MD What would I need for Ortho?

[AthleteDoc7]

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Hey all. I've been pretty set on going into EM since even before med school, and I'm still pretty sure I will, but lately all the doom and gloom about the field from my EM mentors is weighing on me. They keep telling me I can do anything and should heavily consider other fields as "the sky is falling", so I'm doing my due diligence to make sure I'm not missing anything. I really enjoy the field so it feels weird to even be asking this, but everyone around me in EM have been so negative lately.

I spent a day with ortho recently and I honestly loved it. The procedures were awesome and I had a blast. The cons for me were the lack of any real "medicine", and the crap hours, which I'm still not sure I can stomach. But I'm trying to explore all options.

If I were to consider the field, what more would I need? Obviously I am in the preliminary stages, and still not sure I love it yet, but trying to think ahead. My app has been super tailored toward EM through all of med school.

I'm at a lower tier US MD school. Step 1 245-250 range, so not that great for ortho. All honors on clerkships so far, including surgery and medicine. Got a great LOR from the chair of surgery from my rotation who loved me and wanted me to do surgery lol. Im a very outgoing, personable guy.

My biggest lacking area is definitely research. I have a couple poster presentations, not ortho related, and that's really it. I'm approaching the end of third year. Would I need to immediately hop on some projects and try to get some stuff put out to have any chance? Anyone successful without this, maybe just being involved in a current project? I'm not willing to take a research year. Anything else I'm deficient in? Other fields to consider? I appreciate y'all!

 

[Redpancreas]

I’m not the biggest fan of EM myself but what the hell is up with all this doom& gloom about EM in the past week? I feel like last year no one could shut up about 3yrs, 300k, working every other day and now every thread on MD-Allo is getting hijacked by this discussion about the so-called EM apocolypse.

To answer your question you need to determine if you’d rather take your chances with EM vs. doing a research year and have a 75% chance of matching ortho.

 

[AthleteDoc7]

I’m not the biggest fan of EM myself but what the hell is up with all this doom& gloom about EM in the past week? I feel like last year no one could shut up about 3yrs, 300k, working every other day and now every thread on MD-Allo is getting hijacked by this discussion about the so-called EM apocolypse.

To answer your question you need to determine if you’d rather take your chances with EM vs. doing a research year and have a 75% chance of matching ortho.

Right? I've noticed it on here also. I tend to ignore the trends on here, but now it's spilling over into my real life mentors and that worries me a little.

If I were to decide to pursue ortho, I would NOT be willing to do a research year. I'm trying to figure out what I'd need to do now, and what my chances would be without one. I'm sure I'll still end up in EM as I genuinely enjoy it, but like I said, I'm just looking into options.

 

[CherryRedDracul]

What's your max bench press?

 

[Aerus]

You'll be fighting an uphill battle with ortho without a research year, since you don't have any publications or ortho related projects. However, if you do an away somewhere and get a very strong letter from a very influential person in the department, you still have a shot assuming you start SOME ortho research ASAP. Your step 1 score is in line with ortho and honors on all your clerkships so far is good. If you can get AOA, that would be a huge plus.

 

[AnatomyGrey12]

I'm at a lower tier US MD school. Step 1 245-250 range,

All honors on clerkships so far, including surgery and medicine. Got a great LOR from the chair of surgery from my rotation who loved me and wanted me to do surgery lol. Im a very outgoing, personable guy

On the contrary, I think it will be tremendously useful.

That's all fine and dandy but the answer to this next questions could make or break your chances.... Bro do you even lift?

 

[Money Moniker]

Ha, I'm in the same boat as you OP, except that I haven't yet taken Step I and will hopefully get started on an ortho project soon. I too started med school with the notion that EM is my go to as it has the best ratio of payoff to investment out there, but the growing concern that the job market is going to crater just around the time I'd be finishing my 7 year investment has me sweating bullets. It's such a hard decision: do you go for the lower hanging fruit that would allow you to "start" your life earlier but could equally well leave you squeezed by macro trends, or do you spend an additional 3 years of precious, irreplaceable youth pursuing the added safety of a surgical specialty?

So yeah, none of this was helpful to you whatsoever lol.

 

[OrthoTraumaMD]

The average orthopaedic matched applicant has a step 1 score of 245, AOA, and 6 to 7 abstracts/presentations/publications. With zero orthopedic related research, it is unlikely. If you’re not willing to take a research year, it’s likely not happening.


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[AthleteDoc7]

The average orthopaedic matched applicant has a step 1 score of 245, AOA, and 6 to 7 abstracts/presentations/publications. With zero orthopedic related research, it is unlikely. If you’re not willing to take a research year, it’s likely not happening.


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I appreciate you giving it to me straight, that's kind of my style lol. So if I were to jump on a couple current projects and try to push some stuff out in the next 6 months, and possibly earn senior AOA, plus apply to 100+ programs, my chances would be low? Thank you for the insight.

 

[AthleteDoc7]

What's your max bench press?

That's all fine and dandy but the answer to this next questions could make or break your chances.... Bro do you even lift?

haha I was a decent athlete in my glory days. chest day is usually 225 bench, 3 sets of 6 reps. I don't feel the need to do more usually, but maybe will let you know so I can put it on my app

 

[Aerus]

I appreciate you giving it to me straight, that's kind of my style lol. So if I were to jump on a couple current projects and try to push some stuff out in the next 6 months, and possibly earn senior AOA, plus apply to 100+ programs, my chances would be low? Thank you for the insight.

I think I said this on another thread, but I know a person who matched ortho this year without any publications, no research year, nor AOA. He did do a lot of ortho research though and networked like crazy at his home program, so there's that. You aren't out of the running, but you need to jump on a project immediately and network!

 

[OrthoTraumaMD]

I appreciate you giving it to me straight, that's kind of my style lol. So if I were to jump on a couple current projects and try to push some stuff out in the next 6 months, and possibly earn senior AOA, plus apply to 100+ programs, my chances would be low? Thank you for the insight.

Nothing is impossible but probability is still low.


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[AthleteDoc7]

I think I said this on another thread, but I know a person who matched ortho this year without any publications, no research year, nor AOA. He did do a lot of ortho research though and networked like crazy at his home program, so there's that. You aren't out of the running, but you need to jump on a project immediately and network!

A couple people at my school matched this year with very similar stories. I thought maybe they were just anomalies, but seems to be increasingly common (anecdotally). Thanks for that!

 

[operaman]

You're definitely behind the 8-ball here and obviously a research year is the most prudent way forward combined with killing it on a couple aways. The all-honors clinically is a sign that you are well liked and do well on the wards so this may be doable for you. Depending on your schedule and how busy your school is, you could potentially get a few projects going and submitted somewhere by ERAS time.

I guess the big question is whether you want to take your research year now or after you fail to match. You could potentially find a funded position somewhere and bang out papers while also making connections in another department. Your story is the poster child for people who take research years - an otherwise solid application but decided late and took a year to beef up the research. This happens all the time. Remember that one of the big reasons for the year is not just the publications, but also getting to know people in your department. You would need to start requesting LORs in 2-3 months from ortho attendings you barely know.

 

[qrscomplex41]

It seems a bit premature to start planning a switch after just ONE DAY of ortho exposure haha. 😱 I would definitely want more exposure before making such a big decision!

 

[AthleteDoc7]

It seems a bit premature to start planning a switch after just ONE DAY of ortho exposure haha. 😱 I would definitely want more exposure before making such a big decision!

my first post literally said "Obviously I am in the preliminary stages, and still not sure I love it yet, but trying to think ahead". I don't at all know I want this yet, and actually said above i'll most likely still end up doing EM as I greatly enjoy the field and it fits my personality, I'm just trying to explore what I'd need.

 

[AthleteDoc7]

Ha, I'm in the same boat as you OP, except that I haven't yet taken Step I and will hopefully get started on an ortho project soon. I too started med school with the notion that EM is my go to as it has the best ratio of payoff to investment out there, but the growing concern that the job market is going to crater just around the time I'd be finishing my 7 year investment has me sweating bullets. It's such a hard decision: do you go for the lower hanging fruit that would allow you to "start" your life earlier but could equally well leave you squeezed by macro trends, or do you spend an additional 3 years of precious, irreplaceable youth pursuing the added safety of a surgical specialty?

So yeah, none of this was helpful to you whatsoever lol.

haha I feel you. my advice to you would be hop on some research to be safe. I put all my eggs in one basket, a basket Ill more than likely still pursue because I enjoy it, but it's better to prepare for the more difficult of your interests!