Was medicine in the 70's-80's actually THAT cool?

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drivesmecraazee

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I've heard lots of people talking about how big was the satisfaction for people who got to practice medicine in the 70's and 80's, and about the disapointment felt by those who choosed medicine thinking that the profesion was still like in those days.
I would like to know...what was so great about the 70's and 80's? What has changed?

Thnaks.

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Wow... Nice topic. I always love hearing stories from the ancient ones 😀 Please do spill! :corny:
 
Wednesdays afternoons off for golf.
 
My understanding is that several things had not happened which have served to decrease job satisfaction among physicians.

***Please note that I am about to list some things that are bad about the profession of medicine. Any of you who don't want to hear any more bitching from us whiners due to our stupidity and laziness should bail out now.***

Managed care, and I include CMS in that, demands a huge amount of paperwork, justification and administrative overhead to get paid. Back in the day this was not as bad. Many physicians who had to deal with this as it evolved felt it was a blow against their judgement and autonomy because they had to justify everything they did. That is true but the rest of us are just used to it now.

Medical Malpractice was not the life sucking beast from Hell that it is now. You could really only get sued if you really screwed up and then only for real damages, not for the Power Ball.

People didn't expect medicine to fix every aspect of their lives. Now the ads tell people to go to a doctor for everything from feeling sad to being fat to can't get an erection. Had a patient in the ED the other day who came in by ambulance for "I feel tired." Everyone came out of that encounter unhappy.

People used to see doctors as professionals. Now we're just the functionaries who deliver the govt. mandated entitlements. To the typical Medicaid patient who comes to the ED every month to get a refill for whatever I'm no different than the clerk at the Social Security office.

What was the average med school debt back then? Less than now I'll wager. If money/time was an issue you could go the usual route and do an internship and hang up a shingle. No residency unless you wanted to specialize. Good luck going that route now.

All these things combine to limit your ability to practice medicine. In the olden days they could really try to figure out what was wrong and try to fix it. If they thought something was really nothing they could treat it like nothing without the threat of the massive lawsuit. They knew they'd get paid so paperwork was a non-issue. You wrote in the chart to remind yourself what was going on later, not so some bean counter could code your work or decide if you should be paid or not.

Were the "good old days" perfect? No. Were they better. Maybe not. But they just didn't have to contend with some of the things we do today.
 
Sorry to interject physicians but I just bought this old movie that is amazing in characterizing the rather different medical culture that DocB is referring to.

It's called "The Hospital". George C. Scott is the main character. Think Patton walking around a 1971 hospital with a bottle of whiskey.

There's no take home message, just a vastly different style of medical practice revealed in all sorts of interactions, Hollywood or no it is pertinent to the thread I believe because it is a relic of 1970's pop culture.
 
I hear that in the 80s.. if they wanted to find the neurosurgeon in the hospital, all they had to do was look for a unkempt looking drunk that lived in the hospital. :meanie: Did that really change? :laugh:
 
I hear that in the 80s.. if they wanted to find the neurosurgeon in the hospital, all they had to do was look for a unkempt looking drunk that lived in the hospital. :meanie: Did that really change? :laugh:

Yes, now you have to look for the unkempt drunk who only comes to the hospital for scheduled cases.

Many hospitals that aren't Level 1 trauma centers have trouble finding neurosurgery coverage.
 
Sorry to interject physicians but I just bought this old movie that is amazing in characterizing the rather different medical culture that DocB is referring to.

It's called "The Hospital". George C. Scott is the main character. Think Patton walking around a 1971 hospital with a bottle of whiskey.

There's no take home message, just a vastly different style of medical practice revealed in all sorts of interactions, Hollywood or no it is pertinent to the thread I believe because it is a relic of 1970's pop culture.
I love seeing old movies or TV shows where the doctor is some totally distinguished looking white male sitting behind the huge mahogany desk talking to patients while smoking. I guess it was just how things were back then but now it's so incongruous it makes the whole scene look weird.
 
Yes, now you have to look for the unkempt drunk who only comes to the hospital for scheduled cases.

Many hospitals that aren't Level 1 trauma centers have trouble finding neurosurgery coverage.

Obviously neurosurgery is not important enough otherwise the government would get involved to train more neurosurgeons. They better watch out, else business will be taken over by Vascular Surgery and Vascular Neurology... they'll end up degenerating like CT surgery and cardiology.. we already hear about vascular neurologists being hot commodity.
 
I love seeing old movies or TV shows where the doctor is some totally distinguished looking white male sitting behind the huge mahogany desk talking to patients while smoking. I guess it was just how things were back then but now it's so incongruous it makes the whole scene look weird.

:laugh:Yes. I had the same holy **** reaction. It's no wonder why people--well...let's be honest...white men people--would miss that. Even in the cynical story telling mold of that era you can sense a certain awe for the white coat overlaying a 3 piece suit. Nurses strutting around in silly white outfits scurrying to get out of the way wrath of the white coated old fellow who's having a bad morning after an alcoholic binge. It was "cool" in a certain rat pack irreverent way and altogether hilarious in its patriarchal absurdity for our culture.
 
Sorry to interject physicians but I just bought this old movie that is amazing in characterizing the rather different medical culture that DocB is referring to.

It's called "The Hospital". George C. Scott is the main character. Think Patton walking around a 1971 hospital with a bottle of whiskey.

There's no take home message, just a vastly different style of medical practice revealed in all sorts of interactions, Hollywood or no it is pertinent to the thread I believe because it is a relic of 1970's pop culture.

There is a 1950's TV series on DVD now called "Medic". It's an interesting look at 1950's medicine (neurosurgery was quite different w/o CT/MRI) without a lot of soap opera drama or absurdity. (Though the first episode featured an overworked GP who performed a tracheotomy on a child in his office. The child was not anesthetized and did not cry.)

The hilarious part is the narration at the beginning of each episode:
"The traits of the physician are three -- the eye of an eagle, the heart of a lion, and the HAND of a WOMAN!"

That will now be my Student Doc signature. :laugh:
 
The practice of medicine was somewhat cooler. Medicine itself sucked way more. We can actually fix some things now. That's actually the problem. Back then, people knew that they didn't have much chance of getting better. It's easier to be respected for having a huge fund of knowledge if there is no existant gold standard as to how to apply it.

P.S. Medicine is much more awesome now if you are a healthcare worker who is NOT a doctor. There is also a direct correlation between increasing worthlessness and increasing quality of life in modern medicine.
 
There is a 1950's TV series on DVD now called "Medic". It's an interesting look at 1950's medicine (neurosurgery was quite different w/o CT/MRI) without a lot of soap opera drama or absurdity. (Though the first episode featured an overworked GP who performed a tracheotomy on a child in his office. The child was not anesthetized and did not cry.)

The hilarious part is the narration at the beginning of each episode:
"The traits of the physician are three -- the eye of an eagle, the heart of a lion, and the HAND of a WOMAN!"

That will now be my Student Doc signature. :laugh:

In the words of my mentor...
The traits of of a surgeon are four---"the eyes of an eagle, the heart of a lion, the hands of a lady and...THE BALLS OF A MONKEY!!!!!"
 
My understanding is that several things had not happened which have served to decrease job satisfaction among physicians.

***Please note that I am about to list some things that are bad about the profession of medicine. Any of you who don't want to hear any more bitching from us whiners due to our stupidity and laziness should bail out now.***

Managed care, and I include CMS in that, demands a huge amount of paperwork, justification and administrative overhead to get paid. Back in the day this was not as bad. Many physicians who had to deal with this as it evolved felt it was a blow against their judgement and autonomy because they had to justify everything they did. That is true but the rest of us are just used to it now.

Medical Malpractice was not the life sucking beast from Hell that it is now. You could really only get sued if you really screwed up and then only for real damages, not for the Power Ball.

People didn't expect medicine to fix every aspect of their lives. Now the ads tell people to go to a doctor for everything from feeling sad to being fat to can't get an erection. Had a patient in the ED the other day who came in by ambulance for "I feel tired." Everyone came out of that encounter unhappy.

People used to see doctors as professionals. Now we're just the functionaries who deliver the govt. mandated entitlements. To the typical Medicaid patient who comes to the ED every month to get a refill for whatever I'm no different than the clerk at the Social Security office.

What was the average med school debt back then? Less than now I'll wager. If money/time was an issue you could go the usual route and do an internship and hang up a shingle. No residency unless you wanted to specialize. Good luck going that route now.

All these things combine to limit your ability to practice medicine. In the olden days they could really try to figure out what was wrong and try to fix it. If they thought something was really nothing they could treat it like nothing without the threat of the massive lawsuit. They knew they'd get paid so paperwork was a non-issue. You wrote in the chart to remind yourself what was going on later, not so some bean counter could code your work or decide if you should be paid or not.

Were the "good old days" perfect? No. Were they better. Maybe not. But they just didn't have to contend with some of the things we do today.

to add... there were plenty of things that weren't known or had no treatment "back in the day." i had an older physician a few months ago tell me that in the past, there was little to do for patients, but the doctor was there at the bedside. the doctor was there to see the patient and family through it. today, there is more potential to do something, there are more things available, but the doctor isn't there as much at the bedside holding the patient's hand... depending on how you look at it, that's either a good thing or a bad thing.

i have attending's who trained in the 1970s... when there was no ct scanner, there was no mri... they didn't know what hiv was.... didn't know what hepatitis b or c was... the only antifungal's was amphotericin b in it's lipophilic or non-lipophilic form... no mrsa... hell, the double helix structure of dna had only been known for a decade... ace inhibitors were only just in their infancy... even into the 1980s, we didn't know some of what we know now, as even cardiologists who trained then will tell you that they used to think beta blockers early in an mi would kill a patient.

and back in the 70s, they used to admit patients for routine physicals and labs... so rather than the stage 4 breast cancer status post radiation chemotherapy who presented with an undetectable white blood cell count and neutropenic sepsis (like i just admitted 30-40 minutes ago); they'd admit the 45 year old gentleman in need of an h&p, and some basic labs.

patients are sicker and more complex than they were then. 1977, that patient i admitted tonight was likely dead... 30 years later, she's got a chance.

so, i imagine that admitting patients who weren't terribly complex, or admitting patients who were on death's door without a chance to do anything, and without the expectation of the patient or the family that a miracle be pulled off was a bit easier than many of the patients we see these days. throw in higher reimbursement, little questioning from insurance companies/hmo's/medicare about the care of patients, more autonomy and it's easy to see why the "heyday" really was that cool.
 
Only a med student but an older doc gave me an interesting view during Internal Medicine.

We had just seen a 91 one year old woman who's scheduled visit was simply her listing off the same minor, vague complaints she lists every time she comes into the office (he showed me his previos SOAP notes all for "constipation, stiff knees, feels tired more often, occassional headache, thinks she's taking too many pills")

The gist of what he said was "This woman went into early heart failure a decade ago. If she had been my patient when I started practicing, she'd be long dead by now. Now, ACE inhibitors, beta blockers, statins, and stenting have kept her alive. However, she's oblivious to this fact. She doesn't realize all the extra time we've given her. All she can focus on are the complaints of being old that I can't fix".
 
The gist of what he said was "This woman went into early heart failure a decade ago. If she had been my patient when I started practicing, she'd be long dead by now. Now, ACE inhibitors, beta blockers, statins, and stenting have kept her alive. However, she's oblivious to this fact. She doesn't realize all the extra time we've given her. All she can focus on are the complaints of being old that I can't fix".

This is true. A lot of patients think that every complaint they have is going to fixed, like they go to the doctor and come back feeling like they're 25 again or something. Or they take lots of medications and then talk about how "evil pharmeceutical companies" are screwing them (even physicians do this, which is REALLY pathetic). Although it's not PC to say this, when I run into patients who have lengthy lists of medical co-morbidities and lengthier lists of medications, when they start in with complaints about everything I just want to tell them to shut the hell up. I don't care that you had a cough one day and a runny nose a week ago and loose stools for one bowel movement. It's really ridiculous that they even bring up stuff like that.
 
Too Funny...:laugh:

Early to mid-80s... in Chicago...

One could light up a smoke ANYWHERE... hall, patients room, anywhere...

Then only at the nurses station...

Then only in the waiting area or lounge...

Then the "smoking section" was moved too some room/area in the hospital basement (sometimes ventilated... sometimes not)...

Then only outside the building in the designated "smoking kiosks/butt-huts" (some heated... some not)...
The final iteration is NO SMOKING on the hospital campus. Not in the parking lot (inside or outside of YOUR car), not on any of the hospital property... period !!!!

(some of these hospital campuses are 50-60 acres square so the 15 min smoke break takes 30-min... which apparently is a source of contention between the smoking and non-smoking "ancillary staff).


I remember those smoke filled nurses stations with ashtrays on the counters... 🙁
 
the reason that medicine in the 70s was that much cooler was....

you worked for the same amount that you get paid now and you worked 50 percent less.. and the patients were not as sick.. Someone mentioned wednesdays off.. think about having every wednesday off as a rule.. work four days a week.. doing easy bread and butter stuff.. The patient of this century are all on deaths door. I am an anesthesiologist, I routinely see patients who are I mean I cant believe they are alive.. Yet i have to put them to sleep. and if they die on my watch.. im the dingus and i will get sued.. Thats not very satisfying.. and for peanuts.. 100 dollars for 4 hours work.. Medicine to me is terribly un satisfying.. I wonder what i could have done if i didnt go into medicine
 
Patients came and stayed in the hospital for weeks & months compared to the 23h OBS and fast discharge with outpatient follow up that we do now.

There was no EBM and there were large variations in practice patterns.

There were no women or minorities in medicine.

The 80 hour work week did not exist; residents who were mostly single young men literally resided in the hospital.

No such thing as EMR. I knew someone who kept medical records on 3x5 notecards written in pencil.

And the smoking... hilarious.
 
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