Where do I get info on average scores for particular programs?

[aesop]

Hey guys,
I'm a third year medical student who's interested in neurology and is having a hard time figuring out what programs I'm competitive for. I've got an MS in neuroscience, 3 papers (2 first author), honored about 2/3 basic science classes, year fellowship at NIH. Will have step I score in a week.
Tried emailing a few programs asking specifically for avg. USMLE scores for residents, %AOA, basically anything that could tell me whether I'm a competitive applicant at their program or should I focus my attention elsewhere and got a number of responses like this:
Hi Aesop,
To answer your questions, most the interviewees are honor students in many areas of subject, excellent score on USMLE, involved in research. Thank you

I feel like I'm taking crazy pills. How is that helpful? Do u guys have any advice on how to get this info?

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[neurologist]

Hey guys,
I'm a third year medical student who's interested in neurology and is having a hard time figuring out what programs I'm competitive for. I've got an MS in neuroscience, 3 papers (2 first author), honored about 2/3 basic science classes, year fellowship at NIH. Will have step I score in a week.
Tried emailing a few programs asking specifically for avg. USMLE scores for residents, %AOA, basically anything that could tell me whether I'm a competitive applicant at their program or should I focus my attention elsewhere and got a number of responses like this:
Hi Aesop,
To answer your questions, most the interviewees are honor students in many areas of subject, excellent score on USMLE, involved in research. Thank you

I feel like I'm taking crazy pills. How is that helpful? Do u guys have any advice on how to get this info?

You ARE on crazy pills, but it's nobody's fault but your own for obsessing about this.

If it's not on the program's website in plain English, you are not going to find this information anywhere else, so don't waste your time looking for it or even thinking about it.

Just apply to whatever programs interest you. The next best thing would be to talk to the neuro residency program director or chairman of neuro at your own med school. They probably won't know specific test score #s for other programs, but should be able to give you a ballpark sense of where you'd stand at least at some programs. If they tell you you don't have a chance at Program X, but that's where you really really want to go, ignore them and apply there anyway. Get the point? In case you don't, I'll make it plainer: you have nothing to lose by applying.

Once you are interviewing, you will find that most of the interviewees are honor students, have excellent scores on the USMLE, and are involved in research.

 

[GopherBrain]

You ARE on crazy pills, but it's nobody's fault but your own for obsessing about this.

If it's not on the program's website in plain English, you are not going to find this information anywhere else, so don't waste your time looking for it or even thinking about it.

Just apply to whatever programs interest you. The next best thing would be to talk to the neuro residency program director or chairman of neuro at your own med school. They probably won't know specific test score #s for other programs, but should be able to give you a ballpark sense of where you'd stand at least at some programs. If they tell you you don't have a chance at Program X, but that's where you really really want to go, ignore them and apply there anyway. Get the point? In case you don't, I'll make it plainer: you have nothing to lose by applying.

Once you are interviewing, you will find that most of the interviewees are honor students, have excellent scores on the USMLE, and are involved in research.

What he said. Don't bother looking for stats, you won't find them. In fact, I am adding this question to the FAQ because it comes up so much...

 

[aesop]

so i got my step 1 score back and got 253/99
some other basic info about my app is in the top of this thread
for all u neuro savvy people out there at this point do i have a shot at getting into a good neuro program like stanford or ucsf or should i focus my away rotations more lower tier? any residents at either of these programs willing to share their thoughts? are these programs only for the 260+ super geniuses?

i've tried talking to my schools deans and received amazing pearls of wisdom like: "just try your hardest and let god take care of the rest" or "if it's meant to be then it will be."

any REAL advice you guys can offer is greatly appreciated.

 

[lumbering]

are these programs only for the 260+ super geniuses?

You might have a shot with 253 if you're willing to felate the program director.

 

[typhoonegator]

The 253 is great, but on its own isn't going to get you accepted/rejected anywhere.

Your score is certainly an asset for you, but your research history, interests within the field, and future goals are going to hold the admission committee's attention a lot longer. While the "big programs" are very much interested in attracting good clinicians, they also have the luxury of also expecting more than that. Remember, neurology is a very research-driven specialty at the top tier, and unfortunately your 253 by itself doesn't really say anything about your skills as an academician/scientist.

From reading your post, you sound fairly well-qualified, and should apply to a mixture of programs where you see a good fit for yourself. You will likely be competitive in some of the upper echelon programs.

I'm not at UCSF or Stanford -- I'm actually somewhere in Boston...but I did sleep at a Holiday Inn Express last night.

 

[buckley]

253? 270? Hayayay! Any neuro residents with 220 scores??? I thought that was the usual cut-off for the programs...Im thinking maybe I should stop reading SDN...I don't know if it's helping or worsening the interview anxiety trail! Heehee...
Anyhow, to the poster, dude, if I had your scores and your MS, nothing's gonna stop me from applying to my dream program. Actually, I don't have your scores and your MS, but Im not letting that stop me from applying to my dream program either...Oh yeah...I am a firm believer of "Do your best and God will do the rest"..If you think about it, you'll-never-know-unless-you-try is really the soundest most realistic advice. Go for it!

 

[GopherBrain]

You people kill me. Anyhow, I know for a fact that it is possible to get interviews at the top 5 programs with a USMLE score in the high 220s and an otherwise very strong application. Take a deep breath.... Likewise, it is possible to not get an interview with a stellar score, if your application indicates you are a tool.

Just apply and see. It is too late to change anything now.

 

[dave2626]

Okay, how bout the opposite scenario. What if you scored a 217 on step 1, 229 on 2ck and passed CS, but then got kicked out of medical school for doing something stupid (not illegal) and then doing something stupid again (also not illegal) and now you've re-enrolled at a caribbean program after spending a year getting your s**t together and you now have worked your butt off at at UT-Southwestern's neuro program and two faculty members there wrote you great letters of reccommendation and Dr. Vernino said he would at least interview you since you did so well there and then you went to University of Florida and worked really hard there and got a great evaluation from the neuro program there.... and now its september 4th and you have written the longest run-on sentence ever.... what then.... am I an idiot for sending out 26 applications to neurology or is it possible to actually match in neurology. Oh yeah, and your only research is making diluting smallpox vaccines and seeing if they still work.

 

[typhoonegator]

I want to divulge a secret. Okay, here goes...

Anyone can get into any neurology program with any even remotely decent board score (or number of publications, or grades, or hair color, or urine protein/creatinine ratio) if:

1. They act, talk, dress, and smell like a real human being.
2. They act like they have given more than a moment's thought about what they want to do with their lives, and have taken actions that back up those thoughts.
3. They have a passable explanation for any glaring negatives in their application.

Contingency #1 is probably the biggest failing among applicants. Honestly, if you are interested enough in a program that you want to find out what the average stats of their residents are, you should probably just apply there and see what happens.

 

[aesop]

Thanks for all the responses. First off, Lumbering you're a comedic genius. Second, for any of you who recommended I calm down/chill out/take big hit out of my quaalude stash, I'm really not that stressed out about this. I guess my thoughts translated into text just comes off that way. My hope was since there are some people on this board who are currently residents at some of these "top programs" that they may be able to shed some light onto whether I was in the ballpark of the residents in their program and maybe even offer some advice based on their own experience. I do plan on applying to whatever schools I'm interested in, as I know applying to extra schools cannot hurt. But I can only do so many away rotations and would like to spend that time trying to impress a program I actually have a shot at.

 

[buckley]

Har har har! Hee hee hee! We will never really know until we get there...

Gopher, sorry if this kills you. it's not that we dont heed your words...it's also just pretty healthy to let all that anxiety out, you know? Glad to know I am not alone.

Thanks for the *secret*...will pass it on : )

Dave, Im sure you can charm them...Run on sentences actually sound better than constructed sentences when you say them out loud...makes you sound totally spontaneous...even tough you practice it a bit. Got some explaining to do myself...But that's a problem I would be happy to deal with when I get an interview call! LAlalalalalLALALALALlaaalLAalaala....

 

[alateralus88]

this is my first post, just because i've seen so many people talk about getting published and having sky high scores...it's just getting hard to keep optimistic my steps are not great, my grades are avg, i have no publications---- but i love neurology... so im just thinking to myself **** it, im gonna apply to where i want to go, if i get an interview, they will have to see that i am interested in neurology because i love it...and because i know i am gonna be great at it.

so if u have publications, good step scores (you know what a good step score is, stop asking i got a 3 million will they even interview me?), good grades...why would u even second guess urself?... just apply and ull be fine

 

[BogglestheMind]

so i got my step 1 score back and got 253/99
some other basic info about my app is in the top of this thread
for all u neuro savvy people out there at this point do i have a shot at getting into a good neuro program like stanford or ucsf or should i focus my away rotations more lower tier? any residents at either of these programs willing to share their thoughts? are these programs only for the 260+ super geniuses?

i've tried talking to my schools deans and received amazing pearls of wisdom like: "just try your hardest and let god take care of the rest" or "if it's meant to be then it will be."

any REAL advice you guys can offer is greatly appreciated.

Be sure to do well on Step 2, and even more importantly do very very well on all of your clinical rotations in third year, this will have a big impact of matching at merely a good neuro program versus and excellent program. You are close to the "Perfect Triad", a slang term used by some neuro PDs at top programs (read Harvard, UPenn, etc. . ., i.e.

1. Strong Step Scores, varies by program, above average helps alot.
2. Research experience, i.e. academic type i.e. masters/PhD, published articles
3. Honors in most of the third year clinical grades, i.e. IM Honors, Surgery Honors

Also, the "bag of potato chips" helps too, (but less than the triad obviously) this is community involvement/work with people with neurologic disabilities, HAVE heard some applicants referred to as having "All the Triad" and a bag of potato chips! Weird but true . . .