What's wrong with a career in science?

[Denver89]

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Yes I know this is a "medical forum" but I was wondering how many of you out there have considered a career in a science discipline such as organic chemistry, chemistry, biochemistry, genetics, etc.

It seams like you could find a really interesting job that allows you to use your education on a day to day basis, synthesizing molecules and **** like that..

Does anyone know more about these fields? I havnt been able to find much information about what the work like, hours, etc.

The pay may not be great, but its probably pretty laid back and relatively stress free.. Any thoughts?

 

[azrael87]

Yes I know this is a "medical forum" but I was wondering how many of you out there have considered a career in a science discipline such as organic chemistry, chemistry, biochemistry, genetics, etc.

It seams like you could find a really interesting job that allows you to use your education on a day to day basis, synthesizing molecules and **** like that..

Does anyone know more about these fields? I havnt been able to find much information about what the work like, hours, etc.

The pay may not be great, but its probably pretty laid back and relatively stress free.. Any thoughts?

There's nothing wrong with a career in science. However, do not be disillusioned. It is definitely not stress free. Most good science careers depend on you pursuing a Ph. D and doing post-doc work. The education required to pursue a good career in the sciences isn't too far off from that required of physicians in terms of quantity.

There's a lot of grant writing, and much of your success depends on creating worthwhile experiments and publications. I'll leave the specific details to others and yourself to look into...I'm too lazy right now lol.

Seriously though, many people in science enjoy their work. I suggest at the very least a google search on enjoyable science careers, then proceed to look into the education and experience required.

I've thought about it, but medicine just fits me better.

 

[seelee]

I seriously considered it and decided that it was not for me. If you are considering a science field the best degrees to pursue are Chem, Biochem, or some kind of engineering degree.

Money is less, training is less didactic instruction and more self-learning (you must perform or perish)

I recommend joining a research group and getting a closer look at what pure scientists do all day. Maybe consider a summer internship at a pharmeceutical company or something.

Good luck

 

[TheMightySmiter]

Yes I know this is a "medical forum" but I was wondering how many of you out there have considered a career in a science discipline such as organic chemistry, chemistry, biochemistry, genetics, etc.

It seams like you could find a really interesting job that allows you to use your education on a day to day basis, synthesizing molecules and **** like that..

If you want to do your own research, you generally have to get a PhD and work in academia. But if you just want to be involved in scientific research, there are plenty of opportunities to do that in industry (primarily biotech). Lots of companies will hire entry-level lab techs with a science degree straight out of undergrad and you can work your way up through management, although you still won't be able to do what a PhD could do.

 

[MedMan25]

Yes I know this is a "medical forum" but I was wondering how many of you out there have considered a career in a science discipline such as organic chemistry, chemistry, biochemistry, genetics, etc.

It seams like you could find a really interesting job that allows you to use your education on a day to day basis, synthesizing molecules and **** like that..

Does anyone know more about these fields? I havnt been able to find much information about what the work like, hours, etc.

The pay may not be great, but its probably pretty laid back and relatively stress free.. Any thoughts?

There are plenty of opportunities for research and lab work in medicine. It all depends on where your interests are. If you love working in a chem lab and don't like the idea of treating patients, then a career in an o-chem lab may be right up your alley.

 

[dukemed22]

For most people, I would guess it comes down to money (although of course, most here won't admit it)

 

[dr zaius]

I was considering a career in science for the majority of my undergrad career until I obtained some clinical exposure the summer before my senior year.

Academia isn't stress free at all. As was said previously so much depends on landing grants. The probability of getting funding is relatively low, so much writing has to be done in order to obtain funding. This is pretty much constant throughout the career of a scientist unless you work in industry.

Science is great when you're getting results, but boy does it suck when things don't go right...which they don't most of the time. There's a lot of trial and error, tweaking of parameters, and general "wtf is going on" moments. I enjoy troubleshooting, but things can get frustrating in research.

Overall science is great. Coming up with ideas and pushing the current boundaries of medicine and science is pretty exciting. I've enjoyed my years in the lab (except when writing grants), but it's not something I'd like to do for the rest of my life. Interacting with patients and maybe helping out with some clinical research is more my speed.

 

[Global Warming]

The sad thing about Science careers is that you're pretty much worthless unless you have at least a Ph.D. You wouldn't even be credible publishing w/ just a masters!!!!!

Why would I train that many years just to have a mediocre salary. Go professional or go home!!! You can still do research w/ MD.

Conclusion:

MD >>>> all

 

[MedMan25]

The sad thing about Science careers is that you're pretty much worthless unless you have at least a Ph.D. You wouldn't even be credible publishing w/ just a masters!!!!!

Why would I train that many years just to have a mediocre salary. Go professional or go home!!! You can still do research w/ MD.

Conclusion:

MD >>>> all

You're worthless until you get an MD which takes roughly the same amount of time as it takes to get a PhD. There are plenty of PhDs with 6 figure salaries and they aren't graduating with $400K of debt to pay back. Most hard science PhD programs offer full ride scholarships + stipends, travel to conferences, etc. The statement MD >>>>>> all is just ignorance. If you enjoy what medicine has to offer, then go to medical school. Don't do it (or any other career choice for that matter) because it promises a high paying salary when you're done. I've met too many docs who hate what they do now because they did it for the money and none of them would tell you that what they get paid is worth what they went through to become a doctor and what they have to deal with day-to-day.

 

[ziggyd0c]

i wanted to be a chemist for a while, and after working in a lab i realized that i wouldn't be happy doing it. i like working with people and you don't get the doctor/patient relationship working in a lab.

 

[boaz]

Of course you should consider those careers. But you should note two things:

1) It is not "stress-free." Ask your professors. 🙂

2) Know that medicine is only related to the sciences only inasmuch as it depends, for the life of it, on them. But the "mission statements" of the two read very differently. A doctor is a scientist as much as an engineer is a mathematician.

 

[MedMan25]

Of course you should consider those careers. But you should note two things:

1) It is not "stress-free." Ask your professors. 🙂

2) Know that medicine is only related to the sciences only inasmuch as it depends, for the life of it, on them. But the "mission statements" of the two read very differently. A doctor is a scientist as much as an engineer is a mathematician.

Not sure what you mean by this. Medicine IS science. Once you become an MD you're options for doing full time research in a lab are just as viable as someone with a PhD.

 

[ForrestG]

Check out http://scforum.aaas.org/ for the science careers forum. You'll hear plenty about what is wrong with a career in science.

 

[boaz]

Not sure what you mean by this. Medicine IS science. Once you become an MD you're options for doing full time research in a lab are just as viable as someone with a PhD.

Just because an MD allows one to pursue a career in lab research it doesn't mean that lab research is incorporated in the common definition of medicine. Someone who chooses to do lab work after med school chooses to be a scientist.

Is medicine "human biology"?

 

[capricia]

I plan on becoming an audiologist. There are very few research-only jobs, and even fewer are non-university jobs. They all require a phD.

But the reason I want to be a clinician is I love working with people. That's my bread and butter. As interested as I am in the strides being made in my field, the researcher's life is not one for me.

 

[MedMan25]

Just because an MD allows one to pursue a career in lab research it doesn't mean that lab research is incorporated in the common definition of medicine. Someone who chooses to do lab work after med school chooses to be a scientist.

Is medicine "human biology"?

Yes, I think many would consider medicine "human biology". Why do you think you are required to take chemistry, ochem, physics and biology as an undergrad? Why do you think the first two years of medical school is spent studying clinical science (most of which is totally irrelevant for every-day clinical practice)? Why do you think almost every medical school offers a combined MD/PhD degree? Why do you think there are so many residency programs that require you to spend time doing research? It is because our medical system wants to train doctors to become scientists.

That isn't to say that a doctor must or is even obliged to do research after his/her training is through, but from the moment you walk into your first biology class as an undergrad you are being trained by the medical system to be a scientist.

 

[MichaelRW]

After completing your medical education in full, if you could somehow get involved in the administration/analysis of different clinical trials. This can be viewed as a type of research and its possible to do this while actively practicing in the area of medicine that you've chosen. To me, that would be ideal. Best of both worlds. Clinical medicine with a side of research.

 

[Global Warming]

You're worthless until you get an MD which takes roughly the same amount of time as it takes to get a PhD. There are plenty of PhDs with 6 figure salaries and they aren't graduating with $400K of debt to pay back. Most hard science PhD programs offer full ride scholarships + stipends, travel to conferences, etc. The statement MD >>>>>> all is just ignorance. If you enjoy what medicine has to offer, then go to medical school. Don't do it (or any other career choice for that matter) because it promises a high paying salary when you're done. I've met too many docs who hate what they do now because they did it for the money and none of them would tell you that what they get paid is worth what they went through to become a doctor and what they have to deal with day-to-day.

You mean I won't be super rich and awesome? 🙁

 

[MedMan25]

You mean I won't be super rich and awesome? 🙁

You might make money, but there are lots of ways to make money. It definitely won't make you happy if you don't enjoy medicine.

 

[akinetopsia]

A career in science could be rewarding, but there are several problems, at least in a career that is research-intensive:

1) Bottlenecks after your PhD in getting funded and set up. Part of the reason for this is that:

2) The baby boomers are not retiring, so there are bottlenecks in becoming a PI and getting grants after you complete your PhD. Some potential reasons for this: they love what they do, and their retirement plans took a hit with everyone else's in the past two years, among others.

3) Even if no one will admit it's about the money, for the amount of work that is demanded, science careers are woefully under-compensated.

 

[Global Warming]

You might make money, but there are lots of ways to make money. It definitely won't make you happy if you don't enjoy medicine.

I have zero interest in science, but only want glory and money. Crap, am I going to not make it? BTW, I got mostly A's in my science classes.

 

[MedMan25]

I have zero interest in science, but only want glory and money. Crap, am I going to not make it? BTW, I got mostly A's in my science classes.

Never said you couldn't do it. You'll just be going into something you have zero interest in. If you're smart enough to get As in your science classes, you should be smart enough to figure out why that isn't a good idea.

 

[seelee]

i wanted to be a chemist for a while, and after working in a lab i realized that i wouldn't be happy doing it. i like working with people and you don't get the doctor/patient relationship working in a lab.

When you actually work with patients you may find that you prefer test tubes and beakers.

 

[boaz]

.

Yes, I think many would consider medicine "human biology".

A scientist's work involves observing/discovering natural phenomena. A physician seeing patients is not there to observe natural phenomena: he/she is trying to have a direct impact on a person's life.

Why do you think you are required to take chemistry, ochem, physics and biology as an undergrad?

Because all doctors would be quacks if science was not the modus operandi of medicine.

Why do you think the first two years of medical school is spent studying clinical science (most of which is totally irrelevant for every-day clinical practice)?

I gather you are referring to the basic sciences. Doctors must know science if they are to employ science in the practice of medicine.

Why do you think almost every medical school offers a combined MD/PhD degree?

They are intended to train physician-scientists. An md/phd student usually chooses this program because he/she is interested in both.

Why do you think there are so many residency programs that require you to spend time doing research? It is because our medical system wants to train doctors to become scientists.

Yes, they want doctors who will ALSO be scientists.

When you actually work with patients you may find that you prefer test tubes and beakers.

That is the crux of the matter. The world of the test tube is much apart from the world of the patient. Those who enjoy it stay, those who don't enjoy it often choose lab research.

 

[MedMan25]

A scientist's work involves observing/discovering natural phenomena. A physician seeing patients is not there to observe natural phenomena: he/she is trying to have a direct impact on a person's life.

Because all doctors would be quacks if science was not the modus operandi of medicine.

I gather you are referring to the basic sciences. Doctors must know science if they are to employ science in the practice of medicine.

They are intended to train physician-scientists. An md/phd student usually chooses this program because he/she is interested in both.

Yes, they want doctors who will ALSO be scientists.



That is the crux of the matter. The world of the test tube is much apart from the world of the patient. Those who enjoy it stay, those who don't enjoy it often choose lab research.

I agree that your job as a clinician is very different than your job as a scientist but my point is, as a doctor you assume the role of both a clinician and a scientist. The two cannot be separated. The very first step in treating a patient is to observe natural phenomena known as disease. You must then use scientific thought to determine a diagnosis and the most appropriate therapy based on your understanding of the science behind the disease process. Science is not just something that is there for medicine when medicine happens to need it. Medicine depends on science.

 

[vin5cent0]

Little compensation and the stress of always needing to obtain a grant isn't worth it for the education you put into it.

 

[Dial71]

A career in science is definately not low-stress.

It is getting harder and harder to actually find a job nowadays. Tenure track positions are being eliminated and industry jobs are being exported to hungry scientists overseas.

To ensue that you are even employable, you *must* be stellar. Your research skills must make you irreplaceable. Overwise, your job will go to the lowest bidder (i.e. Jagadesh in New Dehli or Xiu, fresh off the boat from China). Publish or perish.

Contrast this with medicine, in which you only need to graduate medical school to be assured a high-paying job, essentially for life. Much chiller indeed.

You should only pursue science if you truly enjoy it and have the drive to excel. Otherwise, you'll end up teaching community college Organic chemistry.

 

[MedMan25]

Contrast this with medicine, in which you only need to graduate medical school to be assured a high-paying job, essentially for life. Much chiller indeed.

Graduate and endure residency. I'll give you that there is more job security in medicine, but I know very few docs who would describe their lifestyle as chill.

 

[runawayclock]

Considered genetics and molecular bio for a LONG TIME (like since i hit puberty. i know, i was an indoor child). Then got to uni, realized that a knock out takes 2 years, in-situs take a week (even then it might not work), and thermocyclers hate me.

 

[GH253]

I'm interested in the field of tissue engineering. I could see myself doing that as an alternative to medicine, but I'm not attracted to the politics/bull**** of academia.

 

[NightOwlPM]

As people have said it is very tough to find a job, even without a recession. At my undergrad I saw less tenured professors and more "visiting professors". Even if you can find a job you will not do your dream research. Pretty much anything you do will be for someones profit, why else would they fund it?

 

[ForrestG]

.

 

[dikoerastenie]

I have a science degree from a prestigious ugrad and i wouldnt be able to find a $10/hr job right now. My goal in life is to have a trophy wife like Tiger woods.

 

[AbbeyRoad708]

I hate my science courses. Hate is a strong word, but most of the science I take I find very dry, and only put in effort to get A's and get into medical school. I do, however, love working with kids and really enjoyed volunteering at the pediatric wing of my university hospital. Science = dry, kids = fun, and I couldn't see myself making $25k a year as an elementary school teacher, so med school it is. Do what you enjoy; if you really like science classes, go do science.

My goal in life is to have a trophy wife like Tiger woods.

And then cheat on her with waitresses and prostitutes? 😛

 

[chman]

I think that a lot of people are mistaken about how hard it is to land a job as a professor at a good university. They are constantly under the stress of gaining enough grants, publishing, etc. It is somewhat of a cr** shoot.