Wow Westrern University really is this much?!

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evenstar7139

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$260k for the full 4 years (in addition to the 80k or so spent doing undergrad). Wow...$340k?

How many decades would THAT take to pay off? How much do you think one would pay a month on that? Or does it vary? If it varies...can you give me an average or at least an example?
 
sad to say but yes it is reallllly that much.....plan on paying back school loans until the day you die
 
Western is the newest vet school in the U.S., and they do things a bit differently there. The curriculum is completely PBL based, and classes are selected based largely on diversity with a greater lenience towards 'not-so-stellar' stats. That is, they look for well-rounded applicants and are more forgiving to deficiency in any one area (i.e. a lower GPA). Also, they have no IS/OOS distinction - all applicants are considered equally. But, all applicants pay the same tuition, which, as you discovered, is a bit pricey.

Therefore, Western has its merits. If the cost is a bit much for you, then don't apply there. It's not really any more costly than out of state tuition at, say, UPenn.

As far as your questions about the overall costs of school and the amount of time needed to pay back loans, you should try out the forum's search function - do some hard research on a subject before deciding if it's worth posting a new thread about it. 🙂

Also, 80k in undergrad debt is a lot. Anyone else have that much?
 
I know I need to search better. I'm sorry >.< I get in a rush.
 
As far as your questions about the overall costs of school and the amount of time needed to pay back loans, you should try out the forum's search function - do some hard research on a subject before deciding if it's worth posting a new thread about it.

No rush here - the forum isn't going anywhere. You can't plan your life out in a week. :d

👍👍👍👍
 
I have friends who recently purchased a house -- they tell me I'm investing in education and they invested in a house. They will be paying it off for about 30 years and so will we. At least we'll like getting up in the morning to go to work! That's big!
 
:hello:


My UG was ~$40K a year... ohhhh the things I would do differently if I could do it all over... live and learn? :shrug:

Mine too. 🙁 I came out of undergrad in debt, got further in debt in grad school and will be deeper in debt when I get out of vet school... So far I've been accepted to upenn oos and my instate is tufts so... Yeah. Goodbye money!
 
If everyone doesnt mind me asking...how did you guys spend so much in undergrad did you guys to to high ranking/ivy league? Only reason why Im asking this is because I go to one of the most expensive schools in my area, Virginia Commonwealth University for undergrad and we are always complaining about it being so expensive. But I came out with like less than 30k in debt. Could it be where you live or something because Im sure most of you guys are science majors like myself...damn those...forever standing lab feels.
 
I dunno about you all, but my undergrad education isn't worth $80k...

Tuition-wise, my undergrad cost $30k (6 years). Luckily, I got a free ride between various scholarships, grants, etc. I'm figuring on $80k in debt for vet school, because there's no way I can afford out of state tuition, so I'll have to attend a contract school.
 
My total undergrad cost me $50K. I am expecting at least an additional 100K to 150K from vet school since I am OOS. OH well, I knew what I was facing going into this and I always believe things work out in the end and that worrying is only beneficial for stomach ulcers. 🙂
 
Mine too. 🙁 I came out of undergrad in debt, got further in debt in grad school and will be deeper in debt when I get out of vet school... So far I've been accepted to upenn oos and my instate is tufts so... Yeah. Goodbye money!

Yep, I also have debt from a year in a master's program that I didn't finish. So I'm going into vet school already $100K+ in debt... bad news bears. And THIS is why I (probably) can't go to Penn. 🙁 🙁 🙁

To answer OtakuVet... I did not go an Ivy League for undergrad, but I did go to a prestigious private liberal arts school (Vassar... although not everyone even knows what that is when I say it, ironic? :laugh:). I'm still trying to decide if my education there was worth the price tag... I had a wonderful experience and it was definitely the best 4 years of my life, and I'm also inclined to believe that it helped me get into vet school on my first try. The year I spent in that master's program was, however, at an Ivy (Penn)... not so sure that year was worth the money spent there, even if I had finished the degree in the end. Oh well, like I said... live and learn. 😳
 
Yep, I also have debt from a year in a master's program that I didn't finish. So I'm going into vet school already $100K+ in debt... bad news bears. And THIS is why I (probably) can't go to Penn. 🙁 🙁 🙁

To answer OtakuVet... I did not go an Ivy League for undergrad, but I did go to a prestigious private liberal arts school (Vassar... although not everyone even knows what that is when I say it, ironic? :laugh:). I'm still trying to decide if my education there was worth the price tag... I had a wonderful experience and it was definitely the best 4 years of my life, and I'm also inclined to believe that it helped me get into vet school on my first try. The year I spent in that master's program was, however, at an Ivy (Penn)... not so sure that year was worth the money spent there, even if I had finished the degree in the end. Oh well, like I said... live and learn. 😳

Well you're certainally helping me learn! And I thank you for it!
 
Well you're certainally helping me learn! And I thank you for it!

Yes, the one thing I will put out there is GO AS CHEAP AS YOU CAN while still getting a quality education - at least that's my opinion, given my background and current debt hole. Save the big loans for vet school. Although my BA is from Vassar, it's in psychology, and I did ALL of my vet school pre-reqs at a small PA state school which costs me about $2500 a semester. That's $5K a year, compared to $40K... I feel like I'm robbing someone, but I don't feel that the education I've gotten here has been inferior in any way. Small classes, great profs, great facilities - and I've been accepted to 3 schools so far despite the fact that NONE of my pre-reqs were taken at Vassar.
 
That's totally sweet! I'm proud of you and I don't even know you xD
 
I went to a small, private Christian school, and thanks to scholarships, I paid about 13K a year. My parents are generously helping me pay, so I just have to focus on paying off vet school, which is so generous.
I enjoyed my time at that school, its science department was teeny tiny, but with EXCELLENT profs who gave me a GREAT education and I really got to know them very well, and my academic advisor (who was also my professor for Organic, biochem., and chem.) gave me an excellent recommendation which I am positive helped me get into vet school. 😀
However, I am going to a community college to finish one pre-req, and it is really nice. Looking back, I think if I had known it was that nice, I would have considered going there. 😕

Oh well, with age comes maturity about money matters
 
If everyone doesnt mind me asking...how did you guys spend so much in undergrad did you guys to to high ranking/ivy league? Only reason why Im asking this is because I go to one of the most expensive schools in my area, Virginia Commonwealth University for undergrad and we are always complaining about it being so expensive. But I came out with like less than 30k in debt. Could it be where you live or something because Im sure most of you guys are science majors like myself...damn those...forever standing lab feels.

Off hand, I can think of at least 10 schools in Virginia that cost more than VCU! If I'm not mistaken, even UVA costs more. University of Richmond is also more, I'm sure.

Public schools are (in general, and without taking into account financial aid-just looking at straight tuition) cheaper than private, regardless of ranking. Private college tuition is generally in the 35-45k range per year. Cost also doesn't often correlate with quality - UNC is one of the top schools in the nation, but is also very inexpensive for in-state students. I can also think of tons of private, liberal arts colleges that are expensive, but aren't highly ranked (for whatever that's worth!)
 
I went to the number 6 public university in the country, Binghamton, and with ZERO financial aid, I paid around $14k a year for tuition and room and board, and whn I moved off campus, I paid $7k a year for tuition. My parents paid for all of it so I am coming out of a great university with zero debt. I might have regretted this if schools were not interested in me, but I have been invited to 9 interviews and been accepted at 2 places, so really, if the quality of education is high, and you don't have to a pay alot, DO IT. As long at the quality is there (and vet schools recognize that quality), I don't believe it is worth it to be so in debt for undergrad.
 
Sadly, when I was applying to college, no school really gave me too much financial aid. My state schools( Binghamton, Buffalo, etc.) actually turned out to cost me more than a private institution with everything factored in. My father was a machinist at Chrysler and my mother was a school teacher, so we didn't have that much money(even though we live comfortably)...and most of my college savings were lost after the financial events after 9/11. Anyway, even after taking two years off to help my family financially( working odd jobs/ getting actual medical and veterinary experience that would set me up later on) I am completing my degree at a small engineering college. Most of my loans are pretty much in my name, although my parents cosigned for a couple. I have about 50K in undergrad loans and, let me tell you, it scares the heck out of me. Personally, I don't think I received a great education, although my college is ranked pretty well. Yes, education costs more than most people want to admit or realize. It is a scary situation for a lot of us. Taking on that large amount of debt with western or another institution is a personal choice, but is a choice we all have to make. Some of us could pay for college easily, some of us couldn't. That directly relates to the number and type of schools we apply to...it even relates to our potential career choices to some degree. Personally, I would not be able to afford western, and even OOS tuition at other schools makes me cringe. Personally, 300K+ would not be worth it to me, but there are others that have taken on that responsibility. Western is a great choice for some, if you can afford it. If you haven't applied this year, I wouldn't let the finances deter you too much from just applying, especially if you could afford the travel for an interview. Apply, see where you get in, and make the best choices personally...even if that includes greatly considering the financial responsibilities associated with each school. Vet schools may award you some financial aid, which may help with your decision. Also, there are scholarships that you can apply for when in school that may take some burdens off. Very long story shot: yes, most of us have large amounts of debt from undergrad, and this debt will shape a lot of the decisions we make.
 
If everyone doesnt mind me asking...how did you guys spend so much in undergrad did you guys to to high ranking/ivy league? Only reason why Im asking this is because I go to one of the most expensive schools in my area, Virginia Commonwealth University for undergrad and we are always complaining about it being so expensive. But I came out with like less than 30k in debt. Could it be where you live or something because Im sure most of you guys are science majors like myself...damn those...forever standing lab feels.

I'm down at W&M!! I like finding people in VA. I'm not sure how our tuitions compare, though, as I am one of the ridiculously lucky people (only child) whose parents paid for undergrad.
 
I'm down at W&M!! I like finding people in VA. I'm not sure how our tuitions compare, though, as I am one of the ridiculously lucky people (only child) whose parents paid for undergrad.

I LIVE in Richmond 😀. Waaaaaaaaay back when i got accepted to W&M, i thought it was very reasonable. VCU doesn't seem too terribly expensive either, compared to UVA, or certainly some of the private schools, like Univ of Richmond which is right here.

Anyway, to the OP, there are a ton of old threads on this topic and even a calculator you can use to figure out your payments after you graduate. Anything you can do to minimize your debt coming out of undergrad, I would try and do. Like, for starters, graduating in 4 years instead of the common 5 or more. I also took summer classes at a community college and transferred them in since I ended up at a private college.
 
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$260k for the full 4 years (in addition to the 80k or so spent doing undergrad). Wow...$340k?

How many decades would THAT take to pay off? How much do you think one would pay a month on that? Or does it vary? If it varies...can you give me an average or at least an example?

Where did you get 260k from?
 
Agreed, Jochebed. I have modest student loans from undergrad (~12K) since I got a decent number of scholarships and since I went in state, I'll be around 125-130K when I graduate. My husband is finishing his MBA program in the spring and he has not yet gotten a job interview. As you might imagine, this is stressing us out quite a bit and if we had racked up a bunch of credit card debt and so on, not to mention doubling the amount of financial aid I would have needed, it would be pretty ugly. People will do what they want, but I'd prefer sitting on some acreage with my dogs and other animals rather than stressing about a payment double many people's mortgages. 🙂
 
I don't think a 10yr repayment plan on that amount of debt is feasible based on probable income out of school. Perhaps 20years...or more.
 
Where did you get 260k from?

I think they're referring to this chart: http://www.westernu.edu/xp/edu/financial/financial-budgets-veterinary.xml

Interesting how they're not even predicting any annual % tuition increase, or increase in COL/room and board. Not quite sure why "transportation" costs are $8K in years 3 and 4--I guess traveling to the actual hospital(s) since they're not directly on the campus? Perhaps a current Westerner can enlighten us.

Regardless....unfreakingbelievable...

btw, K-State tuition alone is now $40K for out of state students. Cost of living is definitely lower here, however.

This whole thing is just pathetic. The more I'm around it, the more it seems like such a scam to be going into veterinary medicine right now...
 
This whole thing is just pathetic. The more I'm around it, the more it seems like such a scam to be going into veterinary medicine right now...

I'd rather be going into vet med than human med right now. At least the gov't isn't trying regulate our entire system and therefore, our ability for future earnings.......yet. Of course, all of the doctor's who were making 300k a year and willing to spend whatever it took on Fuzzball, will now be affected, make drastically less, thus affecting vets....so, i guess it will all roll down hill. 🙄
 
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But what if Western or some other OOS is the only school you get into? Do you decline it and wait another year just so you can get into your instate or move to be instate somewhere. A lot of people don't have the luxury of choosing which school to attend and I'm at the point where I will go wherever they accept me. I know finances are important but I'm not going to let that stop me from achieving my dream.
 
But what if Western or some other OOS is the only school you get into? Do you decline it and wait another year just so you can get into your instate or move to be instate somewhere. A lot of people don't have the luxury of choosing which school to attend and I'm at the point where I will go wherever they accept me. I know finances are important but I'm not going to let that stop me from achieving my dream.

On the other hand, probably even more people don't have the luxury of taking on that much debt. Is inconveniencing your life and moving somewhere for a year and earning money worth 100-150K, especially if you're just graduating undergrad, not married, no kids, and not a non-trad student? In my opinion and talking with other recent grads, YES. And is your goal to go to a specific school or just get in wherever will take you?

My money saving but dream achieving plan would be either:

1) move there and work there for X number of years (sometimes 1, sometimes 2 years) and get in state tuition. Besides, if you are that desperate, getting a vet related job and earning some money would only help your chances
2) apply to places like Mizzou where you can get in state after 1 year
3) go to your in state or contract school but do summers or externships at your dream school with the glitzy awesome program you drool over in your sleep
 
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But what if Western or some other OOS is the only school you get into? Do you decline it and wait another year just so you can get into your instate or move to be instate somewhere. A lot of people don't have the luxury of choosing which school to attend and I'm at the point where I will go wherever they accept me. I know finances are important but I'm not going to let that stop me from achieving my dream.

...and this is why it is starting to be such a scam.

I know--I'm with you--it took me four tries over seven years to get into vet school. And I'm going out of state because it's where I finally got in.

This is where the schools really have you over a barrel: the demand (applicants) will always far, far exceed the supply (number of seats). There are ALWAYS going to be people who "want to be a vet no matter what, I won't give up on my dream for something as stupid as money, etc etc." ALWAYS. So, there's no real pressure on them to solve these problems.

(As an aside, I don't necessarily blame the schools for raising tuition--they're under a lot of financial pressure from many different places and their state funding is being cut or is nonexistent to start with. However, I think there are many, many things they can be doing to maximize their new graduates' productivity from the very beginning--instead of leaving a great deal of their training to their first employer(s) and waiting 1+ years before new grads are able to turn a profit for their boss/make any kind of money towards starting to repay loans. Moving away from the research model would be a start; limited licensure is one extreme option. But I digress.)

Simple cause and effect means that, as this absolutely CRIPPLING (Jochebed is right on target) financial SUICIDE starts to really affect people--the smartest people are those who will turn away from veterinary medicine. We are already losing very bbright and capable applicants to other fields simply because they do a simple cost:benefit analysis and sadly have to turn away from vet med. I know everyone here is of the mindset of, "good, that makes me a more competitive applicant," but that's really very shortsighted. We will be losing the best and the brightest to other professions. How many physicians, attorneys and dentists do you know who have to drive 20-year old cars and live in studio apartments when they're 40 and still working 60-hour weeks? I see veterinary medicine as eventually becoming a career choice only for the wealthy elite--and that would be so terrible for the profession in so many ways.

The other thing is that veterinary medicine is increasingly a second career for many people. There are more and more non-traditionals in our classes every year, whether by choice or because it took so damn long to get in.

I'm not one to talk, because I was bound and determined to get in no matter what because this is my lifelong passion, etc etc--but I will tell you that when you're 30 years old and in your third year of vet school and you're taking out $60K a year and seeing your potential retirement dwindle away at the end of your life--it really makes you wonder if you should have made this decision.

Again, it's difficult to appreciate from the perspective of a pre-vet student--but these are very real issues.
 
I'm not one to talk, because I was bound and determined to get in no matter what because this is my lifelong passion, etc etc--but I will tell you that when you're 30 years old and in your third year of vet school and you're taking out $60K a year and seeing your potential retirement dwindle away at the end of your life--it really makes you wonder if you should have made this decision.

Again, it's difficult to appreciate from the perspective of a pre-vet student--but these are very real issues.

Agreed. I think it's kind of funny that the late 20s, early 30s third years have a different perspective on this, because when you're a pre-vet, you want nothing more than to just start school and think that everything will work itself out. But eventually, one does want to be moderately comfortable. Having double the student debt is certainly going to make that much more challenging.
 
This thread has had a significant impact on my thinking-thank you for starting and contributing your thoughts to it. While watching the economy crumble and preparing vet school applications, I struggled with the excitement of finally initiating steps to pursue this career and the apparent stupidity of throwing a respectable career away, taking on massive debt, and the reality of coming out four years later to earn a modest salary. I would love the opportunity to practice veterinary medicine; this for me would be a means to earn a living doing something that I would feel passionate about. However, with that kind of suffocating debt I'm not so sure it would leave a whole lot to enjoy life beyond work with. I'm finally seeing the picture here. Out of state schools are completely out of the question for me now. Hopefully I'll be lucky enough to get a place at my instate school.
 
When my father started medical school (UNC as an in state-student) in 1968, his tuition was $50/semester.

In today's dollars, that is $308.24...at least according to the below financial calculator.

http://data.bls.gov/cgi-bin/cpicalc.pl

I'm curious to know what, exactly, has changed. More researchers? Higher salaries for administrators? Less state support?

Why has the cost of professional school increased dramatically when compared to the overall cost of living?

To compare apples to apples (same state, another heavily state-supported public university), tuition for veterinary school at NCSU is $10,649 for the year. That is a huge increase above the changes in cost of living that have occurred since then.

And it isn't just professional school! While in undergrad (private liberal arts college, 4 years only!), my tuition increased by an inordinate amount.

WTF is going on?
 
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I'm curious to know what, exactly, has changed. More researchers? Higher salaries for administrators? Less state support?


I know that at least in California the UC schools have lost a great deal of funding because of the state budget crisis which has made them increase tuition by ~20% in the last couple of years. At Ohio we were told that it actually costs ~70,000 per year to teach a vet student and in state tuition is no where near that, therefore the state is actually subsidizing part of our education. The reason out of staters pay so much is because they haven't paid into the state taxes so they can't yet benefit from them. At least that was my understanding of the situation, maybe one of my classmates can explain it better.
 
That makes sense. I was reading something along those lines on Cal Poly Pomona's website. In fact...Western had something like that on their site too. They were saying their tuition is outrageous because they don't get any state funds. And they were even saying with their crazy high tution it only covered like 85% of the cost to teach a student. Something like that.
 
I know that at least in California the UC schools have lost a great deal of funding because of the state budget crisis which has made them increase tuition by ~20% in the last couple of years. At Ohio we were told that it actually costs ~70,000 per year to teach a vet student and in state tuition is no where near that, therefore the state is actually subsidizing part of our education. The reason out of staters pay so much is because they haven't paid into the state taxes so they can't yet benefit from them. At least that was my understanding of the situation, maybe one of my classmates can explain it better.

Yep, I get that. But I doubt the state provided much more support in the 1960s than they do now. 😕 And that still doesn't explain why my tuition in undergrad went up by $7,000-$10,000 in 4 years...a non-research, liberal arts private college (read: no state funding) in the middle of nowhere, that had a very healthy endowment, including 2 people who donated $100 million dollars each in the 4 years I was there.

Something is broken.
 
Yep, I get that. But I doubt the state provided much more support in the 1960s than they do now. 😕 And that still doesn't explain why my tuition in undergrad went up by $7,000-$10,000 in 4 years...a non-research, liberal arts private college (read: no state funding) in the middle of nowhere, that had a very healthy endowment, including 2 people who donated $100 million dollars each in the 4 years I was there.

Something is broken.

Actually, there was a lot more funding on federal and state levels for education from WWII through the 1960's. It started with commitment to veterans and spread out to a belief that everyone should be able to obtain a reasonable education, apparently in the late 60's, early 70's that started to crumble. I can't really remember where I read up on all this, but it was in a social sciences book... it may have been about 'boomeranging' kids. Also, there were not nearly as many technological costs, which are a large part of what is driving school costs up on every level. The infrastructure to provide adequate internet access, in class technology, modern computers and equipment is skyrocketing costs, not to mention increasing liability (remember folks sued MIT when a drunk student fell from a frat balcony), increasing need for security, data protection, fuel/energy costs, and costs for admin and such. Also, when schools get major donations, they are put into endowment to smooth costs over time.

Not saying that I don't agree it is a massive problem; I wish we were on the model so many other countries are; social healthcare and education that really is available for all.
 
What do you do when your IS is almost as expensive as OOS?

IS tuition for me is a bit over 36K and it's only going up.

If I choose to move to get residency in another state with a vet school then I'd have to live there at minimum 1 yr, be independent from my parents (I'm not 😉), not be enrolled in classes, find employment in a down economy, and start paying my undergrad loans. Never mind the fact that I would have to pay to reapply to vet schools.

Kind of a Catch-22 for some people is all I'm trying to say. It is a bit sickening when you think of the money that you will be spending. But, che sara sara

Applying for vet school certainly isn't for the poor. 🙁👎 Even undergrad, some of it came down to who gave me the best financial aid package.
 
What do you do when your IS is almost as expensive as OOS?

From one former Mass-hole to another....

You go to tufts and stop complaining about it.
You go out of state, pay the big bucks.
You move somewhere and take a year off then apply as an in-state student there.
You go to an out of state school that allows you to get in-state tuition for years 2-4.

Its a crappy situation. You need to look at it on the bright side though. If you had a cheap in-state school, then you might keep applying there saying all out of state options are too expensive. But since tufts is Massachusetts expensive, you can apply to every OOS without regret because it would cost you basically the same to go as staying in-state!👍👍


Personally I only applied to out of state schools(wanted some variety from new england) and ended up at a school where I can get in-state tuition for year 2 on. And whats it going to cost me? ~$190 grand(if tuition doesnt go up too much! ha!)
 
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What do you do when your IS is almost as expensive as OOS?

IS tuition for me is a bit over 36K and it's only going up.

If I choose to move to get residency in another state with a vet school then I'd have to live there at minimum 1 yr, be independent from my parents (I'm not 😉), not be enrolled in classes, find employment in a down economy, and start paying my undergrad loans. Never mind the fact that I would have to pay to reapply to vet schools.

Kind of a Catch-22 for some people is all I'm trying to say. It is a bit sickening when you think of the money that you will be spending. But, che sara sara

Applying for vet school certainly isn't for the poor. 🙁👎 Even undergrad, some of it came down to who gave me the best financial aid package.

Aww that sucks. 🙁 I hope things work out.
 
Que sara, sara. :d

I'm Italian so it's che sarà, sarà 😀


David594 - I wasn't naming schools but I guess Tufts' price was hard to hide. Nice to see another Mass-hole on here. 😉 I don't care that much that Tufts is expensive mostly because of the reasoning that I will be able to make my choice for schools based a little bit less off of the cost factor. What's an extra 8 or 10 K a year between friends? It's going to cost no matter what I do. The schools I applied to don't allow residency changes.

I'm finishing my undergrad at UMass and got some amazing financial aid so my loans are pretty minimal now and I still had a great education.

Please, don't anyone get me wrong, I'm not complaining. I'm just saying as we talk about cost that for some of us we don't have a comfy IS tuition option and since I already spent the money applying, if I get in somewhere, OOS, IS, where ever, I'm going.
 
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I did Half a degree at umass and my roomate here also went there. And I know there is atleast 1(possibly 2) umass people in the incoming class here.
 
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