What is a good score in step 1 for an IMG for 2012 match?

[Daydreamer27]

I got a score of 242/99 in step 1. As an IMG,i am not sure if its good enough!!

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[jkuk]

congrats on the score, depends on what your trying to go into, but thats a great score!!

 

[jfgavina]

I'm also an IMG from europe, aiming 230. Will it be enough to internal medicine?

 

[AlexMorph]

I'm also an IMG from europe, aiming 230. Will it be enough to internal medicine?

Probably, depending on the program. It is all very program dependent.

 

[AlexMorph]

Serious question for you IMGs: you are clearly brilliant, so why not stay in your home countries? You could make a much greater impact that way.

The promise of money and girls.

Till they come and find out neither is available to them.

 

[redcard]

Serious question for you IMGs: you are clearly brilliant, so why not stay in your home countries? You could make a much greater impact that way.

You are clearly as brilliant as they are , so why not you go there instead and make that imapct you are talking about ; considering that you had a better U.S education than most people in these countries ?

The promise of money and girls.

Till they come and find out neither is available to them.

How about the promise of no war , better life standard , freedom of speech ....etc ? any of that available ?

 

[jkuk]

or maybe they're from the US but weren't able to get into a US school, and want to come back home to practice!

 

[jfgavina]

Serious question for you IMGs: you are clearly brilliant, so why not stay in your home countries? You could make a much greater impact that way.

Actually my home country (portugal) is one of the countries in europe with the greatest rates of foreign doctors. Most of them come from eastern europe and spain. Now we're recruiting doctors from south america as we have needs at rural areas. These are seen as mercenaries because they're much more well paid than we are.
I believe that most of the IMGs from developing countries like india, mexico and pakistan look for better conditions (money and education) and think this will be possible in the USA. In my home country you can make a fortune as a doctor if you have your own clinic, but in the hospital you are a slave. I'm not brilliant and I think I will add nothing to my country if I don't go where medicine is at its best. USA is my elected country. Also it's like a challange to me to study for step 1.
For AMG: don't see us as a threat, see us as a challenge. We're not there to take your place. In my country foreign graduates take residency places in competition with us, if a foreign has 95% in examination and I have 94% he is preferred.

 

[jfgavina]

Also, gas here costs 6.5 euros (7 or 8 dollars) a gallon. Not cool lol

 

[deleted116380]

How about the promise of no war , better life standard , freedom of speech ....etc ? any of that available ?

Promise of no war? Here in the US, we can promise you we will always be having at least 1 war going on regardless of who is in office. Better life standard? It's dropped each and every day. If you like rising prices, but stagnant income, this place is for you. Freedom of Speech? Also going away.

I'm actually planning on leaving this place after residency...not worth my time and energy anymore. Anything over $100k a year isn't necessary for me anyway. I'd rather stay and practice in the country where I was born and raised, but State and Federal govts have slowly ruined it. Singapore would be a place I wouldn't mind working in.

Congrats on the score.

 

[jfgavina]

How are the conditions in singapore?

 

[AlexMorph]

How about the promise of no war , better life standard , freedom of speech ....etc ? any of that available ?

You clearly have never been to the South...

 

[AlexMorph]

Actually my home country (portugal) is one of the countries in europe with the greatest rates of foreign doctors. Most of them come from eastern europe and spain. Now we're recruiting doctors from south america as we have needs at rural areas. These are seen as mercenaries because they're much more well paid than we are.
I believe that most of the IMGs from developing countries like india, mexico and pakistan look for better conditions (money and education) and think this will be possible in the USA. In my home country you can make a fortune as a doctor if you have your own clinic, but in the hospital you are a slave. I'm not brilliant and I think I will add nothing to my country if I don't go where medicine is at its best. USA is my elected country. Also it's like a challange to me to study for step 1.
For AMG: don't see us as a threat, see us as a challenge. We're not there to take your place. In my country foreign graduates take residency places in competition with us, if a foreign has 95% in examination and I have 94% he is preferred.

First of all, that sucks about gas, but I'm sure public transportation is probably a lot better than the mess that we have here.

Second, you claim you are not brilliant and you will not add anything to your country, but you will make a difference here? Don't get me wrong, I have no issues with you going wherever you want. If you earned your spot, it's yours, enjoy. I just don't follow your logic.

Third, you are right about the Indian and Middle-Eastern docs.

 

[deleted116380]

How are the conditions in singapore?

High tax on cars (like other countries in the area) and not the highest pay for docs ($100k being a high figure). Other living expenses are not too bad. Basically, a doc will have a comfortable living there, but not some baller with helicopters all over their roof. English is not some rare language there anyway.

I'd want to live there for the culture and to experience a new place. I don't think the US has any culture (unless you count SUVs, fast food, and cookie cutter homes as culture).

Other than that, I would like New Zealand, but only because it's a beautiful country with lots of land that hasn't been raped by developers. Kiwis are cool birds, too.

 

[jfgavina]

If I make a difference or not only time will tell, what I can tell you is that I will have a better education so then I can make a difference here at my home country or in the US. I am learning so much just by studying for step 1. The way you americans provide information is simple and effective. You should see what we (don't) learn here. They try to teach us so much that in the end we don't know the key facts.
I'm not taking anyone's place, I'm studying to get my place and I need to study, focus and sacrifice my life more than you to get that. Foreigns here just have to learn the language, take the exam and being subject to a selection in equal conditions to residents.

 

[jfgavina]

Perfectly understandable. Here, old people sometimes refuse to being evaluated by spanish doctors, and we have the same ethnic origin.

 

[redcard]

Promise of no war? Here in the US, we can promise you we will always be having at least 1 war going on regardless of who is in office.

LOL , i didn't mean a war going on abroad ... you can't be serious , right?

Better life standard? It's dropped each and every day. If you like rising prices, but stagnant income, this place is for you. Freedom of Speech? Also going away.

So now it is actually better to live in Pakistan / India / Iraq / Iran than the U.S ......... wow !

I'm actually planning on leaving this place after residency...not worth my time and energy anymore. Anything over $100k a year isn't necessary for me anyway. I'd rather stay and practice in the country where I was born and raised, but State and Federal govts have slowly ruined it. Singapore would be a place I wouldn't mind working in.

Maybe for your own good . Sometimes it is hard to appreciate what one has until experiencing another way of living.

You clearly have never been to the South...

You clearly have never been to ANY third world country .

Because I am being trained to work in the US health system, and my family lives in the US. Plus, I would have to learn a new language and adopt a new set of customs.

You can always train to work in another system just like thousands/millions of doctors did/do/done.

And it's funny that you count learning a new language and being away from your family as if you were making a big sacrifice .... Oh wait , isn't that what IMGs exactly do?

So imagine what they are living through in order to make such sacrifice .

 

[AlexMorph]

You can always train to work in another system just like thousands/millions of doctors did/do/done.

And it's funny that you count learning a new language and being away from your family as if you were making a big sacrifice .... Oh wait , isn't that what IMGs exactly do?

So imagine what they are living through in order to make such sacrifice .

I was with you till your last paragraph. Are you kidding me? If you are making such an amazing sacrifice, gtfo. You are not needed. You make a choice to come here to escape your own ****hole, you said so yourself. Don't pretend like you are making a sacrifice. It's like saying, "I'm making a huge sacrifice by giving up my Suzuki to drive this Ferrari."

And why would you possibly suggest to the other guy to leave America to go practice wherever you are if you can't wait to leave that mess?

 

[redcard]

I was with you till your last paragraph. Are you kidding me? If you are making such an amazing sacrifice, gtfo. You are not needed. You make a choice to come here to escape your own ****hole, you said so yourself. Don't pretend like you are making a sacrifice. It's like saying, "I'm making a huge sacrifice by giving up my Suzuki to drive this Ferrari."

First of all , what's with the attitude ?

Second , I wrote to the other guy : " And it's funny that you count learning a new language and being away from your family as if you were making a big sacrifice "

So ,obviously, i was responding to something he wrote and following his logic since he wrote it (Please read well before going all attack !)

And why would you possibly suggest to the other guy to leave America to go practice wherever you are if you can't wait to leave that mess?

And again i wrote "and make that imapct you are talking about ; considering that you had a better U.S education than most people in these countries ? " so i was obviously referring to what he wrote ...(Dude ,seriously , why do you skip some replies and choose only to read the ones you like?).

 

[indsha008]

The funniest part about this thread is that OP is no where to be found. 1 post and probably will be 1 post.

 

[Zback]

You clearly have never been to ANY third world country .
.

I have been to a third world country, it is called the South and I love it haha.

 

[redcard]

The funniest part about this thread is that OP is no where to be found. 1 post and probably will be 1 post.

Yep , but to be honest , it's our fault since he asked one thing and we started discussing something else .

I have been to a third world country, it is called the South and I love it haha.

LOL . Oh snap !

 

[Mr hawkings]

Is everyone on SDN just waiting for a trigger to go off on some sociopolitical rant regardless of the questions being posed?
We are on the step 1 portion of the site, for goodness sake and people still cant resist turning a very reasonable question into a debate about politics/imigration/any other **** everyone thinks they know more about than anyone else.

If someone makes a comment you dont agree with, its ok to resist the temptation to respond if only to keep the discussion on track with what the original intent of the thread.

 

[pilottodoctor]

calm down everyone, and Congratulation on your step1 score OP make sure you do good in step2 as well, because step2 will weight more trust me. Congrats once again

 

[Chalo1986]

From the time Ive been in this country, Ive certainly seen my share of despotism towards foreign doctors, specially from american graduates, and while at times this has been a bit discouraging, I realize now thankfully this is not the norm, most people come to see us as an integral part of the solution for this nations dire current situation
I can sure tell some posters in this thread have seriuos resent towards us IMGs (dont worry Ill not single out any of you...) and to you I say, never judge someone till youve walked in their shoes, I saw someone referring to other countries as ****holes; believe me I was never eager to leave my family, my roots, my friends just for the pursuit of a ferrari; social insecurity and a great personal tragedy drove me to look for a better future
As for the opinion of some that we would be of greater help by staying in our countries, believe me not a day goes by that I dont ponder on that question, I know some day Ill be able to return, but the love for my country as great as it may be is NOT greater then the love for my family and my concern for their well being
Ill go by saying that regardless of the hatred steaming from a small minority, Ill stay here, today I got my results back for my step 1 exam, with the help of God I got a 252, this is an amazing country, Im given the same oportunities, the same chances as anyone else to go about in my pursuit of happyness, I dont know what the future holds for me but I know one thing, Ill give all my love and hard work for this country which opened its doors for me, and for many more before me

 

[event horizon]

Serious question for you IMGs: you are clearly brilliant, so why not stay in your home countries? You could make a much greater impact that way.

What I like about the United States is that it's the place where, more than anywhere else, competence is most respected. I believe everyone should be free to pursue their own happiness and despite its many faults, the US is still the best place in the world to do that. I admit I was taken aback when I found out that residency positions are subsidized by the government - I have no intention of leeching on anyone's tax dollars. But I figure if I take my residency in your country, then the taxes I'll pay in the subsequent years from my practice should make up for that initial investment.

It's funny - my country has an even worse physician shortage and they're urging all of us to stay. But of course the compensation to doctors here is not at all proportional to the amount of work we put in. The funny part is that I recently found out that foreign citizens are not even allowed to take our medical licensure exam. My dad knows an Indian doctor who took up medicine in our country, but now she can't practice because she's not a Filipino citizen. That's just crazy.

I know the reason IMGs are even allowed in the US is because there's a shortage of doctors - but I don't know, to me it harks back to the remarkable beginnings of your country - the only one built by immigrants from all corners of the globe, built on the principles of freedom and voluntary association.

Right now socialism is encroaching on your country but your health care system is still better off than Canada or Europe, where they are beginning to realize that the government CANNOT support its citizens from the cradle to the grave. It was never meant to. I know a lot of you will disagree, but I'm sure IMGs from those areas will inform you that physicians (and patients) in your country are better off. It is that mixture of a limited government and personal freedom that attracts me most to the United States, and it is my fervent hope that in the long run those conditions, which bring out the best in humanity, will prevail. I don't care to see the day when the totalitarian Chinese government overtakes the US, though I understand it might be coming soon.

 

[Poiu86]

High tax on cars (like other countries in the area) and not the highest pay for docs ($100k being a high figure). Other living expenses are not too bad. Basically, a doc will have a comfortable living there, but not some baller with helicopters all over their roof. English is not some rare language there anyway.

I'd want to live there for the culture and to experience a new place. I don't think the US has any culture (unless you count SUVs, fast food, and cookie cutter homes as culture).

Other than that, I would like New Zealand, but only because it's a beautiful country with lots of land that hasn't been raped by developers. Kiwis are cool birds, too.

Yeah, those dudes here making $150,000 at 35 with double the debt and a young family are REALLY ballin' out of control.

 

[HopeTo99]

I don't mean to butt in here but I couldn't help but say something about all of this considering the fact that I am an IMG myself. We IMGs don't have the luxury of getting a top medical education simply because the education in our countries isn't that good, truthfully speaking. I personally love the American way of medicine and I do agree with the above post; I too actually learned alot by studying for the Steps - I believe it makes us better doctors. For us it is mostly rote memorization and spoon-feeding (only now have some countries decided to adopt a PBL based system and even so it's not going that well). Why are we pursuing a residency spot in the States? It's not like we're not going to go back to our home countries some day and serve the country we were born and raised in. We train in the U.S and hope that some day we can do better for our patients in our own countries.
Great discussion though.

 

[SeekerOfTheTree]

Dude I gotta step in here and just say since when did India become a 3rd world country? It is part of the BRIC countries and is doing really well for itself. The medical/engineering education there is on par with the U.S. by some standards. Same thing with most EU countries. There really aren't many wars going on there and generally people have a good standard of living.

Heck even in Pakistan; India's neighbor, we have it pretty good as docs. You can have like 5 servants. You can pay people to wipe your butt for you if you really want. My family still lives back there and even with the Osama stuff going on they aren't hiding in caves fearing for their lives and wishing they could come to America for salvation. Life goes on. By the way I'm going to a school here not an IMG, just giving a different perspective.

I personally like being in the U.S. because the women are hot and they wear skimpy clothes and my parents moved here. I know everyone talks about how bad all these other countries are but when you leave because you can based on your education you are kind of taking the easy way out and leaving behind all those that are suffering rather than helping them. I feel bad for all those people in Pakistan's villages that will never have a doctor because I am here but at the same time I see hot girls here and they don't.

The funny thing is when we write our med school apps we have to put in how much we want to sacrifice our lives to help those who are in need but when we go to apply for residency we say you are coming from a country where people need you the most and where we send our med school students to help...but since you got a 270 you can come here instead and screw those kids dying of Tom Cruzi or whatever lol.

Lets just be honest when we say why you are in the U.S.
1) It's nice
2) There are hot girls from every country so you can date anybody without worrying about caste, religion, etc.
3) Internet is not restricted so we can watch donkey porn
4) Women can drive and vote!
5) We have so many fast food places to chose from to eat at
6) Girls can wear skimpy clothes without worrying about being groped at the market (trust me, happens all the time in Pakistan)
7) We can vote even for idiots and they can run the country
8) You can go swimming and the girls wear bikinis!!!!
9) You can have pets and not worry about people eating them
10) MAURY!!!!
11) Indoor plumbing!!!!!!
12) No arranged marriages necessary to get with a hot girl!

So lets stop saying I left country X because there was war and my family was getting killed. You know what, there are still about a 100 million people back home so what makes you so special that you get to come here and they don't. Not really directed against anybody but I'm just saying lets be honest. It's cool if you come here for these reasons, just say it. Don't sugar coat it. I'm not the dean of admissions so I don't care.

P.S. If you don't like hot girls you might have Klinefelter's.

 

[hrandani]

Visiting wealthy family is one thing. Try raising a family in Pakistan.

Try opening a business. Being hospitalized, needing surgery with no family to help you out. Pakistan and India are definitely third world, the fact that some people can enjoy a first world lifestyle despite crippling poverty begging outside their mansion doesn't disprove, it just enhances that third world status.

So many ABCDs are so completely clueless when it comes to the old country. You can say Pakistan Zindabad, ekh number one all you want, that doesn't make it true.

America is great not because it's perfect, but because in terms of meritocracy it's miles ahead of most other countries in the world and is far more adapted to immigration, legal or otherwise.

 

[womp]

Dude I gotta step in here and just say since when did India become a 3rd world country? It is part of the BRIC countries and is doing really well for itself. The medical/engineering education there is on par with the U.S. by some standards.

HAHAHAHA

India is on the lower tier of Third World countries. Put down the bong, throw away the chauvinism and maybe travel a little bit outside your upper caste gated neighborhood when you're back in India or Pakistan, maybe try the UP or Bihar. It's easy to be dazzled by some symbols of prosperity and achievement when you have a population base in the billions. Instead, try comparing the typical Indian or Pakistani (1 in 1.3 billion, like the servant who would wipe your family member's butt) with the typical American living in his single family detached home. It's like comparing heaven and hell.

I'm Chinese and I know clearly that China is still a Third World country and China's per capita GDP is more than three times larger than India's. So where does that put India?

 

[bbydoc]

Lets just be honest when we say why you are in the U.S...

So lets stop saying I left country X because there was war and my family was getting killed. You know what, there are still about a 100 million people back home so what makes you so special that you get to come here and they don't.

besides being horny, you are spot on I must say!
I dont get why people can't be honest about this.
But until countries like the US (australia, new zealand) do not graduate enough MDs, fishing for the best foreign grads will go on. It is a win-win situation for both, for the US and the IMGs who get selected.
The ones who lose are the people who these IMGs were supposed to serve in return for free medical school (not always the case).
Personally I dont care much about this issue, worth to be pointed out though.

 

[SeekerOfTheTree]

Visiting wealthy family is one thing. Try raising a family in Pakistan.

Try opening a business. Being hospitalized, needing surgery with no family to help you out. Pakistan and India are definitely third world, the fact that some people can enjoy a first world lifestyle despite crippling poverty begging outside their mansion doesn't disprove, it just enhances that third world status.

So many ABCDs are so completely clueless when it comes to the old country. You can say Pakistan Zindabad, ekh number one all you want, that doesn't make it true.

America is great not because it's perfect, but because in terms of meritocracy it's miles ahead of most other countries in the world and is far more adapted to immigration, legal or otherwise.

Umm bro, before thinking I got some rich family back home ask. It will make you look more informed than thinking you know. They're average people. The 150 million people that live there aren't all rushing to come here. Did you go to Pakistan and open a business? I would really like to know about this venture capital med student.

America is great no ****. I said that life back in Pakistan isn't so miserable that everyone is making a sacrifice and leaving their whole family behind. You can go to a hospital. There are governmetn run hospitals. You can go to clinics, homeopathic doctors, shamans, hell whatever pleases you. I don't recall saying America sucks in my post. Not everyone has to come here to have a great life but I am glad I did. That's my point. You can make a good life in a hut if you want.

If you think India is still third world I can't really make an argument with you. If you go to Detroit in the U.S. you would think we are third world. Don't generalize based on what you hear. Look at economic output, GDP, the number of wealthy in that country before you decide you are the next Greenspan on the forum.

Stop watching Fox News on Pakistan.

 

[SeekerOfTheTree]

besides being horny, you are spot on I must say!
I dont get why people can't be honest about this.
But until countries like the US (australia, new zealand) do not graduate enough MDs, fishing for the best foreign grads will go on. It is a win-win situation for both, for the US and the IMGs who get selected.
The ones who lose are the people who these IMGs were supposed to serve in return for free medical school (not always the case).
Personally I dont care much about this issue, worth to be pointed out though.

Lol, it's not that I'm horny...it's just where can you go and see a girl running in bra and panties in the street and not be chased by a mob in the middle east?

 

[SeekerOfTheTree]

HAHAHAHA

India is on the lower tier of Third World countries. Put down the bong, throw away the chauvinism and maybe travel a little bit outside your upper caste gated neighborhood when you're back in India or Pakistan, maybe try the UP or Bihar. It's easy to be dazzled by some symbols of prosperity and achievement when you have a population base in the billions. Instead, try comparing the typical Indian or Pakistani (1 in 1.3 billion, like the servant who would wipe your family member's butt) with the typical American living in his single family detached home. It's like comparing heaven and hell.

I'm Chinese and I know clearly that China is still a Third World country and China's per capita GDP is more than three times larger than India's. So where does that put India?

Yeah you're Chinese, good for you. I've been to China and India. I've even seen the slums next to the train station in Shanghai and homeless people trying to sleep with you at night just so they have a roof over their head. Is there poverty in China? Yeah. Is there poverty in the U.S.? Oh yeah. What's your point? Same thing happens here. I'm saying now comparatively they can't be considered third world. The countries GDPs and economic growth speaks for themselves. They are not at the level of any of the African nations. Ever been to a poor neighborhood in the U.S? There are more Chinese that are considered wealthy by Chinese standards than the entire population of the U.S.

Again, did my dad have more kids that I didn't know about because how the heck do you know so much about my family? Did I release my W-2 on here or something? Did you know the guy who use to wipe my butt when I was little? It was an example of how good of a life docs can live back home too. They have it good there too. It's not so bad that they have to runaway from the wars to come here. That was the point. Don't ASSume that I'm some rich ABCD. I don't have a doctor or engineer in my family. I'm sorry to disappoint. My dad had an eighth grade education. I'm sorry I actually live here and see people in poverty here and people in poverty around the world but they get by and so do we. If you still think China is third world maybe you should call up somebody back home and find out who is slated to beat the U.S. GDP in the next ten years. But if you would like to find villages in China and take pictures and show me there is poverty I will take pictures of slums here in the U.S. and show you how much poverty we have here too. I'm looking at the big picture and comparing countries on a whole, not at the slum by slum level.

And please just look at this link and see who is number 2 and 4. Please?

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/List_of_countries_by_GDP_(PPP)

Now if you want to tell me that the Chinese and Indians want to come here to look at girls in string bikinis and have some freedoms that they might not have there like having a hack free google account then I will listen.

 

[SeekerOfTheTree]

Again, I'm being really serious when I say I like being here because of the women and Maury. I don't know why some people think I'm making fun of America in some way and loving Pakistan. I don't wanna live there becaue of the reasons I stated. Again, I feel some people just read parts of posts and respond to things that can make them sound cool or patriotic.

 

[event horizon]

Yeah you're Chinese, good for you. I've been to China and India. I've even seen the slums next to the train station in Shanghai and homeless people trying to sleep with you at night just so they have a roof over their head. Is there poverty in China? Yeah. Is there poverty in the U.S.? Oh yeah. What's your point? Same thing happens here. I'm saying now comparatively they can't be considered third world. The countries GDPs and economic growth speaks for themselves. They are not at the level of any of the African nations. Ever been to a poor neighborhood in the U.S? There are more Chinese that are considered wealthy by Chinese standards than the entire population of the U.S.

Again, did my dad have more kids that I didn't know about because how the heck do you know so much about my family? Did I release my W-2 on here or something? Did you know the guy who use to wipe my butt when I was little? It was an example of how good of a life docs can live back home too. They have it good there too. It's not so bad that they have to runaway from the wars to come here. That was the point. Don't ASSume that I'm some rich ABCD. I don't have a doctor or engineer in my family. I'm sorry to disappoint. My dad had an eighth grade education. I'm sorry I actually live here and see people in poverty here and people in poverty around the world but they get by and so do we. If you still think China is third world maybe you should call up somebody back home and find out who is slated to beat the U.S. GDP in the next ten years. But if you would like to find villages in China and take pictures and show me there is poverty I will take pictures of slums here in the U.S. and show you how much poverty we have here too. I'm looking at the big picture and comparing countries on a whole, not at the slum by slum level.

And please just look at this link and see who is number 2 and 4. Please?

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/List_of_countries_by_GDP_(PPP)

Now if you want to tell me that the Chinese and Indians want to come here to look at girls in string bikinis and have some freedoms that they might not have there like having a hack free google account then I will listen.

If you compare poverty in the US and poverty in third world countries, you will find that they are at a whole different level. I have been to the US and I live in a third world country. What you would consider "poor" people in the US are much better off.

 

[AlexMorph]

If you compare poverty in the US and poverty in third world countries, you will find that they are at a whole different level. I have been to the US and I live in a third world country. What you would consider "poor" people in the US are much better off.

He is too busy staring at chicks in bikinis to listen to your logic.

 

[SeekerOfTheTree]

If you compare poverty in the US and poverty in third world countries, you will find that they are at a whole different level. I have been to the US and I live in a third world country. What you would consider "poor" people in the US are much better off.

Yes, we have Maury here. It does make life better. I agree.

I'm guessing being hungry in a third world country must feel much more different than being hungry in the U.S. It must be a unique experience of not being able to feed your family there versus here.

 

[SeekerOfTheTree]

He is too busy staring at chicks in bikinis to listen to your logic.

I agree. They are hot bro, I'm sorry you have XXY syndrome happening

 

[SeekerOfTheTree]

I thought the whole point was how doctors live in these poor countries, not there are poor starving kids in Africa campaign. Wasn't the whole point that if you are smart enough to be a doc and come here to have a good life, you could have a pretty damn good one back home?

Not to mention make a difference in your deprived and poverty stricken country?

 

[event horizon]

Yes, we have Maury here. It does make life better. I agree.

I'm guessing being hungry in a third world country must feel much more different than being hungry in the U.S. It must be a unique experience of not being able to feed your family there versus here.

There's a big difference. In the US, very few people literally (I am using the word in the correct sense) die of hunger. In third world countries like the Philippines, it's a fairly common occurrence.

 

[event horizon]

I thought the whole point was how doctors live in these poor countries, not there are poor starving kids in Africa campaign. Wasn't the whole point that if you are smart enough to be a doc and come here to have a good life, you could have a pretty damn good one back home?

Not to mention make a difference in your deprived and poverty stricken country?

You are right. If you work REALLY hard, have excellent interpersonal skills and deliver superior care, as a medical specialist (surgeons make more) you would be able to make, in my country, around half as much money as a nurse makes in the US. Which is why a lot of doctors in my country have resorted to taking up nursing in the hopes of finding work there. Also most people would agree that well-qualified doctors should stay in their countries to serve, but I don't believe in altruism. I believe that as long as you do not step on the rights of others, you should be free to find your own happiness. No one should be forced to be his brother's keeper. But of course the word "right" has so many different connotations. I personally believe that the United Nations has created too many artificial rights that would be impossible to uphold without violating the rights of others (such as education or health care) but that is a whole different story.

 

[SeekerOfTheTree]

There's a big difference. In the US, very few people literally (I am using the word in the correct sense) die of hunger. In third world countries like the Philippines, it's a fairly common occurrence.

I agree with your statement. But it doesn't make the experience of living in poverty different for the one who goes through it. Knowing, hey atleast I don't have it as bad as the kids in Africa doesn't make it any better.

The point I was getting at (and I have no idea how we got here) is that a doctor in the Philippines is probably better of than the kid that's starving to death right? In an ideal world he would want to help out the people back home right? Now if he wants to come to the U.S. there is nothing wrong with that. This land is open to anyone and it makes it great. Just say you like the U.S. and want to come here. Don't say that because of the war, hungry kids, natural disasters you and your family are going through great hardship so you want to leave. Like my friends in this post pointed out, people with rich families who live in gated suburbs of India and Pakistan are most sheltered from these hardships.

The people you are referring to are the ones going through the hardship but they can't afford to come here. But the ones they need the most (doctor's, engineers, pharmacists, strippers, etc) who can afford to come here leave them to make a better life for themselves; eventhough the one they had was much better than their countrymen. If this is a conscious choice then state it as such and don't sugar coat it. I admit that I would rather be here then helping people in Pakistan who need it because I like the life here. There is nothing wrong with saying that is the reason you want to come to the U.S.

You know someone is going to only quote one line of this post and respond to it in a frantic way rather than reading the whole thing. It's kind of annoying guys. I don't care to have a my country has more poor people than you argument.

By the way, I dated a hottie from the Phillipines. I love lumpia and chicken adobo (sp?)

 

[SeekerOfTheTree]

I don't believe in altruism....

I LOVE YOU! That's all. That's all I care about. That was the point of my post but I think it got lost on the Pakistanis on this forum. Admit why you want to be in the U.S. Life is good. Not that I wouldn't do great with a doctor's salary back home and have servants but it is just much better to be in the U.S.A where you can chase your dreams. I agree with you. No need to be altruistic, just be honest.

EDIT: I don't like Pakistan more than the U.S. eventhough I am Pakistani. I just don't want to live there eventhough living there as a doctor I could save many lives of the poor and underserved, but I don't believe in being altruistic to that extent because I like life here.

 

[event horizon]

I agree with your statement. But it doesn't make the experience of living in poverty different for the one who goes through it. Knowing, hey atleast I don't have it as bad as the kids in Africa doesn't make it any better.

The point I was getting at (and I have no idea how we got here) is that a doctor in the Philippines is probably better of than the kid that's starving to death right? In an ideal world he would want to help out the people back home right? Now if he wants to come to the U.S. there is nothing wrong with that. This land is open to anyone and it makes it great. Just say you like the U.S. and want to come here. Don't say that because of the war, hungry kids, natural disasters you and your family are going through great hardship so you want to leave. Like my friends in this post pointed out, people with rich families who live in gated suburbs of India and Pakistan are most sheltered from these hardships.

The people you are referring to are the ones going through the hardship but they can't afford to come here. But the ones they need the most (doctor's, engineers, pharmacists, strippers, etc) who can afford to come here leave them to make a better life for themselves; eventhough the one they had was much better than their countrymen. If this is a conscious choice then state it as such and don't sugar coat it. I admit that I would rather be here then helping people in Pakistan who need it because I like the life here. There is nothing wrong with saying that is the reason you want to come to the U.S.

You know someone is going to only quote one line of this post and respond to it in a frantic way rather than reading the whole thing. It's kind of annoying guys. I don't care to have a my country has more poor people than you argument.

By the way, I dated a hottie from the Phillipines. I love lumpia and chicken adobo (sp?)

OK I agree completely with this post.
I think lumpia is something we got from the Chinese, but adobo is probably a purely Filipino thing. And I love it. One of the things I'll miss if I get matched next year.

 

[SeekerOfTheTree]

OK I agree completely with this post.
I think lumpia is something we got from the Chinese, but adobo is probably a purely Filipino thing. And I love it. One of the things I'll miss if I get matched next year.

Lol. Good food, man I miss that. I wish you good luck on your match. I hope you get where you want to be. Chicago has good Filipino food, keep it in mind.

 

[event horizon]

I LOVE YOU! That's all. That's all I care about. That was the point of my post but I think it got lost on the Pakistanis on this forum. Admit why you want to be in the U.S. Life is good. Not that I wouldn't do great with a doctor's salary back home and have servants but it is just much better to be in the U.S.A where you can chase your dreams. I agree with you. No need to be altruistic, just be honest.

EDIT: I don't like Pakistan more than the U.S. eventhough I am Pakistani. I just don't want to live there eventhough living there as a doctor I could save many lives of the poor and underserved, but I don't believe in being altruistic to that extent because I like life here.

I'm glad there's people like you on this forum. And I wish more people would be able to stand up openly and defend their right to their own happiness. Don't get me wrong - it's not like I'm a completely unfeeling robot. I'm not blind to the suffering of others, and eventually when I start earning I'll want to help people out. I just don't want to be "guilt-tripped" into doing it. If I help anyone in the future it will be completely voluntary, not because I have a guilty conscience.

 

[event horizon]

Lol. Good food, man I miss that. I wish you good luck on your match. I hope you get where you want to be. Chicago has good Filipino food, keep it in mind.

Thanks, you too! But I guess it's still a couple of years away for you. I actually have a lot of family in Chicago. It's one of the places I hope to match, but if really had my way I'd like to do my residency in NYC for the adventure.

 

[SeekerOfTheTree]

Thanks, you too! But I guess it's still a couple of years away for you. I actually have a lot of family in Chicago. It's one of the places I hope to match, but if really had my way I'd like to do my residency in NYC for the adventure.

Ah the Big Apple. I hope you get to go there. I've only visited but I can see why people want to live there. Follow the dream! I am about to take Step 1 in three weeks so wish me luck for that. Thanks again, it was good seeing an honest opinion on the forums with the world experience to actually back it up.