Worth waiting for step 2 scores to come out before submitting eras

[mplee79]

If i think i improved considerably with step 2 (from step 1) would it be worth my while to wait to submit my eras?

In other words, in selecting applicants for an interview, do programs do a single pass with the application or is it an ongoing process as things update. I'm guessing that certain programs wouldn't give my low-average step 1 scores the time of day and stick my app in the recycle bin (and never see my step 2).

My step 2 scores will come around October 8th

Thanks

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[gutonc]

If i think i improved considerably with step 2 (from step 1) would it be worth my while to wait to submit my eras?

In other words, in selecting applicants for an interview, do programs do a single pass with the application or is it an ongoing process as things update. I'm guessing that certain programs wouldn't give my low-average step 1 scores the time of day and stick my app in the recycle bin (and never see my step 2).

My step 2 scores will come around October 8th

Thanks

As aPD has (thankfully and very helpfully) posted ad nauseum...there really isn't a recycle bin. PDs can filter apps based on particular criteria but every time something new comes into ERAS, any program that has dl'd your app gets an update with that new piece of information.

So, let's say you slacked through a 205 on Step 1 which didn't make the cut at Program X (which filters for Step 1 >220), but you rocked a 250+ on Step 2. If they have a filter which lets in Step 1 or 2 >220 (which can be done), now, your app will pop up and away you go. If their filter is only set to Step1 >220, it doesn't matter if you get 300,000,000 on Step 2, you still don't make the cut. So waiting or not won't make a huge difference. Yes, there may be a program or 2 which reject you in the interim if you apply now but I doubt it. And even then, you could certainly email them with a plea for reconsideration (which...given a Step 2 of 300 million they might be inclined to do).

All that said, you can have 250+ on both Steps and still get rejected by programs. Step scores aren't everything and even people with high scores can be useless clinicians in the end. So obsess if you want but you'll be much better off just hitting submit right now and going out for a beer or 12.

 

[Katia482]

Thanks mplee79, I was actually just about to post with the same question.

In contrast to the advice from gutonc, I was told by the advisor for IM applicants at my school that I should definitely wait for my step 2 score to come out, to avoid being "passed over" by programs seeing only my mediocre step 1 score. However, I am really questioning whether this is accurate. My ERAS application is 100% complete (including LORs) and I hate to have to wait another month to submit.

Any other thoughts on the validity of the one-look screening processes? Does anyone have an idea if it is detrimental to submit ERAS in October as opposed to early September?

Thanks!

 

[NotAProgDirector]

Wait, that's not exactly what I said (or at least not what I meant). I think two separate issues/answers are getting mixed up here.

The first issue is: my application is incomplete because I am missing something (like LOR's). Should I apply now or will my application get passed over?

In this case, there is no harm to applying now. Your application will be downloaded now. Programs create "filters" to look for complete applications -- each program can define a complete application any way they want. If your application does not meet their definition for complete, it will simply sit in their application system until it does. As soon as the missing information is downloaded and your application meets their definition of complete, it will appear the next time they query the system for complete applications. Hence, in this situation, there is no harm to applying early.

The second issue is: my application is basically complete. However, I am expecting some additional piece of information -- perhaps Step 2, or a fourth LOR, or AOA status. I think that this remaining piece of information will make a big difference to my application. If I apply now, could I possibly be rejected before this information has been received, and then if it comes in later will anyone notice?

The answer to this is different. Most programs do not consider step 2 to be necessary for "completion", since many AMG's will not have Step 2 prior to ranking. Hence, it is very possible that your application could be reviewed before your step 2 comes in, and you certainly can be rejected. Once you are rejected, your application is marked as "inactive". Although additional information will continue to be downloaded from the ERAS post office (such as your step 2 score), the application will no longer be reviewed unless the PD/PA runs a query asking about inactive applications. Hence, this situation is different. If you are waiting on a vital piece of information -- Step 2, and LOR, or AOA would be the ones that come to mind -- you might well be better off waiting until that result comes in.

You can always ask to be reconsidered once a new piece of information becomes available. Some programs will do so, some will not. We get 100's of applications per spot, re-reviewing one's we have rejected already is not fun.

Sorry for any confusion.

 

[54578]

Thank you for starting this thread. This is a really tricky situation to be in. So having really outstanding (yes I like to be positive ) Step2 scores is worth the wait, even if it doesn't come until the second/third week of October? When would be a good time to submit the application (or should one wait until the official scores come back?) I'm being told by my office (NIH Top 20 school, but I sadly do not trust any of their advice) to submit now (but my Step1 score blows...the price one pays for falling in love with your future finance during that summer ) I'm applying for General Surgery, which I know isn't crazy competitive, but I don't want to apply and get immediately rejected based on class rank/board scores. Thanks!

 

[Katia482]

Thanks, aProgDirector, your reply was really helpful!

I guess my one remaining question is this: how detrimental is it to wait until ~mid October to submit ERAS? It seems like waiting until this time should not matter, as it is still far before the programs' deadlines. However, there seems to have been a mad rush among my classmates this week to submit asap. Will I really lose chances for interview invites by waiting another month?

Thanks!

 

[Doctor Bagel]

Thanks, aProgDirector, your reply was really helpful!

I guess my one remaining question is this: how detrimental is it to wait until ~mid October to submit ERAS? It seems like waiting until this time should not matter, as it is still far before the programs' deadlines. However, there seems to have been a mad rush among my classmates this week to submit asap. Will I really lose chances for interview invites by waiting another month?

Thanks!

It sounds like people have different opinions on this stuff, and I'm not sure that there is a right strategy. We were told by the people at our school (people who have been involved with residency selection) that generally it's better to submit earlier rather than later. Waiting a week or two for some extra thing might be good, but waiting a month might be pushing it.

 

[mcl]

Thanks, aProgDirector, your reply was really helpful!

I guess my one remaining question is this: how detrimental is it to wait until ~mid October to submit ERAS? It seems like waiting until this time should not matter, as it is still far before the programs' deadlines. However, there seems to have been a mad rush among my classmates this week to submit asap. Will I really lose chances for interview invites by waiting another month?

It depends on how each program where you intend to apply handles interview invitations. I send out invitations as the Selection Committee reviews applications and instructs me to invite people. I have six interview days with eight spots on each day assigned on a first-come, first-served basis. If you apply in October and the Selection Committee tells me to offer you an invitation, I can only offer you options from the days remaining with interview spots available. So by waiting, you may get more interview invitations, but it may be harder to put a reasonable interview schedule together.

Some programs send out all of their invitations on the same day and then schedule as people call. Some programs don't even start reviewing applicants until the MSPE's are available. Some programs don't have a cap on the number of applicants they'll schedule ona given day.

Do you think it's just the missing information that would make your application strong, or is it a strong application and those things will make it stronger? If it's the latter, I don't see how you could lose by going ahead and submitting your CAF.

 

[54578]

Bump: Hoping someone will keep this thread alive with some more insight

 

[tfom08]

It probably depends also on just how low your Step 1 was. For instance, if you think it is so low that your application is going to get screened at a lot of places if you don't have a better Step 2 score, then you should wait to submit. But if it just isn't great and you want to improve it but it's not so low that you will get screened out, then you can probably just submit and they will see your improvement later when they interview you.

I really think NBME has dropped the ball with this restructuring of Step 2. This is probably the only time of year that people actually care about getting their score back in a timely manner, and they decide to restructure it right in the middle of that time. Maybe there is some reason it had to be now, but I don't think it makes much sense.

 

[EM2BE]

I know someone who waited to submit their scores in hopes step 2 was better. Long story, but step 2 was actually worse (not passing) making the app look much worse. Not trying to hurt the ego and ruin the optimistic attitudes, but bad things happen. And yes, this person thought they did much better on step 2 until they got their score back.

 

[tfom08]

I know someone who waited to submit their scores in hopes step 2 was better. Long story, but step 2 was actually worse (not passing) making the app look much worse. Not trying to hurt the ego and ruin the optimistic attitudes, but bad things happen. And yes, this person thought they did much better on step 2 until they got their score back.

Great point that I hadn't even considered. If you don't submit before Step 2 is released, you won't be able to choose whether to include it or not (it will be automatically included). Maybe if you decide to wait to submit for step 2 to come out, you can go ahead and submit your application a day or two prior to the release of scores and then release your step 2 after you make sure it is going to help you. That way it would be basically at the same time. I guess if you got rejected in the couple of days between submitting your app and releasing your step 2, that would be the only risk.

 

[Tsutsugamushi]

I recently took step 2 in August and was wondering whether I should have NBME release my scores automatically or if I should wait to see my score first before having it released? Thanks in advance.

 

[tfom08]

I recently took step 2 in August and was wondering whether I should have NBME release my scores automatically or if I should wait to see my score first before having it released? Thanks in advance.

I don't see the downside of waiting to see it first. Maybe it will take a day or two longer to reach your ERAS, but that's the worst that can happen. If you somehow scored much lower you will be glad you waited to look at it first.

 

[FreakofMeds]

I don't see the downside of waiting to see it first. Maybe it will take a day or two longer to reach your ERAS, but that's the worst that can happen. If you somehow scored much lower you will be glad you waited to look at it first.

Yes, but wouldn't that force you to manually update each program with your new score? Besides won't the programs want to look at your scores any way by the time you interview (that is if they offer an interview based on one score) or at most by the time they rank you?

I actually don't see the downside to letting ERAS update them automatically. Might look for a second opinion here.

 

[tfom08]

Yes, but wouldn't that force you to manually update each program with your new score? Besides won't the programs want to look at your scores any way by the time you interview (that is if they offer an interview based on one score) or at most by the time they rank you?

I actually don't see the downside to letting ERAS update them automatically. Might look for a second opinion here.

I don't think you will have to upload the scores at each program, USMLE will send them to all your programs once you release them.

Many people do not take Step 2 until after interviewing (or even after the match) so programs will likely never know you are holding your score if that's what you decide to do.

The downside to letting ERAS update your scores automatically is that if you do worse than you did on step 1, the programs will know about it.

 

[bachi]

a quick question: i took my ck in aug and i recieved my score and have ERAS auto update. on CAF, it still says awaiting result. its been >2months since i took ck. any idea how long it usually takes for ck to be submitted to eras?

 

[NotAProgDirector]

a quick question: i took my ck in aug and i recieved my score and have ERAS auto update. on CAF, it still says awaiting result. its been >2months since i took ck. any idea how long it usually takes for ck to be submitted to eras?

The CAF is not updated. Your ERAS transcript is. You should see a new download date for your ERAS transcript. Programs will see your CK score and ignore the "awaiting result" entry in the CAF.

 

[PirateHotel]

My USMLE Transcript has been updated on ERAS (ADTS) literally 5 times since midnight.

Has this occurred to anyone else? explanation?

 

[bachi]

when did you take your ck? its been 2mo and mine's still not updated in ADTS!

 

[PirateHotel]

when did you take your ck? its been 2mo and mine's still not updated in ADTS!

Mid-September. Call them and find out what the story is.

 

[NotAProgDirector]

My USMLE Transcript has been updated on ERAS (ADTS) literally 5 times since midnight.

Has this occurred to anyone else? explanation?

This happens all the time, and no one knows why. Do not worry about it.

 

[CrescentWrench]

Had mine set to automatically release. Ended up dropping a bit from from 240/99 to 234/97 . Kinda freaking out a little now since I haven't gotten any more invites since scores came out... NBD though right?

 

[Ariee]

CrescentWrenchHad mine set to automatically release. Ended up dropping a bit from from 240/99 to 234/97 . Kinda freaking out a little now since I haven't gotten any more invites since scores came out... NBD though right?

I think those are superb scores. Don't freak out! You'll be fine!
BTW, apd- thanks for the great responses. Explanation on application becoming inactive, etc, was a huge mystery until clarified. Silly how the process is a mystery, huh...