Hi, I just joined the studentdoctor network and I hope to get the best advice. I'm currently a 4th year undergrad student at UCLA. Academically, things haven't been going well for me. I have a 2.9 premed prereqs gpa, about a 3.8ish non-science gpa, and hope to bring my overall gpa up to a 3.3-3.4 by the time I graduate. I haven't taken the MCAT yet but plan to this upcoming summer. I've been volunteering at the Santa Monica hospital for almost 2 years now, currently a president of a club on campus, doing research under the supervision of some awesome postdocs and a renowned cardiologist at UCLA (hoping to get a publication by next year). Moreover, I'm also planning to take a EMT course after taking my MCAT and work as a EMT. I never envisioned myself being a doctor until last year, when my father and grandfather passed away a month apart from each other. That year was quite detrimental and strongly affected my academics. Ever since then, it's been my motivation and passion to become a doctor one day. I'm striving to get straight As this entire year. What are my chances of getting into medical school, either here in California or in the east coast? Ultimately, I'm aiming for a MCAT score of 36 or higher. Please help!!!
What are my chances? PLEASE HELP!!!
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With a 3.3+/36, past applicants had about a 54% chance of an MD acceptance in past years. You can increase your odds for MD with sterling ECs, great LORs, a steep upward grade trend, a much better BCPM GPA, by considering an additional undergrad year of GPA repair, or with an SMP (Special Masters Program). You can increase your chances of becoming a physician and getting into a California school by including some DO med schools on your application list.
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If based on past experience you have excellent standardized test-taking skills and have reason to believe you can deliver an MCAT score of 34-36+, then I'd suggest you do additional postbac work to raise the BCPM, not necessarily a formal postbac program.
With an MCAT score of 30-33, I'd suggest considering an SMP after some postbac work to raise the BCPM.
With an MCAT score of 30-33, I'd suggest considering an SMP after some postbac work to raise the BCPM.
So post-bach work such as EMT, research, work, etc? I'm a decent test-taker; I'll do well if I study hard and do mediocre if I don't study as hard. Are SMPs competitive? They require that I take the MCAT before applying right? I'm sorry, my knowledge of this is fairly vague.
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By saying "postbac work" I mean to suggest taking more coursework for credit. Developing adequate ECs is another consideration.
SMPs are competitive. They won't take you if they don't see that you have the potential to excel, thus the need for good grades in recent upper-level science classes. They require a competitive MCAT score, usually 30+, though there are some that take a lower score.
Understood. Now, regarding the MCAT, what expert advice would you give me? For instance, if I plan on studying by myself (without taking a prep course), which prep books are the most effective? I already have the ExamKrackers MCAT complete study package, going to get the audio osmosis for it from a friend, and just ordered the ExamKrackers 101 Verbal MCAT passages and the Kaplan MCAT 2010-2011 premier book. Should I get any other prep books/practice exam books? A friend of mine also suggested that I subscribe to this online course for like $20 a month for 3 months. It provides instructional videos on the subjects tested on the MCAT taught by someone from ASU. Any recommendations?
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I will refer you to the sticked self-study plan at the top of the MCAT Discussions Forum.
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I studied the EK Bio, Physics, Chemistry and verbal 101 books for about 2 months and did fine. you should take the free practice test on the AAMC/MCAT Website, and see how you do, then you can base your studying off that. then take another practice test off the AAMC official site, and base more studying off that. search the MCAT forum for some good study guides if you need some structure
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Free MCAT sample test alluded to above: http://www.aamc.org/students/mcat/practicetests.htm
Thank you so much for your advice and help! If I, hypothetically speaking, obtain a score of let's say 36 or above on the MCAT, should I just apply to medical schools or stick with the SMPs? Is that a potent enough of a score to offset my 2.9 pre-reqs/pre-med GPA? I really dislike the fact that medical schools begin weeding out applicants just based on their GPAs.
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Even with a 36 or better, you still have to demonstrate to adcomms that you can consistently produce great grades, thus the need for additional coursework in upper-level sciences, which would incidentally raise your BCPM. IMO, if you can do that, you have a chance of acceptance without the SMP.
Oh awesome, what do you mean by doing additional coursework in upper-level sciences? Are you referring to taking them at my current university (UCLA), or do that after I graduate at some other college? Sorry, I was confused by your previous mention..
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It doesn't matter where you take the classwork, or whether it's before or after graduation, as it will all be included in your undergrad GPA and BCPM GPAs.
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What is your major?
EMT coursework taken at a local CC would count too, BTW.
EMT coursework taken at a local CC would count too, BTW.
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If you've run out of upper-level science classes within your major, then those more commonly taken with other Bio-related majors would be fine to take.
EMT classes are not considered to be science classes by AMCAS or AACOMAS, but they would be factored into your overall GPA: http://forums.studentdoctor.net/showthread.php?t=552026 . I'm just mentioning this since it's a plan of yours, mentioned in the original post.
EMT classes are not considered to be science classes by AMCAS or AACOMAS, but they would be factored into your overall GPA: http://forums.studentdoctor.net/showthread.php?t=552026 . I'm just mentioning this since it's a plan of yours, mentioned in the original post.
So should I stay an extra year to take those classes or should I just take them in conjunction with the EMT classes the summer after I graduate? Regarding the classes on the list you've provided me, are these the options I have to take either right now at UCLA, where I'm doing my undergrad at, or at a local cc? Don't med schools take the rigor of the classes into consideration? For instance, the curriculum of upper-level biochemistry at UCLA is a lot tougher than it would be at local cc. Thus, doing well in a class at UCLA isn't the same as doing well in a class at a cc, as the difficulty factor plays a big role. I simply overheard someone talking about this so I'm not entirely sure if it was an accurate statement. I also plan to retake a couple classes that I received a grade of C- in (Chem 153A, which is biochemistry, and Physci 111B, which is one of the classes within my major). Med schools will look at the fact that I have the motivation and will to retake classes in order to do better right? As long as I show improvement...sorry about the long post.
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More courses not specifically listed are considered to be science classes, so also consider anything that you'd take in med school too, eg Endocrinology, Embryology, Histology.
California schools particularly seem to have a bias against CC classes, and many schools prefer that you take the more rigorous classes at a 4-year school. That's not to say it's impossible to get into any med school with CC credits. And taking a few CC classes over the summer is understandable and commonly done.
If it's at all possible for you to say an extra year at your current school, then that is preferred, but I understand that Ca schools don't all allow retakes if you didn't nearly fail, or an extra year, without a good reason. What is the policy at your school?
Yes, retaking classes with lower grades would be viewed positively by med schools. Getting As in new upper-level science classes is very helpful, too.
California schools particularly seem to have a bias against CC classes, and many schools prefer that you take the more rigorous classes at a 4-year school. That's not to say it's impossible to get into any med school with CC credits. And taking a few CC classes over the summer is understandable and commonly done.
If it's at all possible for you to say an extra year at your current school, then that is preferred, but I understand that Ca schools don't all allow retakes if you didn't nearly fail, or an extra year, without a good reason. What is the policy at your school?
Yes, retaking classes with lower grades would be viewed positively by med schools. Getting As in new upper-level science classes is very helpful, too.
Were allowed to retake a class if we receive a grade C- or lower. So a post-bac or SMP aren't necessary then? I mean, according to what you've suggested, if I can take these upper-level classes and perform well in them, they will be accounted for in the BCPM GPA right? I also plan to follow the 3 month self-study plan for the MCAT. I just need to order the Berkeley Review books and I'll be good to go.
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Refer back to post #4.
generally people who have a 2.9 gpa in their prereqs get at least a 41 on their mcat. you should aim for that. sorry, couldnt help it. your cgpa is not good, your sgpa will get your app trashed. and dont count on a high mcat until you've at least taken a practice test. best bet, go DO and retake some classes. If you dont want to go DO I suggest you dont retake classes. Take as many upper division science classes as you can, preferably ones that relate to medicine. That will prove more to the adcoms. Anyone can get an A if they take the class enough times so I wouldnt waste my time with retakes.
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I tend to think it's selecting who they want based on high academic performance and not weeding out. Give them a reason to want you as a student. The fact of the matter is that with a 2.9 you are going to have to do something special with all other aspects of your application. Whether you do an SMP or not, you are going to need great clinical experience, some eye catching aspect on your resume, and a through the roof MCAT score.
If you are considering taking on debt for an SMP program that offers no guarantee of medical school at the end, then you should make sure you put the same amount of effort and resources into making your application as strong as possible. The truth of the matter is that a 2.9 sGPA with a 36 MCAT score is extremely rare, and wanting a good MCAT score is not enough. You have some ground to make up in terms of understanding the subject matter, so you better plan on a six-month self imposed study boot camp. Before you consider anything else, set your schedule and take the steps you need to get that 36. If you find you have stayed on course and put the hours in about three months from now, then you should start thinking about SMPs and such. Best of luck on your path. It'll be uphill for a while, but worth it in the end.
Clinical experience as in shadowing doctors or clinical research? I'm currently working in a lab at school for one of the chief cardiologists at UCLA and also an undergraduate researcher under her supervision. I'm planning on working as an EMT during my year off and if time permits, shadow a doctor in my neighborhood. There's such a big dilemma for me between applying to SMPs and taking extra classes to offset my incredibly low science GPA. So there's no guarantee of getting into medical school even if I do a SMP? I'm planning to start studying for the MCAT this winter break until Spring at the latest. Thank you all for your input.
