What are examples of things on your app to make you stand out?

[aspiring20]

---

Members do not see this ad.

Africa volunteer trip.

sarcasm, right?

 

[Frazier]

Beyond the 40 mcat, D1 athlete, rhodes, etc... the way one words their EC descriptions does play a major role in an applicant "standing out" from the pack.

 

[mimelim]

Would it be worth noting AP classes/college classes, and major awards you won in competitions while in high school?

Your application tells your story to admissions committees. How do you want to be defined? Are your high school achievements defining/characteristic of yourself? Why do you want to put them in your application? What do they add? Answer those questions for yourself. Never add things to an application for the sake of adding them. Add them for a reason.

 

[Geebeejay]

Unless you're an Olympic athlete, astronaut, or something like that, I'm guessing that ADCOMs have seen plenty of applicants with just about every EC you can possibly think of.

A few of you mentioned non-profits. This currently can be very beneficial to people who have access to a lot of money, since you can create something that "looks good," with minimal effort... But I think once ADCOMs catch on, premed generated non-profits will go the way of medical mission trips in the eyes of ADCOM members.

Do you know what would really make an applicant stand out in my eyes if I were an ADCOM?

If someone wrote a sincere essay about why they chose NOT to pursue all of these activities that every premed is doing. I think honesty can go a very long way. After all, isn't that what ADCOMs are looking for in the first place?

👍
Interviewer: What about you and your application do you think is unique?
Me Well, I'm sure there are plenty of applicants that have done the same things I have, so I can't in good conscience say that anything about my application is unique, but (blah blah blah)

result: accepted. Moral? Have identity and personality and you won't come off as boring and forgettable to Adcoms.

 

[Planes2Doc]

👍
Interviewer: What about you and your application do you think is unique?
Me Well, I'm sure there are plenty of applicants that have done the same things I have, so I can't in good conscience say that anything about my application is unique, but (blah blah blah)

result: accepted. Moral? Have identity and personality and you won't come off as boring and forgettable to Adcoms.

Wow congrats!!!

That is very brave, but I'm glad that the risk you took turned out well! Now what would happen if more people had the courage to stand up and do this?

I would love to see SDN members genuinely take their own advice and DO WHAT YOU ARE PASSIONATE ABOUT.

 

[Neuronette]

A couple of the activities I did are directly relevant to my major and several of the awards are also related to my interests (non medical) and field of research I am interested in (neuroscience)....

 

[Planes2Doc]

Why they started doing it doesn't matter if they have good essays about what they learned. Not everyone cares about volunteering when they start it, but if they learn from it and learn to like it, that's more than enough.

Why they started it DOES matter when people are trying to portray themselves as something they're not. I'm sure that there are some applicants that are honest about their intentions (usually only doing hospital volunteering), and tell the ADCOMs that either they wanted to learn more about the hospital environment, or because it was an integral part of the application.

But that's not what's happening here... People who don't care about volunteering, as you said, will still portray themselves as these bleeding heart individuals who would never want to work for money and are absolutely dying to help the underserved. Yes, some people who did not care about it will begin to genuinely enjoy it, and other people are just gunners who understand the medical school admissions process well (see SDN), and will make whatever sacrifices they need to in order to achieve their goal.

I wouldn't have a problem with this if people were honest about their intentions. But when they are attempting to portray themselves as the next Mother Teresa, when in reality they couldn't be further from it, well then it's just wrong. With all the emphasis placed on honesty in the medical field, I feel that this is just PLAIN WRONG! Once again, I don't blame these people or have anything against them.

People are staking virtually everything on getting into medical school. So anyone would be an idiot to not do everything in their power to get accepted.

Now back to the OP's question, since I'm not sure if I actually answered it or not...

Chances are that you will not be an Olympic athlete, marathon runner, astronaut, cowboy, CEO of a Fortune 500 company, four star general in the military, congressman, senator, or any other thing that will actually set you apart. So if you're looking for things that will look good, here's what you can do (realistically):

What's Hot:

NON-PROFIT ORGANIZATION: Apparently starting non-profits is in these days with the ADCOMs. A few SDN members here talked about friends/acquaintances that were admitted to good schools because of non-profits. These are obviously a lot of work, unless you have a lot of money and are doing this solely to get into medical school. If this is the case, then you need to incorporate the company, hire a website developer to build a website, and usually wealthy parents can donate $10k+ to make it look legitimate. If you genuinely care about what you are doing, then chances are you need partners to help you or you will not be able to handle a full workload with pre-reqs and the MCAT. Also, while I've heard of young entrepreneurs in college, most start for-profit companies with the intentions of making the most money. I'm sure people also start non-profit companies, but NOT charities, in order to make money too (remember that NON-PROFIT =/= CHARITY).

ZERO TO MOTHER TERESA > 1 Year: Please be assured that I'm not a hypocrite when I say this, but suddenly going from never volunteering to devoting the better years of college to serving your community through multiple organizations still looks good in the eyes of the ADCOMs, and will not arouse suspicion. BUT, it will look good under one condition... You must make sure that you didn't end up doing all of these activities within a year or so of applying to medical school. In that case, you will end up looking like a horrible "box-checker" who was doing the activities solely for the sake of putting them on your application. On the other hand, if you've been doing them since freshman or sophomore year, you will be perceived as a saint. The funny thing is that the person who did the long-term commitment and is seen as a saint might have just been a gunner that was well-informed of the medical school admissions process. Have you ever met those people that are so uninformed that all they think they need to do is take the entrance exam and submit an application?

PEACE CORPS: I haven't done this, but this does look good. This will require you to take time off from school or do this after graduating. I know of people on SDN who did this before getting into medical school. Even though this was not medical school, I do have a friend who used Peace Corps to dramatically improve his law school application. He had a pretty bad GPA at the University of Wisconsin at Madison. He originally got into a first tier (not T14) law school, and eventually transferred to a T14 school. I would consider him successful.

LONG-TERM MISSION TRIPS: Mission trips usually look bad if it looks like medical tourism. But if you spend either months or years somewhere, then it will probably end up looking good and giving you good stories to talk about. I also want to mention that even though short-term trips now look bad, you can still make one look good if you have a "genuine" reason. Recently there was a thread about someone wanting to do a relief trip to a refugee camp in Syria because he wants to work as a translator and grew up in a war-torn area in the Middle East. That will look legitimate, and thus will look good. But if you go to a Central American country for a couple of weeks and provide a crappy reason as to why you went, then you'll be in trouble.

UNIQUE HOBBIES: If this is something outrageous, ADCOMs will probably like this.

What's "IN" but NOT Special:

"COOKIE CUTTER" VOLUNTEERING: Even though anyone who volunteers should be commended because they are giving up their time and potential earnings to help others, premeds are apparently expected to volunteer or face bad consequences. Contrary to people saying that volunteering "looks good," I believe that the typical premed volunteering gigs in hospital EDs or similar locations will keep you from looking bad. You don't want to be the oddball without these activities, because that will probably end up hurting you unless you have a pretty good explanation. Despite always being downplayed by SDN members, you might have a couple neat experiences or two that are worth writing about. If you're good at conveying your feelings in writing or during an interview, you'll probably be okay. Another good thing is that hospital EDs around college campuses are usually overflowing with premeds. So if you're doing this against your will, you can probably use it as study time.

CLINICAL JOBS: I advise everyone to STAY AWAY from clinical jobs!!! Why you ask? Because so many premeds are already doing them that it's not blazing any new trails. All it does is forces you to work a job with typically inflexible hours that would detract from studying and other important things that would probably have more of a negative impact on your things that would actually end up mattering more for admissions. Since so many premeds are doing either EMT, CNA, scribe, phlebotomist, or other positions, you might be better off doing...

NON-CLINICAL JOBS: I think that combined with "Cookie Cutter" volunteering, can probably give you more of an advantage versus doing clinical work. Why so? Because non-clinical jobs tend to be more unique, at least in some cases. Once again, even though you're unlikely to be blazing any new trails, you can have a far more flexible schedule doing something like a service job. I worked as a pizza delivery guy early on in college. I worked once or twice a week at most, usually 4-5 hours per shift. I ended with $60-$70 in cash a night! Even though it was not mentioned during my medical school interviews, I did talk about it at one of my job interviews. It was well-received.

SHADOWING: Shadowing is considered a requirement. It's pretty easy to do. I actually had very low shadowing hours compared to people here on SDN. I'm not sure if many more hours/different physicians will help, but it may give you more to write about in your essays or talk about during interviews.

What's NOT Hot:

SHORT-TERM MEDICAL MISSION TRIPS: If you end up going on a one or two week medical mission trip to some Central American country, you'll come off as a premed that is doing this as a box-checking activity that doesn't give a crap about the population they are serving. While this may have looked good back in the day, ADCOMs have caught on. Now it can hurt your application if you can't come up with any legitimate reasons as to why you want to volunteer in a foreign country. Unless you are ridiculously good at BSing, then I would suggest you steer away from this!

ZERO TO MOTHER TERESA WITHIN A YEAR OF APPLYING: If you end up cramming a bunch of volunteer activities within a year or less of applying, ADCOMs will perceive you as being a non-genuine applicant that is only looking to check boxes for the sake of their application! I've seen SDN users say how they were told by ADCOMs after being rejected that they didn't do enough volunteering. Yet, if you continue these activities as a reapplicant, you're suddenly viewed as a saint the next cycle. Yay!

"COOKIE CUTTER" VOLUNTEERING WITHIN A YEAR OF APPLYING: See above.

If You're Feeling Adventurous:

EXPLAIN WHY YOU DIDN'T VOLUNTEER OR DO MORE ACTIVITIES: As I have mentioned before, I would greatly respect an applicant if they were completely honest about why they didn't put on the typical song and dance we see being put on for ADCOMs. If someone can genuinely convey their intentions of going into medicine, then I would definitely say go for it. As you know, the more risk you take, the greater the reward. I am in no way saying you should do this, but perhaps this will be the new wave of applicants. Fight against the system, and do what you think is right. There's nothing I hate seeing more than people who devoted all of their undergraduate experience to pleasing the ADCOMs with activities they hated with a passion. You can avoid this by going the "Cookie Cutter" EC route, or just being completely honest about your intentions. I think this would definitely stand out way more than someone who keeps doing the same recycled ECs over and over again! 👍

 

[Testosterone]

Nice. That's some quality posting above there Planes2Doc.

 

[Josh7]

Nice. That's some quality posting above there Planes2Doc.

Anytime I see a post by him I strap myself into my computer chair with a custom airplane seatbelt and prepare for an excellent read.

 

[Flash7]

Anytime I see a post by him I strap myself into my computer chair with a custom airplane seatbelt and prepare for an excellent read.

Wow that sounds really stupid.


Nice post by Planes2Doc.

 

[aspiring20]

Why they started it DOES matter when people are trying to portray themselves as something they're not. I'm sure that there are some applicants that are honest about their intentions (usually only doing hospital volunteering), and tell the ADCOMs that either they wanted to learn more about the hospital environment, or because it was an integral part of the application.

But that's not what's happening here... People who don't care about volunteering, as you said, will still portray themselves as these bleeding heart individuals who would never want to work for money and are absolutely dying to help the underserved. Yes, some people who did not care about it will begin to genuinely enjoy it, and other people are just gunners who understand the medical school admissions process well (see SDN), and will make whatever sacrifices they need to in order to achieve their goal.

I wouldn't have a problem with this if people were honest about their intentions. But when they are attempting to portray themselves as the next Mother Teresa, when in reality they couldn't be further from it, well then it's just wrong. With all the emphasis placed on honesty in the medical field, I feel that this is just PLAIN WRONG! Once again, I don't blame these people or have anything against them.

People are staking virtually everything on getting into medical school. So anyone would be an idiot to not do everything in their power to get accepted.

Now back to the OP's question, since I'm not sure if I actually answered it or not...

Chances are that you will not be an Olympic athlete, marathon runner, astronaut, cowboy, CEO of a Fortune 500 company, four star general in the military, congressman, senator, or any other thing that will actually set you apart. So if you're looking for things that will look good, here's what you can do (realistically):

What's Hot:

NON-PROFIT ORGANIZATION: Apparently starting non-profits is in these days with the ADCOMs. A few SDN members here talked about friends/acquaintances that were admitted to good schools because of non-profits. These are obviously a lot of work, unless you have a lot of money and are doing this solely to get into medical school. If this is the case, then you need to incorporate the company, hire a website developer to build a website, and usually wealthy parents can donate $10k+ to make it look legitimate. If you genuinely care about what you are doing, then chances are you need partners to help you or you will not be able to handle a full workload with pre-reqs and the MCAT. Also, while I've heard of young entrepreneurs in college, most start for-profit companies with the intentions of making the most money. I'm sure people also start non-profit companies, but NOT charities, in order to make money too (remember that NON-PROFIT =/= CHARITY).

ZERO TO MOTHER TERESA > 1 Year: Please be assured that I'm not a hypocrite when I say this, but suddenly going from never volunteering to devoting the better years of college to serving your community through multiple organizations still looks good in the eyes of the ADCOMs, and will not arouse suspicion. BUT, it will look good under one condition... You must make sure that you didn't end up doing all of these activities within a year or so of applying to medical school. In that case, you will end up looking like a horrible "box-checker" who was doing the activities solely for the sake of putting them on your application. On the other hand, if you've been doing them since freshman or sophomore year, you will be perceived as a saint. The funny thing is that the person who did the long-term commitment and is seen as a saint might have just been a gunner that was well-informed of the medical school admissions process. Have you ever met those people that are so uninformed that all they think they need to do is take the entrance exam and submit an application?

PEACE CORPS: I haven't done this, but this does look good. This will require you to take time off from school or do this after graduating. I know of people on SDN who did this before getting into medical school. Even though this was not medical school, I do have a friend who used Peace Corps to dramatically improve his law school application. He had a pretty bad GPA at the University of Wisconsin at Madison. He originally got into a first tier (not T14) law school, and eventually transferred to a T14 school. I would consider him successful.

LONG-TERM MISSION TRIPS: Mission trips usually look bad if it looks like medical tourism. But if you spend either months or years somewhere, then it will probably end up looking good and giving you good stories to talk about. I also want to mention that even though short-term trips now look bad, you can still make one look good if you have a "genuine" reason. Recently there was a thread about someone wanting to do a relief trip to a refugee camp in Syria because he wants to work as a translator and grew up in a war-torn area in the Middle East. That will look legitimate, and thus will look good. But if you go to a Central American country for a couple of weeks and provide a crappy reason as to why you went, then you'll be in trouble.

UNIQUE HOBBIES: If this is something outrageous, ADCOMs will probably like this.

What's "IN" but NOT Special:

"COOKIE CUTTER" VOLUNTEERING: Even though anyone who volunteers should be commended because they are giving up their time and potential earnings to help others, premeds are apparently expected to volunteer or face bad consequences. Contrary to people saying that volunteering "looks good," I believe that the typical premed volunteering gigs in hospital EDs or similar locations will keep you from looking bad. You don't want to be the oddball without these activities, because that will probably end up hurting you unless you have a pretty good explanation. Despite always being downplayed by SDN members, you might have a couple neat experiences or two that are worth writing about. If you're good at conveying your feelings in writing or during an interview, you'll probably be okay. Another good thing is that hospital EDs around college campuses are usually overflowing with premeds. So if you're doing this against your will, you can probably use it as study time.

CLINICAL JOBS: I advise everyone to STAY AWAY from clinical jobs!!! Why you ask? Because so many premeds are already doing them that it's not blazing any new trails. All it does is forces you to work a job with typically inflexible hours that would detract from studying and other important things that would probably have more of a negative impact on your things that would actually end up mattering more for admissions. Since so many premeds are doing either EMT, CNA, scribe, phlebotomist, or other positions, you might be better off doing...

NON-CLINICAL JOBS: I think that combined with "Cookie Cutter" volunteering, can probably give you more of an advantage versus doing clinical work. Why so? Because non-clinical jobs tend to be more unique, at least in some cases. Once again, even though you're unlikely to be blazing any new trails, you can have a far more flexible schedule doing something like a service job. I worked as a pizza delivery guy early on in college. I worked once or twice a week at most, usually 4-5 hours per shift. I ended with $60-$70 in cash a night! Even though it was not mentioned during my medical school interviews, I did talk about it at one of my job interviews. It was well-received.

SHADOWING: Shadowing is considered a requirement. It's pretty easy to do. I actually had very low shadowing hours compared to people here on SDN. I'm not sure if many more hours/different physicians will help, but it may give you more to write about in your essays or talk about during interviews.

What's NOT Hot:

SHORT-TERM MEDICAL MISSION TRIPS: If you end up going on a one or two week medical mission trip to some Central American country, you'll come off as a premed that is doing this as a box-checking activity that doesn't give a crap about the population they are serving. While this may have looked good back in the day, ADCOMs have caught on. Now it can hurt your application if you can't come up with any legitimate reasons as to why you want to volunteer in a foreign country. Unless you are ridiculously good at BSing, then I would suggest you steer away from this!

ZERO TO MOTHER TERESA WITHIN A YEAR OF APPLYING: If you end up cramming a bunch of volunteer activities within a year or less of applying, ADCOMs will perceive you as being a non-genuine applicant that is only looking to check boxes for the sake of their application! I've seen SDN users say how they were told by ADCOMs after being rejected that they didn't do enough volunteering. Yet, if you continue these activities as a reapplicant, you're suddenly viewed as a saint the next cycle. Yay!

"COOKIE CUTTER" VOLUNTEERING WITHIN A YEAR OF APPLYING: See above.

If You're Feeling Adventurous:

EXPLAIN WHY YOU DIDN'T VOLUNTEER OR DO MORE ACTIVITIES: As I have mentioned before, I would greatly respect an applicant if they were completely honest about why they didn't put on the typical song and dance we see being put on for ADCOMs. If someone can genuinely convey their intentions of going into medicine, then I would definitely say go for it. As you know, the more risk you take, the greater the reward. I am in no way saying you should do this, but perhaps this will be the new wave of applicants. Fight against the system, and do what you think is right. There's nothing I hate seeing more than people who devoted all of their undergraduate experience to pleasing the ADCOMs with activities they hated with a passion. You can avoid this by going the "Cookie Cutter" EC route, or just being completely honest about your intentions. I think this would definitely stand out way more than someone who keeps doing the same recycled ECs over and over again! 👍

great post overall, but if someone is one of those things, then there really is no reason for him/her to apply to med school.

 

[DoctorLacrosse]

Definitely a solid, well written bunch of advice above, but I definitely cannot agree with your take on clinical jobs. You talk about stocking shelves in an ER not being a good form of volunteering to prove a desire for medicine, and I agree with that, but the bottom line is there are probably zero volunteer positions out there that provide any experience close to being a CNA or a phlebotomist. Maybe you aren't diagnosing diseases, but we actually care for patients and get to develop a real solid bedside manner, which from what I hear from friends really shows during the early stages of medical school. Most pre-med volunteers will never get any experience like this, unless they choose to become certified and get a clinical job. Otherwise, solid post above.

 

[Planes2Doc]

Nice. That's some quality posting above there Planes2Doc.

Anytime I see a post by him I strap myself into my computer chair with a custom airplane seatbelt and prepare for an excellent read.

Nice post by Planes2Doc.

Thanks so much! Much appreciated!!! 😍

great post overall, but if someone is one of those things, then there really is no reason for him/her to apply to med school.

Even though I might sound harsh toward the people who aren't genuine, I actually think that there is nothing wrong with what they are doing. The system has become what it is, and most people do not want to stand against it to prove a point. There is way too much too lose. This isn't a game where if you lose, nothing has happened. This is a game where if you lose, there are very real negative consequences that can happen. As they say, don't hate the player, hate the game!

Definitely a solid, well written bunch of advice above, but I definitely cannot agree with your take on clinical jobs. You talk about stocking shelves in an ER not being a good form of volunteering to prove a desire for medicine, and I agree with that, but the bottom line is there are probably zero volunteer positions out there that provide any experience close to being a CNA or a phlebotomist. Maybe you aren't diagnosing diseases, but we actually care for patients and get to develop a real solid bedside manner, which from what I hear from friends really shows during the early stages of medical school. Most pre-med volunteers will never get any experience like this, unless they choose to become certified and get a clinical job. Otherwise, solid post above.

Thanks a lot! I don't mean to sound offensive to the people who had clinical position. I have great respect for people that took up a clinical job, while doing schoolwork, studying for the MCAT, and doing other ECs at the same time. The reason I am against it is because ADCOMs aren't looking for doctors, they are looking for premeds. I think too many people get caught up thinking that the most important per-requisite for medical school is being a doctor! But it isn't.

I agree that given the responsibilities of most volunteering positions, that volunteers will not have any experiences that are comparable to that of paid entry-level clinical positions. But at the same time, the experiences that people have in entry-level clinical positions are not those that a physician would do on a day-to-day basis. Therefore, people are receiving training to do work, that once they are in medical school, are likely to never do again, except maybe check for blood pressure and respiration.

So from a getting into medical school perspective, having a clinical position might be helpful. But given the amount of effort needed to do the training and then work the shifts, it is probably not worth it in the end considering what it may end up costing you (grades, MCAT score, other ECs, etc). Remember, you are premed. You're not looking to become a professional EMT, CNA, phlebotomist, or scribe. You want to become a doctor. Therefore, once you matriculate into medical school, the volunteering and paid clinical work you've done before become worthless. Sure you might know how to take vitals, but you will learn that in one lab session in medical school!

Therefore, I am looking at this from the perspective of trying to get into medical school. It just doesn't make sense to find an inflexible job when you have more important things on your plate, especially since these clinical positions are seen over and over again by ADCOMs. You aren't blazing any new trails, and since you're not looking to become one of these positions for life, it's probably not worth it in the long-run.

 

[aspiring20]

planes2doc, thanks so much for all of your insights.

in your view, how accurate do you think the following statement is?

Barring extreme circumstances (felony conviction, expulsion from undergrad as a result of academic dishonesty, severe learning disability, severe mental illness, etc.) that will make matriculation realistically impossible, anyone who genuinely wants to be a doctor makes it eventually.

thanks

 

[Planes2Doc]

planes2doc, thanks so much for all of your insights.

in your view, how accurate do you think the following statement is?

Barring extreme circumstances (felony conviction, expulsion from undergrad as a result of academic dishonesty, severe learning disability, severe mental illness, etc.) that will make matriculation realistically impossible, anyone who genuinely wants to be a doctor makes it eventually.

thanks

I completely agree with it. I was one of "those premeds" that dropped the track freshman year! It took me a few years to come back, but it was worth it.

If pursuing medicine is something you want to do, you'll get there. It's something that you will never stop thinking about. If you were premed, didn't care, and dropped the track and never looked back, then it wasn't meant for you.

 

[DoctorLacrosse]

Thanks so much! Much appreciated!!! 😍



Even though I might sound harsh toward the people who aren't genuine, I actually think that there is nothing wrong with what they are doing. The system has become what it is, and most people do not want to stand against it to prove a point. There is way too much too lose. This isn't a game where if you lose, nothing has happened. This is a game where if you lose, there are very real negative consequences that can happen. As they say, don't hate the player, hate the game!



Thanks a lot! I don't mean to sound offensive to the people who had clinical position. I have great respect for people that took up a clinical job, while doing schoolwork, studying for the MCAT, and doing other ECs at the same time. The reason I am against it is because ADCOMs aren't looking for doctors, they are looking for premeds. I think too many people get caught up thinking that the most important per-requisite for medical school is being a doctor! But it isn't.

I agree that given the responsibilities of most volunteering positions, that volunteers will not have any experiences that are comparable to that of paid entry-level clinical positions. But at the same time, the experiences that people have in entry-level clinical positions are not those that a physician would do on a day-to-day basis. Therefore, people are receiving training to do work, that once they are in medical school, are likely to never do again, except maybe check for blood pressure and respiration.

So from a getting into medical school perspective, having a clinical position might be helpful. But given the amount of effort needed to do the training and then work the shifts, it is probably not worth it in the end considering what it may end up costing you (grades, MCAT score, other ECs, etc). Remember, you are premed. You're not looking to become a professional EMT, CNA, phlebotomist, or scribe. You want to become a doctor. Therefore, once you matriculate into medical school, the volunteering and paid clinical work you've done before become worthless. Sure you might know how to take vitals, but you will learn that in one lab session in medical school!

Therefore, I am looking at this from the perspective of trying to get into medical school. It just doesn't make sense to find an inflexible job when you have more important things on your plate, especially since these clinical positions are seen over and over again by ADCOMs. You aren't blazing any new trails, and since you're not looking to become one of these positions for life, it's probably not worth it in the long-run.

Agree with most of this again, but not every position is completely inflexible. I am a float pool CNA (male CNA I may add 😉) and have a ton of flexibility. I can get necessary days off and basically choose my days as long as I meet my two weekly shifts minimum. I think it becomes worth it if you are a student who has some bills to pay, so you can effectively kill two birds with one stone (making GREAT money to pay bills while gaining invaluable clinical experience). If you're fortunate enough to have no bills because of parents that spoil you (kidding, settle down guys 🙂), then I can completely understand your take on clinical jobs. Again though, great advice overall.

 

[Yorick]

Olympic medalist, fulbright, rhodes scholar, macarthur fellow

 

[chemnerd9460]

I am not sure how unique this is, but I did a summer internship in austria. They dont have the same rules in Europe so I was assisting in 1-4 surgeries a day for 7 weeks. I also drew blood and started IVs and shadowed a bunch of different types of physicians and surgeons. It was a awesome and unique experiance for me. Does something like that qualify as unique?

 

[Geebeejay]

I am not sure how unique this is, but I did a summer internship in austria. They dont have the same rules in Europe so I was assisting in 1-4 surgeries a day for 7 weeks. I also drew blood and started IVs and shadowed a bunch of different types of physicians and surgeons. It was a awesome and unique experiance for me. Does something like that qualify as unique?

Only if no/very few other applicants did the same internship would it be considered unique. But the name of the game is "get into medical school"; it's not "be as unique as possible"

 

[Planes2Doc]

I am not sure how unique this is, but I did a summer internship in austria. They dont have the same rules in Europe so I was assisting in 1-4 surgeries a day for 7 weeks. I also drew blood and started IVs and shadowed a bunch of different types of physicians and surgeons. It was a awesome and unique experiance for me. Does something like that qualify as unique?

What kind of internship was this? Do you have clinical training? You can shoot yourself in the foot if you're in a foreign country performing procedures you aren't licensed/trained to do. I know that ADCOMs frown upon this, and find it to be extremely unethical. It's probably looked upon more poorly in underdeveloped countries. Austria is far from that. But if you were trained to do the IVs and draw blood, then more power to you! 👍

 

[Planes2Doc]

Only if no/very few other applicants did the same internship would it be considered unique. But the name of the game is "get into medical school"; it's not "be as unique as possible"

👍 Exactly. You will not be unique unless you do those activities that are considered out of reach for most people. Even then, there would have been people that have probably done it and gone to medical school. Of course they would give you a good edge though!

 

[MedPR]

Being a URM makes you standout too.

 

[OwlPower22]

I really despise short-term medical mission trips. I'm sure 98% of the people who sign up for and do these are just doing them to "improve" their AMCAS or have something to say in their personal statement, as opposed to doing them for purely altruistic reasons. They are expensive (usually, groups fundraise for the trips, but costs still end up in the thousands) and the trips provide no long-term benefit to the people they serve. If you want international experience, I suggest Peace Corps or if time is limited, spend a summer or two volunteering or working at hospitals and non-profits abroad. Don't shell out money to volunteer.

As for "stand-out" activities, I have some pretty far-out and unique hobbies (not traveling and photography-related). I could care less what adcoms think of them; I do them because I absolutely love doing them.

 

[MedPR]

I really despise short-term medical mission trips. I'm sure 98% of the people who sign up for and do these are just doing them to "improve" their AMCAS or have something to say in their personal statement, as opposed to doing them for purely altruistic reasons. They are expensive (usually, groups fundraise for the trips, but costs still end up in the thousands) and the trips provide no long-term benefit to the people they serve. If you want international experience, I suggest Peace Corps or if time is limited, spend a summer or two volunteering or working at hospitals and non-profits abroad. Don't shell out money to volunteer.

Same. I know someone who is going abroad for 7 days (of which 1 whole day will be spent traveling) and had to pay ~$1200. Global health is great, but I wouldn't take a short term trip just to get a tiny glimpse at an underserved population when I could easily drive outside the city and see the same thing.

 

[Neuronette]

Same. I know someone who is going abroad for 7 days (of which 1 whole day will be spent traveling) and had to pay ~$1200. Global health is great, but I wouldn't take a short term trip just to get a tiny glimpse at an underserved population when I could easily drive outside the city and see the same thing.

What if its for a month or more? and multiple trips over a period of 2 or 3 years?

 

[MedPR]

What if its for a month or more?

I don't think we (pre-meds) are of any use on medical mission trips. We have no training, and most of the people who go on them care more about padding their application than doing any real good.

 

[Planes2Doc]

Same. I know someone who is going abroad for 7 days (of which 1 whole day will be spent traveling) and had to pay ~$1200. Global health is great, but I wouldn't take a short term trip just to get a tiny glimpse at an underserved population when I could easily drive outside the city and see the same thing.

I don't think we (pre-meds) are of any use on medical mission trips. We have no training, and most of the people who go on them care more about padding their application than doing any real good.

I agree with you. Despite the $1,200, it still works out well for someone who doesn't give a crap. Based on some old threads I've seen, a lot of trips end up being a few short moments of giving out pills or something at a clinic, and the rest of the trip being spent studying.

I was looking at all-inclusive vacations in the Caribbean and some are more than $1,200 for a week. But in this case, the applicant will kill two birds with one stone. They will have a fun trip to an exotic place while they perceive to improve their applications.

I'm sure the less informed premeds still think that short mission trips look good.

What if its for a month or more? and multiple trips over a period of 2 or 3 years?

Just like typical premed volunteering, I think that the length of commitment should be taken with a grain of salt. Like I said earlier, I knew someone who did Peace Corps in order to help him with law school admissions. I think that only a fraction of the premeds that still undertake "long term" commitments in foreign countries actually care. It could be gunners with a lot of time and money too.

 

[Geebeejay]

Same. I know someone who is going abroad for 7 days (of which 1 whole day will be spent traveling) and had to pay ~$1200. Global health is great, but I wouldn't take a short term trip just to get a tiny glimpse at an underserved population when I could easily drive outside the city and see the same thing.

I agree....most of these trips seem to be more tourism, team-building, fun oriented than providing much long-term service. I imagine the people of the target abroad communities would benefit more from $1200 in cash than a pre-med playing doctor for a few days. I think a non-medical abroad mission would come off more positively - i.e. building houses in Haiti for a few months, etc.

 

[lobo.solo]

Definitely a solid, well written bunch of advice above, but I definitely cannot agree with your take on clinical jobs. You talk about stocking shelves in an ER not being a good form of volunteering to prove a desire for medicine, and I agree with that, but the bottom line is there are probably zero volunteer positions out there that provide any experience close to being a CNA or a phlebotomist. Maybe you aren't diagnosing diseases, but we actually care for patients and get to develop a real solid bedside manner, which from what I hear from friends really shows during the early stages of medical school. Most pre-med volunteers will never get any experience like this, unless they choose to become certified and get a clinical job. Otherwise, solid post above.

Agree.
Planes2doc I think a clinical job > Clinical volunteering. First, volunteers don't so much that's to pass water, blankets and other menial jobsa. Second, when you have a clinical job you have a responsibility while volunteers rarely have any responsibility. I might be bias though since I have clinical work experience. But thanks for the good post 👍

 

[Geebeejay]

Agree.
Planes2doc I think a clinical job > Clinical volunteering. First, volunteers don't so much that's to pass water, blankets and other menial jobsa. Second, when you have a clinical job you have a responsibility while volunteers rarely have any responsibility. I might be bias though since I have clinical work experience. But thanks for the good post 👍

Agreed here....the experiences I walked away with as a CNA were a lot more valuable and meaningful than the ones I walked away with as a volunteer.

 

[bollywoodlover]

Amazing, personal, and passionate essays that portray things about you that you can't get from just looking at your list of Ecs. Good written descriptions of your activities that focused on what you learned and not whAt you did. A good LOR from someone on the adcom of your top choice that you've worked with.

 

[Planes2Doc]

I agree....most of these trips seem to be more tourism, team-building, fun oriented than providing much long-term service. I imagine the people of the target abroad communities would benefit more from $1200 in cash than a pre-med playing doctor for a few days. I think a non-medical abroad mission would come off more positively - i.e. building houses in Haiti for a few months, etc.

It's funny when donating cash comes up in the volunteering abroad threads. Someone always says that you should donate the money you otherwise would have spent on the trip. Then the response goes: "But donating money won't make me look good in front of the ADCOMS!" This comes to show just how much the applicants care about these impoverished populations!

Agree.
Planes2doc I think a clinical job > Clinical volunteering. First, volunteers don't so much that's to pass water, blankets and other menial jobsa. Second, when you have a clinical job you have a responsibility while volunteers rarely have any responsibility. I might be bias though since I have clinical work experience. But thanks for the good post 👍

Thanks! And fair enough. I think I'm probably coming from a different perspective. I'm coming from the "getting into medical school" perspective. I'm not as concerned about the actual value of experiences, since any medical school student, whether they had paid clinical experience or not, will learn everything they need to be a doctor. Medical school isn't like PA school, where the fast-track curriculum actually requires you to have experience. If entry-level clinical jobs were vital to one's success in medical school, then it would have been implemented as a requirement like with PA schools. It's not though, and people do just fine. Therefore, I see it this way:

Grades/MCAT >>>> Entry-Level Clinical Job > Clinical Volunteering

I'd also like to add that I'm biased. I came from an immigrant family that was all about getting good grades. Therefore, my parents gave me spending money so that I could focus in school. On the contrary, my best friend from high school had parents that never supported him. He had to work since high school to support himself. Things didn't end well for him academically. So I realize everyone is different, and has a different perspective. I think this definitely shaped my perspective toward clinical jobs, where I view them as being more detrimental since they aren't required and so many applicants do them which makes them not so unique. I hope this clears things up! 🙂

 

[Geebeejay]

Grades/MCAT >>>> Entry-Level Clinical Job > Clinical Volunteering

I think it's more like Entry-Level Clinical Job >>>> Clinical Volunteering, with the clause that neither of them will really make up for inadequate grades/MCAT.

Also....I don't necessarily think the >>>> means that a job is leagues better than volunteering in the eyes of admissions, but moreso that it opens up way more doors to patient interaction, exposure to medicine and professional relationships with physicians/nurses/other clinical staff that you will certainly collaborate with as a physician as well. Many attendings/residents will walk me through their thought processes/reasoning, or ask me what I think about certain patients, or tell me to listen to a certain patient's breath sounds, etc. because they know I'm a pre-med, and they know me well on a professional and personal level - and I don't think I'd get that same treatment as a volunteer. That, and I think my LORs from my physician colleagues are probably killer.

 

[Planes2Doc]

I think it's more like Entry-Level Clinical Job >>>> Clinical Volunteering, with the clause that neither of them will really make up for inadequate grades/MCAT.

Also....I don't necessarily think the >>>> means that a job is leagues better than volunteering in the eyes of admissions, but moreso that it opens up way more doors to patient interaction, exposure to medicine and professional relationships with physicians/nurses/other clinical staff that you will certainly collaborate with as a physician as well. Many attendings/residents will walk me through their thought processes/reasoning, or ask me what I think about certain patients, or tell me to listen to a certain patient's breath sounds, etc. because they know I'm a pre-med, and they know me well on a professional and personal level - and I don't think I'd get that same treatment as a volunteer. That, and I think my LORs from my physician colleagues are probably killer.

Those are definitely some good points... Looking back at what I wrote, I realized that it wasn't fair of me to impose my views on others. I think that everyone will find value in the different things they do along the way, whether it's virtually none or a whole lot. I think we can agree that clinical jobs aren't blazing any new trails, but they might have different meanings to different people. If this is an important stepping stone toward their ultimate goal, then by all means they should go for it! But as for me, I valued different things, and that's why I took my own path.

Luckily, the paths usually meet up in the same place.

 

[Geebeejay]

Those are definitely some good points... Looking back at what I wrote, I realized that it wasn't fair of me to impose my views on others. I think that everyone will find value in the different things they do along the way, whether it's virtually none or a whole lot. I think we can agree that clinical jobs aren't blazing any new trails, but they might have different meanings to different people. If this is an important stepping stone toward their ultimate goal, then by all means they should go for it! But as for me, I valued different things, and that's why I took my own path.

Luckily, the paths usually meet up in the same place.

No worries man, I didn't take your post to be overstepping your bounds or imposing your views or anything like that....just another worthy opinion.

I know that most of what I've learned in my clinical job I will eventually learn in medical school, but I'm still glad I did it (at least at this point). I think as long as you can look back and be glad you did something, than it was worth the time you put into it. 🙂

 

[DoctorLacrosse]

No worries man, I didn't take your post to be overstepping your bounds or imposing your views or anything like that....just another worthy opinion.

I know that most of what I've learned in my clinical job I will eventually learn in medical school, but I'm still glad I did it (at least at this point). I think as long as you can look back and be glad you did something, than it was worth the time you put into it. 🙂

Very well put Geebeejay, and I agree 100%. Wouldn't trade my experiences at my job so far for anything, required or not.

 

[McNCheese]

I volunteer as a hospital magician and do bedside magic for children in the hospital. I get a lot of patient interaction, and it makes for great conversations at interviews. It's also loads of fun.

 

[sunflower18]

I volunteer as a hospital magician and do bedside magic for children in the hospital. I get a lot of patient interaction, and it makes for great conversations at interviews. It's also loads of fun.

That's actually super awesome.