What constitutes an Intern year?

[InDarkestKnight]

I had a question just regarding the classification of an intern yr. I am currently a partially matched 4th yr med student who has matched into an advanced program. For the required pgy1 year, there is obviously the prelim programs and TY programs. That being said, could I do a year of a categorical specialty and have that count towards the requirement for my advanced program? For example family medicine or peds

I guess my question is, what are the technical requirements of a pgy1 year to fulfill the need to start an advanced position? ACGME accreditation? Some sort of certificate at the end of the year? Or is it just spending a year somewhere?

Thanks for any and all replies

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[J ROD]

year 1 of residency

 

[InDarkestKnight]

The requirements can be found in the ACGME program and institutional requirements page for whatever advanced specialty you have matched into.

Just google "______ ACGME program requirements" and insert neurology or radiology or whatever you're going into.

ex: neurology: https://www.acgme.org/acgmeweb/Portals/0/PFAssets/ProgramRequirements/180_neurology_07012014.pdf

Bottom line though is no; a peds or FM year will not count for any of the advanced field to my knowledge.

I did what you suggested, and for my advanced specialty, it states that I'm required to do "6 months of emergency medicine, family medicine, internal medicine, obstetrics and gynecology, pediatrics, surgery, or any combination of these patient care experiences" and "the remaining months of these 12 months of education may include any combination of accredited specialty or subspecialty".

So I'm assuming doing a year of peds or FM would be acceptable?

 

[candbgirl]

Southern Surgeon told you it wouldn't count and I'd believe him. Why don't you call the program you matched at and ask them. They'll tell you what you need. In the match what did you apply for as your prelim year?

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[InDarkestKnight]

Southern Surgeon told you it wouldn't count and I'd believe him. Why don't you call the program you matched at and ask them. They'll tell you what you need. In the match what did you apply for as your porcelain year?

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The other reason I ask is, because how can people currently in a categorical PGY-1 (such as internal medicine) switch fields, such as into a PGY-2 in Neurology if what you say is true? That first year had to count for that initial 12 month training period (assuming they completed it)

 

[gutonc]

Peds and FM can count for some things. You've got 2 options here:
1) be less vague so we can actually help you
2) call your matched advanced program and ask them

 

[NotAProgDirector]

Based on what you've posted, a PGY-1 in almost anything clinical will count. The ACGME is actually not the website to check, however. You need to check the "American Board of XXX" website, and see what it says. But if that's where the quote above is from, then any clinical experience for 1 year will count.

 

[InDarkestKnight]

Based on what you've posted, a PGY-1 in almost anything clinical will count. The ACGME is actually not the website to check, however. You need to check the "American Board of XXX" website, and see what it says. But if that's where the quote above is from, then any clinical experience for 1 year will count.

Thank you for the reply, I'll be sure to double check

 

[mvenus929]

Bottom line though is no; a peds or FM year will not count for most of the advanced fields to my knowledge.

Not true. I am aware of a Peds intern who matched into derm and the intern year through Peds counted. While I'm not sure if it would apply for very field, there are Peds prelim years available too, and those wanting to do something like child neuro can do two years of Peds and be double board certified. I'm sure it's much easier to get a FM intern year to count for things, since you generally have to do a mix of IM and ED anyway.

Of course, OP, joining a categorical program when you intend on going into an advanced specialty is a really ****ty thing to do to your coresidents, who will have to pick up the slack from the lack of a classmate during second and third year after you jump ship from your intern year. The programs are categorical for a reason.

 

[Crayola227]

I know someone this year finished PGY1 in FM and is now in neuro
Someone who finished PGY1 in IM and is now psych

They are both getting credit but not a one for one
The new neuro resident has 4 months to make up
The new psych resident will only have 3 months apply

They neuro resident will have to do more inpatient months of medicine, and will be not be promoted to second year until midway through the year at the new program

It is mostly up to PDs how much credit they give you, certificate of completing the year or not

And you should never take a categorical position with the aim of transferring
When these things happen everyone including the person transferring suffer, it is a "in case of emergency" escape hatch to change residencies

 

[DocBlin]

There are NO written rules to if a PD in the new program/specialty will offer a full year or credit or not. Personal experience from prelim surgery to FM. My son did 1 year Prelim Surg than started FM with 3 months credit, but he used that time to do more ER, clinic rotations, write papers. There was another resident that did 2 years Prelim Surg that did obtain 1 full year credit in FM in that program. But it is up to the PDs discretion..

 

[RangerBob]

I did what you suggested, and for my advanced specialty, it states that I'm required to do "6 months of emergency medicine, family medicine, internal medicine, obstetrics and gynecology, pediatrics, surgery, or any combination of these patient care experiences" and "the remaining months of these 12 months of education may include any combination of accredited specialty or subspecialty".

So I'm assuming doing a year of peds or FM would be acceptable?

I don't know what specialty you're applying to, but that is exactly what PM&R allows you to do for your intern year.

Peds, IM, surgery, and TY obviously all count as a prelim year for PM&R. TY/IM typically makes the most sense, but I know someone who wants to do peds rehab that is doing a peds prelim.

EM, FM, OB-Gyn also in fact count as an intern year for PM&R. However, there are no intern-year programs in those specialties (just categorical positions)--the only way to do one is to have matched into a categorical EM/FM/etc program and then change your mind and switch to PM&R, or fine an unmatched program that just wants a warm body for one year. That seems rather unlikely, as a program having trouble matching a PGY1 is going to have even more trouble matching a PGY2. Any categorical program willing to take you for just one year is likely to be a bottom-of-the-barrel program.

So practically speaking that leaves just peds, TY, IM, and surgery for PM&R. Other advanced specialties have more limits, and in the case of neuro you have to do at least 8 or 10 months of medicine, so I believe only IM and a TY that lets you do that many floors months (most will) count. I believe prelim peds only counts for neuro if you're in a peds-neuro program, in which case it's a two-year "pre-lim."