WCUCOM vs ATSUSOMA

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Hello,
I recently got accepted to WCUCOM and ATSUSOMA for the 2023 class off the accepted pending open seat list. I wanted to ask which one would be better to pursue for a Diagnostic Radiology residency? My backup I'm shooting for is Anesthesiology.
From the data I have seen, it seems that diagnostic radiology is considered "IMG friendly" so does this mean it's easier for DO's to get into it as well?
Furthermore, anyone have useful tips on how fresh medical students can get a good step forward from the start of class to crush their COMLEX and STEP exams from the start of classes? I plan to pair my classes with 3rd party resources synced with Anki. If there are better ways, please let me know.
Thank you!

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Hello,
I recently got accepted to WCUCOM and ATSUSOMA for the 2023 class off the accepted pending open seat list. I wanted to ask which one would be better to pursue for a Diagnostic Radiology residency? My backup I'm shooting for is Anesthesiology.
From the data I have seen, it seems that diagnostic radiology is considered "IMG friendly" so does this mean it's easier for DO's to get into it as well?
Furthermore, anyone have useful tips on how fresh medical students can get a good step forward from the start of class to crush their COMLEX and STEP exams from the start of classes? I plan to pair my classes with 3rd party resources synced with Anki. If there are better ways, please let me know.
Thank you!
Saying this as a first year at WCUCOM, I would go to the school that is going to give YOU the best chance of success, because that is what's going to give you the best chance to match into the specialty of your choice. A school matching more people into Rads is no predictor whatsoever of your chance to match into that specialty 4 years from now. Even if you chose that school that matched more people into Rads, if the culture is bad, its far from home/doesn't match your values, etc. and you burnout/perform poorly because of your emotional/mental health/lack of support (insert whatever misaligned value matters to you), it won't matter. That's gonna hurt your chances way more than choosing a school that matches 2 people less in Rads.

That said, I did look at match lists for the school I chose, and one of my *lesser* factors in choosing that school was the fact they had matched a couple people into programs I could *potentially* see myself in, just because I felt like those could be potential connections later on. but again that was a minimal factor. Ultimately, choose the school that has the best culture/matches your values and the things that will help you succeed the most!

As far as studying, as someone who was asking these exact questions a year ago, I will tell you the best advice I've gotten to "study" for COMLEX/STEP first year is to study well and perform well in your classes. Especially first year, studying for classes IS studying for COMLEX/STEP. The only thing I would say is if you use Boards/Beyond for classes like biochem, you could keep the relevant AnKing cards unsuspended throughout the year to keep that material fresh. Other than that, I can tell you there just isn't enough time to start thinking about anything else other than performing well in your classes getting involved in your school's EC's/research, and kind of like the AAMC content for MCAT, I've been advised to really save the high yield stuff until second year when it's fresh and more relevant to the second year content. It's also good to keep in mind that your study strategies for each class are going to shift, sometimes block to block, dependent on how much boards relevant content is in that class/block. I'd just definitely advise that you keep an open mind to study strategies and be willing to adjust if need be!

Overall I would say as HARD as you may want to try and plan ahead and prepare and feel super in control for August (I was the exact same way), beyond getting your life in order, there really is just no preparation you can do to be fully "ready" for what first year is like academically. I hated when people told me this, but it really is true. The best thing you can do is just enjoy your time off, try to relax, and get the non academic aspects of your life in order because once first year starts you *will not* want to have to deal with pesky health stuff, a broken down car, dental work, etc. Take care of that stuff now if you can and *that* will set you up best for success in pre-clinical and ultimately success in second year/boards!

All that said, the months between acceptance and the start of med school were some of the best of my life so enjoy it! Starting med school will be the hardest thing you've ever done, but it will also be one of the most rewarding, and you'll want to look back on every phase of the journey and know you were present and lived those moments to the fullest! Congrats!
 
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Thanks so much for the advice! I realized that I can only control my academic prep so much (very little) before I actually start classes and get my feet wet! As for the number of people matching a particular specialty in a school, I understand that people have different goals and that just because one school has more matches in one specialty, doesn't make it better than another school. I was just wondering if either school would have easy access to a support system for students to achieve such residencies in terms of acquiring research, extracurriculars, and mentors to guide. I'm sure all schools do, but students would have the best insight of how easy it was for them to acquire what they needed.

So far, WCUCOM is my top choice out of my previous applications because I will be just 1.5 hours away from my family and friends in Jackson. I also already went ahead and paid my deposit as well as signed up for a lease. I got accepted to ATSUSOMA yesterday so its got me reevaluating my choice, because that is also a good school too. Financially (on top of cheaper tuition, it would be a pain to pay another deposit and lose the work I have done so far) and family support wise, WCUCOM makes the most sense, but I am completely unsure what the culture will be for either schools. Do you have any advise of how to figure that out? It would be extremely helpful for me to gauge this if WCUCOM or any school threw like an open day for accepted candidates to mingle with and pick the brain of some first years! Maybe they will before class starts, but we also have SDN filled with helpful people :)
Saying this as a first year at WCUCOM, I would go to the school that is going to give YOU the best chance of success, because that is what's going to give you the best chance to match into the specialty of your choice. A school matching more people into Rads is no predictor whatsoever of your chance to match into that specialty 4 years from now. Even if you chose that school that matched more people into Rads, if the culture is bad, its far from home/doesn't match your values, etc. and you burnout/perform poorly because of your emotional/mental health/lack of support (insert whatever misaligned value matters to you), it won't matter. That's gonna hurt your chances way more than choosing a school that matches 2 people less in Rads.

That said, I did look at match lists for the school I chose, and one of my *lesser* factors in choosing that school was the fact they had matched a couple people into programs I could *potentially* see myself in, just because I felt like those could be potential connections later on. but again that was a minimal factor. Ultimately, choose the school that has the best culture/matches your values and the things that will help you succeed the most!

As far as studying, as someone who was asking these exact questions a year ago, I will tell you the best advice I've gotten to "study" for COMLEX/STEP first year is to study well and perform well in your classes. Especially first year, studying for classes IS studying for COMLEX/STEP. The only thing I would say is if you use Boards/Beyond for classes like biochem, you could keep the relevant AnKing cards unsuspended throughout the year to keep that material fresh. Other than that, I can tell you there just isn't enough time to start thinking about anything else other than performing well in your classes getting involved in your school's EC's/research, and kind of like the AAMC content for MCAT, I've been advised to really save the high yield stuff until second year when it's fresh and more relevant to the second year content. It's also good to keep in mind that your study strategies for each class are going to shift, sometimes block to block, dependent on how much boards relevant content is in that class/block. I'd just definitely advise that you keep an open mind to study strategies and be willing to adjust if need be!

Overall I would say as HARD as you may want to try and plan ahead and prepare and feel super in control for August (I was the exact same way), beyond getting your life in order, there really is just no preparation you can do to be fully "ready" for what first year is like academically. I hated when people told me this, but it really is true. The best thing you can do is just enjoy your time off, try to relax, and get the non academic aspects of your life in order because once first year starts you *will not* want to have to deal with pesky health stuff, a broken down car, dental work, etc. Take care of that stuff now if you can and *that* will set you up best for success in pre-clinical and ultimately success in second year/boards!

All that said, the months between acceptance and the start of med school were some of the best of my life so enjoy it! Starting med school will be the hardest thing you've ever done, but it will also be one of the most rewarding, and you'll want to look back on every phase of the journey and know you were present and lived those moments to the fullest! Congrats!
 
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I know this thread is a bit old, but I would like yall's opinion about WCUCOM vs ATSUSOMA for the class of 2023. Especially @Goro 's opinion. Based on my research, both schools have their pros and cons, but I am slightly leaning toward WCUCOM for reasons below. My dream is to match Diagnostic Rads but want to have a backup: Anesthesia

WCUCOM pros:
Cheaper tuition
Already paid deposit + signed appartment
Close to family (1.5 hrs away)
Pass/Fail system
Good chance I will match in southeastern regions to continue to stay close to family
Is part of an undergrad campus so perhaps lots of faculty may be doing research which I hope easily participate.

WCUCOM cons:
Used to be Goro's ban list but is now off of it.
^^^Not sure about the match stats and placements for residency.

ATSUSOMA pros:
DO+MPH program option, slightly interested in this.
Stronger placements (from what I can see) in top residencies such as Derm, Rads, and Ortho.
Im 24 and I spent all my undergrad commuting from home so its kind of alluring to completely be on my own in a new place.
Older and more established

ATSUSOMA cons:
1+3 curriculum (just don't know how this will help me on COMLEX/STEP)
Being shipped somewhere for clinicals
Curriculum changes are frequent
School focuses on Primary care so I am not sure how to go about obtaining research etc for Rads, especially if I am shipped out for clinicals.

I am grateful for your advice!
Thanks
 
I know this thread is a bit old, but I would like yall's opinion about WCUCOM vs ATSUSOMA for the class of 2023. Especially @Goro 's opinion. Based on my research, both schools have their pros and cons, but I am slightly leaning toward WCUCOM for reasons below. My dream is to match Diagnostic Rads but want to have a backup: Anesthesia

WCUCOM pros:
Cheaper tuition
Already paid deposit + signed appartment
Close to family (1.5 hrs away)
Pass/Fail system
Good chance I will match in southeastern regions to continue to stay close to family
Is part of an undergrad campus so perhaps lots of faculty may be doing research which I hope easily participate.

WCUCOM cons:
Used to be Goro's ban list but is now off of it.
^^^Not sure about the match stats and placements for residency.

ATSUSOMA pros:
DO+MPH program option, slightly interested in this.
Stronger placements (from what I can see) in top residencies such as Derm, Rads, and Ortho.
Im 24 and I spent all my undergrad commuting from home so its kind of alluring to completely be on my own in a new place.
Older and more established

ATSUSOMA cons:
1+3 curriculum (just don't know how this will help me on COMLEX/STEP)
Being shipped somewhere for clinicals
Curriculum changes are frequent
School focuses on Primary care so I am not sure how to go about obtaining research etc for Rads, especially if I am shipped out for clinicals.

I am grateful for your advice!
Thanks

The most important factor for choosing a school when it comes to targeting specific specailties is honestly if they have a home program. This helps with networking and research. As far as I know neither of these programs have rad or anesthesia, correct me if I am wrong. In terms of undergrad research that is not going to be helpful so I wouldn't consider that as a deciding factor. The most important aspect of matching into a specialty is not where you went to medical school, but how you performed against your peers. Realize that both of the specialties you listed are competitive and are not DO friendly. They hey both had 60% match rates for DO students in the 2022 cycle which is not great. So just keep this in mind. If you do good on your clinical rotation and most importantly have a step II score equivalent to or better than your MD counterparts then you have a good chance of matching. You can separate yourself from other DO applicants by doing summer research at anesthesia research programs and doing away rotations your 4th year to get good letters of recommendation and connections. When it comes to DO schools there are very few that actually separate themselves apart from others in terms of actually helping you match. These would be medical schools that have home prorams and research in your desired field. Otherwise you matching or not will be completely determined on your work ethic.
 
The most important factor for choosing a school when it comes to targeting specific specailties is honestly if they have a home program. This helps with networking and research. As far as I know neither of these programs have rad or anesthesia, correct me if I am wrong. In terms of undergrad research that is not going to be helpful so I wouldn't consider that as a deciding factor. The most important aspect of matching into a specialty is not where you went to medical school, but how you performed against your peers. Realize that both of the specialties you listed are competitive and are not DO friendly. They hey both had 60% match rates for DO students in the 2022 cycle which is not great. So just keep this in mind. If you do good on your clinical rotation and most importantly have a step II score equivalent to or better than your MD counterparts then you have a good chance of matching. You can separate yourself from other DO applicants by doing summer research at anesthesia research programs and doing away rotations your 4th year to get good letters of recommendation and connections. When it comes to DO schools there are very few that actually separate themselves apart from others in terms of actually helping you match. These would be medical schools that have home prorams and research in your desired field. Otherwise you matching or not will be completely determined on your work ethic.
Thanks for the blueprint! I will certainly work for the strong scores and obtaining research in my 2nd year summer and recommendations/connections during my 4th year.
You are correct that WCUCOM and ATSUSOMA don't have any home programs, but WCUCOM's rotation sites are all in Mississippi and Louisiana while ATSUSOMA's is spread out with their CHC sites in multiple states. At WCUCOM's rotation sites, they seem to be smaller private organizations making the list among some big ones while ATSUSOMA is just big ones because they are CHC sites.

Do you think bigger places would be better to chose for rotations? I could imagine smaller ones would give great LOR's but the bigger ones would provide more connections.

I used to shadow a Psychiatrist at my state's mental ward. He had lots of WCUCOM rotate under him, but he was in a small team of 4 other docs. Although I am sure he gave great LOR's because he was a great guy, I am not sure if a small organization would be the best choice for rotations. I'm sure the students (and I at the time) learned a lot from all the really extreme cases.

 
Thread moved to School X vs Y forums. I have also merged your other posts to this thread to consolidate them.

WCU seems good for you. P/F, close to family and the fact you don’t have to deal with the curriculum that has gotten a lot of complaints lately at SOMA.
 
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I'm did not attend ATSU-SOMA, but I saw this from one of the very first posts on the ATSU-SOMA 2022-2023 application thread. And based on some of these alone, I would kinda be weary about going there. No DO school is perfect, but some will be worse than others.

Come to ATSU-SOMA if you want the following:

✅A new dean almost every year - our previous Dean was in her position for a whopping 11 months

✅A brand new untested curriculum

✅Sudden curriculum changes in the middle of a course

✅High tuition for a curriculum where you essentially teach yourself medicine - when the school was asked why tuition was so high during the COVID-19 lockdown, their response was "Zoom is more expensive than having in-person classes" o m e g a l u l.

✅New faculty hired to replace the massive wave of professors who left the previous year

✅An administration that disregards feedback and complaints from students and even professors - force professors and deans out of their positions because they disagree with policies

✅Take exams that focus on minutiae from PhD professors’ research despite promises to 'teach to the boards' - you also can't review your exams when you get your grade back because they're too lazy to hold feedback sessions.

✅Multiple mandatory 8-hour Kaplan practice exams (which don't even reflect the boards) - you also can't review your exams when you get your grade back

✅Declining board pass rates – 10 students failed COMLEX last year (and board pass rates haven't been published recently 🤔)

✅No board dedicated time – instead go to class up to 5x a week, review OMM material for several hours (because that's more important than anything else), and have school exams up until May. The school expects you to take boards at the end of May (lmao)

✅Being discouraged from taking USMLE step 1 'because primary care residencies don't need it' and 'you're a DO student'

✅Being threatened to take COMLEX level 1 before July 1 or else you have explain yourself to the Student Performance Committee - a negative mark goes onto your MSPE

✅Being forced to do a useless research project in second year on top of clinic, 3 classes, and board studying

✅Being a slave in a clinic in second year – shadow doctors for 8 hours per week for no grade while exams are around the corner

✅Take a useless epidemiology/biostats course for the entirety of second year in which the course contents can be summarized in an email

✅Feeling isolated and having no support from the school in year 2 and beyond

✅Laughable mental health services – being told they can’t help you because they’re unlicensed in your particular state

✅Receive threats of expulsion from the school for 1 poor quiz/exam performance

✅Participate in countless hours of stupid wellness meetings during critical periods (like right before an exam) because "yOuR mEnTaL hEaLtH iS iMpOrTaNt tO uS"

✅Have OMM shoved down your throats by professors who drank the osteopathy Kool-Aid

✅Have insecure rotation spots and living in fear that you may have to rotate 100’s of miles away because the school can't keep their end of the deal. The Texas CHC was shutdown in the midst of the pandemic because the school failed to take the necessary steps to get approved by the state and clinical sites. Luckily it was resolved months later. The NY CHC failed to renew their partnership with NYU Langone for rotation spots. They were forced to partner with Wyckoff Heights Medical Center as a last resort. Not long ago, Wyckoff severed ties with ATSU out of the blue, forcing the 3rd and 4th year students out of their rotations. ATSU considered sending students to other CHC locations across the country, but luckily that was resolved too. Who knows what's next?

✅Participate in meetings upon, meetings upon, meetings upon, meetings upon, meetings upon, meetings upon meetings

✅Have fear instilled in you and then participate in meetings about "speaking up" - those that actually speak up then sit in front a council for unprofessionalism

✅Being forced to move up to 3 times in less than 2 years with no support from the school - some students are paying 2 leases in very expensive cities (some have to take private loans to cover the cost of living)

✅Potentially live in poverty because the school will not adjust loans based on the cost-of-living and inflation. Imagine maxing out your loans, any only getting ~$35k to live in a major city like Chicago or NYC where annual rent cost is upwards of $30k.

✅Being forced to enroll in the school's crappy health insurance plan with ridiculous co-pays in 3rd and 4th year because "Medicaid doesn't provide enough coverage" and "Medicaid doesn't cross state-lines." The school insurance actually excludes mental health coverage (l m a o) which Medicaid covers (and a lot more). Here's a kicker - the school's insurance plan doesn't cover abortion unless it was due to rape or incest. That's just one of the asinine exclusions that the insurance plan has. The majority of students plan on doing their away rotations in a state where their Medicaid plan is valid, however the school still won't accept it for reasons unknown. For those who are actually going out-of-state for away rotations, the school forbids temporary coverage for those weeks. It's another $4000 per year going into the school's pockets on top of your increasing tuition fees.

✅Being forced to take a poorly written practice exam that has a notoriously bad predictive value just 2 weeks into your limited "dedicated" time (the few quiet weeks in May when the school finally leaves us the f**k alone). Just as you're about to take COMSAE you receive threats of expulsion for failing. This is straight from Dr. Coty:

Ironic that this is coming from a man who holds a PhD in anatomy and has never taken a medical board exam in his life. How is he responsible for ensuring that we pass the boards? His policies are so stupid that LECOM Bradenton (his former school in which he utterly sabotaged) made a website dedicated to his stupidity. You can read about it here: LECOM-a-SUTRA (Search results for: coty) (tumblr.com)

Some highlights from the previous year's thread:











Some gems from reddit:​





Do yourself a favor and don't come here.

ATSU leadership should be embarrassed.

 
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Thanks so much for the advice! I realized that I can only control my academic prep so much (very little) before I actually start classes and get my feet wet! As for the number of people matching a particular specialty in a school, I understand that people have different goals and that just because one school has more matches in one specialty, doesn't make it better than another school. I was just wondering if either school would have easy access to a support system for students to achieve such residencies in terms of acquiring research, extracurriculars, and mentors to guide. I'm sure all schools do, but students would have the best insight of how easy it was for them to acquire what they needed.

So far, WCUCOM is my top choice out of my previous applications because I will be just 1.5 hours away from my family and friends in Jackson. I also already went ahead and paid my deposit as well as signed up for a lease. I got accepted to ATSUSOMA yesterday so its got me reevaluating my choice, because that is also a good school too. Financially (on top of cheaper tuition, it would be a pain to pay another deposit and lose the work I have done so far) and family support wise, WCUCOM makes the most sense, but I am completely unsure what the culture will be for either schools. Do you have any advise of how to figure that out? It would be extremely helpful for me to gauge this if WCUCOM or any school threw like an open day for accepted candidates to mingle with and pick the brain of some first years! Maybe they will before class starts, but we also have SDN filled with helpful people :)
all that totally makes sense! have you visited either school yet? if it's possible, i would definitely try to visit both places. i know at WCU we have prospective/accepted students tour and have lunch with current students so they can ask honest questions and the get the vibe.

one thing i will say is the culture of your class going to totally depend on the people in your class. which obviously you can't predict. i think what you want to look at is how the school sets you up to develop a good culture: P/F curriculum, openness to feedback from students, etc. all of which are things you can ask current students when you visit!
 
Thanks for the blueprint! I will certainly work for the strong scores and obtaining research in my 2nd year summer and recommendations/connections during my 4th year.
You are correct that WCUCOM and ATSUSOMA don't have any home programs, but WCUCOM's rotation sites are all in Mississippi and Louisiana while ATSUSOMA's is spread out with their CHC sites in multiple states. At WCUCOM's rotation sites, they seem to be smaller private organizations making the list among some big ones while ATSUSOMA is just big ones because they are CHC sites.

Do you think bigger places would be better to chose for rotations? I could imagine smaller ones would give great LOR's but the bigger ones would provide more connections.

I used to shadow a Psychiatrist at my state's mental ward. He had lots of WCUCOM rotate under him, but he was in a small team of 4 other docs. Although I am sure he gave great LOR's because he was a great guy, I am not sure if a small organization would be the best choice for rotations. I'm sure the students (and I at the time) learned a lot from all the really extreme cases.

The bigger ones will have more doctors definitely, but that doesn’t always translate to better connections and networking. The best rotations I’ve had and the most meaningful were smaller rotations where I worked directly with 1-2 doctors the entire time as opposed to rotating between 20 doctors. It’s impossible to gauge this in your decision because maybe the big program at the hospital you rotate at would better understand than working with a doctor who is a terrible preceptor for a month. I wouldn’t factor this into your decision because it’s too variable
 
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