Yield protection and re applicants

[Marcion]

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Hi all,

So my cycle has not been going great. I applied to 25 schools, have only gotten one interview, and am waiting to hear from 8 still. At this point I have my fingers crossed that the one interview will turn into an acceptance, but I'm trying to keep from getting too optimistic.

I kind of have an unbalanced app that makes me worry I got shafted because of yield protection. I have a 520 MCAT, and 3.89 sGPA from a post-bacc, but my cGPA is a 3.3 as I kind of screwed around in undergrad.

I am worried that my app wasn't good enough for elite schools, but min elite schools may have decided my stats made it unlikely I would attend their school. My question is, when I reapply, will that logic change for them? After all, if I'm reapplying, I obviously must not have gotten into a better school. Is it possible I might have better luck with mid-low tier schools next cycle?

 

[rilte4]

When were your applications marked complete?

 

[Marcion]

End of August/Early Sept.

 

[gyngyn]

A re-application with a high MCAT is its own category of risk.
It is a reasonable assumption that you got interviews and still didn't get in...
Your state school is going to be the best bet.

 

[GrapesofRath]

http://forums.studentdoctor.net/thr...where-do-i-stand.1151274/page-2#post-17344537

I think everything you got in terms of feedback from this thread still stands. You're a Texas resident so the issues of yield protection arent really that relevant as your odds are tied largely to the programs in your state which are mandated to take 90+% of their matriculants from your state.

For OOS, many schools just arent interested in Texas residents regardless. Furthermore, many wont know or put that much weight even if they ask if you're a reapplicant if you arent a reapplicant at their programs specifically. The types of schools that could be most interested in texas residents(the high end ones) your GPA is low for.

So no to answer your question, I dont think what you are hoping for of being a reapplicant and hence "looking less low yield" is going to really be viable or do much for you.

It's a tough situation to give advice to as normally a high sGPA, outstanding MCAT, and good upward trend arent the types of candidates who need SMPs. But in your case, I think if MD is the goal it might be the best thing you can do for yourself if you are confident you can do well in one.

 

[GrapesofRath]

k

 

[gyngyn]

http://forums.studentdoctor.net/thr...where-do-i-stand.1151274/page-2#post-17344537

I think everything you got in terms of feedback from this thread still stands. You're a Texas resident so the issues of yield protection arent really that relevant as your odds are tied largely to the programs in your state which are mandated to take 90+% of their matriculants from your state.

For OOS, many schools just arent interested in Texas residents regardless. Furthermore, many wont know or put that much weight even if they ask in the fact you are a reapplicant if you arent a reapplicant at their programs specifically. The types of schools that could be most interested in texas residents(the high end ones) your GPA is low for.

So no to answer your question, I dont think what you are hoping for of being a reapplicant and hence "looking less low yield" is going to really be viable or do much for you.

It's a tough situation to give advice to as normally a high sGPA, outstanding MCAT, and good upward trend arent the types of candidates who need SMPs. But in your case, I think if MD is the goal it might be the best thing you can do for yourself if you are confident you can do well in one.

I forgot this thread.
TX puts a lot of stock in gpa's.
You are right, "yield protection" is not an issue in TX.
OOS schools will tend to interview only the TX applicants that are likely to be eligible for recruitment scholarships. Sometimes if they attended an OOS private school, they will get an interview at their undergrad.
OP may want to contact his state schools to see what they recommend if he is unsuccessful this cycle.

 

[GrapesofRath]

I forgot this thread.
TX puts a lot of stock in gpa's.

When it's so universal across all the 10+ Texas schools there has to be some reason or study etc behind it. Do you know of any or why all these Texas schools put such an added emphasis on GPA? I dont really buy its just a coincidence that 10+ of the schools in the country that happen to put more weight in GPA than most all happen to reside in the same state.

 

[gyngyn]

When it's so universal across all the 10+ Texas schools there has to be some reason or study etc behind it. Do you know of any or why all these Texas schools put such an added emphasis on GPA? I dont really buy its just a coincidence that 10+ of the schools in the country that happen to put more weight in GPA than most all happen to reside in the same state.

I have observed this behavior over the course of many years. I have no explanation.

 

[starspells]

I feel like TX schools are unable to resist a high MCAT. You got an interview at San Antonio right? I feel like what hurt you is your late application. I mean judging from the few stories I read on SDN there were many kids here who had extremely high MCAT scores and GPA below the TX schools 10th percentile but got several interviews at the TX schools (and they were OOS!!!!!).

I think San Antonio will probably pan out but if it doesn't reapply on day 1 and make sure to get feedback from the schools that rejected you to see where you can improve.

 

[starspells]

TX puts a lot of stock in gpa's.

Are you saying this because you've seen candidates who were high mcat/low gpa rejected more often (versus plenty of high gpa/average or even low mcat accepted)? Not sure if that was coherent or made sense but hopefully you understand what I was asking...

I feel like if most of the TX schools can accept many of these OOS students with low gpas but high mcat they'd definitely be willing to accept a TX resident who was a low gpa/high mcat candidate.

 

[Marcion]

It's a tough situation to give advice to as normally a high sGPA, outstanding MCAT, and good upward trend arent the types of candidates who need SMPs. But in your case, I think if MD is the goal it might be the best thing you can do for yourself if you are confident you can do well in one.

Do I need to have grades posted in the SMP for it to benefit me? Or is the act of applying to an SMP enough of an app-booster? I really don't want to spin my wheels an extra year if I don't have to...

 

[gyngyn]

Are you saying this because you've seen candidates who were high mcat/low gpa rejected more often (versus plenty of high gpa/average or even low mcat accepted)? Not sure if that was coherent or made sense but hopefully you understand what I was asking...

I feel like if most of the TX schools can accept many of these OOS students with low gpas but high mcat they'd definitely be willing to accept a TX resident who was a low gpa/high mcat candidate.

Yes, I have seen this more often than expected in IS TX applicants, both those with high and moderate MCAT scores. TX applicants are a special case since their odds of leaving the state are so small. It is essentially a closed system.
I have no idea how they choose their OOS interviewees, thus no clue whether they are looking for similar or different types of candidate.

 

[GrapesofRath]

Do I need to have grades posted in the SMP for it to benefit me? Or is the act of applying to an SMP enough of an app-booster? I really don't want to spin my wheels an extra year if I don't have to...

There are many people who do SMPs who apply to medical school the same time they are doing an SMP. To have success with this though often entails having borderline stats and where an SMP is moer like a "final nudge to get you to the acceptance". That describes you pretty accurately so yes it is something you could consider.

The only caveat is you are a reapplicant so there is greater burden to show improvement. The schools you reapply to might not be particularly keen to show interest in someone who they rejected last year who now is applying in August just starting an SMP and wont have grades out until Nov/Dec. That said your best bet talking about this stuff is an SMP advisor at a school you would do an SMP at. They can answer your questions fairly well about whether you should wait until the end of hte SMP to apply given you are a reapplicant(my personal guess is you might be fine applying next cycle while doing an SMP).

 

[CowboyNiceguy]

Can people answer this question for a non TX resident? 3.9/37 here, 4 interviews. Final pooled at one, silence at another, one (NYU) has not accepted most of their class yet, and the other hasn't accepted anyone. My applications were top heavy (rankings-wise) but my interviews ranged from rank 14-40 and I was ignored by the lower ranked schools.

If I don't get in this cycle, I'll be volunteering and working full time as a scribe to improve the weakness in that area of my application. But I also wonder if the schools that may have ignored me for yield protection reasons will give me a better look the second time.

 

[bearintraining]

Just to add regarding reapplications & previous waitlists: the schools I had a previous waitlist spot before have essentially ignored me thus far (silence). Something to keep in mind when picking your new list.

 

[starspells]

Yes, I have seen this more often than expected in IS TX applicants, both those with high and moderate MCAT scores. TX applicants are a special case since their odds of leaving the state are so small. It is essentially a closed system.
I have no idea how they choose their OOS interviewees, thus no clue whether they are looking for similar or different types of candidate.

That's interesting because the candidates I'm thinking of were very low GPA students (granted they had good upward trends) and high MCATs (one with an astronomically high MCAT) and they were interviewed and accepted at several TX schools. Some even only had a 35-36 MCAT. And again these were all OOS applicants. I know when state schools look at OOS applicants they will consider them if it helps bring up their average stats so maybe that's it? I've considered applying to these TX schools as an OOS because I saw a lot of encouraging stories of OOS students being successful with the TX schools.

 

[gyngyn]

I know when state schools look at OOS applicants they will consider them if it helps bring up their average stats so maybe that's it? I've considered applying to these TX schools as an OOS because I saw a lot of encouraging stories of OOS students being successful with the TX schools.

I've seen CA applicants like this accepted to other states. TX remains an enigma. Their statutory limitations may have the effect of making their OOS choices somewhat different than IS. Let us know how it goes.

 

[Efflorescence]

This is only an n=3 for Texas, but you may find it interesting ...

I'm IS and so is one of my good friends. Same MCAT (32), similar cGPA (high 3.8's - low 3.9's), my sGPA is low 3.8's (hers is probably similar) ... we were both invited to interview at every Texas school we applied to (we both skipped TCOM, she skipped Foster), including BCM, UTSW, and Dell. I was not even complete at BCM until mid September and I still got an II. We were both surprised because our MCATs were only "ok". Maybe having high GPAs helped us? Who knows.

I have an OOS friend (~31 MCAT, solid GPA, CA resident) who got 4 Texas II and 2 acceptances so far. Given her so-so stats for OOS, I think the difference was that she has ties to the state: she went to undergrad in TX and is spending her gap year (service oriented) in Texas.

 

[ThoracicGuy]

This is only an n=3 for Texas, but you may find it interesting ...

I'm IS and so is one of my good friends. Same MCAT (32), similar cGPA (high 3.8's - low 3.9's), my sGPA is low 3.8's (hers is probably similar) ... we were both invited to interview at every Texas school we applied to (we both skipped TCOM, she skipped Foster), including BCM, UTSW, and Dell. I was not even complete at BCM until mid September and I still got an II. We were both surprised because our MCATs were only "ok". Maybe having high GPAs helped us? Who knows.

I have an OOS friend (~31 MCAT, solid GPA, CA resident) who got 4 Texas II and 2 acceptances so far. Given her so-so stats for OOS, I think the difference was that she has ties to the state: she went to undergrad in TX and is spending her gap year (service oriented) in Texas.

That gap year should make her a Texas resident, so she'd get in-state tuition on starting.

 

[redferrari]

This is only an n=3 for Texas, but you may find it interesting ...

I'm IS and so is one of my good friends. Same MCAT (32), similar cGPA (high 3.8's - low 3.9's), my sGPA is low 3.8's (hers is probably similar) ... we were both invited to interview at every Texas school we applied to (we both skipped TCOM, she skipped Foster), including BCM, UTSW, and Dell. I was not even complete at BCM until mid September and I still got an II. We were both surprised because our MCATs were only "ok". Maybe having high GPAs helped us? Who knows.

I have an OOS friend (~31 MCAT, solid GPA, CA resident) who got 4 Texas II and 2 acceptances so far. Given her so-so stats for OOS, I think the difference was that she has ties to the state: she went to undergrad in TX and is spending her gap year (service oriented) in Texas.

I am OOS, but did undergrad in TX. Had a <30 MCAT and was accepted to a TX school, and received two II. Undergrad in TX definitely played a role, I'm 100% convinced.

 

[Efflorescence]

That gap year should make her a Texas resident, so she'd get in-state tuition on starting.

That's true! However, many Texas schools (possibly all, but maybe not BCM?) give OOS students a $1000 scholarship that somehow qualifies them for IS tuition. It works out to where OOS students actually pay less tuition than IS students.

 

[ThoracicGuy]

That's true! However, many Texas schools (possibly all, but maybe not BCM?) give OOS students a $1000 scholarship that somehow qualifies them for IS tuition. It works out to where OOS students actually pay less tuition than IS students.

Yes, but not every OOS student gets those unless something has changed... And there's always the fact that most of the schools have to take 90% Texas residents, so she beat the odds already.

 

[redferrari]

Yes, but not every OOS student gets those unless something has changed... And there's always the fact that most of the schools have to take 90% Texas residents, so she beat the odds already.

+1 I'm definitely in that category. No IS tuition. However, that may change. Regardless, I still feel like it's a bargain. And I'm so fortunate to be able to get my MD in Texas. Texas >>>> my state.

 

[starspells]

I've seen CA applicants like this accepted to other states. TX remains an enigma. Their statutory limitations may have the effect of making their OOS choices somewhat different than IS. Let us know how it goes.

Sorry I'm replying to this late but I definitely will. I'm also going to PM you some interesting info!

 

[gyngyn]

Sorry I'm replying to this late but I definitely will. I'm also going to PM you some interesting info!

Excellent.

 

[texan2414]

Texas ftw!

 

[jqueb29]

Not a Texan, but yes to your question in general. My first cycle, every school I applied to was a toss-up with the exception of one school that should have immediately accepted me. Ended up getting yield protected first cycle, then being pretty much the first person accepted next cycle....and repaid their yield protection by damaging their yield that year and accepting a better school's offer lol.