When do marks start to "matter" for internships and residency

[DPolaris]

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I'm a first year veterinary student, and like many in my class as well as many other veterinary students (hopefully haha), my grades have taken a hit from the 90s most of us are used to from whatever degree or program we were in previously. I'm basically sitting at class average for the tests and assignments we have done, and it's quite a bit lower than what we're all used to.

I am not sure if I want to pursue an internship or residency after graduation in what feels like forever from now, but I do want to keep my options open. Some of my third and fourth year buddies tell me grades in first and second year don't really matter at all, and it's your resume and who you know that matters the most.

I'm not too sure if this information is correct, and it probably varies from school to school, country from country, but right now I'd like to think that I'm living quite a well-balanced life, I'm enjoying some of my evenings, I got out every so often, do some sports, while still studying and trying to know the major parts of each course, but my grades aren't exactly what I'm used to. I also am always really tired after a day of classes and labs and stuff, and feel like if I study any more than I study and do now I'll probably hate myself.

I do want to keep my options open, and I have a great group of classmates and professors, and I do have many options open to me in terms of jobs during the year and during holidays, and I don't think I'll be lacking in terms of reference letters and connections, but I do worry that I'll be lacking in terms of my grades.

So I guess the question is, when do grades matter for an internship or residency? Do grades really matter that much? I mean for really competitive ones like equine surgery or small animal surgery, I guess they'll look at grades all the way from first year right? And I guess I'll probably not have a chance at those if I don't get my grades up asap (not looking at those right now, just want to keep my options open)?

Thanks everyone!

 

[SocialStigma]

You have to give your class rank as well as your cumulative GPA when applying through VIRMP for internships and residencies. They definitely matter, particularly for academic positions (where they don't always interview applicants) and for competitive fields like SA surgery. I've seen some academic residencies where there are minimum grade cutoffs around a 3.5/4.0. However, LORs are still more important! As long as you have great references, a lower class rank/GPA won't matter as much.

 

[rdc]

Unfortunately, your grades and class rank matter significantly for residency applications... especially as residencies become more and more competitive. Many academic internships will have literally hundreds of applicants, and typically the first weeding process (as it is at my institution) is GPA/Rank; we only consider applicants above the cut-off for that year. After that first cut, it becomes less important and the entire application is considered in its entirety.

Take home message: if you are considering a residency, do as well as you possibly can.

 

[JaynaAli]

Grades definitely matter for some specialties but matter a little bit less for others. I ended 1st year with a 2.8 GPA and raised it to a 3.2 by the end of 4th year...I was in the bottom half of my class by rank (53rd percentile). I got a SA rotating internship at a private practice (sure, not a 'top tier' one, but I still got one) and just accepted a residency position in clinical pathology which was what I've wanted to do since 1st year. I wouldn't have been competitive for many (if not most) other specialties, but I worked my butt off to get experience related to pathology, make those important connections, and prove that I was committed to that specialty. No programs ever commented on my grades but they did mention that my LORs (all three from boarded clinical pathologists) were great. Maybe my experience was extremely unique, but don't let a lower GPA stand in your way at this point...you're a first year so there's lots of time to pull it up before you'd need to do the match.

 

[DVMDream]

Unfortunately, your grades and class rank matter significantly for residency applications... especially as residencies become more and more competitive. Many academic internships will have literally hundreds of applicants, and typically the first weeding process (as it is at my institution) is GPA/Rank; we only consider applicants above the cut-off for that year. After that first cut, it becomes less important and the entire application is considered in its entirety.

Take home message: if you are considering a residency, do as well as you possibly can.

Veterinary school and medical school residencies and internships are very different. You are in the veterinary forums.

 

[DPolaris]

Well guess I need to burn the midnight oil and show anatomy who's boss :'(. Overall, myself and my class included, we're doing pretty well in other courses and stuff, but our anatomy mark is pretty low haha, mine included 😛

Thanks for all your help guys, and for not telling me what I wanted to hear but what reality is (i.e. no I can't netflix as much as I am doing right now...)

 

[WhtsThFrequency]

I'm a first year veterinary student, and like many in my class as well as many other veterinary students (hopefully haha), my grades have taken a hit from the 90s most of us are used to from whatever degree or program we were in previously. I'm basically sitting at class average for the tests and assignments we have done, and it's quite a bit lower than what we're all used to.

I am not sure if I want to pursue an internship or residency after graduation in what feels like forever from now, but I do want to keep my options open. Some of my third and fourth year buddies tell me grades in first and second year don't really matter at all, and it's your resume and who you know that matters the most.

I'm not too sure if this information is correct, and it probably varies from school to school, country from country, but right now I'd like to think that I'm living quite a well-balanced life, I'm enjoying some of my evenings, I got out every so often, do some sports, while still studying and trying to know the major parts of each course, but my grades aren't exactly what I'm used to. I also am always really tired after a day of classes and labs and stuff, and feel like if I study any more than I study and do now I'll probably hate myself.

I do want to keep my options open, and I have a great group of classmates and professors, and I do have many options open to me in terms of jobs during the year and during holidays, and I don't think I'll be lacking in terms of reference letters and connections, but I do worry that I'll be lacking in terms of my grades.

So I guess the question is, when do grades matter for an internship or residency? Do grades really matter that much? I mean for really competitive ones like equine surgery or small animal surgery, I guess they'll look at grades all the way from first year right? And I guess I'll probably not have a chance at those if I don't get my grades up asap (not looking at those right now, just want to keep my options open)?

Thanks everyone!

That is a pile of horse****.

Of course grades matter. Do other things matter too? Sure. Can stellar LORs and externships make up for some on-the-fence grades? Sure, depending on the situation. Is networking underappreciated and very important? Of course.

But they are fooling themselves if they think GPA doesn't matter "at all". I don't understand how third and fourth year vet students think they know all this stuff about residencies and how we evaluate applicants when they haven't even come close to one yet.

 

[DPolaris]

That is a pile of horse****.

Of course grades matter. Do other things matter too? Sure. Can stellar LORs and externships make up for some on-the-fence grades? Sure, depending on the situation. Is networking underappreciated and very important? Of course.

But they are fooling themselves if they think GPA doesn't matter "at all". I don't understand how third and fourth year vet students think they know all this stuff about residencies and how we evaluate applicants when they haven't even come close to one yet.

Thank you so much for your reply. Well as a "firstie" basically everything they say we take as the Holy Grail hahaha! I guess I should be talking to people who do matter, such as my profs and such and just trying as hard as I can! Once again, thank you for your help!

 

[Minnerbelle]

Thank you so much for your reply. Well as a "firstie" basically everything they say we take as the Holy Grail hahaha! I guess I should be talking to people who do matter, such as my profs and such and just trying as hard as I can! Once again, thank you for your help!

There's usually a prof that is the head honcho in evaluating the intern applications at your school's teaching hospital. That would be a good person to talk to

 

[rdc]

Veterinary school and medical school residencies and internships are very different. You are in the veterinary forums.

I am a veterinarian, and a resident... I'm not sure why it says 'verified physician.'

 

[DVMDream]

I am a veterinarian, and a resident... I'm not sure why it says 'verified physician.'

Odd because you have to submit licensing information to get any of the "verified xxx" badges. Apparently SDN believes you have submitted documentation to show that you are an MD.

 

[rdc]

Odd because you have to submit licensing information to get any of the "verified xxx" badges. Apparently SDN believes you have submitted documentation to show that you are an MD.

They just confirm your institutional (university) email... i selected the 'veterinarian' box in the form, so it was likely a clerical error on their part.

 

[DVMDream]

They just confirm your institutional (university) email... i selected the 'veterinarian' box in the form, so it was likely a clerical error on their part.

Could be a clerical error, but for the physician badges you typically need both an email account and licensing documentation, at least according to SDN's own website. Though the information I found on SDN is from 2011, so who knows what has changed since then.

Definitely could still be a clerical error, those happen, I just remember this conversation happening not too long ago with the recent class of 2015 grads commenting that they had to submit their license info to get the verified badge.

Anyway, might be worth poking the SDN admin and giving them a "psst, I am a vet, not an MD". Alternatively, you can just run with the MD thing because why not? 😉

 

[jmo1012]

Could be a clerical error, but for the physician badges you typically need both an email account and licensing documentation, at least according to SDN's own website. Though the information I found on SDN is from 2011, so who knows what has changed since then.

Definitely could still be a clerical error, those happen, I just remember this conversation happening not too long ago with the recent class of 2015 grads commenting that they had to submit their license info to get the verified badge.

Anyway, might be worth poking the SDN admin and giving them a "psst, I am a vet, not an MD". Alternatively, you can just run with the MD thing because why not? 😉

i definitely submitted licensing info along with an email, so yeah that hasnt changed...

 

[dyachei]

They just confirm your institutional (university) email... i selected the 'veterinarian' box in the form, so it was likely a clerical error on their part.

yes, please either address the help desk or send me credentials I can look into and I can change it

 

[Starry-chan]

What is the verified ______ badge for? Just so other people know you're telling the truth when you say you're a vet/MD/whatever?

 

[twelvetigers]

What is the verified ______ badge for? Just so other people know you're telling the truth when you say you're a vet/MD/whatever?

it mean we legit

like, forrealz

 

[Starry-chan]

it mean we legit

like, forrealz

Does the badge bestow any magical powers? 😛 If so, what's your vet super power? xD

 

[dyachei]

Does the badge bestow any magical powers? 😛 If so, what's your vet super power? xD

it gives you a bigger inbox for SDN conversations. It means that the staff at SDN make sure you are who you say you are.

 

[Starry-chan]

it gives you a bigger inbox for SDN conversations. It means that the staff at SDN make sure you are who you say you are.

Oh there's a limit on that? Had no idea. I guess I'd better keep old conversations cleaned out of my inbox, so I always have room for new ones 😉

 

[Cracker.Jack.]

@DPolaris you should talk to Dr. Emma Read if you have questions about internships/residencies. She will give you all the info you need.

 

[DPolaris]

@DPolaris you should talk to Dr. Emma Read if you have questions about internships/residencies. She will give you all the info you need.

Yea definitely haha! Don't want to be a keener though and Dr. Read scares me sometimes even though she's like the nicest person ever 😛

 

[Cracker.Jack.]

@DPolaris Haha fair enough. For me, Romero has also been a great resource for internship and residency info, so you could always ask him too.