Another Adcom, ask me (almost) anything

[hushcom]

I so totally agree with your last point. I was one of those people during college. Chose to do community service with APO instead of doing research because I truly love the former and have zero passion for the latter.

How much would it hurt a candidate if they attended a top 20 undergrad that was well-known for being a research powerhouse but chose not to do any research? I've grown a lot during my 4 years as an undergrad, had my fair share of ups and downs, and cherish most of those experiences. They just didn't include research.

A lack of research would hurt at some schools, while your community service would help at others. This is a case where finding as school that appreciates your background/interests and sees you as a good "fit" would play well for you both.

---

Members don't see this ad.

 

[heisneberg]

I am currently entering my 5th year of a 6 year PharmD program. However, I have been very seriously considering medical school . I wasn't sure if not having a bachelor's degree and instead only a PharmD would cause problems applying to programs. Also, I wasn't sure how my gpa would be calculated due to having 2 years of pre-pharm and 2 (will be 3) years of pharmacy school classes. They are all still considered undergraduate classes at this point.

I have been involved in some research and will have posters presented at meetings, but all of it has been clinical. I wasn't sure how clinical vs lab research was viewed. Furthermore, are there anythings in particular that would useful to help demonstrate that I truly do wish to have a change in my profession?

 

[jagster92]

I am currently entering my 5th year of a 6 year PharmD program. However, I have been very seriously considering medical school . I wasn't sure if not having a bachelor's degree and instead only a PharmD would cause problems applying to programs. Also, I wasn't sure how my gpa would be calculated due to having 2 years of pre-pharm and 2 (will be 3) years of pharmacy school classes. They are all still considered undergraduate classes at this point.

I have been involved in some research and will have posters presented at meetings, but all of it has been clinical. I wasn't sure how clinical vs lab research was viewed. Furthermore, are there anythings in particular that would useful to help demonstrate that I truly do wish to have a change in my profession?

I'd certainly like to hear what @hushcom thoughts are on this as well, as I'm in the same boat (except i'm in the committed rather than considering stage). From my own experience, I've found that Penn St and NYU don't generally accept pharmacy credits, but emailing individual schools tends to give you the best answer.

 

[Doctorworld]

How are honors science courses viewed in comparison with non-honors? Would taking an honors course be worth the extra time in studying as compared to getting more clinical experience?

Thanks for your help.

 

[Beach_Bum]

-

 

[jagster92]

One of my parents lives in PA and one in NY. Currently I'm a PA resident but there are only 2 schools at most in PA i will apply to (Pitt and Penn). I'll be applying to quite a few NY schools (Albany, Albert Einstein, Columbia, Mt Sinai, Rochester, Cornell and likely SUNY downstate). I'm wondering if it would be worth the trouble to change my residency status to NY because although Penn would be my dream school, the likelihood of me getting in is pretty slim and from the MSAR it doesn't look like they have much of an in-state preference.

 

[heisneberg]

I'd certainly like to hear what @hushcom thoughts are on this as well, as I'm in the same boat (except i'm in the committed rather than considering stage). From my own experience, I've found that Penn St and NYU don't generally accept pharmacy credits, but emailing individual schools tends to give you the best answer.

When you say Penn State and NYU don't accept pharmacy credits, would that be in reference they wouldn't factor them into my gpa or would it mean that I would need another degree rather than a PharmD to apply there?

 

[jagster92]

When you say Penn State and NYU don't accept pharmacy credits, would that be in reference they wouldn't factor them into my gpa or would it mean that I would need another degree rather than a PharmD to apply there?

Essentially the latter. Per NYU's site, an undergraduate baccalaureate degree is required and "Normally, credit is not given for courses taken in schools of dentistry, nursing, veterinary medicine, or pharmacy." Penn State claims to require a baccalaureate degree on their site, and although there is no explicit claim that they don't accept pharmacy credits, I have emailed the admissions office a few times and never received a firm answer. They just referred me to the admission site. Based on that (and the experience of another PharmD I know who contacted them) I would assume this to mean they favor a baccalaureate. Some schools say they require a baccalaureate, but once you contact them they say the PharmD would be considered equivalent.

 

[FFH]

Dear @hushcom

Why the discrepancy in terms of length of time between secondary completion and II notifications? Is it generally true that it is a good sign if you receive II very fast? (<2wks)
Should I assume that my app is generally weaker/stronger if generally I hear back from school with II quickly/slowly?

As you might have guesses, I am asking because I would like to find a way to reduce the stress of waiting for II by knowing a little more about the process. Thank you very much!

 

[Goro]

It depends how many people the school has working in their Admissions office (they might have to deal with other parts of the university too, like, say, the Law or Dental school), and how many apps they receive.

Dear @hushcom

Why the discrepancy in terms of length of time between secondary completion and II notifications? Is it generally true that it is a good sign if you receive II very fast? (<2wks)
Should I assume that my app is generally weaker/stronger if generally I hear back from school with II quickly/slowly?

As you might have guesses, I am asking because I would like to find a way to reduce the stress of waiting for II by knowing a little more about the process. Thank you very much!

 

[FFH]

It depends how many people the school has working in their Admissions office (they might have to deal with other parts of the university too, like, say, the Law or Dental school), and how many apps they receive.

Oh It's Goro! I was hoping you could chip in! Lucky me! Thank you for the info. What if someone who completed secondary on the same day as I did or even after me, what could be some of the reasons that I have not yet hear back from the school, while the other applicants get an II? No hard feelings, just curious to know.

 

[killthemoonlight]

Hopefully this question can be answered in this thread. I'm in the process of reapplying. One secondary question asks me to explain any bumps in my academic performance. My stats are 3.37 GPA, 26 MCAT (April 2013). Most recently (July 2014), I retook the MCAT and scored a point lower. I attribute this to working full-time while studying. Should I acknowledge this in the secondary question? My wording is along the lines of "I recognize that in my medical training, I will have to learn to make sacrifices, given the rigours of the training, to fully focus on my academics. However, I was unable to take time off from my job, etc. while studying and my score reflects this. [If I don't get in this cycle*], I plan to go the post-bacc route, etc., etc. and refocus my time and energy on building a stronger application.

I'm a non-trad applying to state schools (TX) and eight DO schools (GPA is 3.5 on AACOMAS). I'm a Hispanic male, not disadvantaged/URM. Pretty decent ECs -- 3 years working in underserved clinic as a Nutritionist, fluent in Spanish. Needless to say, this won't fully compensate for my numbers. This isn't intended as a "What are my chances" type question; rather, I want some feedback on how I should address the secondary question. Thanks for your time!

*Not sure if I should include this fragment

 

[Dr. Retractor]

Hopefully this question can be answered in this thread. I'm in the process of reapplying. One secondary question asks me to explain any bumps in my academic performance. My stats are 3.37 GPA, 26 MCAT (April 2013). Most recently (July 2014), I retook the MCAT and scored a point lower. I attribute this to working full-time while studying. Should I acknowledge this in the secondary question? My wording is along the lines of "I recognize that in my medical training, I will have to learn to make sacrifices, given the rigours of the training, to fully focus on my academics. However, I was unable to take time off from my job, etc. while studying and my score reflects this. [If I don't get in this cycle*], I plan to go the post-bacc route, etc., etc. and refocus my time and energy on building a stronger application.

I'm a non-trad applying to state schools (TX) and eight DO schools (GPA is 3.5 on AACOMAS). I'm a Hispanic male, not disadvantaged/URM. Pretty decent ECs -- 3 years working in underserved clinic as a Nutritionist, fluent in Spanish. Needless to say, this won't fully compensate for my numbers. This isn't intended as a "What are my chances" type question; rather, I want some feedback on how I should address the secondary question. Thanks for your time!

*Not sure if I should include this fragment

Hispanic = URM, whether you're 'disadvantaged' or not.

 

[Blueberries11]

Sorry to post about this here. I moved it to the relevant thread.

 

[killthemoonlight]

Hispanic = URM, whether you're 'disadvantaged' or not.

Is that so? I was under the impression that URM = Native American, Mexican-American, African American. I am neither of those. Thanks.

 

[Dr. Retractor]

Is that so? I was under the impression that URM = Native American, Mexican-American, African American. I am neither of those. Thanks.

The Hispanic ethnicity is not limited to Mexicans. If you (or your family) are from any of the South American (not sure about Brazil) or Central American countries you are Hispanic. I'm not sure if people from Spain count as Hispanic, but I am fairly sure they are classified as Caucasian.

 

[ReadyToRumble]

The Hispanic ethnicity is not limited to Mexicans. If you (or your family) are from any of the South American (not sure about Brazil) or Central American countries you are Hispanic. I'm not sure if people from Spain count as Hispanic, but I am fairly sure they are classified as Caucasian.

Textbook minority definition is different than URM in medicine. Per AAMC (https://www.aamc.org/initiatives/urm/)

"Underrepresented in medicine means those racial and ethnic populations that are underrepresented in the medical profession relative to their numbers in the general population."

Before June 26, 2003, the AAMC used the term "underrepresented minority (URM)," which consisted of Blacks, Mexican-Americans, Native Americans (that is, American Indians, Alaska Natives, and Native Hawaiians), and mainland Puerto Ricans. The AAMC remains committed to ensuring access to medical education and medicine-related careers for individuals from these four historically underrepresented racial/ethnic groups.​

Hispanic alone doesn't necessarily=URM. That doesn't mean a school's interest might not be piqued by killthemoon's unique experiences as a non-URM Hispanic, but the technical definition isn't the same as what most people on SDN think. Also, AAMC's definition is baseline, schools may also be interested in recruiting other more inclusively defined minority groups and may label killthemoon URM by their school's parameters.

 

[Dr. Retractor]

Textbook minority definition is different than URM in medicine. Per AAMC (https://www.aamc.org/initiatives/urm/)

"Underrepresented in medicine means those racial and ethnic populations that are underrepresented in the medical profession relative to their numbers in the general population."

Before June 26, 2003, the AAMC used the term "underrepresented minority (URM)," which consisted of Blacks, Mexican-Americans, Native Americans (that is, American Indians, Alaska Natives, and Native Hawaiians), and mainland Puerto Ricans. The AAMC remains committed to ensuring access to medical education and medicine-related careers for individuals from these four historically underrepresented racial/ethnic groups.​

Hispanic alone doesn't necessarily=URM. That doesn't mean a school's interest might not be piqued by killthemoon's unique experiences as a non-URM Hispanic, but the technical definition isn't the same as what most people on SDN think. Also, AAMC's definition is baseline, schools may also be interested in recruiting other more inclusively defined minority groups and may label killthemoon URM by their school's parameters.

I may be missing something, but isn't that what they used before that date? I'm Hispanic, not Mexican-American, but I have been told by adcoms at more than one school that I would be considered a URM. So if a person who is Hispanic but not Mexican-American puts that they are Hispanic on their application, would they get screwed for lying?

 

[tantacles]

I may be missing something, but isn't that what they used before that date? I'm Hispanic, not Mexican-American, but I have been told by adcoms at more than one school that I would be considered a URM. So if a person who is Hispanic but not Mexican-American puts that they are Hispanic on their application, would they get screwed for lying?

No. You are a URM.

 

[ReadyToRumble]

I may be missing something, but isn't that what they used before that date? I'm Hispanic, not Mexican-American, but I have been told by adcoms at more than one school that I would be considered a URM. So if a person who is Hispanic but not Mexican-American puts that they are Hispanic on their application, would they get screwed for lying?

AMCAS has two layers of self-identification for Hispanics. You probably chose "Hispanic, Latino, or of Spanish origin," which is correct for you according to what you've told us. Under that it wanted you to check any of the following: Argentinean, Colombian, Cuban, Dominican, Mexican/Chicano, Peruvian, Puerto Rican, Other. You would not have checked, "Mexican/Chicano". It's all optional though and as I said, AMCAS is baseline. If you checked "Hispanic" and then "Other" some schools may in fact still consider you URM for their own criteria, others go strictly by AMCAS parameters (e.g. Hopkins: http://www.hopkinsmedicine.org/Medicine/diversity/urm_definition.html). Just check what you think correctly identifies you (if you want, it's optional) and let the cards fall where they may for each school.

Edit: Adcoms LizzyM and gyngyn have also touched on this earlier this year: http://forums.studentdoctor.net/thr...an-half-hispanic-chances-at-top-tier.1077981/ Here are some highlights:

Post #11, LizzyM: ...Unless your ethnicity is Mexican, mainland Puerto Rican, or perhaps Central American, or Dominican, your Hispanic heritage will not get you much traction....

Post #14, gyngyn: Identifying as Hispanic is not equivalent to being under-represented in medicine. Some Hispanics are actually over-represented. Language skills are always appreciated, so it is not too late to start working on that.

Post #15, LizzyM: ...Every medical school can choose to define URM as it chooses. If your mother's country of origin puts you into URM territory, then you might do well, even at top tier schools. Others may note that you don't speak Spanish or seem to have ties to US immigrants from that country and disregard your Hispanic ethnicity. (The point is to find applicants who will go into underserved communities and be identified as a member of those communities. If your last name isn't Hispanic and you don't speak Spanish or have experience with the community, what's the point?)...

 

[typoncho]

I had a question about an interview:
I thought that my interviews went great and were mostly conversational and I received great positive feedback from both interviewers. However, I did fumble one question with one interviewer about "why here?". My problem was that I was trying to recall specific things (statistics and such) that stood out to me during my research on the school but for whatever reason drew a complete blank. After a bit of a more than pregnant pause I simply came up with a generic response that was sincere, but lacked any true specifics. How would this harm my chances of acceptance in light of an otherwise superb interview? Thanks for your feedback!

 

[lnvictus]

There's a possibility that I won't have time to take a second English class to fulfill the English prerequisite for med school admissions before I graduate. I know that taking a required science class at other institutions is frowned upon, but does this apply for English classes as well?

 

[road2md]

Hi everyone,

I was on an admissions committee for three years, so I hope I can help answer some of these questions as well.

I so totally agree with your last point. I was one of those people during college. Chose to do community service with APO instead of doing research because I truly love the former and have zero passion for the latter.

How much would it hurt a candidate if they attended a top 20 undergrad that was well-known for being a research powerhouse but chose not to do any research? I've grown a lot during my 4 years as an undergrad, had my fair share of ups and downs, and cherish most of those experiences. They just didn't include research.

Ace khalifa - Agree with hushcom. Not every school will approach this the same way, but adcoms are generally more interested in how strongly you pursued whatever it is you are passionate about, even if it is not research. However, you will likely have to do some degree of research during medical school for applying into residency programs, so it wouldn't hurt to get started now.

@hushcom, thank you in advance:

1. When evaluating GPA, how do you factor in the rigor of an undergraduate pre-med program from notoriously difficult top 20 institutions (or those with grade deflation) such as Princeton, UChicago, Johns Hopkins, MIT, and Cal Tech?

2. How do you view non-research based summer programs such as SMDEP? In comparison, how do you view research based summer programs?

3. How do you consider research that was done in correspondence with a semester long class?

4. Does double majoring in unrelated subjects make an applicant more attractive?

Beach_Bum -
1. Some committees do consider the rigor of your undergrad program. but the boost is marginal, if any.
2. I'm not too familiar with SMDEP, but it sounds like this program could be more beneficial for your overall growth than a summer research program may, but I'm not too sure about this. My advice is generic, but remember that you get what you put into it -- whatever it is that you do.
3. Aided by class or not, what's really important is what you've learned (e.g., specific research skills, how to think like a scientist) and what publications you got out of it. Generally, these classes help guide your research, so you don't just end up as a lab drone.
4. Yes... but not necessarily with strict bonus points according to some criteria. For example, if you double major in a non-science major that requires a lot of reading and critical thinking, it may help you for the MCAT. It will also likely help you with your interviews, as your perspective on different issues will likely be unique.

I had a question about an interview:
I thought that my interviews went great and were mostly conversational and I received great positive feedback from both interviewers. However, I did fumble one question with one interviewer about "why here?". My problem was that I was trying to recall specific things (statistics and such) that stood out to me during my research on the school but for whatever reason drew a complete blank. After a bit of a more than pregnant pause I simply came up with a generic response that was sincere, but lacked any true specifics. How would this harm my chances of acceptance in light of an otherwise superb interview? Thanks for your feedback!

typoncho - This really depends on the philosophy of the adcom and the interviewers. If you rocked the interview, you are a stellar applicant, and it was just the "why here" question that you fumbled, I would look past that, offer you an acceptance and let YOU decide. Because if you don't want to go to that school in the end, they'll eventually offer their acceptance to someone else on their wait list. Believe it or not though, interviewers do realize that you may a little bit nervous during a medical school interview!

 

[Syndicate101]

I know this topic has been touched a lot of times but I always see answers on both sides. It'd be nice to hear from an adcom. Exactly how much influence does your major have on your app? I'm planning to major in psych, something I know I will enjoy learning, and I'm afraid it will be looked at as an "easy" major. Say a neuroscience major with identical stats as a psych major applied. Would you give preference to one?

 

[OrbitalOverload]

We talk it out. The experienced members can advocate an appropriate outcome with relative ease. Occasionally things get contentious, but those times are the exception.

If you had to pick out a couple of traits that these discussions usually focus on, what would they be? Which characteristics are the most often recognized by interviews and discussed as either a make or break over these conversations?

 

[Pericynthion]

Hi Hushcom, thanks for taking the time to answer more questions. I've read through the previous pages and your replies are very helpful.

I hope you can answer a question of mine: how much will my late application hurt me?
I sent in my primary application June 18 and I finished my secondaries (22 of them) in middle of July. My 2nd MCAT score was finally released to the score a few days ago (August 26th) but I'm still waiting on my school's committee letter to be sent out. Judging by their status updates, my letter should be out either Labour Day week or the week after.

I know it's out of my hands now but I'm just wondering if I shot myself in the foot having an application complete only by September...
If it helps, ny stats are cGPA 3.8, sGPA 3.88, MCAT 35 (balanced) and I'm waiting for my committee letter from Cornell.

Thank you in advance for your advice : )

 

[Nerdette]

Howdy Hushcom. EDIT: and all participating adcoms! Thank you for this generous thread. I'd like to get your opinion on how MCAT scores are viewed for non-traditional applicants with graduate degrees. A little background...I'm a 34 yr old caucasian female E01 applicant with a PhD in biomedical sciences. As you can imagine it has been quite some time since I've taken my under-grad pre reqs and although I have a sGPA 3.75 and cGPA 3.8 I fear my MCAT will be in the high 20's due to working full-time and being years out from my undergrad courses. Do adcoms take these challenges into consideration? Does having an advanced science degree (3.95 GPA) help my chances at overcoming a lackluster MCAT score? Also, I'm obviously a late applicant this cycle and am prepared to apply again next year. I applied as disadvantaged due to circumstances growing up. Next year, would you suggest that I do not self-identify as disadvantaged due to my age and level of independence? It was hard for me to decide but ultimately made my decision based on the fact that I'm still being judged on my performance from when I was 19yrs old so...

 

[uwgmed]

@hushcom

Thanks for doing this, I have gleaned a lot of great info from this thread. I apologize if my questions were specifically addressed earlier in the thread.

1. How much would it hurt an applicant if they have a couple of semesters with class loads just below full time, say 9 to 11 credit hours, if the applicant has a 3.9 or better GPA and heavy (13 to 17 credit hours, and 8 in the summer) upper level science course loads during their senior year to compensate?

2. What is your opinion of TA experience in upper level science classes? How useful is that on an application?

3. How much does college major influence your opinion of someone's GPA? Specifically, is there a significant advantage for someone with a major in chemistry vs. biology vs. liberal arts major if they all have the same GPA?

4. What are the most important factors you look for when analyzing the significance of someone's ECs, both medical and non-medical? For example, I've been told that many adcoms value "quality" of the experience over just racking up a bunch of hours. Does 5-6 years of volunteer experience in youth sports coaching and church-organized community programs provide a solid non-medical volunteering background?

5. You mentioned earlier that research experience is not very valuable if there were not multiple publications. Does this mean that a year or two of research with only one pub is virtually useless?


Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk

 

[Lakedays]

Awww - I fear we've chased all Adcoms away!! But I do have a question in terms of clinical experience vs volunteer work in general. Working full time is hard to fit in volunteer hours that are clinically based. I've chosen a few projects that are more community based and in mentorship to high schools students. What about tutoring where the hourly rate is good, but it's also true that the content is fun for me and sharing the enthusiasm to see positive results is rewarding?

 

[Goro]

Since hushcom is taking a break, allow me to chime in:

Tutoring and getting paid for it is a job.

Tutoring for free is an altruistic endeavor.

Awww - I fear we've chased all Adcoms away!! But I do have a question in terms of clinical experience vs volunteer work in general. Working full time is hard to fit in volunteer hours that are clinically based. I've chosen a few projects that are more community based and in mentorship to high schools students. What about tutoring where the hourly rate is good, but it's also true that the content is fun for me and sharing the enthusiasm to see positive results is rewarding?

I'm OK with it.
1. How much would it hurt an applicant if they have a couple of semesters with class loads just below full time, say 9 to 11 credit hours, if the applicant has a 3.9 or better GPA and heavy (13 to 17 credit hours, and 8 in the summer) upper level science course loads during their senior year to compensate?

I don't pay much attention to TA'ing when this activity is listed.
2. What is your opinion of TA experience in upper level science classes? How useful is that on an application?

Plays no role. We don't care about majors or minors, only that you do well in them
3. How much does college major influence your opinion of someone's GPA? Specifically, is there a significant advantage for someone with a major in chemistry vs. biology vs. liberal arts major if they all have the same GPA?


LizzyM defined much better than I did, but it boils down to your helping enrich someone else's life. Serive for others is looked very highly upon. My particular soft spots are Habitat for Humanity, military service, TFA, or any teaching at the public school level, Americorps, Peace Corps, volunteering in nursing homes, camps for sick children or hospice.

4. What are the most important factors you look for when analyzing the significance of someone's ECs, both medical and non-medical? For example, I've been told that many adcoms value "quality" of the experience over just racking up a bunch of hours.

Knowing what the soccer coaches have to go through with my kids' soccer league, I'd say this is very altruistic. Church-0based helping programs are fine, missionary work is not as valued.
Does 5-6 years of volunteer experience in youth sports coaching and church-organized community programs provide a solid non-medical volunteering background?

I will disagree with my learned colleague on that one, but you should have a LOR from your PI prooving you were int he lab and contributing.
5. You mentioned earlier that research experience is not very valuable if there were not multiple publications. Does this mean that a year or two of research with only one pub is virtually useless?

This will probably depend upon the schools you're aiming for. Keep in mind that it's a seller's market and so MD schools can afford to turn away many highly qualified people. On the other hand, people with a non-trad background do get cut some slack. BUT, MD schools also view MS or PhD grades with suspicion, because of the high degree of grade inflation in grad programs, and the nature of the classwork doesn't mimic the rigor of medical school classes. But people do get into MD programs with MCATs in the high 20s, but you can likely rule out Harvard or Stanford. key thing will be to apply strategically.

I'd like to get your opinion on how MCAT scores are viewed for non-traditional applicants with graduate degrees. A little background...I'm a 34 yr old caucasian female E01 applicant with a PhD in biomedical sciences. As you can imagine it has been quite some time since I've taken my under-grad pre reqs and although I have a sGPA 3.75 and cGPA 3.8 I fear my MCAT will be in the high 20's due to working full-time and being years out from my undergrad courses. Do adcoms take these challenges into consideration? Does having an advanced science degree (3.95 GPA) help my chances at overcoming a lackluster MCAT score?

 

[typoncho]

I know there is much controversy over military service adding (3-5) theoretical LizzyM points to an applicant. If this is true, what does it say for an applicant who has a below average MCAT? Since there is a definite relationship between low MCAT and performing poorly on Step 1, does military service speak to the applicant's ability and discipline in overcoming obstacles, or does it simply give an Adcom more willingness to take a chance on the applicant?

 

[Goro]

We're cognizant enough to recognize that we're not doing anyone any favors by admitting people who can't handle medical school.

Thus, a veteran/non-trad/URM/fill-in-blank-for-desired-demographic here with an MCAT of 20 will not get accepted, even a Medal of Honor winner. However, a vet with a 26 will likely be cut some slack.


And for MCAT scores, it's the scores <25 that specifically indicate risk, not a linear correlation running from 30 downwards to 20.

I know there is much controversy over military service adding (3-5) theoretical LizzyM points to an applicant. If this is true, what does it say for an applicant who has a below average MCAT? Since there is a definite relationship between low MCAT and performing poorly on Step 1, does military service speak to the applicant's ability and discipline in overcoming obstacles, or does it simply give an Adcom more willingness to take a chance on the applicant?

 

[jagster92]

@Goro Glad to see your opinion of hospice. It's something I've found great meaning in myself. I know you mentioned your thoughts on quite a bit of ECs. What do you think of competing in intercollegiate sports? I'm not at a big NCAA school, but I do captain the team and it's at least something that's enjoyable to me.

 

[Goro]

I have an immense respect for student athletes who can maintain a high GPA. Those who try to reason that "I was a D1 lineman and maintained a B avg" don't generate the same amount of love.

@Goro Glad to see your opinion of hospice. It's something I've found great meaning in myself. I know you mentioned your thoughts on quite a bit of ECs. What do you think of competing in intercollegiate sports? I'm not at a big NCAA school, but I do captain the team and it's at least something that's enjoyable to me.

 

[nolookpass]

If you were to put aside 3 months dedicated to just studying for the MCAT, with no EC's, job, or schooling, does this look bad/frowned upon. Meaning a gap year and you dedicated a portion of that year simply to studying for the MCAT.

 

[Goro]

I don't have a problem with it, unless one does poorly. Some people might use the logic of "you should be able to walk and chew gum at the same time and both do stuff and study for MCAT", but it's never been raised as an issue where I am.

If you were to put aside 3 months dedicated to just studying for the MCAT, with no EC's, job, or schooling, does this look bad/frowned upon. Meaning a gap year and you dedicated a portion of that year simply to studying for the MCAT.

 

[jagster92]

Idk how familiar you are with II across the board for MD schools, but what would be the best timeframe for me to take off during my app year to get the best bang for my free time to attend interviews? I only get one 6wk module off from May to May.

 

[nolookpass]

I don't have a problem with it, unless one does poorly. Some people might use the logic of "you should be able to walk and chew gum at the same time and both do stuff and study for MCAT", but it's never been raised as an issue where I am.

Thanks I appreciate the quick response. I hope all schools have that same mentality for my sake

 

[uwgmed]

Since hushcom is taking a break, allow me to chime in:

Tutoring and getting paid for it is a job.

Tutoring for free is an altruistic endeavor.





I'm OK with it.
1. How much would it hurt an applicant if they have a couple of semesters with class loads just below full time, say 9 to 11 credit hours, if the applicant has a 3.9 or better GPA and heavy (13 to 17 credit hours, and 8 in the summer) upper level science course loads during their senior year to compensate?

I don't pay much attention to TA'ing when this activity is listed.
2. What is your opinion of TA experience in upper level science classes? How useful is that on an application?

Plays no role. We don't care about majors or minors, only that you do well in them
3. How much does college major influence your opinion of someone's GPA? Specifically, is there a significant advantage for someone with a major in chemistry vs. biology vs. liberal arts major if they all have the same GPA?


LizzyM defined much better than I did, but it boils down to your helping enrich someone else's life. Serive for others is looked very highly upon. My particular soft spots are Habitat for Humanity, military service, TFA, or any teaching at the public school level, Americorps, Peace Corps, volunteering in nursing homes, camps for sick children or hospice.

4. What are the most important factors you look for when analyzing the significance of someone's ECs, both medical and non-medical? For example, I've been told that many adcoms value "quality" of the experience over just racking up a bunch of hours.

Knowing what the soccer coaches have to go through with my kids' soccer league, I'd say this is very altruistic. Church-0based helping programs are fine, missionary work is not as valued.
Does 5-6 years of volunteer experience in youth sports coaching and church-organized community programs provide a solid non-medical volunteering background?

I will disagree with my learned colleague on that one, but you should have a LOR from your PI prooving you were int he lab and contributing.
5. You mentioned earlier that research experience is not very valuable if there were not multiple publications. Does this mean that a year or two of research with only one pub is virtually useless?

This will probably depend upon the schools you're aiming for. Keep in mind that it's a seller's market and so MD schools can afford to turn away many highly qualified people. On the other hand, people with a non-trad background do get cut some slack. BUT, MD schools also view MS or PhD grades with suspicion, because of the high degree of grade inflation in grad programs, and the nature of the classwork doesn't mimic the rigor of medical school classes. But people do get into MD programs with MCATs in the high 20s, but you can likely rule out Harvard or Stanford. key thing will be to apply strategically.

I'd like to get your opinion on how MCAT scores are viewed for non-traditional applicants with graduate degrees. A little background...I'm a 34 yr old caucasian female E01 applicant with a PhD in biomedical sciences. As you can imagine it has been quite some time since I've taken my under-grad pre reqs and although I have a sGPA 3.75 and cGPA 3.8 I fear my MCAT will be in the high 20's due to working full-time and being years out from my undergrad courses. Do adcoms take these challenges into consideration? Does having an advanced science degree (3.95 GPA) help my chances at overcoming a lackluster MCAT score?

Thanks for the input. While some of my volunteering would probably fall under your definition of "missionary work", I would like to mention that the programs I was involved in helped to give a lot of kids a place to go and things to do in a positive environment when they needed it most, it isn't driven by carelessly trying to gain converts, although sadly there are certainly people and programs that follow that mentality. I also spent time in church-directed programs that provided things like free food, clothes and other household items, and home improvement for the underprivileged. My clinical volunteering experience is at a free clinic for the underprivileged.





Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk

 

[Goro]

It's impossible to answer this because it depends upon the schools you applied to and their applicant pool.

Idk how familiar you are with II across the board for MD schools, but what would be the best timeframe for me to take off during my app year to get the best bang for my free time to attend interviews? I only get one 6wk module off from May to May.

Volunteering to do something similar to your job is not the same thing as your job, so I'd call it a good thing.

how would adcoms look on volunteering related closely to a job? For example, I'm trying to set up a best buddies group for my students with disabilities at my school but that would be an entirely voluntary position for me. Would that count as volunteering even though it's at my workplace?

Also, if I'm just starting out what should I really focus on to make myself as competitive as possible (especially for DO)? Right now I'm teaching full time in a title 1 school with students with very severe disabilities, looking for a hospital to volunteer at, have some previous volunteering (different types in high school, college, and grad school), and around a c3.6/s3.5 GPA. I don't want to overextend myself with too many ECs when I start classes.

 

[SSSMDt]

Is being an Eagle Scout something that may impress an interviewer or potentially help ones chance get into medical school? Or is that something that wouldn't be considered very much?

 

[jagster92]

It's impossible to answer this because it depends upon the schools you applied to and their applicant pool.

Ha alright I might just use the random method then. Thanks for everything you do on here! I might just cite SDN as my faculty advisor this semester.

 

[Ailleurs]

[...]Medical education is incredibly standardized, and you should focus on getting into a place that fits your goals, personality, and (most importantly) debt tolerance.

1. How exactly does one go about figuring out which schools fit their personality? Obviously, there will be some factors (whether you prefer suburbia or metropolitan lifestyles) but the subtle nuances? Or were you implying just the basics (suburbia, pros and cons of nearby towns, "gut feeling," etc.)

2. Also lastly, are you aware of any matriculating students who were denied financial aid/loans due to bad credit? I ask because I didn't truly understand financial maturity until 2 years ago and I'm going to have to spend some time building up from my measly 60X score.

 

[socalrulez]

.

 

[Lakedays]

Is your current UG using the grade to compute your current GPA? OR does it show up on your HS transcript to affect your GPA there? (F's don't transfer) so if it was prereq, you'd have to have retaken it regardless. Right?

As for the grade itself, It would be my guess that you didn't communicate (vs miscommunication), so my first inclination would be to stop putting blame outside yourself in any explanation. You screwed up (is a W or I really something to commend either?). By the time you apply to medical school you will have at least four additional years of maturity on your side plus UG GPA, MCAT, plus clinical experience plus research. My advice is focus on doing the best you can on things you can control, and this HS CC grade aint one of them. If it gives you any comfort, there's a space to explain additional information on the primary. Not sure this is where you might explain it to adcoms, but I am not convinced it falls anywhere close to doom and gloom.

Of course, this is just opinion and so I will be anxious to read what Adcoms think!

 

[Goro]

Only if there are current or former scouts on the Adcom.

Is being an Eagle Scout something that may impress an interviewer or potentially help ones chance get into medical school? Or is that something that wouldn't be considered very much?

Many medical schools place emphasis on the last 2-3 years of your transcript, so a strong upward trend counts for much.

If I got an F in a CC course in HS (misunderstanding between me and the prof, difficult circumstances and should have been given an I or a W but was put on transcript as F, hoping for a retroactive change to W), but have been killing it in undergrad (4.0 freshman year, 3.8ish sophomore year), will the AMCAS gpa factor into keeping me from getting interviews? That stupid F is lowering my cgpa/sgpa about .2-.3, and I'm hoping schools see that it was in HS and will be forgiving, but part of me thinks top tier schools will look at the amcas numbers and be wary of giving me a chance.
Edit: Also is this situation similar to doing poorly in freshman year and pulling grades up sophomore year and beyond? I hear more of those types of stories turning up fine, but I wasn't sure if my circumstances are similar enough

Check the school's mission statement and ask current students in the school-specific thread here. Also, find out what kind of curriculum they use. Some people really like PBL style environments. You should definitely consider if you want o live in a big vs small city or urban vs rural, East Coast vs West vs Midwest vs South.

How exactly does one go about figuring out which schools fit their personality? Obviously, there will be some factors (whether you prefer suburbia or metropolitan lifestyles) but the subtle nuances? Or were you implying just the basics (suburbia, pros and cons of nearby towns, "gut feeling," etc.)

Never heard of it happening, but this is not my area of expertise.
2. Also lastly, are you aware of any matriculating students who were denied financial aid/loans due to bad credit? I ask because I didn't truly understand financial maturity until 2 years ago and I'm going to have to spend some time building up from my measly 60X score.

 

[acslater99]

I will be getting my AA degree this spring, so my question will be based on transferring to a prestigious school .

As of right now I have a 4.00 GPA, and I go to a CC. I have the option to transfer to a prestigious school that so happens to have grade deflation.

Knowing that adcoms see a decline in GPA as a red flag. Would one still think it is a red flag even though I went to a prestigious school, knowing they deflate grades?

Would adcoms brush it off?

I need to know because I'm in the process of applying to university's and I don't want to make a bad decision as to where I end up.

Thank you for reading.


Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk

 

[BackpackerAT]

Do you look down upon someone with a 3.75 who goes to an Ivy League school known for grade inflation? Would you consider this gpa to be lower given the reputation for grade inflation?

 

[Goro]

Most Adcom members have little knowledge of which schools grade deflate, inflate or whatever. The Deans of Admissions have a better understanding of this.

In our discussions of borderline candidates (meaning someone who was borderline int he interview, not on paper), occasionally someone will say, "this kid got a 3.5 at {big name school} , that's got to count for something." We consider that for a second or two, and then move on to a decision. To me, a 4.0 is a 4.0, whether it's from Harvard, U Chicago, or Kutztown State. A 3.0 at U Chicago is not going to get me excited like a 4.0 from Kutztown State; we simply do NOT view them as equivalent.


Do you look down upon someone with a 3.75 who goes to an Ivy League school known for grade inflation? Would you consider this gpa to be lower given the reputation for grade inflation?[/QUOTE]


We expect you to excel no matter where you go.
I will be getting my AA degree this spring, so my question will be based on transferring to a prestigious school .
As of right now I have a 4.00 GPA, and I go to a CC. I have the option to transfer to a prestigious school that so happens to have grade deflation.
Knowing that adcoms see a decline in GPA as a red flag. Would one still think it is a red flag even though I went to a prestigious school, knowing they deflate grades?
Would adcoms brush it off?
I need to know because I'm in the process of applying to university's and I don't want to make a bad decision as to where I end up.

 

[Ace Khalifa]

Most Adcom members have little knowledge of which schools grade deflate, inflate or whatever. The Deans of Admissions have a better understanding of this.

In our discussions of borderline candidates (meaning someone who was borderline int he interview, not on paper), occasionally someone will say, "this kid got a 3.5 at {big name school} , that's got to count for something." We consider that for a second or two, and then move on to a decision. To me, a 4.0 is a 4.0, whether it's from Harvard, U Chicago, or Kutztown State. A 3.0 at U Chicago is not going to get me excited like a 4.0 from Kutztown State; we simply do NOT view them as equivalent.


Do you look down upon someone with a 3.75 who goes to an Ivy League school known for grade inflation? Would you consider this gpa to be lower given the reputation for grade inflation?

Wait, so does that mean the caliber of a school's academic rigor and premed program doesn't matter? I am grateful to have graduated from WUSTL with a 3.7+, and I know for a fact that there is absolutely no grade inflation (there might actually be deflation). Is the typical premed argument that "you should go to the most prestigious university you can" entirely wrong, then? Sorry, I just don't want to feel like my time at WUSTL was a complete waste.