Why is it so hard to quit?

[jl lin]

You can claim you are all for DO being equal and what not, but the passive language implies something different. You have yet to establish any concrete reason as to why Osteopathic medicine is a real problem. You vaguely allude to residency options and to say you dislike OMM.

Well, residency options are limited because you failed to get into an MD school. Even if you get into an MD school, you can have limited options if you fail to have the right grades and recommendations for it. What would you do if that happens? Not complete any residency because you might be limited on fellowships or something? The rational approach is that if you want to be a physician, you would much rather face your problems and even have to "settle" for a residency that's not your top choice, the same way people "settle" to go to Yale because they didn't get into Harvard and so on. Therefore, limit in residency options is not even an argument based on any rationality.

Your argument about OMM is clearly an exaggeration. Hate it? Good. Also probably >50% of DO students. The day you're done with your boards you don't need to do it ever again. Don't like the AOA? Good, join the AMA. You aren't forced to be a part of the AOA.

Lets not get into how you don't want to do an international MD program or SMP as a compromise.

Do you understand why people simply don't believe that you're a genuine person? It all points to a lust for prestige which is a by-product of problems with your self-esteem. You seek for things to make you happy instead of being happy you can do things. There are millions of people out there that would gladly give away a kidney to have the life of a doctor, even Caribbean. You keep torturing yourself because you couldn't get into an MD school and you enjoy that much more than pushing on against problems. That's why I have a hard time believing you'd be happy even if you got into University of Washington or another great college because you'd be moping over not being at Harvard. Your problem is really your self-esteem. You need to work on that.

I don't mean to get off target, but maybe someone could post a link that is specific to a discussion on why there has to be two types of medical schools in the US in the first place. The whole thing irks me a bit, b/c I have lived through the whole hospital-school RN vs. ADN, RN vs. BSN RN thing. In the end, even in light of the Linda Aiken studies, the proficiency and expert of practice comes down to the individual and getting loads of excellent clinical experience. Didactics are important, no doubt; but they are of little practical use and application without clinical experience--to me, it is the latter that makes or breaks you.

So, I see some of these anti-DO or questionable anti-DO threads, and it smacks of the different types of pathways to RN, which ultimately lead to all its applicants, regardless of degree or modality of education, taking the same state board examinations. I always think, "This is stupid. Why isn't there just one unified pathway to RN, academically speaking?" And now I am questioning why there is not just one, unified academic pathway to physician????

I don't know why there has to be these two streams. If anything, it seems that it would lead to disunity within the medical profession. I have seen enough of that in nursing.

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[TwistinD]

Look, you can't beat yourself up over what you've done in the past, and if you want to be a physician so badly (I get that), you can't be so negative. Yes, you need to be realistic, but instead of focusing on all the aspects of your application that won't get you in - focus on the strengths you can contribute to a program and the field. I can't do an SMP either because of the money, but what about spending another year or so taking one course per semester (esp helpful if your job has tuition reimbursement benefits). Nail the MCAT, get some recent upper-level bio coursework on your transcript (and gun for the A's), research the DO option more, and keep applying. Make the schools see you and your passion. Do whatever it takes. I have a good friend who had the same passion and same stats, applied for med school for 6 years straight (became an EMT during because he couldnt stand the rejections at first), and got into Temple's MD program last fall. Persistance is key.

And if there's a will, there's sure as hell a way. Best of luck!!!

 

[jl lin]

Look, you can't beat yourself up over what you've done in the past, and if you want to be a physician so badly (I get that), you can't be so negative. Yes, you need to be realistic, but instead of focusing on all the aspects of your application that won't get you in - focus on the strengths you can contribute to a program and the field. I can't do an SMP either because of the money, but what about spending another year or so taking one course per semester (esp helpful if your job has tuition reimbursement benefits). Nail the MCAT, get some recent upper-level bio coursework on your transcript (and gun for the A's), research the DO option more, and keep applying. Make the schools see you and your passion. Do whatever it takes. I have a good friend who had the same passion and same stats, applied for med school for 6 years straight (became an EMT during because he couldnt stand the rejections at first), and got into Temple's MD program last fall. Persistance is key.

And if there's a will, there's sure as hell a way. Best of luck!!!

Just wanted to say that your reply was great. I agree.

From OP, I have thought to myself, "What is this person really asking?" I mean you either know that you want to do this, even when things are hard and suck, or you don't. I don't think this is the kind of field where a vacillating mentality prevails. It's OK, even good to admit, "Hey. I was wrong." But I'm not sure what the OP is saying on the matter. Why is it a hard dream to give up? I don't know. Only YOU can answer that. But you either want it and are willing to give it your best try--and be persistent--or you don't. I mean there are folks on SDN that have been through all kinds of stuff, and in spite of serious illnesses, major financial struggles, family and other kinds of conflicts, they have persevered. How badly do you want it? Yep. It may not work out. But I think you have to come to that after you have repeatedly exhausted every course possible--that is, if you are crazy serious about this pathway. If you are not, that's fine too. Face it, let it go, and then be done with it.

OP, if that's where you are, put it to bed already. If not, ask for definitive directions.

 

[TriagePreMed]

I don't mean to get off target, but maybe someone could post a link that is specific to a discussion on why there has to be two types of medical schools in the US in the first place. The whole thing irks me a bit, b/c I have lived through the whole hospital-school RN vs. ADN, RN vs. BSN RN thing. In the end, even in light of the Linda Aiken studies, the proficiency and expert of practice comes down to the individual and getting loads of excellent clinical experience. Didactics are important, no doubt; but they are of little practical use and application without clinical experience--to me, it is the latter that makes or breaks you.

So, I see some of these anti-DO or questionable anti-DO threads, and it smacks of the different types of pathways to RN, which ultimately lead to all its applicants, regardless of degree or modality of education, taking the same state board examinations. I always think, "This is stupid. Why isn't there just one unified pathway to RN, academically speaking?" And now I am questioning why there is not just one, unified academic pathway to physician????

I don't know why there has to be these two streams. If anything, it seems that it would lead to disunity within the medical profession. I have seen enough of that in nursing.

It happened due to historical reasons. There's a book called "the DO's" that outlines the history really well.

As for state board examination, they have different ones for MD and DO, although DO can take the MD boards.

 

[jl lin]

It happened due to historical reasons. There's a book called "the DO's" that outlines the history really well.

As for state board examination, they have different ones for MD and DO, although DO can take the MD boards.

Yes, I know they do. I am sorry. I wasn't clear. I was stating that RNs, regardless of academic pathway to RN, become RNs through the same board exam.



Maybe they should just make OM a choice for those in DO programs? IDK. I'm just saying it annoys me in the same sense that the differences in RN ed annoy me. BSN is just more nursing-data-research based courses pretty much. The core stuff is taught in all programs leading to RN; b/c they all have to take the same boards.

Its also interesting to me that other countries don't seem to do the DO thing. Why is that? The philosophy only took hold in the US?

Thanks for referral to "The DOs".

 

[COMedic2Doc]

Yes, I know they do. I am sorry. I wasn't clear. I was stating that RNs, regardless of academic pathway to RN, become RNs through the same board exam.



Maybe they should just make OM a choice for those in DO programs? IDK. I'm just saying it annoys me in the same sense that the differences in RN ed annoy me. BSN is just more nursing-data-research based courses pretty much. The core stuff is taught in all programs leading to RN; b/c they all have to take the same boards.

Its also interesting to me that other countries don't seem to do the DO thing. Why is that? The philosophy only took hold in the US?

Thanks for referral to "The DOs".

The DOs will be an excellent source of information. Additionally two students from Western wrote a short essay that has been published by the AOA. Here's the link that will answer many of your questions regarding the DO vs MD titles, history, some about OMM, etc. Here's the link:

http://www.aacom.org/resources/bookstore/Documents/Brief-Guide-to-OME_Final.pdf

 

[columbiapostbac]

You do what you have to do to get what you want. If you give up, you've proven you don't want it enough. That's ok, just move on. From your track record and OP, it sounds like you don't or can't do what it takes to get good grades. You should think about that and how it pertains to being a doctor, which is probably the most demanding job out there, jumping hoops-wise. Also, you've closed yourself off to DO, which makes little sense. You should think about that and how it pertains to making life decisions. Medicine may not be the right field for you. If you still feel it is, then my only advice would be to think about what you need to change about yourself. What you're doing now isn't working.

 

[Courtjester8]

I'm still confused as to whether or not the original post was serious or not. If it was, let me tell you this: my undergrad cGPA was a 2.9 with something like a 2.0 sGPA. I went into finance, left finance with my soul intact, started a post-bacc, finished it with a 3.9 GPA, that brought my cGPA to 3.2 and sGPA to a 3.4. Took the mcat, hit a 35 on the first go, and now my apps are in and i've already seen some love ( interview invite at pitt). From start of post-bacc to now was 1.5 years. I could have done it in 1 if it weren't for a financial aid mishap keeping me from registering for prereqs.

Point being this: you don't need 6 years and a ph.d. You need to get serious, bust hump, and turn your s*** around. So what if between classes, volunteering, research, and shadowing you only sleep 4 hours a night. If thats the cost of following your dream, then that's what you need to do. Now stop feeling sorry for yourself and go get it.

-cj8

 

[Misugaru]

Cj8, did you take a year off to study full time and do all that volunteering? Did you take those pre-reqs at a CC or 4 year university?