When is considered too late to apply to AACOMAS?

[Sheemu]

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I'm a Canadian Citizen currently waiting on my Green Card so that I can apply as a permanent resident. My question is when would it be considered too late to apply? Say I don't receive my Green Card until end of August or early September. Is it even worth applying at that point as an Out of State student?

Thanks.

 

[asdf123g]

like november

 

[Goro]

Even early Dec might be OK.

like november

 

[OrdinaryDO]

Even early Dec might be OK.

That's reassuring. Seriously, I thought me submitting mid august was pushing it.

 

[Cardboard101]

Even early Dec might be OK.

B-b-but my esteem pre-med adviser told me September/October was late for all medical schools.
Glad to hear this though, it means I can have summer grades ready before applying next year \o/

 

[Goro]

Tell that flea-brain that Sept/oct is too late for MD, but fine for DO!

B-b-but my esteem pre-med adviser told me September/October was late for all medical schools.
Glad to hear this though, it means I can have summer grades ready before applying next year \o/

 

[Sheemu]

This is extraordinary news, thanks a lot!

 

[IslandStyle808]

That's reassuring. Seriously, I thought me submitting mid august was pushing it.

It is depends on your GPA and MCAT. Goro is referring to a competitive applicant.

 

[Ahii]

Look at the threads from last year for the schools you want to apply to. I did and found the following (for a specific school, not in general):

About 90% of people who interviewed in November and later were waitlisted (although many were later admitted).

I then figured in the following:

4 weeks AACOMAS is taking to verify applications
2 weeks it took for that school to send out secondaries
assumed I would submit and pay for my secondary immediately (questions are already posted)
1-2 weeks for my payment to go through and my application to be considered complete
1-2 more weeks for an II
2 weeks from II to date of interview

I submitted my primary for verification at the end of July, so I should be in time (with about a week to spare).

Different schools do things differently, and competitive applicants are more likely to be pulled off the waitlist sooner... so many variables.

 

[IslandStyle808]

Look at the threads from last year for the schools you want to apply to. I did and found the following (for a specific school, not in general):

About 90% of people who interviewed in November and later were waitlisted (although many were later admitted).

I then figured in the following:

4 weeks AACOMAS is taking to verify applications
2 weeks it took for that school to send out secondaries
assumed I would submit and pay for my secondary immediately (questions are already posted)
1-2 weeks for my payment to go through and my application to be considered complete
1-2 more weeks for an II
2 weeks from II to date of interview

I submitted my primary for verification at the end of July, so I should be in time (with about a week to spare).

Different schools do things differently, and competitive applicants are more likely to be pulled off the waitlist sooner... so many variables.

Very good analysis!

Remember that depending on how competitive you are will determine how fast your IIs will come. If you are very competitive, then 1-2 weeks is correct. If you are somewhat competitive expect it to take 1 month. If you are not competitive, you could even wait 1-3 months. Just a heads up.

 

[Ahii]

Very good analysis!

Remember that depending on how competitive you will determine how fast your IIs will come. If you are very competitive, then 1-2 weeks is correct. If you are somewhat competitive expect it to take 1 month. If you are not competitive, you could even wait 1-3 months. Just a heads up.

Is having scores about average for that schools accepted applicants considered "somewhat competitive"?
Statistically speaking, wouldn't it also be about 75th percentile for those granted an II, assuming they accept the "better" half (and an even distribution)?
Or are post-interview choices much less about stats?
I guess this will also vary by school.

 

[mathnerd88]

Is having scores about average for that schools accepted applicants considered "somewhat competitive"?
Statistically speaking, wouldn't it also be about 75th percentile for those granted an II, assuming they accept the "better" half (and an even distribution)?
Or are post-interview choices much less about stats?
I guess this will also vary by school.

I assume that having scores that are average for the schools be considered "somewhat competitive." Of course, there will be outliers. In my experience, the schools that gave me II's really early this cycle was due to a combination of my above average stats (30+ MCAT, 3.6+ GPA) AND my excellent EC's.

Most applicants usually only have one or the other in my one interview experience so far. (Have 3 more to attend so far this cycle, total 4 II's at the time of writing this post.) I'm expecting more since I already got a II from CCOM (top DO school in average LizzyM.) I can't be too greedy though.

 

[Ahii]

I assume that having scores that are average for the schools be considered "somewhat competitive." Of course, there will be outliers. In my experience, the schools that gave me II's really early this cycle was due to a combination of my above average stats AND my excellent EC's.

Most applicants usually only have one or the other in my one interview experience so far. (Have 3 more to attend so far this cycle, total 4 II's so far.)

I have the following ECs:

16 hours volunteering in a free clinic
40 hours volunteering in a wilderness setting (medical care)
7 hours shadowing a DO

I got started late, so they're pretty limited. Those aren't very competitive are they? Are they bad enough to get me denied most places?

I'm still working on them though and intend to have at least a little more by the time I submit my secondary.

 

[IslandStyle808]

Is having scores about average for that schools accepted applicants considered "somewhat competitive"?
Statistically speaking, wouldn't it also be about 75th percentile for those granted an II, assuming they accept the "better" half (and an even distribution)?
Or are post-interview choices much less about stats?
I guess this will also vary by school.

My definition for "somewhat" competitive is for a person to be above average in one category and slightly below average in another, but would even each other out. For example, if a school had an average MCAT of 27 and an average GPA of 3.5. Then a somewhat competitive applicant would have an MCAT of 29 and a GPA of 3.4. So you are hitting the average to some degree, just like asmathnerd88 has stated.

As for he IIs, it is just as you have stated, the post-inteview then starts to become less about stats and more about your ECs and letters of recs. The grades and MCAT will still be in the picture.

 

[mathnerd88]

I have the following ECs:

16 hours volunteering in a free clinic
40 hours volunteering in a wilderness setting (medical care)
7 hours shadowing a DO

I got started late, so they're pretty limited. Those aren't very competitive are they? Are they bad enough to get me denied most places?

I'm still working on them though and intend to have at least a little more by the time I submit my secondary.

Yeah, that's not very competitive volunteering hours. I would recommend to add on as much as you can.

I shadowed more than 100 hours with a DO, 150 hours volunteering in a hospital (Emergency and ICU), and 1000+ hours volunteering in a tutoring center. I also did 10k+ hours of medical research+ publication.

Your GPA+MCAT will get you the II alone, but your EC's will carry you the rest of the way.

 

[IslandStyle808]

I have the following ECs:

16 hours volunteering in a free clinic
40 hours volunteering in a wilderness setting (medical care)
7 hours shadowing a DO

I got started late, so they're pretty limited. Those aren't very competitive are they? Are they bad enough to get me denied most places?

I'm still working on them though and intend to have at least a little more by the time I submit my secondary.

The ECs are not very strong, but it doesn't matter too much pre-interview. The stats will at least carry you to the interview. The ECs will carrying more weight after your interview. So get in as much as you can before then.

 

[mathnerd88]

The ECs are not very strong, but it doesn't matter too much pre-interview. The stats will at least carry you to the interview. The ECs will carrying more weight after your interview. So get in as much as you can before then.

We think alike!

The key is to take your experiences in your EC's during your interview and spin them to why you want to become a physician.

 

[Ahii]

Yeah, that's not very competitive volunteering hours. I would recommend to add on as much as you can.

I shadowed more than 100 hours with a DO, 150 hours volunteering in a hospital, and 1000+ hours volunteering in a tutoring center. I also did 10k+ hours of medical research.

Yeah I intend to keep adding to it. Would 100 clinic, 100 wilderness medical, and 50 shadowing by the time I have my interview be good enough most likely?

 

[mathnerd88]

Yeah I intend to keep adding to it. Would 100 clinic, 100 wilderness medical, and 50 shadowing by the time I have my interview be good enough most likely?

It should be fine. Will you have a DO letter?

What are your stats?

 

[Ahii]

It should be fine. Will you have a DO letter?

What are your stats?

I believe the DO I'm currently shadowing will write me one. I intend to ask tomorrow afternoon when I hit 7 hours at the end of his shift.
He respects me enough to let me make recommendations to his patients, so I suspect he'll say "yes".

There's also another DO I contacted about starting to shadow in the next couple weeks (hasn't responded yet) so I'll ask him if this one says "no".

I do have one from a MD from the wilderness medical volunteering (and I got to do some more advanced stuff like administering local anesthetic and giving stitches).

Edit: Stats are 504 MCAT (124,128,124,128) and narrative evaluations (no GPA unless the schools asks them to have one calculated).

 

[IslandStyle808]

We think alike!

The key is to take your experiences in your EC's during your interview and spin them to why you want to become a physician.

Yep. Plus quantity is as important as quality. As one talk about his or her experiences, they will see how much effort he or she has put in them. This will help the applicant in the case of low hours.

 

[mathnerd88]

Yep. Plus quantity is as important as quality. As one talk about his or her experiences, they will see how much effort he or she has put in them. This will help the applicant in the case of low hours.

Yes, if you can describe OMT/OMM in action, it would be pretty compelling. My DO sometimes had me help her in some procedures (although in a small way.)

 

[Ahii]

Yes, if you can describe OMT/OMM in action, it would be pretty compelling. My DO sometimes had me help her in some procedures (although in a small way.)

The DO I want to shadow later this month specializes in OMM.

 

[mathnerd88]

I believe the DO I'm currently shadowing will write me one. I intend to ask tomorrow afternoon when I hit 7 hours at the end of his shift.
He respects me enough to let me make recommendations to his patients, so I suspect he'll say "yes".

There's also another DO I contacted about starting to shadow in the next couple weeks (hasn't responded yet) so I'll ask him if this one says "no".

I do have one from a MD from the wilderness medical volunteering (and I got to do some more advanced stuff like administering local anesthetic and giving stitches).

Edit: Stats are 504 MCAT (124,128,124,128) and narrative evaluations (no GPA unless the schools asks them to have one calculated).

Your overall MCAT is fine for DO, but the 2 sections where you have 124 are a bit concerning. Maybe most DO schools will overlook that. I can't really say about GPA though.

 

[mathnerd88]

Ohh, and I also recommend to start writing your PS at least a month before you submit the primary. It takes a long time and countless edits. (Mine went through 9 major revisions before I was satisfied.)

Even one month sometimes isn't enough. Also, prewrite secondaries. I got burned out with secondaries and just stopped submitting after 13 schools. Summer has made me lazy. All these interviews have become a mini vacation for me.

 

[IslandStyle808]

Ohh, and I also recommend to start writing your PS at least a month before you submit the primary. It takes a long time and countless edits. (Mine went through 9 major revisions before I was satisfied.)

Even one month sometimes isn't enough. Also, prewrite secondaries. I got burned out with secondaries and just stopped submitting after 13 schools. Summer has made me lazy. All these interviews have become a mini vacation for me.

Concur with above. It also took me a month to write out my personal statement (2 weeks of me writing and 2 weeks of corrections from reviewers). It took me around 7 revisions for mine.

Yep also pre-write the secondaries, so you save more time. I am currently at that stage and it can be tough putting in the time. Just treat it as a marathon OP and you won't burnout.

 

[Ahii]

Your overall MCAT is fine for DO, but the 2 sections where you have 124 are a bit concerning. Maybe most DO schools will overlook that. I can't really say about GPA though.

They correspond to a 7 and an 8. The 8 will be fine, but the 7 isn't great.

To understand my "GPA", one has to read my 30-pages of evaluations 😛 I can say they are all "good" to "exceptional" (with the exception of 1) and get better throughout.