Work Experiences Section - References

[doctor712]

Quick question regarding this section (5.) on the AMCAS. I listed my 15 most important work experiences, and, as my file gets verified, I'm thinking of letting the references listed know that they may hear from schools that I applied to. So, it begs the question, do adcoms every really call these people and reach out?

Many of the experiences (maybe all of them actually) coincide with the same docs who wrote my LORs, so they may not be surprised to get a phone call on my behalf per a reference letter, but they may not know that I listed them as a separate reference for a co-authored publication/experience, for example. Should I give these docs a heads up? Many of these docs have lots and lots of pubs and I'd hate for them not to remember the one random one we did together if/when the phone call comes. While it was memorable to me, who knows what these busy docs think of that one random publication...if they recall it at all...

Thoughts?
D712

p.s. I think I have moved, without doubt, into neurotic-applicant-zone with this thread question. I can only wait to see what November-January will bring out of me... At least I have a good perspective on it all and am still laughing...FOR NOW...

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[QofQuimica]

You're talking about the contact person for each EC, right? No, I don't think it's necessary to tell them that you listed them.

I can only speak to what one school does, but no, we don't call people's EC references. Sometimes an interviewer or the Admissions Dean may call an applicant's letter writers/premed advisor if there is a specific question or they want more information about something that was said in the LOR. This is only for candidates that have been or are being interviewed. There's not much need to call references pre-interview; for one, we may not even invite the person, in which case it's a moot point. For another, it's pretty obvious if someone is trying to exaggerate an experience when they're asked to discuss it in an interview.

And yes, you are being neurotic. It's ok; this is the time of year for it. The good news is that your condition will be instantaneously cured as soon as you get your first acceptance.

 

[doctor712]

Thanks for the reply. That's a bit of a relief. Coming off the heels of asking for 5 new and updated LORs, less (contact) is more right now.

FIRST acceptance? The optimist in me is smiling, but the
neuroticist (new word?) in me is beating that smile back with small stacks of thin envelopes mailed from 39 of my 40 schools.
Thanks for the vote of confidence though.

It only takes one ...

D712

Nb as I await my MCAT fate, I awoke to a nightmare this morning whereby I had taken the MCAT, felt like I really did well, was walking away from the MCAT center only to realize, as I walked with a friend who also took it, that, oops, I forgot to take the VERBAL section. My strongsuit. (as if skipping BS or PS would be any less deleterious !!!). Oh yeah, it's that time of year for sure.

 

[QofQuimica]

Dreams are funny that way. This AM, right before my alarm went off at 4:30, I was dreaming that I had been called to the ER to see a homeless patient with diabetic ulcers. The guy was indeed homeless and did have foot ulcers, but they were completely clean and granulating. I had no idea why he was even in the ER, let alone why I was asked to see him. Still, something about the exam struck me as being not quite right. Just then, my alarm goes off. I get up, and I'm still pondering what the problem was. Then it hits me; the guy was sitting in the pelvic exam chair, and I had been examining him with his feet in the stirrups. Well, at least they didn't ask me to come do a pelvic exam on him.

 

[doctor712]

Dreams are funny that way. This AM, right before my alarm went off at 4:30, I was dreaming that I had been called to the ER to see a homeless patient with diabetic ulcers. The guy was indeed homeless and did have foot ulcers, but they were completely clean and granulating. I had no idea why he was even in the ER, let alone why I was asked to see him. Still, something about the exam struck me as being not quite right. Just then, my alarm goes off. I get up, and I'm still pondering what the problem was. Then it hits me; the guy was sitting in the pelvic exam chair, and I had been examining him with his feet in the stirrups. Well, at least they didn't ask me to come do a pelvic exam on him.

It sounds like we're each having our own medical-field-induced dream-inations. Sorry to use such official medical-ease here.

Congratulations on graduating and matching btw, I read somewhere on SDN that you are now a resident! Oh yeah, right there next to your name, where it says, "Resident." Excellent.

D712

 

[QofQuimica]

Congratulations on graduating and matching btw, I read somewhere on SDN that you are now a resident! Oh yeah, right there next to your name, where it says, "Resident." Excellent.

D712

Haha, thanks. Though it may be more appropriate to offer me your condolences.

All kidding aside, scary to think of me as a resident, isn't it? But the good news is that residency apps are way less difficult than med school apps are (though just as stressful!). I matched at my top choice and will be here for fellowship as well. I'm in with some good, smart academic mentor types. It's an incredibly intense program, but I think I made the right decision to come here. I think....

 

[doctor712]

Haha, thanks. Though it may be more appropriate to offer me your condolences.

All kidding aside, scary to think of me as a resident, isn't it? But the good news is that residency apps are way less difficult than med school apps are (though just as stressful!). I matched at my top choice and will be here for fellowship as well. I'm in with some good, smart academic mentor types. It's an incredibly intense program, but I think I made the right decision to come here. I think....

It's not scary to think of you as a resident. I had all the faith you'd match top spot. Your patients, well they might feel otherwise for a few months...

It's barely August and you want condolences??!? Ha. You won't be getting any condolences from me until October, at earliest. It could be November, I warn. Misery loves company, ya know. .

Having had two close friends match since we spoke last, then another not match-then get-a-job-only-to-then-match-out-of-the-match-three-months-ago, all the while texting and calling me at every-single-point-of the process, because, surely, I can comfort these people in an area I know NOTHING about, I can only imagine the pain that surrounds that maniacal match process that you went through. I'm not sure how that can be much better than uploading your life story into 224 AMCAS drop down boxes - and, on Firefox because Safari isn't compatible, of course - but I'll take your word for it, Doc^2.

D712

 

[QofQuimica]

I'm not sure how that can be much better than uploading your life story into 224 AMCAS drop down boxes....

Two words: no secondaries. You know what I had to do to complete my app at each program once I certified ERAS? Check a few boxes. You know how much I spent on my residency apps? $500 even. (Not including interview travel, of course.) That was the fee to apply to 35 programs; had I only applied to 15 programs like my advisor told me to, it would have cost about $150. I can't remember now which med school it was that made me re-enter my coursework on the secondary even though I'd already spent hours putting it all there on AMCAS. For residency apps, I didn't have to enter any of my coursework at all. ERAS doesn't require you to do that. There were no secondary essays either. I wrote one PS and that was it.

The whole app season is compressed into a much shorter period of time, too. It's an app season on steroids. You know how long it takes to be complete on ERAS after you certify? About 15 seconds, versus weeks, or even months, at some med schools. You know how soon I started getting interview invites after submitting ERAS? About two weeks later, and I submitted my apps a few days after ERAS opened. The peak where I was getting one or two invites every day, including weekend days, was about six weeks after submitting. I also went on my first interview about six weeks after I submitted, and my last interview was four months after submitting. The whole thing from starting my app to opening my envelope took less than six months. I could go on, but I assume I don't have to by this point.

If you thought AMCAS was painful....bwahahahaha, just you wait. You have barely begun to feel application pain! More essays to write, more little drop down boxes to fill, more fees to pay, more hassles to deal with. Who wouldn't want all of that over one simple online app that can be filled out in an hour or two tops? [/sarcasm]

 

[doctor712]

...had I only applied to 15 programs like my advisor told me to, it would have cost about $150.

Oh SNAP. Cheap date. I'm just going to take a wild guess, if it's anything like your med school apps, 34/35 interviews?
The fact that you got a fellowship going in...

I can't remember now which med school it was that made me re-enter my coursework on the secondary even though I'd already spent hours putting it all there on AMCAS.

If you remember, lemme know. So I can PRESS DELETE to that med school. I have 4 transcripts and 1XX+ credits? I lost track. There is NO WAY I AM GOING TO APPLY TO A SCHOOL...Oh wait, I already paid for my schools...never mind.

You know how soon I started getting interview invites after submitting ERAS? About two weeks later...

At the rate my app is going to get verified, I may well be able to compete with that... HA.

If you thought AMCAS was painful....bwahahahaha, just you wait. You have barely begun to feel application pain!

I give I give. You win. Me more pain. You less pain.

I have had a couple moments, where, shall I say, keeping a good spirit in this (AND THAT'S KEY MY NON-TRAD PALS!) has kept me "sane."

Exhibit A) From the Office of a VERY WELL KNOWN TOP SCHOOL because I would never call a school I really thought I had a chance to get into...and I quote, "Mr. D712, yes, don't worry, feel free to update us by email when your book chapter (yay) in early 2012 officially is printed, for now, in order to get an interview, we don't pay any attention to EC things like that, you know bowling team, pizza making, book chapters, journal papers, that's all fluff for us."
DEPRESSED DELETE on my AMCAS 12.2 seconds later. If I'm simply a GPA/MCAT, I'll never make it there. And wait - Did she just equate a book chapter and pubs with pizza making and bowling team? NOTHING AGAINST YOU BOWLERS, I love bowling, I'll roll an 85 any day of the week. It's (get ready for it) how I roll. BUT - Who knew research was so UNIMPORTANT in all this. You mean I could've sat home and played Nintendo all these years instead of busting my butt to LEARN SOMETHING?! Ciao. #numbersnobs

Exhibit A Part I) Much the way the EM forum has "Craziest things you learn from patients...and Dumbest things patients have done..." I think we need "Funniest Dealing-With-Admissions-Offices Moments!

Exhibit B) From the Office of a not WELL KNOWN TOP SCHOOL... "Please feel free to ask any other applications questions you may have, I'm here to help." I follow up with about as BENIGN A QUESTION as one could possibly ask. Trust me. Response, "I'm sorry, it's not in my duties to answer application questions..."

Exhibit C) AMCAS wanted me to mail transcript requests directly to schools? Ok. So, I do. Oh wait, 2 of my schools charge $$$ for transcripts? Does AMCAS' transcript form MAKE MENTION of any fee? (No.) Oh. You'd think, that, maybe, ya know...being AMCAS and all, the service that allows us to APPLY to schools... Oh wait, so the school wants me now, nay REQUIRES me now, to use THEIR OWN internet-based transcript request form, AMCAS' form ain't even gonna cut it? SURE. WHY. NOT. It's just TIME.

Exhibit D) I think I just wanna skip to residency...

D712

 

[mauberley]

Exhibit C) AMCAS wanted me to mail transcript requests directly to schools? Ok. So, I do. Oh wait, 2 of my schools charge $$$ for transcripts? Does AMCAS' transcript form MAKE MENTION of any fee? (No.) Oh. You'd think, that, maybe, ya know...being AMCAS and all, the service that allows us to APPLY to schools... Oh wait, so the school wants me now, nay REQUIRES me now, to use THEIR OWN internet-based transcript request form, AMCAS' form ain't even gonna cut it? SURE. WHY. NOT. It's just TIME.

AMCAS interfaces with med schools, not undergrad institutions. How would they reasonably be able to keep track of every single institution's policies about requesting transcripts? Some schools don't charge fees for current students. Most require you to use their own request forms. The AMCAS form is not a "request" per se but something to help match received transcripts with the correct applications.

This just seemed an odd expectation to have. Anyway, carry on.

 

[QofQuimica]

D, I think you should stop contacting schools and asking questions. Your app is in; the deed is done. You won't know how competitive you are until your MCAT score comes in, and you can't predict now which schools will be interested in you. Assuming your MCAT is decent, at the very least, I think most of our state schools will be interested in you.

And no, I was rejected by two programs, not one.

 

[doctor712]

D, I think you should stop contacting schools and asking questions. Your app is in; the deed is done.

But I like calling and saying hello to them...

Haha. No, sorry, I was unclear, I was calling before I submitted stuff, but Roger That. No point in calling now!

You won't know how competitive you are until your MCAT score comes in, and you can't predict now which schools will be interested in you. Assuming your MCAT is decent, at the very least, I think most of our state schools will be interested in you.

Is that the "royal" our as in OF THE UNITED STATES, or my personal state's school? See how I snuck a question in without making a call...

And no, I was rejected by two programs, not one.

^--------- CRUEL, just CRUEL. Yet, par for course. I'm going to follow the pattern and predict 3 rejections i.e. 17/20 job offers in 4 years. Just sayin'.

 

[QofQuimica]

Is that the "royal" our as in OF THE UNITED STATES, or my personal state's school?

I'm talking about FL. "Our" refers specifically to you and me. While "Q" does sometimes get mislabeled as "queen" on SDN, I do not generally go around using a royal "we."

I hope I don't have to go on 17 job interviews! Doing that as a fellow would be less painful than doing that as a resident would be, but still. Fortunately, the higher you get up the food chain, the more your connections matter. The fellowship director promised me that he will help me find a job south of the Mason-Dixon line. You better believe I'll be reminding him of this in four years.

 

[doctor712]

I'm talking about FL. "Our" refers specifically to you and me. While "Q" does sometimes get mislabeled as "queen" on SDN, I do not generally go around using a royal "we."

I hope I don't have to go on 17 job interviews! Doing that as a fellow would be less painful than doing that as a resident would be, but still. Fortunately, the higher you get up the food chain, the more your connections matter. The fellowship director promised me that he will help me find a job south of the Mason-Dixon line. You better believe I'll be reminding him of this in four years.

Who said anything about you having to GO to 17 interviews? I was more picturing offers, with their accompanying contracts, being gently slid under your front door...