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Good afternoon everyone,

I am on the alternate list at USUHS (which is my top choice) and can hear back from them anytime between now and July. However, I was also accepted into 2 other medical schools (and waiting for others) and am talking to an AMEDD recruiter to submit an HPSP packet. Can I submit the HPSP scholarship and still get out of HPSP to get into USUHS if they send me an acceptance? Should I not sign a contract with HPSP until later next year? Also want to see what kind of financial aid the other medical schools will offer me because if I get a full-ride or something crazy, I can just do direct commissioning after residency.

A little confused, and seems like a pretty life-changing decision so any advice would mean a ton. Thanks y'all.
 

Slevin

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If you are waiting on USU then you can also sign up for HPSP and if you get into USU you can decline HPSP
 
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Sep 7, 2019
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Does anyone know how long I can hold an HPSP scholarship without signing the contract if I am waiting for financial aid from schools? Would be worth waiting if I could get a merit scholarship from schools and then join mil directly after residency
 
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goodstuff33

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I cannot answer your question about holding off on signing the HPSP contract. However, the truth is only you can answer the remaining questions. You are asking about three different routes and each one has different ADSO lengths. Irrespective of which route you choose, you first need to fully understand what you are signing up for and be 100% committed.
 
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I cannot answer your question about holding off on signing the HPSP contract. However, the truth is only you can answer the remaining questions. You are asking about three different routes and each one has different ADSO lengths. Irrespective of which route you choose, you first need to fully understand what you are signing up for and be 100% committed.

Absolutely, and fair enough. Been thinking about mil-med for the better half of a decade now. Just want to get it right in terms of entry.
 

95ragtop

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I went through the dilemma of HPSP vs USU. I was active duty at the time, so some of this may change for your situation. I had an early acceptance (December) to a school, but USU was my top choice. I talked to a recruiter and decided to not initially apply for HPSP because I thought I had enough time. I interviewed at USU in December and heard back in late February I had been wait listed. I had already gotten everything together for my HPSP packet while I was waiting and it took until May to submit everything to the board. I had a really close call getting out of the Army and making it to med school on time. I didn't commission till several weeks into med school.

Lessons learned: I would not have waited to hear back from USU. I would have got the ball rolling with my HPSP packet.
 
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el mero mero

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Just my two cents... Unless you're prior military and going for 20 usuhs is a tough pill to swallow. If all other things are equal (besides AD pay thru school) the flexibility on the back end is worth it. Personally, I declined hpsp and ended up taking hplr (loan repayment) with the army reserve. I'm in lucrative private practice and able to serve. I'm really happy where I'm at in my career. Wish you the best.
 
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Lessons learned: I would not have waited to hear back from USU. I would have got the ball rolling with my HPSP packet.


Just my two cents... Unless you're prior military and going for 20 usuhs is a tough pill to swallow. If all other things are equal (besides AD pay thru school) the flexibility on the back end is worth it. Personally, I declined hpsp and ended up taking hplr (loan repayment) with the army reserve. I'm in lucrative private practice and able to serve. I'm really happy where I'm at in my career. Wish you the best.

Thanks y'all. I appreciate your wisdom. I'm going to get on my HPSP packet ASAP -- it'll take a while for it to get the board anyway. If I get merit scholarships or if USU hits me up before then, that'll be a good problem to have. Otherwise, by taking care of HPSP now, I'll be working on what I can control ATM. cheers
 

epidural man

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Some things to think about.

Payback for USU is a long time. A really long time.

If you happen to NOT do a career in the military, and you want to do Reserves (like I am doing), you get your HPSP years back, but USU years do NOT come back until you have already completed 20. I have no idea why - seems rather crazy to me.

For example, I did 15 years active duty. I did three years reserves, they will give me back 3 years HPSP - so now I have 21 years and can retire from the reserves if I want.

If did USU, I would have to do 5 years in there reserves, then retire, then MAYBE they would give me back those 4 years of USU.
 
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MedicalCorpse

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Some things to think about.

Payback for USU is a long time. A really long time.

If you happen to NOT do a career in the military, and you want to do Reserves (like I am doing), you get your HPSP years back, but USU years do NOT come back until you have already completed 20. I have no idea why - seems rather crazy to me.

It's a long, sordid story. Search for DOPMA 1981 USUHS.

Executive summary: the rules were changed by DOPMA in 1981 to remove constructive service credit for students on active duty and in uniform at USUHS starting in 1985. Of course, some people from the class of 1986 claimed that they were misinformed, so the three services' military boards granted them the years back without Congressional approval.

The entire reason for the USUHS clauses of DOPMA always seemed to me to screw doctors into staying in longer...20 years after graduation, rather than 16.

I never claimed that I was informed incorrectly. The whole thing was briefed to us very clearly during our interview day at USUHS. At that time, of course, I assumed I would be in the Air Force for life...

An exhaustive legal and financial analysis is here if you have time:
https://apps.dtic.mil/dtic/tr/fulltext/u2/a376958.pdf

...from which I quote:

"Defense Officer Personnel Management Act.

The Act eliminated constructive service credit for pay purposes for students enrolled in the Uniformed Services University of the Health Sciences (USUHS) and the Health Professions Scholarship Program (HPSP) after September 14, 1981. Before the Act was implemented, medical officers who graduated from USUHS and HPSP received 4 years of constructive service credit for training...The USUHS and HPSP classes that graduated in 1985 and 1986 were the first to be affected by the Act. The classes of 1982 through 1984 entered on active duty before the Act was implemented; therefore, they received 4 years of constructive service credit for training.

IMPLEMENTATION OF THE ACT
The Boards for the Correction of Military and Naval Records used inappropriate decisionmaking criteria and administrative procedures in awarding constructive service credit to 1985 and 1986 graduates of the USUHS and HPSP. The awards have already resulted in $12 million in back payments, and could cost the Government as much as $193 million in increased active duty and retirement pay for medical officers. Until procedural changes are implemented, the Boards may continue to use inappropriate decisionmaking criteria and procedures.

In 1984, DoD considered a USUHS-sponsored bill to restore constructive service credit to USUHS and HPSP medical students. DoD did not support the bill because the Assistant Secretary of Defense (Health Affairs) did not endorse it.

The Army and Air Force Boards' decisions to correct the records of HPSP students so that the students could receive constructive service credit for time spent in medical school were unconnected to any legal standard for identifying injustices. When the Army and Air Force Boards granted blanket relief to HPSP students, their decision was not based on a finding that the applicants had presented sufficient, relevant evidence to demonstrate that that injustices had occurred. Instead, the Boards' decisions were based on considerations of equity that ran contrary to Congressional intent as set out in the Act."

It still boggles my mind that the DoD IG report whines on and on about actual and potential payments to doctors in the millions of dollars over 40 years, when DoD wastes billions of dollars per year that can't be accounted for.

It's exactly as though they don't care about us.
 

armytrainingsir

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Some things to think about.

Payback for USU is a long time. A really long time.

If you happen to NOT do a career in the military, and you want to do Reserves (like I am doing), you get your HPSP years back, but USU years do NOT come back until you have already completed 20. I have no idea why - seems rather crazy to me.

For example, I did 15 years active duty. I did three years reserves, they will give me back 3 years HPSP - so now I have 21 years and can retire from the reserves if I want.

If did HPSP, I would have to do 5 years in there reserves, then retire, then MAYBE they would give me back those 4 years of USU.

Hmm, I have a friend that is in a CWS and he told me his USU years counted toward reserve retirement. IIRC, he based this off of his DA5016.

I agree with sentiments above that the carve outs that make medical school time to be worthless towards retirement suck.

Finally, I am amazed at how so few AMEDD recruiters understand that HPSP time can be credited towards retirement and am astounded they don't pursue former HPSP folks with 10-12 years of AD time.

I will eternally grateful that I learned here that my HPSP time counted and all it took was one email and a few weeks to have three more good years. And I am happy to have paid that knowlege forward with two colleagues who both received an extra 2 and 4 good years. One was able to drop papers for a 20 year letter immediately, instead of the 2 he thought he had remaining.
 
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