What else do I need to make it to the top?

[WisNeuro]

Building off of erg, as a neuropsych person, regardless of your GRE scores and previous experience, you would not be a strong fit in any of the programs that I know. Your interests aren't in neuropsych. They are in experimental neuroscience. We don't like training people who won't be utilizing any of the skillsets that we teach.

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[LisaLisa86]

Thank you for your advice. I do understand that the rankings are different for undergraduate/graduate school. However, more often than not, many of the researchers in psychology from any of the top ivy league schools/california schools (harvard, princeton, MIT, stanford, berkeley, etc) all are leaders in their respective fields. Additionally, those schools often have plenty of endowment and funding for their programs and many of their research interests align with mine. What I probably did not convey as well with my previous posts is that I plan on applying to other schools as well, however, I just wanted to know what my chances were for these top programs. I understand your sentiment regarding clinical neuropsychology and neuroscience and truly feel that my future lies in developing new methods and clinical interventions for a variety of psychiatric illnesses. I am also very interested in computer science and AI and believe that I can find a happy medium entertaining all of these future endeavours.

Regarding the letters, all 3 will be very strong since all 3 professors were my advisers for my theses. Is there any other area that my application is lacking (besides my GRE) and what sort of numbers should I aim for on the GRE to be very competitive for these programs? Should I take the psych GRE as well?

Thank you all for the help and sorry if any of my posts offended you as this was not my intention.

Technically, MIT doesn't even have a psych program, they have a brain & cog science program, with very little traditional psych in it, and definitely nothing approaching clinical psych. :-D

Anyway, as mentioned 100x above, it honestly depends who you work with more than anything else. Read tons of papers and professor descriptions on websites, and try to find people doing the most interesting research and work backwards from there (what department/area of psychology are they in? what programs are they at? what is the scope of their research?). I'm at a decent clinical program now, but working with a very well known and well connected professor in my field. Funding is not a problem: my stipend is about double what most psych programs offer, and the resources available through my lab is above and beyond what other psych labs offer, even at the schools you mentioned. And even if I went into industry or non-academia, my professor would likely know people in those fields. Generally, your professor's name will determine the resources available to you, and carry more weight than your program. Even if you go into a field of industry related to your field of study, they will likely know your professor (in my experience, subfields of psychology are unexpectedly small, and cross the boundaries of academia, policy, industry, and more). You should also consider the experience and trainings that your professor/lab can offer you- if you go to a program with name recognition but don't get the types of experience or training needed to become a great researcher, it won't get you very far.

In my opinion, aside from just reading tons and tons of professor descriptions and program descriptions, your biggest decision is clinical versus not. This decision is the biggest decision because choosing a clinical program versus a non-clinical program affects the likelihood of you getting in, what schools have programs, your life in grad school, the type of research you can do, and your career options when you graduate.

 

[NeuroTrope]

As a clinical neuropsychology post doc who has transitioned a bit into computational neuroscience I suppose I should weigh in...

1. Computational modeling is very difficult to learn. There's a reason people spend 5-7 years training in this field and specialize only in it - it's dense material.

2. Clinical neuropsychology is also difficult to learn. It taps into a different set of skills but there's also a reason people spend 5-7(+) years training in it. Start with clinical psychology and add behavioral neurology + advanced psychometrics and you're in for a long haul.

3. The two areas have minimal overlap, at least at the predoctoral level. You'll have difficulty finding a mentor who can straddle both. Ask me again in 10 years and maybe I can help - or maybe I'll have thrown in the towel by then.

Pick one and stick with it. Given your stated interests, experimental/cognitive neuroscience may be the better option. You can delve immediately into the big research questions out there and there's some fantastic mentors available - Michael Frank (incidentally at an Ivy League - woohoo) and Randy O'Reilly come to mind. As other folks said, clinical is clinical and you have to live and breathe it - years spend learning psychometrics, assessment, psychopathology, intervention, etc. I was and remain an avid CLINICIAN first - the modeling part of my career came only recently and is specific to some research hypotheses I have (that are ultimately aimed towards improving clinical outcomes). In case you haven't picked up the hint, I'm halfway ready to give up doing it myself and instead collaborating with others, which is what 99% of other clinical psychologists do anyway. However, if you do like clinical work, it probably provides you with the most options down the line but you won't be doing much cognitive neuroscience/computational modeling for many years.

I do like your moxie!

 

[QAsPsych]

Totally off topic, but have been wondering for quite some time... is the one known for taking next-to-no students and not well established Harvard? I'm not interested in Ivy League, prestiga, yada yada, not applying to Yale or anything like that, and Boston would actually be an inconvenient location for me to relocate to, but I am completely obsessed with the work of one professor there, I have been following their publications for about two years and have read everything available through my university library. Anyway, I ask because I am so excited to apply and love this work, but notice on SDN and GradCafe that there are never acceptances... do they not take students every year? I know it's Harvard, and I see the match rate is 100%, but do they not have that many resources or something? Also, if you're not referring to Harvard, sorry about this, haha.

Off topic, but probably more interesting than the topic is

Yes. Columbia is the program I meant is radically different from the others, and Harvard is the one that is new. Harvard seems to have that reputation but they don't post the "fuller disclosure" data so it's hard to say whether that impression they take very few students is true exactly. If it is and I had to guess why I would say it's not unlikely that they have to fund all their own grad students, which can lead to that situation. I'm sure they do great by those students they accept. I also know that there is at least one professor there who does amazing work and is also supposed to be a great, really pleasant person all around. So, hey, like any other program, ask the POI if they're planning to take a student next year and be aware that no matter how much you desire to work with somebody, they may not take a student any given year (probably one of the most frustrating things about this for me when I was deciding where to apply).

 

[S3IZURE]

I guess what you guys are missing is tha

As a clinical neuropsychology post doc who has transitioned a bit into computational neuroscience I suppose I should weigh in...

1. Computational modeling is very difficult to learn. There's a reason people spend 5-7 years training in this field and specialize only in it - it's dense material.

2. Clinical neuropsychology is also difficult to learn. It taps into a different set of skills but there's also a reason people spend 5-7(+) years training in it. Start with clinical psychology and add behavioral neurology + advanced psychometrics and you're in for a long haul.

3. The two areas have minimal overlap, at least at the predoctoral level. You'll have difficulty finding a mentor who can straddle both. Ask me again in 10 years and maybe I can help - or maybe I'll have thrown in the towel by then.

Pick one and stick with it. Given your stated interests, experimental/cognitive neuroscience may be the better option. You can delve immediately into the big research questions out there and there's some fantastic mentors available - Michael Frank (incidentally at an Ivy League - woohoo) and Randy O'Reilly come to mind. As other folks said, clinical is clinical and you have to live and breathe it - years spend learning psychometrics, assessment, psychopathology, intervention, etc. I was and remain an avid CLINICIAN first - the modeling part of my career came only recently and is specific to some research hypotheses I have (that are ultimately aimed towards improving clinical outcomes). In case you haven't picked up the hint, I'm halfway ready to give up doing it myself and instead collaborating with others, which is what 99% of other clinical psychologists do anyway. However, if you do like clinical work, it probably provides you with the most options down the line but you won't be doing much cognitive neuroscience/computational modeling for many years.

I do like your moxie!

I truly appreciate your response I'll elaborate more when I get the chance!

 

[psychologyman]

No, you can't be that picky. You treat what walks in.

Have you given thought, at least thought, to how this dream career will interact with, ya know....life? Life is what happens when you are bsuy making plans for big things, right?

I love my VA job just fine, but their are many other things I would be interested in doing too, but children, family, friends, tailgating, church, and golf make those other things take a back seat. And thats the reality of being an adult my friend. I would encourage you to consider the future of your non-professional life (what are those values, what are those goals) in addition to your profesonal life.

Well said!!! My career allows me to spend time with family and friends. My articles have never provided me soup when feeling ill.

 

[G Costanza]

It's a little odd that the OP has that much experience in complicated areas of research but seems to have missed the big picture of the field. Then when it's explained, again seemed to have missed the rather simple points.
Not trying to make a poke at you OP but wondering if this is a pattern in your life. If so, that might be something to work on in preparation for your career. For most people, good listening skills are a must to get ahead.

You're obviously a bright student, good luck with your goals!

 

[S3IZURE]

I think that most of you have just missed what the point of my post was. I respect what everyone said and I appreciate it, I just want to attend school in either California or an ivy league, and there are plenty of programs there (clinical or not) that match my interests. I know myself and I just won't be happy going to school in Iowa or Kansas (no offense if anyone lives there). Personal preference, I feel like I've taken the time and effort to deserve to go t o school in a place that I like the climate and atmosphere. Regarding have a life, family, and everything else that you mentioned, that doesn't have really much to do with what I asked in my OP. Just simply wanted to know my chances for top schools, regardless of programs, but thanks for the other points brought up as I will take them into account. What I have seen is that most of you clinicians are much more in tuned with conducting interventions for your patients and in general being a clinical first and that is definitely something I need to evaluate further as to whether it is my prime objective as well.

Lastly, if anyone could advise what the top schools/programs are in clinical npsych I would greatly appreciate it as it will help me narrow my schools down. Thank you again for all the help.

 

[S3IZURE]

As a clinical neuropsychology post doc who has transitioned a bit into computational neuroscience I suppose I should weigh in...

1. Computational modeling is very difficult to learn. There's a reason people spend 5-7 years training in this field and specialize only in it - it's dense material.

2. Clinical neuropsychology is also difficult to learn. It taps into a different set of skills but there's also a reason people spend 5-7(+) years training in it. Start with clinical psychology and add behavioral neurology + advanced psychometrics and you're in for a long haul.

3. The two areas have minimal overlap, at least at the predoctoral level. You'll have difficulty finding a mentor who can straddle both. Ask me again in 10 years and maybe I can help - or maybe I'll have thrown in the towel by then.

Pick one and stick with it. Given your stated interests, experimental/cognitive neuroscience may be the better option. You can delve immediately into the big research questions out there and there's some fantastic mentors available - Michael Frank (incidentally at an Ivy League - woohoo) and Randy O'Reilly come to mind. As other folks said, clinical is clinical and you have to live and breathe it - years spend learning psychometrics, assessment, psychopathology, intervention, etc. I was and remain an avid CLINICIAN first - the modeling part of my career came only recently and is specific to some research hypotheses I have (that are ultimately aimed towards improving clinical outcomes). In case you haven't picked up the hint, I'm halfway ready to give up doing it myself and instead collaborating with others, which is what 99% of other clinical psychologists do anyway. However, if you do like clinical work, it probably provides you with the most options down the line but you won't be doing much cognitive neuroscience/computational modeling for many years.

I do like your moxie!

I thought that pursuing a clinical npsych degree would allow me to hone my skills in studying the disorders and uncovering more aspects to it. Is this more an approach for experimental neuroscience? I'm interested in both the cellular mechanisms as well as on a systems and holistic level. For the cellular/genetics work, I was hoping on finding a postdoctoral position that would let me expand on those interests. Any advice from someone in the field like yourself is greatly appreciated

 

[AcronymAllergy]

I think that most of you have just missed what the point of my post was. I respect what everyone said and I appreciate it, I just want to attend school in either California or an ivy league, and there are plenty of programs there (clinical or not) that match my interests. I know myself and I just won't be happy going to school in Iowa or Kansas (no offense if anyone lives there). Personal preference, I feel like I've taken the time and effort to deserve to go t o school in a place that I like the climate and atmosphere. Regarding have a life, family, and everything else that you mentioned, that doesn't have really much to do with what I asked in my OP. Just simply wanted to know my chances for top schools, regardless of programs, but thanks for the other points brought up as I will take them into account. What I have seen is that most of you clinicians are much more in tuned with conducting interventions for your patients and in general being a clinical first and that is definitely something I need to evaluate further as to whether it is my prime objective as well.

Lastly, if anyone could advise what the top schools/programs are in clinical npsych I would greatly appreciate it as it will help me narrow my schools down. Thank you again for all the help.

A few programs that spring to mind for me with respect to having strong neuropsych reputations: UW-Madison, University of Florida, University of Houston, University of Alabama-Birmingham. A common theme is that each of these programs has multiple well-known folks who are typically viewed as leaders in their respective sub-specialties. I also know that UCLA tends to be pretty highly regarded for neuroscience (among other things).

I'm sure I've missed plenty and will defer to others to fill in those blanks.

 

[erg923]

I think that most of you have just missed what the point of my post was. I respect what everyone said and I appreciate it, I just want to attend school in either California or an ivy league, and there are plenty of programs there (clinical or not) that match my interests. I know myself and I just won't be happy going to school in Iowa or Kansas (no offense if anyone lives there). Personal preference, I feel like I've taken the time and effort to deserve to go t o school in a place that I like the climate and atmosphere. Regarding have a life, family, and everything else that you mentioned, that doesn't have really much to do with what I asked in my OP. Just simply wanted to know my chances for top schools, regardless of programs, but thanks for the other points brought up as I will take them into account. What I have seen is that most of you clinicians are much more in tuned with conducting interventions for your patients and in general being a clinical first and that is definitely something I need to evaluate further as to whether it is my prime objective as well.

Lastly, if anyone could advise what the top schools/programs are in clinical npsych I would greatly appreciate it as it will help me narrow my schools down. Thank you again for all the help.

Are you aware that to obtain the career plans you have, you will have to become MUCH more flexible, both geogrpahically, as well as cognitively/mentally?

Based on your posts, your career goals, and your exteremely conditional interest in clincial work and less than optimal openess to feedback (I'll enjoy if the patients are interesting; wanting to limit the diverity of patients), neuropsychology, which is a subdivision of clincial psychology (not sure why you cant seem to understand this) is NOT for you. Its pretty clear why you have failed in your admisions attempts. I wouldn't admit you either.

You come across as very much in this for your own fortune and glory. There is nothing particuarly wrong wit that per se, but I would spare patients the burden of having to see someone who is only it for the journal articles." That is NOT what I want to hear from a future psychologist/neuropsychologist, even a very researchy one...especially BEFORE you have even begun your training. It taints the air with a resistance to learning that is INCONGRUENT with this profession.

 

[NeuroTrope]

I think that most of you have just missed what the point of my post was. I respect what everyone said and I appreciate it, I just want to attend school in either California or an ivy league, and there are plenty of programs there (clinical or not) that match my interests. I know myself and I just won't be happy going to school in Iowa or Kansas (no offense if anyone lives there). Personal preference, I feel like I've taken the time and effort to deserve to go t o school in a place that I like the climate and atmosphere. Regarding have a life, family, and everything else that you mentioned, that doesn't have really much to do with what I asked in my OP. Just simply wanted to know my chances for top schools, regardless of programs, but thanks for the other points brought up as I will take them into account. What I have seen is that most of you clinicians are much more in tuned with conducting interventions for your patients and in general being a clinical first and that is definitely something I need to evaluate further as to whether it is my prime objective as well.

Lastly, if anyone could advise what the top schools/programs are in clinical npsych I would greatly appreciate it as it will help me narrow my schools down. Thank you again for all the help.

If you are committed to an Ivy League or CA site, then you're kind of in trouble - not many graduate programs explicitly train neuropsychologists. UCSD springs to mind (if you can stomach the third best UC instead of the top two). Berkeley and UCLA have clinical science programs but not much emphasis on neuropsychology. UCLA Semel is an internship/post doc site with excellent translational research opportunities but that comes after your graduate training. Ivy league is the same boat...Columbia, Harvard, and Yale don't really have neuropsychology programs. Brown, UPenn, and Harvard have solid neuro post docs though these are more clinical (unless Brown still has a T32 or two emphasizing research). So that pretty much exhausts your clinical training options if you are limited to CA and Ivy League. University of Florida is an integrated graduate training site that incorporates grad school, internship, and post doc (like UCSD) but you'll have to live in Gainesville.

Be aware these are all very, very competitive programs. For clinical psychology, you really do have to be geographically flexible and willing to move anywhere.

 

[erg923]

All of us are ahead of you in this game and we are teling you the things that 99% people will need to consider and/or will encounter down the road. Not just the specific question. We dont exist in vacumms. I would highly suggest you listen for the relevance of other points that we are trying to get you to think about, because...life is full of suprises.

"If you want to a wreck a man, give him 20 years of success..."

 

[NeuroTrope]

I thought that pursuing a clinical npsych degree would allow me to hone my skills in studying the disorders and uncovering more aspects to it. Is this more an approach for experimental neuroscience? I'm interested in both the cellular mechanisms as well as on a systems and holistic level. For the cellular/genetics work, I was hoping on finding a postdoctoral position that would let me expand on those interests. Any advice from someone in the field like yourself is greatly appreciated

You'll have to narrow down what you want to do. Postdoc is the right time to expand towards neuroscience if you are clinical, but like I said there is so much more to the clinical side you'll have to do first - and frankly, it's a waste of time if you are more interested in the neuroscience aspects of disease. There are several prominent researchers who study psychopathology who primarily are experimental. Might I also recommend you peruse this book: http://grey.colorado.edu/CompCogNeuro/index.php?title=CCNBook/Main and see if this is more up your alley.

 

[researchgirl]

I agree with much of what has been said and wonder if a clinical program is right for you, but I'll set that aside and answer the question "how do I find the top research-oriented clinical programs?"

I think geographically narrowing your search is going to interfere with your ability to find the best research match and the best programs so I would highly encourage you to reconsider that aspect of your search.

As for top clinical programs with heavier research emphases, if you were to go that route, it cannot be stressed enough that your mentor matters more than the school (as long as that school has good EPPP and APPIC stats and is accredited). So, when I was applying I found published research I was interested in and then looked up authors' affiliations.

The insiders guide is also a good way to search. I took that book and looked up program websites of schools they deemed research oriented, and then I read all of the faculty research interests. I also found a list that ranked clinical programs by publications and citations (one way to measure research productivity) which I found useful in determining "top" programs (and then looked up faculty interests at each of those places to determine potential matches), but the list uses 2005 data and I can't find an updated one.

 

[cara susanna]

Even if you manage to get into grad school located in a place you like, you have to move a LOT in this field. Internship, post-doc, academic jobs, etc. And it's notoriously difficult to get those last three things in California. If you feel like you can't be in happy in a place that isn't Ivy-affiliated or in California, you're going to have a rough time in this field.

 

[NeuroTrope]

You'll have to narrow down what you want to do. Postdoc is the right time to expand towards neuroscience if you are clinical, but like I said there is so much more to the clinical side you'll have to do first - and frankly, it's a waste of time if you are more interested in the neuroscience aspects of disease. There are several prominent researchers who study psychopathology who primarily are experimental. Might I also recommend you peruse this book: http://grey.colorado.edu/CompCogNeuro/index.php?title=CCNBook/Main and see if this is more up your alley.

I'll add that I'm speaking from a neuropsychologist's point of view. There are clinical neuroscientists who mentor students but not many are neuropsychologists as well. That might be the major disconnect I'm feeling here. Deanna Barch, for example, is a clinical scientist who uses functional neuroimaging in her studies. There are others like her...but you'll have to do the legwork. Check out clinical science programs at http://www.pcsas.org/.

 

[Ollie123]

I'll add that I'm speaking from a neuropsychology point of view. There are clinical neuroscientists who mentor students but not many are neuropsychologists as well. That might be the major disconnect I'm feeling here. Deanna Barch, for example, is a clinical scientist who uses functional neuroimaging in her studies. There are others like her...but you'll have to do the legwork. Check out clinical science programs at http://www.pcsas.org/.

That was my understanding of where the breakdown was too...these are really separate fields completely. My work is heavily cognitive-neuroscience based. I do experimental/laboratory work with clinical populations. Yet I am by no stretch of the imagination a neuropsychologist. The leaders in this field are not neuropsychologists and many are not even clinicians. I don't think one needs to be interested in purely clinical trials work to pursue clinical programs - I know many successful clinical psychologists whose research has nothing to do with clinical trials. However, one still needs to have a "fit" with the program/mentor and from the OP's posts it sounds like he is a terrible fit with everyone I know of in the clinical departments at the ivy's and at least one of the big CA schools. Heck, many probably wouldn't make it past "Neuropsychologist" before moving it to the bottom of the pile.

I see it frequently on this board, but much like the "PhDs don't get clinical training" myths there seems to be some pervasive belief that neuropsychology is the path for anyone interested in brain-behavior relationships. That describes the bulk of my research and I have yet to encounter a neuropsychologist doing work in my area.

 

[Therapist4Chnge]

I feel like I've taken the time and effort to deserve to go to school in a place that I like the climate and atmosphere.

That kind of thinking will be incredibly problematic for you going forward. Not to be callous, but you don't deserve diddly squat in regard to being accepted into a program. Many people on the other side of the table (e.g. professors, administrators, etc) will see that attitude from a mile away and it will TANK your application.

*edit to add*

The 'gunner' mentality has kept many smart students out of programs because most people don't want to deal with all of the "extra" stuff that comes with that approach.

Lastly, if anyone could advise what the top schools/programs are in clinical npsych I would greatly appreciate it as it will help me narrow my schools down. Thank you again for all the help.

Based on what you have posted thus far, you are not a good fit for neuropsychology. The actual field, as in what people do on a day to day basis is very different than what you have described. A neuroscience program and/or a very specialized computer science program is where you probably need to look.

 

[WisNeuro]

I see it frequently on this board, but much like the "PhDs don't get clinical training" myths there seems to be some pervasive belief that neuropsychology is the path for anyone interested in brain-behavior relationships. That describes the bulk of my research and I have yet to encounter a neuropsychologist doing work in my area.

Well, neuroscience and neuropsychology both study brain-behavior relationships, we just do it in different ways.

 

[erg923]

That was my understanding of where the breakdown was too...these are really separate fields completely. My work is heavily cognitive-neuroscience based. I do experimental/laboratory work with clinical populations. Yet I am by no stretch of the imagination a neuropsychologist. The leaders in this field are not neuropsychologists and many are not even clinicians. I don't think one needs to be interested in purely clinical trials work to pursue clinical programs - I know many successful clinical psychologists whose research has nothing to do with clinical trials. However, one still needs to have a "fit" with the program/mentor and from the OP's posts it sounds like he is a terrible fit with everyone I know of in the clinical departments at the ivy's and at least one of the big CA schools. Heck, many probably wouldn't make it past "Neuropsychologist" before moving it to the bottom of the pile.

I see it frequently on this board, but much like the "PhDs don't get clinical training" myths there seems to be some pervasive belief that neuropsychology is the path for anyone interested in brain-behavior relationships. That describes the bulk of my research and I have yet to encounter a neuropsychologist doing work in my area.

Thats a good point. I am thinking of people like Sohee Park, Jeff Bedwell, Kring, Blanchard....all heavily into cognition and/or imaging with severe psychiatic illness, but not neuropsychologists at all. Just good ole psychiatric researchers. I still think all their stuff is a little to "clinical" (for lack of a better descriptor) for this poster though .

 

[erg923]

Agree w. WisNeuro. I only work w. residents and fellows at the moment

That kind of thinking will be incredibly problematic for you going forward. Not to be callous, but you don't deserve diddly squat in regard to being accepted into a program. Many people on the other side of the table (e.g. professors, administrators, etc) will see that attitude from a mile away and it will hurt your application.

I think i know what he was trying to say I think, but I agree with you.

I think it really important that you realize that you ar talking to people who have gotten in (and some us out) with CVs a quarter of the size of yours. We have all made it...and you are struggling. Why?
1. research fit
2. self-imposed limitations in applying (Ivy league, geography)
3. lack of need for, and lack of expressed interest in, clincial training.

This would be MY assessment. What is yours? I am curious.

 

[Ollie123]

Well, neuroscience and neuropsychology both study brain-behavior relationships, we just do it in different ways.

Oh absolutely! I didn't mean to imply neuropsychologists don't do that! Just addressing the notion that some here seem to come in with the belief that neuropsychologists have a monopoly on the brain and that one can't do, say EEG/fMRI research unless one is in neuropsych. To me, the distinction has always been primarily with the populations. Someone with minimal interest in TBI/Dementia/Parkinson's etc. who primarily wants to study, say, anxiety (or addiction, or personality disorders, or trauma, take your pick) probably does not belong in neuropsych.

 

[NeuroTrope]

Oh absolutely! I didn't mean to imply neuropsychologists don't do that! Just addressing the notion that some here seem to come in with the belief that neuropsychologists have a monopoly on the brain and that one can't do, say EEG/fMRI research unless one is in neuropsych. To me, the distinction has always been primarily with the populations. Someone with minimal interest in TBI/Dementia/Parkinson's etc. who primarily wants to study, anxiety (or something similar) probably does not belong in neuropsych.

It's also difficult to transition to a primarily academic/research career if you complete the 2-year neuropsychology post doc, which is mostly clinical (and the research component is generally not of the cognitive neuroscience nature). I know this is a source of some consternation for academic neuropsychologists. The primary options are to complete a second post-doc, or acquire a research/clinical neuropsychology post doc, which only a few sites offer.

 

[psychRA]

I think that most of you have just missed what the point of my post was. I respect what everyone said and I appreciate it, I just want to attend school in either California or an ivy league, and there are plenty of programs there (clinical or not) that match my interests. I know myself and I just won't be happy going to school in Iowa or Kansas (no offense if anyone lives there).

I don't think anyone has missed the point of your post - we understand what you said, but we disagree with you. What folks here are saying is that you want a specific type of training, and you are focusing on programs that are unlikely to provide you with that training. To stand a chance at getting in, you need to apply to a lot of programs (10-15), and there are maybe 4-5 programs total from CA/the ivies that might be what you're looking for. Those are not good odds. You're also focusing on programs that you think are prestigious, but aren't actually presitious when it comes to doctoral psychology. I matched to one of the most competitive internship sites in the country, and not one of current or more recent interns attended any of the grad programs that you mentioned.

Because you're also looking at programs in geographically desirable areas, you're going to have much more competition. You have a good CV, but your two areas of weakness are your GRE and your GPA, and those are the two areas that are most commonly used to weed out applicants. It's great that your psych GPA is 3.9, but your cumulative is 3.4, and some programs use 3.5 as a cutoff. Your GRE is also likely to be below the minimum score that some programs use to make the first round of cuts. It doesn't matter how strong your research experience is, and your letters of recommendation are, if no one in the department ever reads your application because you didn't make it through the first cut. You can't change your GPA at this point, but I'd suggest that you put everything you've got into bringing that GRE up.

Finally, consider the fact that grad school is intensely stressful and busy, and you're probably not going to care what kinds of local attractions are available to you because you're going to be too busy to spend much time outside of the department. If you've never lived outside of a major metro area (I hadn't before grad school, either), you don't actually know that you "can't" do it - you're just making assumptions, and you're really going to hobble your chances of getting in. If you really are committed to doing this work, you need to be open to the possibility of doing it outside of CA.

ETA: I came back and bolded my advice about your GRE and GPA, as you were asking for practical advice and those are two weak areas in your applications. In terms of the psych GRE, I would suggest taking a practice test to get a sense of how prepared you are. You've still got lots of time to prepare for it, and if you can take it and do well, it might help to bolster you applications. If you're going to get an average score, I wouldn't take it unless you're applying to a program that requires it.

 

[LisaLisa86]

I don't think anyone has missed the point of your post - we understand what you said, but we disagree with you. What folks here are saying is that you want a specific type of training, and you are focusing on programs that are unlikely to provide you with that training. To stand a chance at getting in, you need to apply to a lot of programs (10-15), and there are maybe 4-5 programs total from CA/the ivies that might be what you're looking for. Those are not good odds. You're also focusing on programs that you think are prestigious, but aren't actually presitious when it comes to doctoral psychology. I matched to one of the most competitive internship sites in the country, and not one of current or more recent interns attended any of the grad programs that you mentioned.

This. Very well put.

 

[sockit]

nvm

 

[chman]

So, hey, like any other program, ask the POI if they're planning to take a student next year and be aware that no matter how much you desire to work with somebody, they may not take a student any given year (probably one of the most frustrating things about this for me when I was deciding where to apply).

This is the most frustrating thing for me. I am looking up potential mentors and plan to apply next cycle, but at this point I have no way of knowing if they will actually be taking students lol. Oh well, what can you do?