When to take step 2 for IM

[penguins123]

---

Members don't see this ad.

Hi everyone,

I know various iterations of this question have come up before, but I'm wondering if anyone has advice on when to take step 2 for someone applying to IM residencies.

I'm currently an MS3 at a top 40 state school; I have decent pre-clinical grades (not AOA), 249 on step 1, honors in medicine and a GI elective/ A's in the rest of my third year clerkships so far, and some research - one publication and another one (hopefully) soon plus some other research experiences. I'm couples matching, so I want to do 1-2 away rotations in cities that my significant other and I are focusing on in addition to home sub-I's.

I was always under the impression that IM program directors want to see a step 2 score that's equal to or better than your step 1 score so I was planning on taking June to study. However, I was recently told by an adviser that if you have a decent step 1, PD's don't really care about seeing a step 2 score and I could just wait until after my sub-I's to take step 2.

Just trying to gain some more perspective on this before planning my fourth year schedule. Thanks in advance!

 

[Crayola227]

what you were told is what i was told, I had a late Step 2 score that was similar, I had no problems getting interviews

interviewers made it clear they wanted that score when I got it back before rank tho

 

[W19]

Most programs want CK/CS before ROL deadline...

If you got a decent step1, which you have, use it as an asset.

 

[penguins123]

what you were told is what i was told, I had a late Step 2 score that was similar, I had no problems getting interviews

interviewers made it clear they wanted that score when I got it back before rank tho

That's helpful, thanks! So you didn't feel like not having the step 2 score precluded you from getting interview invites at certain places? Just trying to really maximize my chances since doing the couples match.

 

[Redpancreas]

That's helpful, thanks! So you didn't feel like not having the step 2 score precluded you from getting interview invites at certain places? Just trying to really maximize my chances since doing the couples match.

The following is for you and others reading this in the future, particularly those applying to IM:

It does, a majority may disagree with me and I scoured the literature on SDN looking for this answer during fall last year. No one said it matters besides like UCSF I think, however, it does matter and you may miss out on some a few interviews at places. These places may not be the most competitive and it's basically based on how the PD selects interviewees which they never really reveal. With the ERAS format we have now, PDs have the option to sort candidates by every drop down menu in ERAS. I'm sure they apply Step 1 and CK filters and if your name doesn't pop up initially because you didn't take CK, you may not make the cut. I had a higher Step 1 (low 250s). I remember on multiple interviews I got off waitlists for, the PDs on interview days started off with the (relax, we have all your achievements and you're qualified to be here, today is just a day to assess fit) speech and during it they mentioned they had Step 1, Step 2, Sub-Is, etc. However, during my interviews, my interviews had a small written note to remind them to ask me why I didn't take Step 2 (2 places I got off wait lists for) and one place that I had to send an LOI for an II. I said I hadn't gotten around to it and they said OK, but make sure it's in before ROL. What I suspect happened is they initially invited people they saw a Step 1/CK score for, and then when looking for remaining applicants to interview, they found me and was like, oh! no CK but did well on Step 1 and no red flags... OK, invite him too! But I suspect that there are many places could afford to not adjust their filters to find their interviewees and that's where I feel I may have missed out.

Here's my conservative rule of thumb for 2017-18 (and add 1-2 pts. for every year in the future):

Step 1>=245, you can afford to not have it for interview season, but will need it for ROL submission, but you still may miss out on a few interviews. If you're really gonna screw up CK and know you have protected time to improve later, then consider delaying.

Step 1 < 245, you really didn't really do thaaat well (77th percentile or lower). You need a repeat performance on CK (255) and then you'll be sitting well. Don't get me wrong, you'll still get good interviews with like a Step 1 of 240 for example without CK, but you may miss out on a some decent places.

That being said, I know that extra few months Sept, Oct, Nov, Dec, time period sounds like a haven to get more studying done to ensure that you kill CK but the down side is that a lot of other crap like finishing ERAS (Sep), Oct/Nov/Dec (interviews/SubI), etc. is going on. Like any board exam, you need a high volume of practice in a short amount of time so that everything is fresh come test day. Doing 40q UWorld sets after coming home from work or between interview days is not going to stick. Just take the month that your school offers and take it. Even if your diagnostic is not where you want it to be (mine was 10 points below my Step 1 so I procrastinated and I'm living the consequences of delaying it right now and feel like I've forgotten even more and lost all motivation even though I've had some time to reconcile). 9 times out of 10, GET IT OUT OF THE WAY!

 

[Spica]

Just do it early to be done with it. I took both CK and CS one month into 4th year and was very happy to be free of worrying about it during my subI, other rotations, and, most importantly, during my precious time off. Also you remember more stuff from prepping for shelf exams at that point.

 

[penguins123]

The following is for you and others reading this in the future, particularly those applying to IM:

It does, a majority may disagree with me and I scoured the literature on SDN looking for this answer during fall last year. No one said it matters besides like UCSF I think, however, it does matter and you may miss out on some a few interviews at places. These places may not be the most competitive and it's basically based on how the PD selects interviewees which they never really reveal. With the ERAS format we have now, PDs have the option to sort candidates by every drop down menu in ERAS. I'm sure they apply Step 1 and CK filters and if your name doesn't pop up initially because you didn't take CK, you may not make the cut. I had a higher Step 1 (low 250s). I remember on multiple interviews I got off waitlists for, the PDs on interview days started off with the (relax, we have all your achievements and you're qualified to be here, today is just a day to assess fit) speech and during it they mentioned they had Step 1, Step 2, Sub-Is, etc. However, during my interviews, my interviews had a small written note to remind them to ask me why I didn't take Step 2 (2 places I got off wait lists for) and one place that I had to send an LOI for an II. I said I hadn't gotten around to it and they said OK, but make sure it's in before ROL. What I suspect happened is they initially invited people they saw a Step 1/CK score for, and then when looking for remaining applicants to interview, they found me and was like, oh, no CK but did well on Step 1 and no red flags. OK, invite him too!

Here's my conservative rule of thumb:

Step 1>=245, you can afford to not have it for interview season and for ROL submission.
Step 1 < 245, you didn't really do thaaat well. You need a repeat performance on CK (255) and then you'll get some solid interviews. Don't get me wrong, you'll still get good interviews, but you may miss out on a few places.

That being said, I know that extra few months Sept, Oct, Nov, Dec, time period sounds like a haven to get more studying done and ensure that you kill CK but the down side is that a lot of other crap like finishing ERAS (Sep), Oct/Nov/Dec (interviews/SubI), etc. is going on. Like any board exam, you need a high volume of practice in a short amount of time so that everything is fresh come test day. Doing 40 UWorld sets after coming home from work or between interview days is not going to stick. Just take the month that your school offers and take it. Even if your diagnostic is not where you want it to be (mind was 10 points below my Step 1 and I'm living the consequences of delaying it right now).

That's what I was wondering about. Definitely leaning towards just getting it out of the way. Really helpful info - thanks so much!

 

[Barbecue]

The commonly given advice - that CK isn't necessary for interviews - is outdated IMO. I'm fairly certain that I missed out on some interviews because I didn't have CK back (invites I was able to get after I had CK and sent a LOI).

Seriously, ignore people telling you that you can wait. Have your score back by Sept 15th (or a few days after, so you can choose to release it or not depending on how good it is).

 

[NeurologyHopeful2018]

Cheking Freida - at least 40% of Neurology programs require a step2CK score for interview consideration.