Which med schools are research-oriented?

[Liz10185]

Hi everyone-

I'm interested in research, especially neurology, and I'm planning to do a fellowship after med school instead of doing a MD/PhD. I'm from New York and I'm trying to choose out-of-state schools to apply to, especially the ones on US News's Research list, but they're all starting to look so similar! Any suggestions on good research-oriented schools?

Thanks!

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[Liz10185]

...anyone?

 

[Law2Doc]

Hi everyone-

I'm interested in research, especially neurology, and I'm planning to do a fellowship after med school instead of doing a MD/PhD. I'm from New York and I'm trying to choose out-of-state schools to apply to, especially the ones on US News's Research list, but they're all starting to look so similar! Any suggestions on good research-oriented schools?

Thanks!

You should be able to find a decent focus on research, and ample projects to get involved in, in most of the top 50 or so schools on the US News research ranking. Those schools at the top of the primary care ranking list tend to have less of a research focus, so to the extent a school is high on the list in primary care and not so high on research ranking, it probably isn't a research powerhouse and vice versa.

 

[durfen]

Hi everyone-

I'm interested in research, especially neurology, and I'm planning to do a fellowship after med school instead of doing a MD/PhD. I'm from New York and I'm trying to choose out-of-state schools to apply to, especially the ones on US News's Research list, but they're all starting to look so similar! Any suggestions on good research-oriented schools?

Thanks!

Stanford is one of the few schools that emphasize research in their mission statement:

"It is our mission to develop and direct our students’ skills and passion so they can become outstanding clinicians who improve the health of the world’s people through research, innovation, and leadership."

 

[Law2Doc]

Stanford is one of the few schools that emphasize research in their mission statement:

It's easy to say things, the proof is in the pudding. Stanford is a strong research school. But I would focus more on grant money and less on mission statements.

 

[solitude]

You should be able to find a decent focus on research, and ample projects to get involved in, in most of the top 50 or so schools on the US News research ranking. Those schools at the top of the primary care ranking list tend to have less of a research focus, so to the extent a school is high on the list in primary care and not so high on research ranking, it probably isn't a research powerhouse and vice versa.

Well, there are actually a few schools that are ranked highly in both research and primary care. If you are interested in research, you should pay more attention to the research rankings, but I just wanted to note that simply because a school is at the top of the primary care ranking does not always imply that they lack ample research opportunities.

For example, UWashington, UNC, Duke, UCSF, Baylor, and Iowa are all in the top11 in primary care, and each of these schools should easily have enough good research opportunities for motivated med students.

 

[Law2Doc]

Well, there are actually a few schools that are ranked highly in both research and primary care. If you are interested in research, you should pay more attention to the research rankings, but I just wanted to note that simply because a school is at the top of the primary care ranking does not always imply that they lack ample research opportunities.

For example, UWashington, UNC, Duke, UCSF, Baylor, and Iowa are all in the top11 in primary care, and each of these schools should easily have enough good research opportunities for motivated med students.

True, but there are also some other schools high on the primary care list, that, while they may give lipservice to the fact that they "value research", are clearly there to churn out primary care docs and have very limited research opportunities. You don't see this at the top 50 or so of the other list.

 

[Brainsucker]

If you've already done research in a particular area and you'd like to continue, see if you can find out about the facutly's grant money in that area and their publishing in high impact journals.

There are the obvious choices, but a lot of places that have really strong research aren't so well known. Also, you should know that if you take a year off, you can spend it somewhere besides your med school.

AECOM
Case
CCLCM (You really owe it to yourself to take a good look at this school since you're looking for something short of an MD-PhD. Don't think you're going to get much done in lab unless you're taking a year off anyway.)
UCSD (Scripps, Salk Institute, lots going on.)
WashU

You might also find some useful info here, http://www.mdphds.org/programs.shtml. It's directed towards an MD-PhD audience, but much of what they have to say about research is more broadly applicable.

 

[riceman04]

Case Western...it is the basis of their curriculum (or at least it seems as if it is the basis of it)

Hi everyone-

I'm interested in research, especially neurology, and I'm planning to do a fellowship after med school instead of doing a MD/PhD. I'm from New York and I'm trying to choose out-of-state schools to apply to, especially the ones on US News's Research list, but they're all starting to look so similar! Any suggestions on good research-oriented schools?

Thanks!

 

[Bubblehead-to-MD]

This brings up a question I've been pondering for some time now.

I'm applying to some research-oriented schools. While I strongly believe research is a fundamental component to the advancement of medical technologies/treatments, I have no desire to pursue a MD/PhD. In fact, I think even your average MD will find it difficult to graduate from any residency programs these days without having to do some basic research.

What are the research-oriented schools going to think of the regular MD applicants that are applying to their schools? Are they going to think I'm full of $h!+ when I tell them that I truly believe in the conduct of research and wholeheartedly plan on doing some myself?

Anybody else wondering about these things?

 

[LauraPaz]

Case
CCLCM (You really owe it to yourself to take a good look at this school since you're looking for something short of an MD-PhD. Don't think you're going to get much done in lab unless you're taking a year off anyway.)

This is most definitely true. I did my undergrad at Case (and thus just down the street from the Cleveland Clinic's program) and I know they've been restructuring their curriculum over the past couple years to provide more exposure to research. The CCLCM is a relatively new program, but the Cleveland Clinic is an incredibly well-respected institution and generates some great research in many fields.

 

[Brainsucker]

Danjo, that all depends on prior experience. It's a little hollow to pump up all the research you're going to do if you've never done any. (It's fine to say that you haven't done it but would like to try it out in the future, just don't make it a centerpiece of your app.) But no, schools at all levels let in tons of humanities majors that are quite honest about not being too interested in research.

You're also on the wrong track about residencies. If you want a high-powered academic residency, then you should know that's what you're signing up for. If you choose a community based residency, you might (might!) have to co-author some case reports or simple clinical stuff, but nothing hardcore.

 

[solitude]

True, but there are also some other schools high on the primary care list, that, while they may give lipservice to the fact that they "value research", are clearly there to churn out primary care docs and have very limited research opportunities. You don't see this at the top 50 or so of the other list.

Yeah, I agree.

 

[Bubblehead-to-MD]

Danjo, that all depends on prior experience. It's a little hollow to pump up all the research you're going to do if you've never done any. (It's fine to say that you haven't done it but would like to try it out in the future, just don't make it a centerpiece of your app.) But no, schools at all levels let in tons of humanities majors that are quite honest about not being too interested in research.

You're also on the wrong track about residencies. If you want a high-powered academic residency, then you should know that's what you're signing up for. If you choose a community based residency, you might (might!) have to co-author some case reports or simple clinical stuff, but nothing hardcore.

Thanks for the input! I don't plan on hyping up a bunch a research that I plan on doing...I have been very straightforward in my application in stating that my exposure to medical research is very limited. I do believe, though, that every physician should be equipped with the basic tools needed to conduct effective research, and I am therefore interested in some of the research-oriented schools...I'm just trying to find out if they will think I'm paying lip service to research, since I'm not applying for MD/PhD.

 

[Sol Rosenberg]

UT Southwestern is very research oriented.

 

[Brainsucker]

Sounds like a good plan to me. A good thing to do now is look at curricula. You'll want a school that involves more serious education in biostats and epidemiology. I think some schools have evidence based medicine classes and stuff of that nature. (I really don't know where.) They'll probably be proud to trumpet it on their websites. This doesn't really matter, however, if you plan to take a year off (summer's okay also, but as I'm figuring out, it's hard to get much done) to do research (clinical, at least) since you'll learn far more about the process, assumptions, and everything else involved by actually doing it than you will by taking a class.

 

[Bubblehead-to-MD]

Sounds like a good plan to me. A good thing to do now is look at curricula. You'll want a school that involves more serious education in biostats and epidemiology. I think some schools have evidence based medicine classes and stuff of that nature. (I really don't know where.) They'll probably be proud to trumpet it on their websites. This doesn't really matter, however, if you plan to take a year off (summer's okay also, but as I'm figuring out, it's hard to get much done) to do research (clinical, at least) since you'll learn far more about the process, assumptions, and everything else involved by actually doing it than you will by taking a class.

Thanks again for the info...I'll look more into the curricula that you mentioned above!

 

[Lanced]

Stanford
Wash U
U Chicago
Case Western
U of Pittsburg
U of Penn
U of Rochester
Duke
Johns Hopkins
Harvard
Yale
Columbia
Cornell

This a group of private research colleges. I'm interested in research though maybe not MSTP, I applied to about half of them.

 

[Liz10185]

Thanks for the advice guys. I'll take a closer look at the schools you mentioned. I didn't know about CCLCM and it looks pretty interesting.
Is there a way I can find out about a school's grants?

 

[Brainsucker]

http://grants.nih.gov/grants/award/trends/medschc.htm

 

[kirexhana]

Sorry if this sounds like I'm tooting my own horn, but DUKE. They have a whole year dedicated to research. LOTS of opportunities to apply for funding before 3rd year. A friend of mine recently got a Howard Hughes research grant and will be working at DC next year. There are large stipends that can cut down on tuition costs. Research is big there.

 

[Brainsucker]

Sorry if this sounds like I'm tooting my own horn, but DUKE. They have a whole year dedicated to research. LOTS of opportunities to apply for funding before 3rd year. A friend of mine recently got a Howard Hughes research grant and will be working at DC next year. There are large stipends that can cut down on tuition costs. Research is big there.

Wow, this thread went on for quite a while without someone doing that. Well, maybe durfen. For the record, every institution I've graced is the best ever!

 

[durfen]

Wow, this thread went on for quite a while without someone doing that. Well, maybe durfen. For the record, every institution I've graced is the best ever!

Ok ok, maybe I did. But stanford's curriculum is research-oriented, plus you have to look at funding per faculty not funding overall. Stanford is small compared with harvard/johns hopkins etc but still is 10th on the list. and a higher percentage goes towards non-clinical research, like bioengineering etc. That said, no statistics to back this up, except money/fellowship on the NIH link posted earlier.

 

[silas2642]

Sorry if this sounds like I'm tooting my own horn, but DUKE. They have a whole year dedicated to research. LOTS of opportunities to apply for funding before 3rd year. A friend of mine recently got a Howard Hughes research grant and will be working at DC next year. There are large stipends that can cut down on tuition costs. Research is big there.

Okay, okay, I get how you like Jake Gyllenhall (spelling? I'm sure someone on sdn will correct it if I spelled it wrong) and Brokeback Mountain and everything. BUT I think that you need to come to grips with the fact that Jakey boy is just a poor man's Tobey Maguire. I mean, c'mon really, he's not THAT cute, especially next to Tobey. And can you be any cuter with a name like Tobey?

 

[Brainsucker]

Ok ok, maybe I did. But stanford's curriculum is research-oriented, plus you have to look at funding per faculty not funding overall. Stanford is small compared with harvard/johns hopkins etc but still is 10th on the list. and a higher percentage goes towards non-clinical research, like bioengineering etc. That said, no statistics to back this up, except money/fellowship on the NIH link posted earlier.

You're right, it's just that I expect that each person will chime in with the school he got into or is attending and talk it up as the best ever for research, which isn't too useful.

 

[snobored18]

Is there a way I can find out about a school's grants?

Yep ---> http://grants2.nih.gov/grants/award/trends/medschc.htm
NIH grants aren't everything...keep that in mind. Some places have extremely deep pockets and hence lots of intramural funding in addition to what they bring in via extramural sources.

 

[durfen]

You're right, it's just that I expect that each person will chime in with the school he got into or is attending and talk it up as the best ever for research, which isn't too useful.

Trouble is, I haven't got in yet....

 

[ahumdinger]

WashU WashU WashU! Research is very much emphasized there, and you'll find that many of your classmates are like you: want to do research, but don't want to do MSTP. There's a pretty large MSTP class, but the rest of the group is equally eager. The majority of students do a summer research project after their first year, and it's a surprisingly popular option to take a year off (either between 2nd and 3rd or 3rd and 4th) to do research. As far as neurology, there's a great dept here for you to get your feet wet. It's amazing how many researchers are NOT MD/PhDs!! The chair of the neurology dept actually, David Holtzman, is a huge research powerhouse at WashU, and he only has an MD.

 

[durfen]

WashU WashU WashU! Research is very much emphasized there, and you'll find that many of your classmates are like you: want to do research, but don't want to do MSTP. There's a pretty large MSTP class, but the rest of the group is equally eager. The majority of students do a summer research project after their first year, and it's a surprisingly popular option to take a year off (either between 2nd and 3rd or 3rd and 4th) to do research. As far as neurology, there's a great dept here for you to get your feet wet. It's amazing how many researchers are NOT MD/PhDs!! The chair of the neurology dept actually, David Holtzman, is a huge research powerhouse at WashU, and he only has an MD.

The St. Louis one? or the one 'up there'?

 

[ahumdinger]

The St. Louis one? or the one 'up there'?

st. louis!! WashU in St. Louis! I'm not going there, though. 'twas my dream school, but in the end, money talks.

I'd chime in for my own UW, but it's so hard to get in out of state that I don't think it's worth the time. Although if you're thinking MSTP, it's not a bad option. Some years so few people apply that practically everyone gets in. (but I think that's more rare nowadays)

 

[Bubblehead-to-MD]

I'd chime in for my own UW, but it's so hard to get in out of state that I don't think it's worth the time. Although if you're thinking MSTP, it's not a bad option. Some years so few people apply that practically everyone gets in. (but I think that's more rare nowadays)

Yeah...I'm OOS, but I'm taking the chance. Wishful thinking, I know! *Crosses fingers*

 

[durfen]

st. louis!! WashU in St. Louis! I'm not going there, though. 'twas my dream school, but in the end, money talks.

I'd chime in for my own UW, but it's so hard to get in out of state that I don't think it's worth the time. Although if you're thinking MSTP, it's not a bad option. Some years so few people apply that practically everyone gets in. (but I think that's more rare nowadays)

Then you should change your sig 'mano. It's WashU not UWash.