Your opinion of occupational therapists in mental health

[InfoNerd101]

You're welcome. I am definitely in the United States. But, I am only referring to Day Treatment Centers in which they do psycho-educational groups, group counseling, and individual crisis counseling.

Building off of this, I work in a behavioral health unit of a fairly large hospital with a couple of occupational therapists who are wonderful and so knowledgeable.

Both of them perform cognitive behavioral therapy and dialectic behavioral therapy on patients both in groups and individually... As far as I know, neither are "psychotherapists" are those therapies not considered psychotherapy and included as part of OT curriculum?

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[ObakeMe]

I am not familiar with the OT curriculum. The OT's at the treatment centers did not conduct DBT or CBT sessions. Only the social workers used CBT and DBT along with other types of therapies in their sessions with day tx patients.

A physician assistant program is very different than an OT program. It is not medical school, but doctors and PAs are both products of a medical model educational system. As a PA-C, I have done medication management, some counseling, worked on sleep hygiene, but certainly never did psychotherapy.

 

[smalltownpsych]

Building off of this, I work in a behavioral health unit of a fairly large hospital with a couple of occupational therapists who are wonderful and so knowledgeable.

Both of them perform cognitive behavioral therapy and dialectic behavioral therapy on patients both in groups and individually... As far as I know, neither are "psychotherapists" are those therapies not considered psychotherapy and included as part of OT curriculum?

A key component of DBT is skills training. Another component is psychotherapy. An OT would probably make a good skills trainer but that is not the same thing as being a good psychotherapist.

Everyone thinks they can do paychotherapy mainly because they don't understand what it is we do very well. Being able to develop rapport is a good base skill, but that is not sufficient. It is also not about giving sage advice either. Learning how to tell patients hard truths in a way that they can use that information is part of skill. Learning to navigate complex interpersonal dynamics and see my own part in those dynamics and then maximize the therapeutic outcome is also part of it. Being able to run toward the fire and not away from it is another part. By fire, I mean the topics we don't want to talk about and then once they talk about it, knowing what to do. It is also about having a solid grasp of normal and abnormal psychological functioning and legal and ethical issues involved in treatment. In addition to these base skills, it is also about knowing in depth how to administer the indicated treatment modality. I actually don't think that midlevels should practice this independently either.

Keep in mind that these are just the basics of what is necessary right off the top of my head. It's hard to sum up what I learned in 10 years of post-grad training, but when I am in a life or death situation which is when the amateurs call us in and it happens every day, I am grateful for that experience.

 

[InfoNerd101]

A key component of DBT is skills training. Another component is psychotherapy. An OT would probably make a good skills trainer but that is not the same thing as being a good psychotherapist.

Everyone thinks they can do paychotherapy mainly because they don't understand what it is we do very well. Being able to develop rapport is a good base skill, but that is not sufficient. It is also not about giving sage advice either. Learning how to tell patients hard truths in a way that they can use that information is part of skill. Learning to navigate complex interpersonal dynamics and see my own part in those dynamics and then maximize the therapeutic outcome is also part of it. Being able to run toward the fire and not away from it is another part. By fire, I mean the topics we don't want to talk about and then once they talk about it, knowing what to do. It is also about having a solid grasp of normal and abnormal psychological functioning and legal and ethical issues involved in treatment. In addition to these base skills, it is also about knowing in depth how to administer the indicated treatment modality. I actually don't think that midlevels should practice this independently either.

Keep in mind that these are just the basics of what is necessary right off the top of my head. It's hard to sum up what I learned in 10 years of post-grad training, but when I am in a life or death situation which is when the amateurs call us in and it happens every day, I am grateful for that experience.

What about their cbt training?

 

[smalltownpsych]

What about their cbt training?

There are some aspects of CBT that are psychoeducational in nature so that can be something other disciplines are involved in. I have had co-facilitators of many types of groups that were from a variety of disciplines. My main point is not that other disciplines can't be involved, I actually think they should be more involved because of what they bring to the table. I just tend to think that people in this business confound rapport for psychotherapy. They also will see examples of psychologists or psychiatrists that can't develop rapport and just piss the patients off and think "I could do better than that." There is truth to that as almost anyone (including pets) can be more therapeutic than a bad psychotherapist. Also, keep in mind that we are often placed in an authority role and that can be another reason why they are angry with us. When I worked on the inpatient unit, the OT and Recreation Therapists tended to be the most popular, followed by psychology interns, then non-licensed staff, then RNs, then psychologists, then social workers, and at the bottom of the list were the psychiatrists. We did have some pretty poor psychiatrists, but it also was because they were in charge of the keys. The social workers were not LCSWs and tended to be responsible for implementing psychiatrists plans so they got a bad rep. Everyone knows psychology interns have no power so the patients tended to like us almost as much as the people that did fun and constructive stuff with patients.

 

[AcronymAllergy]

I think it's important here to distinguish between using some psychotherapeutic techniques and principles (e.g., aspects of CBT, DBT, rapport building, etc.) to improve OT treatments, and actually conducting psychotherapy. I could see the former easily being integrated into OT curricula. The latter would require substantial additional education I would imagine. The reason social workers, psychologists, and psychiatrists can essentially adjunct their current training with additional psychotherapeutic experiences is that in such cases, the educational foundations of psychotherapeutic principles are already included in the "basic" education of these professions. I have no idea if that's the case for OTs, but I'd imagine it's not, and to include it would require a significant retooling of the way OT programs are structured.

And as another poster mentioned, I'd also imagine that OTs have quite enough to do already without also attempting to conduct psychotherapy sessions...which I'd imagine don't necessarily mesh well with what's currently done in a "standard" OT session. Remember, psychotherapy sessions are often conducted weekly and for an hour, in which psychotherapy is the only thing being done. To add that to what the OT would also be doing in regard to occupational therapy would seem to result in a protracted session that the average OT patient may not be able to tolerate or benefit from.

 

[InfoNerd101]

I think it's important here to distinguish between using some psychotherapeutic techniques and principles (e.g., aspects of CBT, DBT, rapport building, etc.) to improve OT treatments, and actually conducting psychotherapy. I could see the former easily being integrated into OT curricula. The latter would require substantial additional education I would imagine. The reason social workers, psychologists, and psychiatrists can essentially adjunct their current training with additional psychotherapeutic experiences is that in such cases, the educational foundations of psychotherapeutic principles are already included in the "basic" education of these professions. I have no idea if that's the case for OTs, but I'd imagine it's not, and to include it would require a significant retooling of the way OT programs are structured.

And as another poster mentioned, I'd also imagine that OTs have quite enough to do already without also attempting to conduct psychotherapy sessions...which I'd imagine don't necessarily mesh well with what's currently done in a "standard" OT session. Remember, psychotherapy sessions are often conducted weekly and for an hour, in which psychotherapy is the only thing being done. To add that to what the OT would also be doing in regard to occupational therapy would seem to result in a protracted session that the average OT patient may not be able to tolerate or benefit from.

Ac

I think it's important here to distinguish between using some psychotherapeutic techniques and principles (e.g., aspects of CBT, DBT, rapport building, etc.) to improve OT treatments, and actually conducting psychotherapy. I could see the former easily being integrated into OT curricula. The latter would require substantial additional education I would imagine. The reason social workers, psychologists, and psychiatrists can essentially adjunct their current training with additional psychotherapeutic experiences is that in such cases, the educational foundations of psychotherapeutic principles are already included in the "basic" education of these professions. I have no idea if that's the case for OTs, but I'd imagine it's not, and to include it would require a significant retooling of the way OT programs are structured.

And as another poster mentioned, I'd also imagine that OTs have quite enough to do already without also attempting to conduct psychotherapy sessions...which I'd imagine don't necessarily mesh well with what's currently done in a "standard" OT session. Remember, psychotherapy sessions are often conducted weekly and for an hour, in which psychotherapy is the only thing being done. To add that to what the OT would also be doing in regard to occupational therapy would seem to result in a protracted session that the average OT patient may not be able to tolerate or benefit from.

Actually it's really funny you bring that up about social workers have the psychotherapeutic training integrated into their masters. I spoke with someone in the field and he said there a big discrepancy in the field between the programsprograms.

Some of them do some training and others non at all but in the end they all become "LCSW's" and claim themselves as "psychotherapists" when some of them don't even have the proper training.

 

[ObakeMe]

Social workers are able to do psychotherapy. Maybe they are not the best at providing it. But, they do have the training to do it.

 

[InfoNerd101]

Social workers are able to do psychotherapy. Maybe they are not the best at providing it. But, they do have the training to do it.

Yes, but as I said, I talked to a social worker who said there's a big discrepancy in the field because some programs are not clinically oriented, and others that are are, are providing minimal training, like 1 class, and yet they're all running around claiming to be psychotherapists, regardless if they have the training for it or not

 

[clausewitz2]

Yes, but as I said, I talked to a social worker who said there's a big discrepancy in the field because some programs are not clinically oriented, and others that are are, are providing minimal training, like 1 class, and yet they're all running around claiming to be psychotherapists, regardless if they have the training for it or not

To call themselves LCSWs or the equivalent, social workers in almost every US state need to sit a clinical exam or two and generally spend between one and two years in clinical practice with weekly supervision. Not a guarantee of quality, necessarily, but definitely more than taking "1 class.'

 

[InfoNerd101]

[Yes the OTE="clausewitz2, post: 17009548, member: 227825"]To call themselves LCSWs or the equivalent, social workers in almost every US state need to sit a clinical exam or two and generally spend between one and two years in clinical practice with weekly supervision. Not a guarantee of quality, necessarily, but definitely more than taking "1 class.'[/QUOTE]

Yes, they need the 2,000 hours of clinical supervision regardless, but as far as the training in the program goes, some programs only have one class in psychotherapeutic techniques and thats it

 

[AcronymAllergy]

Ac



Actually it's really funny you bring that up about social workers have the psychotherapeutic training integrated into their masters. I spoke with someone in the field and he said there a big discrepancy in the field between the programsprograms.

Some of them do some training and others non at all but in the end they all become "LCSW's" and claim themselves as "psychotherapists" when some of them don't even have the proper training.

This is true, and I'd make the argument that without the foundational coursework and practicum/supervision, they'd need significant additional training to truly be competent in psychotherapy. Given that the LCSW license affords them the opportunity to provide psychotherapy, it falls on the individual social worker to determine whether or not they truly think they're competent, and if not, to take steps to remediate that.

Edit: My general thought is that unfortunately, many people unintentionally downplay or don't realize the very real harm that ineffective or improperly administered psychotherapy can do. At the very least, it can turn the person off from seeking psychotherapy (or mental health care in general) in the future because insufficient progress was made and/or the patient had a poor view of the therapist's competence and, by extension, the potential benefit of any form of therapy.

 

[smalltownpsych]

Yes, but as I said, I talked to a social worker who said there's a big discrepancy in the field because some programs are not clinically oriented, and others that are are, are providing minimal training, like 1 class, and yet they're all running around claiming to be psychotherapists, regardless if they have the training for it or not

It seems to me that you are making my point. I think that this shortcut to being a therapist by becoming a social worker was the first and I don't think it has been good for the field of social work, psychotherapy, or the patients. Why would you want to dilute the field of OT in a similar fashion?

 

[Therapist4Chnge]

InfoNerd101, as I posted in your thread in the OT forum, here are the AOTA Scope of Practice guidelines…..I didn't see psychotherapy covered, though I admittedly just did a quick once over.

 

[ObakeMe]

Yes, but as I said, I talked to a social worker who said there's a big discrepancy in the field because some programs are not clinically oriented, and others that are are, are providing minimal training, like 1 class, and yet they're all running around claiming to be psychotherapists, regardless if they have the training for it or not

NO. This is absolutely false information, at least for the United States. They have less training, but they have more than just 1 class. They have coursework in therapy and learn to do therapy as they complete the practicum portion of their curriculum.

I am talking about the United States only. If this is the case, in other countries I say that would be disastrous.

 

[ObakeMe]

OT is more science based than psychology. As ugrads their pre-req courses included chemistry, physics, biochem, and other hard science courses. They mentioned studying anatomy and physiology, neuroscience, etc during their programs. If anything their curriculum would be closer to a physical therapy program. The ones that I met did some very brief lecturing about topics regarding biochemistry and nutrition, neuroscience of sleep, and a few topics on the biological basis of behavior.

It almost seemed like their functioning as counselors and handling crisis situations was something they learned on the job or in another mental health position. A couple of them had worked for quite a few years as mobile outreach suicide and crisis workers before going to OT school. This gave them the experience that they needed to work as mental health counselors in a partial hospitalization program. But, they still did not do therapy. Only the social workers did.

 

[InfoNerd101]

To call themselves LCSWs or the equivalent, social workers in almost every US state need to sit a clinical exam or two and generally spend between one and two years in clinical practice with weekly supervision. Not a guarantee of quality, necessarily, but definitely more than taking "1 class.'

Yes, they need the 2,000 hours of clinical supervision regardless, but as far as the training in the program goes, some programs only have one class inpsychotherapeutic techniques and thatsit

 

[InfoNerd101]

It seems to me that you are making my point. I think that this shortcut to being a therapist by becoming a social worker was the first and I don't think it has been good for the field of social work, psychotherapy, or the patients. Why would you want to dilute the field of OT in a similar fashion?

Thanks for pointing that's out! I see your point now. But why don't you think it's been good for the social work field?

 

[InfoNerd101]

you don't seem to be understanding that psychotherapy has nothing to do with OT. In the UK, psychotherapy is regulated by UKCP or BACP regardless of whether you are a magician, soothsayer, occupational therapist, psychiatrist, nurse, and the vast majority of therapists have no other professional background. OT regulatory bodies do not regulate psychotherapy. that's crazy talk.

So if psychotherapy is a regulated profession through the ukcp or bacp then how can anyone call themselves a psychotherapist?

Also what do licensed clinical Social workers do in the UK because here in the states the majority of them solely do psychotherapy?

 

[smalltownpsych]

Thanks for pointing that's out! I see your point now. But why don't you think it's been good for the social work field?

I think that it has led to a de-emphasis on the other aspects of social work. So a case manager is seen as less than a psychotherapist in hierarchy and pay. Maybe I am wrong, but I would see social workers as the go-to experts in helping patients access services and coordinating the treatment in the more severely mentally ill. To put it another way, many social workers do not primarily do psychotherapy and it used to be that was the main focus. Now it seems like 50/50 and how do I know if this is an LCSW who has solid clinical training or one who had a lot of classes in advocacy and worked at an agency that completely faked the supervision (I saw this personally). What I have also seen are many new social workers confused about their roles.

 

[Shikima]

I think that it has led to a de-emphasis on the other aspects of social work. So a case manager is seen as less than a psychotherapist in hierarchy and pay. Maybe I am wrong, but I would see social workers as the go-to experts in helping patients access services and coordinating the treatment in the more severely mentally ill. To put it another way, many social workers do not primarily do psychotherapy and it used to be that was the main focus. Now it seems like 50/50 and how do I know if this is an LCSW who has solid clinical training or one who had a lot of classes in advocacy and worked at an agency that completely faked the supervision (I saw this personally). What I have also seen are many new social workers confused about their roles.

I must admit, those who are social workers in my office have been immensely helpful because they can do psychotherapy and case management at the same time as issues and needs are identified. They know the resources in the community much better than I could.

 

[InfoNerd101]

I think that it has led to a de-emphasis on the other aspects of social work. So a case manager is seen as less than a psychotherapist in hierarchy and pay. Maybe I am wrong, but I would see social workers as the go-to experts in helping patients access services and coordinating the treatment in the more severely mentally ill. To put it another way, many social workers do not primarily do psychotherapy and it used to be that was the main focus. Now it seems like 50/50 and how do I know if this is an LCSW who has solid clinical training or one who had a lot of classes in advocacy and worked at an agency that completely faked the supervision (I saw this personally). What I have also seen are many new social workers confused about their roles.

When you say "to put it another way, many social workers do not primarily do psychotherapy and it used to be that was the main focus," I don't really understand this it's like contradicting what you said earlier. Social works original roots DID NOT include psychotherapy.. It was mostly casework and advocacy... Its wasn't until the 60's that it became "psychologized" and psychotherapy was integrated.

 

[splik]

So if psychotherapy is a regulated profession through the ukcp or bacp then how can anyone call themselves a psychotherapist?

Also what do licensed clinical Social workers do in the UK because here in the states the majority of them solely do psychotherapy?

theres no such a thing as a licensed clinical social worker in the UK. If you are doing psychotherapy then you're not a social worker even if you are social worked trained there.

same way that the american psychoanalytic society regulates psychoanalysis but anyone can call themselves a psychoanalyst in the US outside of NYS. They regulate standards within the profession but they can't stop you if you're not part of them.

 

[ObakeMe]

Yes, they need the 2,000 hours of clinical supervision regardless, but as far as the training in the program goes, some programs only have one class inpsychotherapeutic techniques and thatsit

Look at Hawaii's MSW program. It is more than just one course in psychotherapy. They also do practicum. Within a practicum placement, they learn how to conduct therapeutic sessions. So again, they have more than just one course in psychotherapy.

MSW Courses
SW 500 Master’s Plan B/C Studies (1)
SW 606 Social Work Practice with Individuals (3)
This beginning practice course introduces students to the basic processes of social work and the roles and skills needed for generalist practice. Relevant theories of social work practice with individuals are explored for their efficacy with various problems and for their applicability to practice with various ethnocultures, social classes, and oppressed populations. Interviewing and interpersonal skill development are incorporated. Pre: admission to MSW program.

SW 607 Social Work Practice with Families and Groups (3)
This practice course builds upon the generalist framework and foundation content presented in 606. Special emphasis is given on models for assessment, intervention, and evaluation of practice with families and groups. Relevant theories of groups and the principles of group dynamics and group work methods are examined in regard to task, therapeutic, psycho-educational, and social development groups. Family content includes structural, behavioral, communication/experiential, and culturally-specific theories of intervention. Pre: 606.

SW 630 Social Welfare Policy and Services (3)
Examines in a historical and comparative framework the economic, social, political, organizational, and administrative factors influencing the development, formulation, and implementation of social welfare policies in the U.S. The course provides opportunity for the application of various models of social policy analysis in major areas of social welfare programming and service delivery. Pre: graduate standing, or consent.

SW 631 Social Work Practice in Communities and Organizations (3)
Community conceptualization; organized roles of developer, enabler, broker, mediator, and advocate; diagnostic and problem-solving technology; the special characteristics of the social worker as community organizer; matrix of structural objectives; sources and use of power; how to build an organization; and interorganizational negotiation. Pre: 606, graduate standing, and consent.

SW 636 Policies, Programs and Services on Aging (3)
Explores policies, programs, and services for older adults. Students learn about the aging network, assess older adults’ needs, link older adults to appropriate services in the community, and track legislative bills that address older adults’ quality of life. Pre: graduate standing or consent.

SW 639 Social and Cultural Aspects of Aging (3)
Overview of aging from the biopsycho, socio-economic and cultural perspectives. Explores common theories of aging. Emphasis on bridging the gap between the realm of concepts and theories, and the world of practice in gerontology. Pre: graduate standing or consent.

SW 640 Introduction to Scientific Methods and Principles in Social Work (3)
Understanding and interpreting results of nomothetic and idiographic research; design principles and statistical analyses and their relationship to practices; use of published research. Pre: graduate standing.

SW 650 Research Designs and Data Analyses for the Evaluation of Practice Effectiveness (3)
Extending the study of scientific methods introduced in 640. Covers the range of empirical research methods and data analytic procedures suitable for knowledge building and practice evaluation at all levels of intervention from case to program. Pre: 640.

SW 651 Introduction to Quantitative Methods (3)
Introduction to quantitative methods in the behavioral sciences. Review of elementary statistical methods. Introduction to the general linear model as principle of data analysis. Pre: 640 or consent. (Cross-listed as EDEP 601 and PSY 610)

SW 652 Computer Applications in the Behavioral Sciences (3)
Introduction to the use of computers and computer-related equipment in the management and analysis of data in the behavioral sciences. Includes introduction to control language, use of SAS or SPSS routines, and interpretation of output. Emphasis on application through use of the University’s computing facilities. Pre: 640 or 651. (Cross-listed as EDEP 602)

SW 654 Multiple Regression in Behavioral Research (3)
Advanced application of the general linear model to complex problems of data analysis. Relation of analysis of variance and co-variance to regression analysis. Pre: 651 or consent. (Cross-listed as PSY 612 and EDEP 604)

SW 655 Factor Analysis (3)
Theory and method of factor analysis and related methods of multivariate analysis. Pre: 654 or consent. (Cross-listed as PSY 613 and EDEP 605)

SW 656 Multivariate Methods (3)
Multivariate forms of analysis, variance, co-variance, discriminant analysis, canonical correlation, and principal components analysis. Pre: 654 or consent. (Cross-listed as PSY 614 and EDEP 606)

SW 658 Measurements and Evaluation (3)
Theory of measurement and evaluation; analysis of tests and scales emphasizing statistical and psychological analysis of experimental and standardized tests and scales. Special topics include measurement of attitude and mental health concepts and measurement issues in cross-cultural research. Pre: 651. (Cross-listed as PSY 616 and EDEP 616)

SW 659 Human Behavior in the Social Environment I (3)
An overview of social work’s person-in-environment focus as it applies to human behavior in the context of families, groups, communities, and organizations. Using an ecological perspec-tive, theories and evidence about human behavior are introduced and examined. Pre: graduate standing. Fall only.

SW 660 Human Behavior in the Social Environment II (3)
This course uses social work’s person-in-environment focus to organize knowledge development about biological, psychological, social, and cultural systems as they are affected by human behavior. It is designed to provide students with an overview of human behavior and healthy and unhealthy development over the life span. Pre: 659. Spring only.

SW 663 Treatment of Chemical Dependency (3)
Introduction to treatment of alcoholism and other chemical dependencies. Application of social work strategies in work with individuals and families in the disease and recovery process. Pre: graduate standing

SW 672 Child Welfare as a Field of Social Work (3)
Emphasis on the developments in child welfare; issues, concerns with regard to needs and rights, and the application of social work services to problems associated with needs for protection. Review of historical, theoretical, empirical, and legal findings for skill development in intervening in dysfunctional parent/child interaction. Pre: graduate standing.

SW 674 Community and Public Health Practice (3)
An introduction to the principles and concepts of prevention and their application to health services planning and delivery. Integration of concepts of social epidemiology and social work practice. Meets seminar requirement. Pre: graduate standing and consent. (Cross-listed as PH 671)

SW 680 Topics in Social Welfare (V)
Current trends in field of social welfare. Recent courses have focused on child abuse and neglect, justice system, sexual assault and family violence, and gerontology. Meets seminar requirement. Pre: graduate standing.

SW 690 Foundation-Year Practicum (3)
Field units are maintained by the school in public and voluntary welfare agencies, as well as in governmental programs. Students receive instruction related to their school experience with social problem situations and an opportunity to see the applicability and to experience the use of concepts and principles in actual practice. Pre: admission to MSW program.

SW 691 Foundation-Year Practicum (3)
Field units are main-tained by the school in public and voluntary welfare agencies, as well as in governmental programs. Students receive instruction related to their school experience with social problem situations and an opportunity to see the applicability and to experience the use of concepts and principles in actual practice. Pre: admission to MSW program, completion of 690.

SW 696 Health and Aging (3)
Biological and physiological changes associated with aging. Social and psychological factors associated with health maintenance. Major threats to health, changing patterns of morbidity and mortality of the aged. Pre: graduate standing.

SW 699 Directed Reading and Research (V)
Students, on the basis of special interest, select a faculty member to work with on a problem for which planned individualized study or research is deemed advisable. Pre: consent.

SW 700 Thesis Research (V)
Independent research under supervision of a thesis committee. Includes formal proposal and defense of finished research.

SW 707 Methods of Group Psychotherapy (3)
This course is designed specifically to train students in the theory and practice of leading psychotherapy groups; it includes historical developments, research, theories, and application of group psychotherapy, group techniques and exercises. Pre: 607 or consent.

SW 715 Therapeutic Strategies with the Older Adult (3)
The course focuses on interdisciplinary strategies with older adults: individual, family, and group therapy; eclectic mental health approaches; case management; and environmental intervention. Emphasis placed on the use of these strategies as preventive, as well as supportive, measures for the well, transition, and frail elderly. Meets seminar requirement. Pre: graduate standing.

SW 717 Social Work Practice with Children and Families (3)
An advanced practice course for students specializing in social work with children and families. It is designed to provide students with an in-depth understanding of both theoretical formulations and therapeutic techniques for practice in the field of family and child welfare. Emphasis placed on the development of specialized knowledge and skills for assessment, intervention, and evaluation of a variety of common child and family practice situations. Pre: completion of foundation courses.

SW 718 Seminar in Social Work Practice with Children and Families (3)
This seminar is designed for students in the child and family concentration and builds upon past knowledge and skill development in practice classes and in the practicum. Students integrate, demonstrate, and extend earlier learning, acquire new knowledge, and learn and practice new skills. The course is organized around student case presentations in a consultation format. Meets seminar requirement. Pre: 717.

SW 722 Social Work Practice in Health Care (3)
Didactic and experiential learning activity focuses on the major role functions of the social worker in the health field including assessment, contracting, counseling, advocacy, case management, discharge planning, family group work, community and team building. Course content covers health care policy, research directions in practice and social work management issues. Pre: completion of foundation courses.

SW 723 Seminar in Social Work Practice in Health Care (3)
Through the use of case studies developed by the students, social work practice is examined in three areas of health care: primary care provided in health departments and medical groups, hospital-based services, and long-term care. Meets seminar requirement. Pre: 722.

SW 724 Seminar in Social Work Practice in Mental Health (3)
This course prepares students for social work practice in mental health settings. As the first course in the concentration, it focuses primarily on minor or short-term mental dysfunctioning (e.g., reactive depression, anxiety). The course is built on conceptual foundations including cultural implications of mental health, human ecology, life cycle/events, strengths assessments, and research. It includes a seminar component which involves student case presentations and consultations. Pre: completion of foundation courses.

SW 725 Social Work Practice in Mental Health (3)
This course prepares students to work with persons who are experiencing major mental disorders and to improve the systems of care that have been developed to serve this population. It reviews the history of the community mental health movement, discusses relevant policies and laws, and describes the current mental health system in the United States and Hawaiʻi. Pre: 724.

SW 726 Social Work Practice with the Aged (3)
This course is designed for social work students specializing in social work practice with the aged and their families. It examines normative and pathological aging and its impact on physical processes, intellectual functions, and personality. Emphasis is placed on the development of specialized knowledge and skills for assessment, intervention, and evaluation of a variety of issues and needs common in later life. Discussions on the applicability of certain interventions with the older adult and the family, along with enthnocultural and gender considerations. Pre: completion of foundation courses.

SW 727 Seminar in Social Work with the Aged (3)
This course, designed for social work students in the aged concentration, builds upon past knowledge and skill development from courses and practicum. Students examine micro and macro interventions used for a wide range of issues and problems encountered by older adults and their families through the use of both case presentation and case consultations assignments. Meets seminar requirement. Pre: 726.

SW 737 Social Work and the Law (3)
Knowledge of judicial systems and law relevant to social work practice in corrections, child-family welfare, health, and mental health. Skills for effective participation in the legal process are acquired in moot court and in practice for testifying. Pre: graduate standing.

SW 741 Review of Research in Social Work (3)
In-depth study of research in a substantive area. Each seminar will be devoted to a particular topic: e.g., foster care of children, effectiveness of social work intervention, etc. Pre: 650.

SW 743 Individual or Group Research Project—Plan B (V)
Independent research (group of two to seven students or by an individual student) undertaken under the sponsorship of a faculty adviser. Elements are selection of a topic related to the practice of social work or knowledge relevant to that practice, utilization of empirical research methodology in collecting and analyzing original data, and preparation of a scholarly paper. Pre: 650.

SW 744 Individual or Group Research Project—Plan B (V)
Same as 743. Pre: 743.

SW 746 Individual or Group Research Project—Plan B (V)
Same as 743.

SW 774 Cultural Factors in Work with Hawaiians (3)
Hawaiian culture, past and present. Explores and examines possible approaches to working with Hawaiians and part-Hawaiians. Special emphasis on supports in the Hawaiian system that may promote maximal functioning for those Hawaiians experiencing problems in today’s society. Meets seminar requirement. A-F only. Pre: graduate standing.

SW 776 Seminar on Women and Health (3)
Women’s health and the role of women health professionals. Current literature and research regarding attitudes, roles, rights, and health care. Pre: graduate standing or consent. (Cross-listed as NURS 744 and PH 744)

SW 790 Concentration-Year Practicum (V)
Concentration year practicum must coordinate with the student's concentration courses. The practicum provides an opportunity for the student to integrate course work and test out concepts, principles, theories, and alternative approaches in actual practice settings. Pre: 691.

SW 791 Concentration-Year Practicum (V)
Same as 790. Pre: completion of 790.

SW 797 Social Welfare Policy and Change (3)
This course builds on SW 630 and emphasizes a more thorough and comprehensive examination of major policies, programs, and populations central to a concentration (health, mental health, gerontology, child and family). Students learn a more focused and applied analysis of the relationship between social policy, social policy research, and social work practice, as well as the effects of social policy on the design, structure, and resource management of human service organizations within the student's area of concentration. Pre: completion of foundation courses, Spring only.

 

[AcronymAllergy]

Yes, I definitely count practicum classes for psychotherapy as a class for psychotherapy, as the included supervision component should involve discussion not just of what transpires in the session, but of how/why certain feedback is given with respect to its relation to the theory underlying the psychotherapy (and to theories of mental health in general). Otherwise, what you learn in supervision with one patient wouldn't transfer very well to work with other patients.

If this isn't occurring, I'd say the supervision is subpar.

Although having more than 1 course in the principles of psychotherapy would be helpful as well. I haven't checked coursework requirements for any SW programs, so can't verify if any of them do indeed only include 1 class. If so, those may be programs that lean more toward case management--which, as smalltownpsych mentioned, I consider to be equally as important as psychotherapy. It's hard to focus solely on decreasing emotional distress if your patient is about to be homeless or have their power shut-off. I refer to our SWs all the time for assistance with problems like these; lord knows, they're better versed in available resources than am I.

 

[smalltownpsych]

When you say "to put it another way, many social workers do not primarily do psychotherapy and it used to be that was the main focus," I don't really understand this it's like contradicting what you said earlier. Social works original roots DID NOT include psychotherapy.. It was mostly casework and advocacy... Its wasn't until the 60's that it became "psychologized" and psychotherapy was integrated.

I actually mean that they used to not have much focus on psychotherapy because they didn't really do it. Which is what you said, sorry for the unclear pronoun reference. keep in mind though that most of our research comparing different providers of patients psychotherapy has not found significant differences in patient outcome so please be clear that I am not saying a social worker cannot be an excellent psychotherapist, I am just questioning how that shift affected the profession.

 

[ObakeMe]

Although I just referenced one program, the other programs in the US are like this. They get courses in therapy so they have the knowledge to see patients in practicum. Just like med students/PA students need to go through the didactic portion of their curriculum before seeing patients. The MSW programs do get some courses in case management.

As far as case management goes, the BSW programs cover that in their coursework and practicum placement.

The entrance to these MSW programs require that people already have strong backgrounds in case management or mental health background. Many students come in to these programs currently employed as case managers or mobile outreach crisis workers.

Of course, they still do not have as extensive training as a psychologist or psychiatrist would.

 

[InfoNerd101]

theres no such a thing as a licensed clinical social worker in the UK. If you are doing psychotherapy then you're not a social worker even if you are social worked trained there.

same way that the american psychoanalytic society regulates psychoanalysis but anyone can call themselves a psychoanalyst in the US outside of NYS. They regulate standards within the profession but they can't stop you if you're not part of them.

So can anyone become a psychotherapist is the UK? You don't have to have a particular background such as Social work or mental health nursing etc?

 

[InfoNerd101]

Where I live, in South Australia, there is an option to complete a Masters Degree in Psychotherapy and Counselling, after one has first completed a Graduate Diploma in the same course. So yes it is possible for a Social Worker or Occupational Therapist to complete that course and work as a Psychotherapist, but then they'd be a Psychotherapist not a Social Worker et al who just happens to practice what they think is Psychotherapy, and would probably be employed as such (a Psychotherapist that is). Put it this way, I'm a patient being treated at a training clinic in South Australia, there are trainee Psychotherapists there who may very well have a Social Work or Occupational Therapist background but within that clinic they are Provisional Psychotherapists not Social Workers or Occupational Therapists.

edited to add: As Splik said anyone can call themselves a Psychotherapist in the UK, and it is more or less the same here, so I don't give much credence to anyone who claims the ability or title of 'Psychotherapist' unless they have gone through proper training channels (and no some 6 month online course at BS College Inc. doesn't count). There are Psychotherapists and then there are 'Psychotherapists'. If you don't truly know the difference between a properly trained Psychotherapist, and someone who is just claiming the title because it sounds better than just saying you're a 'Counsellor' then I'm sure there are plenty of *trained* Psychotherapists on here who would be happy to explain the difference.

So anyone can get training to be a psychotherapist in Australia? Like even if you have a background in something unrelated like marketing? You don't have to have a background in something mental health related like social work to get training and become qualified?

 

[Ceke2002]

So anyone can get training to be a psychotherapist in Australia? Like even if you have a background in something unrelated like marketing? You don't have to have a background in something mental health related like social work to get training and become qualified?

As far as I'm aware, pretty much. There's all sorts of BS sounding online colleges, or 'send away for your 6 CDs and course book for just $99 and you too can be a Counsellor in 12 weeks' type nonsense you see advertised in magazines. We do have some regulatory bodies here, that people can join if they have legit qualifications in Psychotherapy, so that potential clients can know if the Psychotherapist has been accepted as a member of this certain body then they have the correct and proper training. But outside of that there's not really much to stop someone doing a basic counselling course and setting themselves up as a 'Psychotherapist'. Things might have changed recently though, I believe there was a push to ensure better regulation of who could and couldn't claim to be practicing Psychotherapy.

 

[splik]

So can anyone become a psychotherapist is the UK? You don't have to have a particular background such as Social work or mental health nursing etc?

no, most psychotherapists do not have such backgrounds. It's not just the UK. The US one of the the exceptions, most countries do not have such requirements and this isn't even the case in the US anymore like it used to be. There is absolutely no reason why one should have to train in another field to become a psychotherapist. It is protectionism and greed that has historically limited the practice of psychotherapy

 

[Ceke2002]

no, most psychotherapists do not have such backgrounds. It's not just the UK. The US one of the the exceptions, most countries do not have such requirements and this isn't even the case in the US anymore like it used to be. There is absolutely no reason why one should have to train in another field to become a psychotherapist. It is protectionism and greed that has historically limited the practice of psychotherapy

I agree, I think anyone should be allowed to train as, and become a psychotherapist regardless of their background, with the caveat that their training should be proper and rigorous and involve a satisfactory number of supervised training hours.

 

[splik]

I agree, I think anyone should be allowed to train as, and become a psychotherapist regardless of their background, with the caveat that their training should be proper and rigorous and involve a satisfactory number of supervised training hours.

And of course careful screening out of those who appear predatory or otherwise wholly unsuitable for this kind of work

 

[Ceke2002]

And of course careful screening out of those who appear predatory or otherwise wholly unsuitable for this kind of work

Exactly. And even the obvious cases aside, like I said before I don't think many people actually understand the long term damage that poor psychotherapy can do. I remember when I was still disillusioned with Psychiatry, and looking for a more alternative approach to mental illness that incorporated spiritual aspects, going to see a woman who was trained in basic counselling skills, but who described herself as a 'metaphysical psychotherapist'. Now she was a perfectly lovely lady, we had a good rapport from the outset, conversation between us flowed easily, but within two sessions I realised all we were doing was having a pleasant chat, there was no actual Psychotherapeutic treatment taking place, and I was $60 out of pocket for something I could have gotten from a friend for free. But then what if I didn't realise that? What if I spent a year going to this very nice person, and having some great conversations, and paying her money to treat me, and all the while I'm getting no better because she simply doesn't have the proper skill set. That's time and money wasted, both of which could actually end up exasperating my condition rather than relieving it.

 

[InfoNerd101]

no, most psychotherapists do not have such backgrounds. It's not just the UK. The US one of the the exceptions, most countries do not have such requirements and this isn't even the case in the US anymore like it used to be. There is absolutely no reason why one should have to train in another field to become a psychotherapist. It is protectionism and greed that has historically limited the practice of psychotherapy

I read the entry requirements for psychotherapy training programs in the UK and they said bachelors degree in social work, psychology or social sciences related field required.

 

[InfoNerd101]

no, most psychotherapists do not have such backgrounds. It's not just the UK. The US one of the the exceptions, most countries do not have such requirements and this isn't even the case in the US anymore like it used to be. There is absolutely no reason why one should have to train in another field to become a psychotherapist. It is protectionism and greed that has historically limited the practice of psychotherapy

And also, as I was reading for most countries, they limit and restrict psychotherapy to only psychologists and psychiatrists.

 

[splik]

im not going to argue with you on this point as no such requirements exist, and even if one needed a bachelors in social science related field that is not the same as having a professional qualification in a particular field as is typically required in the US.

 

[InfoNerd101]

im business, g to argue with you on this point as no such requirements exist, and even if one needed a bachelors in social science related field that is not the same as having a professional qualification in a particular field as is typically required in the US.

What I'm getting at is if you had a bachelors in say business for example, you couldn't just apply and enter a psychotherapy training program? You'd have to go back and get another bachelors in either social sciences or psychology and then apply?

 

[InfoNerd101]

According to the College of Occupational Therapists of Ontario (COTO) Standards of Psychotherapy, OTs in Ontario have been authorized to provide psychotherapy. They define 'psychotherapy' as the same definition used by the College of Physicians and Surgeons of Ontario (CPSO).
Fromhttp://www.coto.org/pdf/COTO_Standards_Psychotherapy.pdf:
Occupational Therapy Act, 1991 S.o. 1991, last modified 2007, chapter 10 Schedule R
3.1 (1) "A member is authorized, subject to the terms, conditions and limitations imposed on his or her certificate of registration, to treat, by means of psychotherapy technique delivered through a therapeutic relationship, an individual’s serious disorder of thought, cognition, mood, emotional regulation, perception or memory that may seriously impair the individual’s judgement, insight, behaviour, communication or social functioning. 2007,c.10, Sched. R,s.17(1)."

Regarding earlier in my post, here is an example of a nation (in this case Canada) Where OT's can practice as psychotherapists with additional training.

 

[Shikima]

So? Practice in Ontario then? You could live in Detroit and commute.

 

[InfoNerd101]

So? Practice in Ontario then? You could live in Detroit and commute.

Lol, no its a consideration for what OT's in other countries can get ideas from

 

[Shikima]

AOTA needs lobbyists. Have you applied for a position?

 

[smalltownpsych]

That's all we need is another path in this country for the "I wanna be a therapist and help people and I am just as good as a psychologist" crowd.

 

[beestrng]

I would not go to an OT for psychotherapy.

 

[InfoNerd101]

That's all we need is another path in this country for the "I wanna be a therapist and help people and I am just as good as a psychologist" crowd.

Why there's a lot of people that think like this?

 

[InfoNerd101]

I would not go to an OT for psychotherapy.

Would you go to an LCSW for psychotherapy?

 

[Shikima]

Would you go to an LCSW for psychotherapy?

I got a bunch in my office and they do very good work.

 

[clausewitz2]

That's all we need is another path in this country for the "I wanna be a therapist and help people and I am just as good as a psychologist" crowd.

Don't forget that one case manager who is sure she/he is basically her clients' therapist.

 

[InfoNerd101]

I got a bunch in my office and they do very good work.

My point exactly, if an appropriately trained social worker can do psychotherapy why can't an appropriately trained OT do the same?

 

[InfoNerd101]

they can. just like anyone else. my first therapist had a masters in public administration from harvard. she had no health professional background before becoming a psychoanalyst and was excellent. anyone with the right suitability for the work and appropriate training can become an effective psychotherapist. and what the mental health industry has suppressed for too long is that caring individuals with very little training can do very effective therapeutic work with disturbed individuals. quite frankly i cant think of any worse training for psychotherapy than an MD. as psychiatrists we have to spent so much time having to unlearn everything in order to become an effective psychotherapists.

So you are in fact more for having people trained from the bottom up so to speak rather than requiring previous professional qualifications such as they do here in the states?

And when you say... "what the mental health industry has suppressed for too long is that caring individuals with very little training can do very effective therapeutic work" are you referring to over in the UK or here in the states?