Wreb exam is the most inhuman, unfair exam in the world

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End to wreb

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The worst experience in my life was the wreb exam. Patients are treated as giny pigs!! The exam is unfair, inhumane and subjective!! Who ever has more money can buy better patients and dental assistants!!! Infection control is at it's minimal. Exam settings, examiners and patients are different in USA!! Luck plays an important role! This exam doesn't make any sense! What is the purpose of this exam? How would Having patients with open mouth and rubber dam waiting in the grading area for an hour make any sense? Why has this exam not been eliminated till now! I am going to sue WREB. Who is with me? It's time to say enough is enough! No more of our time and money should be wasted on this inhumane exam! People are making business out of this exam by selling patients!!! The slavery era is gone!! Let's all stand up together!
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It does seem like the WREB exam is not going to last forever. There are many objections to it, and there is definitely a growing consensus that it is mostly useless and unethical. Having recently assisted it, and preparing to take it myself, it is hard to see what exactly its purpose is (aside from wasting money)
 
ncide said:
ADA Board of Trustees votes to create national dental licensure exam
Competency test averts potential ethical issues involved in the use of patients

ADA Board of Trustees votes to create national dental licensure exam

This licensure exam is planned to be implemented in 2020.
Click to expand...

I love it!

However, it says:


Dr. Roberts said the DLOSCE is simply a new option for state dental boards to consider.

"This is another way to test competency," he said. "Another tool in their toolbox."

There are already several forward-thinking ways to assess competency that have not been adopted by the majority state dental boards (such as licensure by AEGD, which is accepted by NY, CT, CA, and a few others). I really hope that this national licensure exam is accepted by the state dental boards.
 
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End to wreb said:
The worst experience in my life was the wreb exam. Patients are treated as giny pigs!! The exam is unfair, inhumane and subjective!! Who ever has more money can buy better patients and dental assistants!!! Infection control is at it's minimal. Exam settings, examiners and patients are different in USA!! Luck plays an important role! This exam doesn't make any sense! What is the purpose of this exam? How would Having patients with open mouth and rubber dam waiting in the grading area for an hour make any sense? Why has this exam not been eliminated till now! I am going to sue WREB. Who is with me? It's time to say enough is enough! No more of our time and money should be wasted on this inhumane exam! People are making business out of this exam by selling patients!!! The slavery era is gone!! Let's all stand up together!
Click to expand...
all joking aside, you never took the old Florida Board.
now there's a doozy for ya...
 
Incis0r said:
I love it!

However, it says:


Dr. Roberts said the DLOSCE is simply a new option for state dental boards to consider.

"This is another way to test competency," he said. "Another tool in their toolbox."

There are already several forward-thinking ways to assess competency that have not been adopted by the majority state dental boards (such as licensure by AEGD, which is accepted by NY, CT, CA, and a few others). I really hope that this national licensure exam is accepted by the state dental boards.
Click to expand...
I see what you are saying, but I really think this will be a completely different case entirely. I was on the ASDA board of trustees when the new L-1 policy was created as well as the White Paper written and we met with the ADA board of trustees to discuss this coming up. My prediction is, in the same way that residency programs jumped on board with requiring the ADAT to be taken for their programs (although a number of them pulled back and just made it optional) just because it was an ADA exam, the state dental boards will jump on board in accepting the DLOSCE. It is the first and only dental licensing exam not only endorsed by the ADA, but created by them. We have already seen it with the sedation guidelines just barely passed at the last ADA annual session making their way into state laws and policies and again in some states with the update to the code of ethics with advertising and practicing outside your specialty. By 2030, I really think that at least 35 if not 40 or more states will accept this as an initial licensure pathway (which is saying something because it has taken 50+ years to get this far), assuming the ADA does their due diligence in developing it, which I believe they will because they have enlisted the help of Dr. Gerrow, the executive director of NDEB of Canada who was a main player in getting the Canadian OSCE to what it is today.
 
End to wreb said:
The worst experience in my life was the wreb exam. Patients are treated as giny pigs!! The exam is unfair, inhumane and subjective!! Who ever has more money can buy better patients and dental assistants!!! Infection control is at it's minimal. Exam settings, examiners and patients are different in USA!! Luck plays an important role! This exam doesn't make any sense! What is the purpose of this exam? How would Having patients with open mouth and rubber dam waiting in the grading area for an hour make any sense? Why has this exam not been eliminated till now! I am going to sue WREB. Who is with me? It's time to say enough is enough! No more of our time and money should be wasted on this inhumane exam! People are making business out of this exam by selling patients!!! The slavery era is gone!! Let's all stand up together!
Click to expand...
I took the Canadian OSCE to be licensed instead because when I learned about these patient-based "human subjects" exams, I was morally opposed to it. I don't condemn anyone for taking it because I don't like to sit on a moral high horse and because I know the law in most states require it, but when Colorado opened up the option to take a patient-less exam instead (of which I had a small role in), I jumped in with both feet and haven't looked back. The time will come. The ADA's DLOSCE is hopefully going to change things up.
 
cooliyak said:
I see what you are saying, but I really think this will be a completely different case entirely. I was on the ASDA board of trustees when the new L-1 policy was created as well as the White Paper written and we met with the ADA board of trustees to discuss this coming up. My prediction is, in the same way that residency programs jumped on board with requiring the ADAT to be taken for their programs (although a number of them pulled back and just made it optional) just because it was an ADA exam, the state dental boards will jump on board in accepting the DLOSCE. It is the first and only dental licensing exam not only endorsed by the ADA, but created by them. We have already seen it with the sedation guidelines just barely passed at the last ADA annual session making their way into state laws and policies and again in some states with the update to the code of ethics with advertising and practicing outside your specialty. By 2030, I really think that at least 35 if not 40 or more states will accept this as an initial licensure pathway (which is saying something because it has taken 50+ years to get this far), assuming the ADA does their due diligence in developing it, which I believe they will because they have enlisted the help of Dr. Gerrow, the executive director of NDEB of Canada who was a main player in getting the Canadian OSCE to what it is today.
Click to expand...

You are amazing. Thank you for being so involved and for explaining this so well here 🙂

I'm hoping to follow the lead of people like you and get involved with these issues in dental school as well.
 
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I failed the operative part with 2.91. Six others failed with me too!! We all failed from the finishing and polishing part!! LOL
I am sure that one of the graders was obsessive about polishing. The exam is very subjective and unfair.It totally depends on the graders and luck. A week after my exam, UCLA held WREB and the lights and air went off in the middle of the exam!!! LOL most people didn't finish their treatment and they brought their patients the day after the exam. WREB passed most of them so they would stay quiet and not complain. As for me I have to buy a human being aka patient and take him or her to another state to take this inhumane exam. I have no other options than taking this exam, I have half million dollar loan and I have to start working as soon as possible. And I have no idea what will happen this time in the unjust exam area !!! Something always happens in these kind of stressful and unorganized exams.
The day of my exam there was so many mixed ups!! My x-rays got mixed with another patient. I started the exam at 11:00am instead of 8:00am, examiners mixed up my x-rays and didn't take any responsibility. A patient had a medical problem and fainted in the grading area. The student was crying for her patient that had fainted. My poor patient with an open mouth and rubber dam had to wait exactly for an hour and a half to be graded because of the emergency and also the graders having lunch. People from WREB should be sued for tearing patients like this. Making our patients to suffer is a criminal act!!!! Why on earth did my patient have to open her mouth for an hour to be graded???? While the graders were having lunch. My patient didn't eat for hours, she was hungry too!!!Who could believe that in year 2017 I bought a human for $200. My patient was crying and the examiners were having lunch and taking their time. Lets stop this inhumane exam. Our patients should not suffer and we are not a money making machine for WREB people.
Who ever is willing to stop this exam today come and stand by me. If we all utilize we can put an end on, torturing human beings for getting our dental license. We all have been in school for many years and we have been trained in the best schools in the world. If USA believes that the dental schools are efficient, why should we take this exam??? How does this exam help the dental education in USA? Lets show for once that we care and we can change something that is very wrong!!!
 
End to wreb said:
I failed the operative part with 2.91. Six others failed with me too!! We all failed from the finishing and polishing part!! LOL
I am sure that one of the graders was obsessive about polishing. The exam is very subjective and unfair.It totally depends on the graders and luck. A week after my exam, UCLA held WREB and the lights and air went off in the middle of the exam!!! LOL most people didn't finish their treatment and they brought their patients the day after the exam. WREB passed most of them so they would stay quiet and not complain. As for me I have to buy a human being aka patient and take him or her to another state to take this inhumane exam. I have no other options than taking this exam, I have half million dollar loan and I have to start working as soon as possible. And I have no idea what will happen this time in the unjust exam area !!! Something always happens in these kind of stressful and unorganized exams.
The day of my exam there was so many mixed ups!! My x-rays got mixed with another patient. I started the exam at 11:00am instead of 8:00am, examiners mixed up my x-rays and didn't take any responsibility. A patient had a medical problem and fainted in the grading area. The student was crying for her patient that had fainted. My poor patient with an open mouth and rubber dam had to wait exactly for an hour and a half to be graded because of the emergency and also the graders having lunch. People from WREB should be sued for tearing patients like this. Making our patients to suffer is a criminal act!!!! Why on earth did my patient have to open her mouth for an hour to be graded???? While the graders were having lunch. My patient didn't eat for hours, she was hungry too!!!Who could believe that in year 2017 I bought a human for $200. My patient was crying and the examiners were having lunch and taking their time. Lets stop this inhumane exam. Our patients should not suffer and we are not a money making machine for WREB people.
Who ever is willing to stop this exam today come and stand by me. If we all utilize we can put an end on, torturing human beings for getting our dental license. We all have been in school for many years and we have been trained in the best schools in the world. If USA believes that the dental schools are efficient, why should we take this exam??? How does this exam help the dental education in USA? Lets show for once that we care and we can change something that is very wrong!!!
Click to expand...
If you want to be taken seriously drop the hyperbole and irrelevant nonsense.
 
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End to wreb said:
I failed the operative part with 2.91. Six others failed with me too!! We all failed from the finishing and polishing part!! LOL
I am sure that one of the graders was obsessive about polishing. The exam is very subjective and unfair.It totally depends on the graders and luck. A week after my exam, UCLA held WREB and the lights and air went off in the middle of the exam!!! LOL most people didn't finish their treatment and they brought their patients the day after the exam. WREB passed most of them so they would stay quiet and not complain. As for me I have to buy a human being aka patient and take him or her to another state to take this inhumane exam. I have no other options than taking this exam, I have half million dollar loan and I have to start working as soon as possible. And I have no idea what will happen this time in the unjust exam area !!! Something always happens in these kind of stressful and unorganized exams.
The day of my exam there was so many mixed ups!! My x-rays got mixed with another patient. I started the exam at 11:00am instead of 8:00am, examiners mixed up my x-rays and didn't take any responsibility. A patient had a medical problem and fainted in the grading area. The student was crying for her patient that had fainted. My poor patient with an open mouth and rubber dam had to wait exactly for an hour and a half to be graded because of the emergency and also the graders having lunch. People from WREB should be sued for tearing patients like this. Making our patients to suffer is a criminal act!!!! Why on earth did my patient have to open her mouth for an hour to be graded???? While the graders were having lunch. My patient didn't eat for hours, she was hungry too!!!Who could believe that in year 2017 I bought a human for $200. My patient was crying and the examiners were having lunch and taking their time. Lets stop this inhumane exam. Our patients should not suffer and we are not a money making machine for WREB people.
Who ever is willing to stop this exam today come and stand by me. If we all utilize we can put an end on, torturing human beings for getting our dental license. We all have been in school for many years and we have been trained in the best schools in the world. If USA believes that the dental schools are efficient, why should we take this exam??? How does this exam help the dental education in USA? Lets show for once that we care and we can change something that is very wrong!!!
Click to expand...
Are you calling for armed insurrection?! Ammo up!

The hyperbole is strong with you. You make it sound as if these patients arrived to the dental school aboard slave ships. The day I took the NERB it snowed over a foot and one of my patients didn't even show up, let alone call and tell me they weren't coming. Had to pay $900 to take that missed section another day. I definitely wasn't alone in my class. You failed. It sucks. Time to move on.

Big Hoss
 
make.php
 
End to wreb said:
If USA believes that the dental schools are efficient, why should we take this exam??? How does this exam help the dental education in USA? Lets show for once that we care and we can change something that is very wrong!!!
Click to expand...

The exams are needed. Licensure gives more consistency to graduates and confidence to a public that is growing every more skeptical of dentistry because of the internet. Also, there should be an article before USA in the previous sentences 🙂
 
Big Time Hoosier said:
Are you calling for armed insurrection?! Ammo up!

The hyperbole is strong with you. You make it sound as if these patients arrived to the dental school aboard slave ships. The day I took the NERB it snowed over a foot and one of my patients didn't even show up, let alone call and tell me they weren't coming. Had to pay $900 to take that missed section another day. I definitely wasn't alone in my class. You failed. It sucks. Time to move on.

Big Hoss
Click to expand...

you figure that the OP would be mentally strong entering the WREB especially after finishing most of dental school where you would face that dental professor that is super picky on what he wants on the restorations and other stuff to the point it drives you insane. But apparently not, the WREB is the first time OP faced a severe challenge..


side note: I see you're in CA and have Hoosier in your screen name. Hated the blizzards?
 
dmd2021 said:
The exams are needed. Licensure gives more consistency to graduates and confidence to a public that is growing every more skeptical of dentistry because of the internet. Also, there should be an article before USA in the previous sentences 🙂
Click to expand...
Exams are needed, yes, but not these exams. There are better ways to test competence in dentistry. I don't believe the current clinical licensure exams are doing anything except teaching students to "play the game" (not to mention the pressure to over-treat, treat prematurely/out of order, only test a narrow scope of General dentistry, etc). Many students fail due to arbitrary rules or the subjectivity of examiners. There is no proven validity or reliability and the exams that claim it, don't release their data for others to analyze. They are littered with ethical concerns and put both patients and students in difficult situations that do not reflect real life.

Although I do believe the original poster is being a little dramatic, they do have a point. These exams are not ethical and need to go. But all in due time...
 
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All students should be given equal opportunities. With this exam it's mostly about who is better at finding the ways around.
In my opinion, if I need to do class 2, then I need to worry about doing it right and not about if I am going to have a patient, right sized lesion or if my examiner had sex/good sleep the night before
 
dmd2021 said:
The exams are needed. Licensure gives more consistency to graduates and confidence to a public that is growing every more skeptical of dentistry because of the internet. Also, there should be an article before USA in the previous sentences 🙂
Click to expand...
Exams like these are not needed. It defeats the whole purpose of the school accreditation process. Live patients are traded around and bribed. Hard to find procedures are specifically hoarded and held onto for the exams. It completely defies so many ethical principles. The subjectivity of the exams are not an accurate assessment of clinical competence.
 
End to wreb said:
The worst experience in my life was the wreb exam. Patients are treated as giny pigs!! The exam is unfair, inhumane and subjective!! Who ever has more money can buy better patients and dental assistants!!! Infection control is at it's minimal. Exam settings, examiners and patients are different in USA!! Luck plays an important role! This exam doesn't make any sense! What is the purpose of this exam? How would Having patients with open mouth and rubber dam waiting in the grading area for an hour make any sense? Why has this exam not been eliminated till now! I am going to sue WREB. Who is with me? It's time to say enough is enough! No more of our time and money should be wasted on this inhumane exam! People are making business out of this exam by selling patients!!! The slavery era is gone!! Let's all stand up together!
Click to expand...

I have taken both WREB and CDCA, and I can tell you the CDCA exam is 10 times worse. They falsify their reports to fail more candidates. they act with total impunity and their senior management just covers up for them. I contacted them and told them I have evidence that their examiners have committed fraud. Their reaction was to end the conversation. The CDCA people haven't yet been introduced to the notion of honor. The least I can say about them, because this is a respectable forum, is that they have no honor.
 
dmd2021 said:
The exams are needed. Licensure gives more consistency to graduates and confidence to a public that is growing every more skeptical of dentistry because of the internet. Also, there should be an article before USA in the previous sentences 🙂
Click to expand...

I think the public is more skeptical of dentists because of the same practices these exams employ, like cheating, committing fraud and falsifying their records.
 
98E89942-D69C-4B95-8A6C-1AB0F9592835.gif


@harmeetkau, I think it’s time for you to move on. Just let it go! The day I took the CDCA it snowed over a foot. One of my patients no-showed and I couldn’t find a backup. Lots of my fellow students had no-shows. Did the examiners care? No. Paid my $900 to take that section another day and then I moved on. Do I think these exams are stupid? Yes. But, I think your message has been repeated ad nauseam in numerous threads.

Big Hoss
 
I don't want to sound harsh BUT...

The daily work life of a REAL DENTIST involves adverse circumstances, unpredictable events and working with difficult people.

That is what the board exam is really about! Can you overcome, adapt and succeed in a less then ideal situation? If you cannot think on your feet, under pressure and shrug off the small stuff maybe dentistry isn't for you.
 
Saddleshoes said:
I don't want to sound harsh BUT...

The daily work life of a REAL DENTIST involves adverse circumstances, unpredictable events and working with difficult people.

That is what the board exam is really about! Can you overcome, adapt and succeed in a less then ideal situation? If you cannot think on your feet, under pressure and shrug off the small stuff maybe dentistry isn't for you.
Click to expand...

overcome.jpg


Sorry, I couldn't resist!

But back on topic, accredited dental schools should be able to say that someone is a competent dentist without having them have the entire thing hinge on a class II and a class III. The degree and an OSCE exam should be plenty, and I hope states eventually pick that up.

I do find it interesting that there are really only two professions that have you doing procedures on live patients for a license - dentists...... and beauticians.
 
Vicviper said:
overcome.jpg


Sorry, I couldn't resist!

But back on topic, accredited dental schools should be able to say that someone is a competent dentist without having them have the entire thing hinge on a class II and a class III. The degree and an OSCE exam should be plenty, and I hope states eventually pick that up.

I do find it interesting that there are really only two professions that have you doing procedures on live patients for a license - dentists...... and beauticians.
Click to expand...
Actually, not even beauticians/cosmetologists use live patients (or models as they call them) for licensing anymore. The only state that I could find still using them for the cosmetology licensing exam was Texas. All the rest have switched to mannequins, the most recent being Alaska in 2015-ish I believe. There are still a few exceptions such as those testing to become master estheticians in some states, but I don’t know enough about that to comment further.
 
Big Time Hoosier said:
View attachment 231620

@harmeetkau, I think it’s time for you to move on. Just let it go! The day I took the CDCA it snowed over a foot. One of my patients no-showed and I couldn’t find a backup. Lots of my fellow students had no-shows. Did the examiners care? No. Paid my $900 to take that section another day and then I moved on. Do I think these exams are stupid? Yes. But, I think your message has been repeated ad nauseam in numerous threads.

Big Hoss
Click to expand...

A no-show is one thing, and fraud is another. They falsified their report and I can prove it. I am suing them right after school. My lawyer thinks this could take up to 2 years. I don't think I will be letting go any time soon.
 
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