been so long since they posted an increase in sales compared to last year. Even with todays big increase for Walgreens and big decrease for CVS, CVS is still up 31% over last year and Walgreens stock price is down almost 27%.

Did you notice that it came after Walgreens realized that when their contracts with Medco expired, they were going to lose 25% of their business? They may have gotten a few pennies from ESI, but even if they did, it wouldn't make up for the customers they lost. Do you think 100% of them will now run back to Walgreens? They went to CVS or Indies or some other local chain. They will never get them all back. This was a loser for Walgreens no matter how you slice uit.
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Walgreens didn't take a "pasting" like they way you are thinking. Walgreens has little debt and billions of dollars in excess cash. Secondly you can't just look at stock price and think that tells the world of information bc CVS stock can drop to 30 in a few days bc Stocks today are very volatile. Walgreens is on top because they have always been the #1 chain and STILL IS (get it right). No one can tell what customers will do whether they will leave CVS in drones until that day arrives, i do see walgreens offering good incentives when that time come for those patients to transfer back. It's not just about rx count but the profit derived from those scripts.
 
PharmDstudent said:
Idk... I see people paying cash to avoid CVS and others begging to know whenever we'll take Express Scripts again. In my area, this whole contract renewal thing is huge!
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Same here, I am from St Louis. Walgreens is huge here and ESI is based off of here. Nationally ESI does 10% of the total scripts for Walgreens (about 5 million out of 55 million). But in St. Louis it is close to 30% so it was really a big deal in this city.
 
Pharmpills said:
Walgreens didn't take a "pasting" like they way you are thinking. Walgreens has little debt and billions of dollars in excess cash. Secondly you can't just look at stock price and think that tells the world of information bc CVS stock can drop to 30 in a few days bc Stocks today are very volatile. Walgreens is on top because they have always been the #1 chain and STILL IS (get it right). No one can tell what customers will do whether they will leave CVS in drones until that day arrives, i do see walgreens offering good incentives when that time come for those patients to transfer back. It's not just about rx count but the profit derived from those scripts.
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Good lord we have an argument about who is better CVS or Walgreens......Its like debating if getting kicked it the balls hurts worse if someone does it with thier left foot or right foot..
 
MountainPharmD said:
Good lord we have an argument about who is better CVS or Walgreens......Its like debating if getting kicked it the balls hurts worse if someone does it with thier left foot or right foot..
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👍👍:laugh:
 
Good for who? This isn't good news for those pharmacies and their staff who took on the ESI patients Walgreens left behind.
 
Pharmpills said:
Walgreens didn't take a "pasting" like they way you are thinking. Walgreens has little debt and billions of dollars in excess cash. Secondly you can't just look at stock price and think that tells the world of information bc CVS stock can drop to 30 in a few days bc Stocks today are very volatile. Walgreens is on top because they have always been the #1 chain and STILL IS (get it right). No one can tell what customers will do whether they will leave CVS in drones until that day arrives, i do see walgreens offering good incentives when that time come for those patients to transfer back. It's not just about rx count but the profit derived from those scripts.
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The future has arrived! Where can I get my drone? Ha, j/k buddy I just had to!:laugh:
 
PharmDstudent said:
Idk... I see people paying cash to avoid CVS and others begging to know whenever we'll take Express Scripts again. In my area, this whole contract renewal thing is huge!
Click to expand...

They put at risk 80 million rxs per year. For what? They will get some of them back, but they won't get them all back. Let's say they get 75% back, they lost 20 million rxs per year forever. They lost the companion sales that go with them and they strengthened their largest competitor.

Do you think CVS is going to stand around and let these people leave without putting up a fight? I have no clue what they are cooking up in Rhoad Island, but I am certain about one thing, they will aggressively fight to hold onto this business.

I think this will be a permanent net loss of business for Walgreens, time will tell.
 
Pharmpills said:
Walgreens didn't take a "pasting" like they way you are thinking. Walgreens has little debt and billions of dollars in excess cash. Secondly you can't just look at stock price and think that tells the world of information bc CVS stock can drop to 30 in a few days bc Stocks today are very volatile. Walgreens is on top because they have always been the #1 chain and STILL IS (get it right). No one can tell what customers will do whether they will leave CVS in drones until that day arrives, i do see walgreens offering good incentives when that time come for those patients to transfer back. It's not just about rx count but the profit derived from those scripts.
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You can live in any fantasy world you want. There was no effect on ESI at all. They did not lose one contract because Walgreens was not in their network. Every month in 2012 since this went into effect Walgreens has done less sales and less prescriptions. Their stock is down almost 30% in the last year. That's not day to day volatility. That's a years worth of 1-3% of Walgreens prescriptions going to CVS and other competitors.

The signed for the following reasons:


  • They failed in their attempt to have employers leave ESI
  • They failed in their attempt to keep the customers with their cash/discount plans.
  • They have continued to post negative comp sales and rxs since the impasse.
  • They were aware that when their contracts with Medco expired, they would all be shifted to ESI and that would place them in an untenable situation where they would put more than 1-3% of their business at risk.
This is not a win for Walgreens. The only way this is a win for Walgreens is if they get 100% of the prescriptions back and they got an increase in reimbursement from ESI. Without that they never make up for the almost 1 year of lost business from ESI.


I used to write computer programs. The first real program I wrote was a strike loss chart that showed striking workers how much money they would lose by going on strike and how long it would take to make up for the strike depending on the raise and the length of the strike. It basically showed unless you smoke the employer, it almost NEVER pays to go on strike, Well, Walgreens went on strike against ESI. They will never make up this loss, ever.....
 
MountainPharmD said:
Good lord we have an argument about who is better CVS or Walgreens......Its like debating if getting kicked it the balls hurts worse if someone does it with thier left foot or right foot..
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Ahh Mountain... has anyone ever told you that you always misspell "their"? Anyway, these CVS vs. Walgreens threads are always a hoot, so carry on! :laugh:
 
Did anyone read lower in the article?

"About Express Scripts:
Express Scripts manages more than a billion prescriptions each year for tens of millions of people. On behalf of our clients, we make the use of prescription drugs safer and more affordable. We innovate to enhance patient care, reduce pharmacy-related waste and increase therapy adherence. Building on a strong clinical foundation, we apply our understanding of the behavioral sciences -- an approach we call Consumerology® -- to make it easier for people to choose better health."


Really? Consumerology? :laugh::laugh::laugh:


BS-meter.jpg
 
CUninja said:
Did anyone read lower in the article?

"About Express Scripts:
Express Scripts manages more than a billion prescriptions each year for tens of millions of people. On behalf of our clients, we make the use of prescription drugs safer and more affordable. We innovate to enhance patient care, reduce pharmacy-related waste and increase therapy adherence. Building on a strong clinical foundation, we apply our understanding of the behavioral sciences -- an approach we call Consumerology® -- to make it easier for people to choose better health."


Really? Consumerology? :laugh::laugh::laugh:


BS-meter.jpg
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At least it can get people to take their meds.
 
pezdispenser said:
Ahh Mountain... has anyone ever told you that you always misspell "their"? Anyway, these CVS vs. Walgreens threads are always a hoot, so carry on! :laugh:
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I noticed that awhile back and can't figure out when it became a habit. I can't spell for **** anyway. Its bad when I am using a program with spell check. I miss spell it everytime. I before e except after c is bull crap!
 
Old Timer said:
They put at risk 80 million rxs per year. For what? They will get some of them back, but they won't get them all back. Let's say they get 75% back, they lost 20 million rxs per year forever. They lost the companion sales that go with them and they strengthened their largest competitor.

Do you think CVS is going to stand around and let these people leave without putting up a fight? I have no clue what they are cooking up in Rhoad Island, but I am certain about one thing, they will aggressively fight to hold onto this business.

I think this will be a permanent net loss of business for Walgreens, time will tell.
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I agree- I thinks WAGS waited far too long- I am confident that I will retain at least 90% of my ESI base- now had WAGS worked aggressively and perhaps got a deal done by march than I think they would have been able to bring back a ton of their "lost" customers.
Now for those CVS- if you lose a great majority of those ESI customer you have no one to blame but yourself. Nine months is plenty of time to impress those ESI transfers customers.
 
JamesL1585 said:
Click Here

Walgreens and Express Scripts finally make deal.
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As I mentioned in another thread- WAGS waiting a little too long- think about it- those customers have been with a new pharmacy for 9 months- when September 15 hits that's beginning of Flu season- bad timing and they just waited to long and allow those ESI customer 9 months to get settled at another chain.
 
Rxnupe said:
I agree- I thinks WAGS waited far too long- I am confident that I will retain at least 90% of my ESI base- now had WAGS worked aggressively and perhaps got a deal done by march than I think they would have been able to bring back a ton of their "lost" customers.
Now for those CVS- if you lose a great majority of those ESI customer you have no one to blame but yourself. Nine months is plenty of time to impress those ESI transfers customers.
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Impress them with what? The same type of ****ty service, inadequate staffing and long wait times?

Opps...Hold habits die hard I guess!

Hey 'Nupe haven't you lost a good chunk of those customers to Express scripts mandatory mail order and zero co-pay for generic scripts through mail order? The bottom line is people willl go where it is the most convenient. If Walgreens is half a block closer they will go back to Walgreens. I would bet by this time next year things will have equalized and you will be down close to what you were up this year with the Wags customers going back.
 
MountainPharmD said:
Impress them with what? The same type of ****ty service, inadequate staffing and long wait times?

Opps...Hold habits die hard I guess!

Hey 'Nupe haven't you lost a good chunk of those customers to Express scripts mandatory mail order and zero co-pay for generic scripts through mail order? The bottom line is people willl go where it is the most convenient. If Walgreens is half a block closer they will go back to Walgreens. I would bet by this time next year things will have equalized and you will be down close to what you were up this year with the Wags customers going back.
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I am honestly not worried about it- yes we lost some I wouldn't say a good chunk to the mandatory mail order but remember we still have those who have ESI and get non maintenance meds filled at my store, but the WAGS near my store even prior to them losing ESI had longer wait times and overall ****ty service so I don't see any of them rushing back to WAGS and I have 2 Wal-Mart a Krogers, Minyards and about 3 Independent chains that the ESI customers could have transferred to but we seem to have picked up most of the WAGS customers.
 
joetrisman said:
i'm pretty stoked that my intern spot is moderately valuable again
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Ding! Ding! Ding! We have a winner! 🙂

New grads who just signed on with Wags this year but were only offered 32 hrs/wk can hopefully get bumped up to 40 hrs now.
 
pezdispenser said:
Ding! Ding! Ding! We have a winner! 🙂

New grads who just signed on with Wags this year but were only offered 32 hrs/wk can hopefully get bumped up to 40 hrs now.
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Actually, they will probably do what the rest of corporate America has done.
The euphemism of choice is "Increase labor productivity."
 
WVUPharm2007 said:
Actually, they will probably do what the rest of corporate America has done.
The euphemism of choice is "Increase labor productivity."
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Hey maybe if more people call in sick because they're burnt out from being pushed over the edge... by the hundredth person to ask for their entire profile to be transferred back from CVS... and they want them done in 15 mins while they wait... then the new floaters will get some hours...
 
MountainPharmD said:
The bottom line is people willl go where it is the most convenient. If Walgreens is half a block closer they will go back to Walgreens. I would bet by this time next year things will have equalized and you will be down close to what you were up this year with the Wags customers going back.
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Have to agree with this. My Walgreens is located in between 2 retirement villages and the nearest CVS is an extra mile and a half away. Sounds terribly far, right? When all the old people come in to do their grocery shopping, they whine to no end about how they can't get their prescriptions here anymore because we're so much closer and more convenient.

Then there are the racist ones that can't wait to come back because the CVS, Rite Aid, Stop n Shop, Walmart, Shop Rite, and local independent are in a more ethnic part of town. They make me laugh because they're inappropriate.
 
Wheresmyaricept said:
Have to agree with this. My Walgreens is located in between 2 retirement villages and the nearest CVS is an extra mile and a half away. Sounds terribly far, right? When all the old people come in to do their grocery shopping, they whine to no end about how they can't get their prescriptions here anymore because we're so much closer and more convenient.

Then there are the racist ones that can't wait to come back because the CVS, Rite Aid, Stop n Shop, Walmart, Shop Rite, and local independent are in a more ethnic part of town. They make me laugh because they're inappropriate.
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There's probably more crime there also.
 
My district Wags is launching a program in which they get reimbursed for health testing (lipids, etc) by state medicaid and the local city government employee's ins. Not sure of the logistics of everything, but definitely an interesting step in pharmacists being reimbursed as providers.
 
joetrisman said:
My district Wags is launching a program in which they get reimbursed for health testing (lipids, etc) by state medicaid and the local city government employee's ins. Not sure of the logistics of everything, but definitely an interesting step in pharmacists being reimbursed as providers.
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Walgreen's has been trying to do stuff like this but has met with modest to no success.I remember the time when they did this whole national blood pressure checking thing which was a massive failure. I really really hope they have some success here. It would be a small step in the right direction.
 
Lemme just say... thank god I'm on the night shift and there's no 24hr CVS to speak of!
 
We are about to make a big jump into MTM in WI Wags. We will officially be joining the WPQC, and also, WI Medicaid (20% of the state's population) and United Healthcare will be joining as payors. For small interventions, i.e. brand to generic, simple device demonstrations, we will be paid $30, and for CMRs, we will be paid $100.
 
Stoichiometry said:
Good for who? This isn't good news for those pharmacies and their staff who took on the ESI patients Walgreens left behind.
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What are you talking about exactly? Can you elaborate? I don't see why any pharmacy would complain about taking on new patients unless they aren't fond of job security more hours, or bigger bonuses.
 
JamesL1585 said:
What are you talking about exactly? Can you elaborate? I don't see why any pharmacy would complain about taking on new patients unless they aren't fond of job security more hours, or bigger bonuses.
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The people that left walgreens because of their insurance and now are at another pharmacy and are going to leave to go back to Walgreens. So there will be hour cuts at some other places because Walgreens will be taking business from them. Walgreens in jumping for joy. Cvs and rite aid not so much.
 
Old Timer said:
Are you for real? Walgreens took a pasting. It's been so long since they posted an increase in sales compared to last year. Even with todays big increase for Walgreens and big decrease for CVS, CVS is still up 31% over last year and Walgreens stock price is down almost 27%.

Did you notice that it came after Walgreens realized that when their contracts with Medco expired, they were going to lose 25% of their business? They may have gotten a few pennies from ESI, but even if they did, it wouldn't make up for the customers they lost. Do you think 100% of them will now run back to Walgreens? They went to CVS or Indies or some other local chain. They will never get them all back. This was a loser for Walgreens no matter how you slice uit.
Click to expand...

Everyone I know at Walgreens seems to have had significant hour cuts, and a lot of our patients who transferred from Walgreens have talked about how they WISH they would've left sooner, so I seriously doubt they will even come close to getting them all back. lol
 
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