Another Adcom, ask me (almost) anything

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ridethecliche said:
Depends on whether the stuff has been done before or not. If it's to teach you about research, no, if the Prof/PI is using you guys to do his/her experiments, then potentially.
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No, it hasn't been done before. The professor is using us for his experiment about yeast transformation. But since we are all making posters to be hung in the deartment building, I wasn't sure.
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nkolstate96 said:
No, it hasn't been done before. The professor is using us for his experiment about yeast transformation. But since we are all making posters to be hung in the deartment building, I wasn't sure.
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Honestly, that wouldn't carry much weight.

"I have presented posters as part of my science lab research for a department mixer."

Woop de do.
 
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nkolstate96 said:
Okay great! Also, my university developed a program this year that randomly chose 1/3 of the intro bio labs, and put us in a research curriculum instead of the traditional lab, where we are required to separate into groups, analyze yeast transformation and gene expression for a particular gene (different for each group), and make a poster.
Can I count this as research, even though I didn't choose to be involved in it?
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I am not an authority, however I can tell you this: No matter what research you conduct, make sure you are able to intelligently describe the process and its intended/actual outcomes. Not being able to describe what you did in the lab is a huge mistake many pre-med students make while interviewing. Moreover, anything you do that could be contributed to medical school should be documented. No matter what I do, I write down addresses, staff, time spent, and I also log a journal of the exact activities I did.
Ask Goro if that counts as valid research; I don't see why not, so long as you can speak about it intelligently.
 
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Hi Goro.
I was wondering if volunteering at the local fire dept in our rural town would classify as non-medical volunteering or not? I am also an EMT who has volunteered countless hours in a rural city and now I get paid. Wondering about Search and Rescue as well. It is somewhat medical but mostly also being able to think fast and use my climbing skills. Not sure if I should volunteer in a more care based place like hospice? I've always just done what I love and not worried about checking off every box for med school. But just wanted your opinion.
Thanks!
 
ridethecliche said:
Honestly, that wouldn't carry much weight.

"I have presented posters as part of my science lab research for a department mixer."

Woop de do.
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Yeah, that's why I hadn't considered even bringing it up, because it's an activity for freshmen, picked randomly, and required very little work other than a paper.
But as usual, everyone else in the lab is high-tailing it to the advisor's office to make this lab a part of their med school resume.:rolleyes:
 
I'm very critical of people who use a lab course as a research experience. The poster wouldn't count, unless you took it to a scientific meeting.

Okay great! Also, my university developed a program this year that randomly chose 1/3 of the intro bio labs, and put us in a research curriculum instead of the traditional lab, where we are required to separate into groups, analyze yeast transformation and gene expression for a particular gene (different for each group), and make a poster.
Can I count this as research, even though I didn't choose to be involved in it?

Fire fighter and S&R to me = non-clinical. EMT or paramedic= clinical. I do recommend something with more traditional patient based contact, such as clinic, hospice, nursing home, or hospital. I have a high opinion of anyone who volunteers in a hospice!

I was wondering if volunteering at the local fire dept in our rural town would classify as non-medical volunteering or not? I am also an EMT who has volunteered countless hours in a rural city and now I get paid. Wondering about Search and Rescue as well. It is somewhat medical but mostly also being able to think fast and use my climbing skills. Not sure if I should volunteer in a more care based place like hospice? I've always just done what I love and not worried about checking off every box for med school.


SO true!!!
...however I can tell you this: No matter what research you conduct, make sure you are able to intelligently describe the process and its intended/actual outcomes. Not being able to describe what you did in the lab is a huge mistake many pre-med students make while interviewing.
 
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How do the socioeconomic status (SES) indicators work? I meet the EO-1 status under this indicator and did have a job before I was 18, but I did not have to contribute to the family income. I did have to use that money for college expenses, though. I also received Pell Grants.

Actually, does it count as contributing towards the family income if your parents would sometimes take your money without telling you? Sometimes, it would be paid back, sometimes not.
 
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It's not anything the Adcom pays attention to. This is probably the domain of Admissions deans.
Doug Underhill said:
How do the socioeconomic status (SES) indicators work? I meet the EO-1 status under this indicator and did have a job before I was 18, but I did not have to contribute to the family income. I did have to use that money for college expenses, though. I also received Pell Grants.

Actually, does it count as contributing towards the family income if your parents would sometimes take your money without telling you? Sometimes, it would be paid back, sometimes not.
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How are interviewees assessed in the mmi format? Would performing well in the majority of the stations help compensate for the ones you did worse in?
 
We haven't done this interview format, so I have no knowledge of it. It's supposed to be good for sussing out who will make an empathic physician, I'm told.

cornchiu said:
How are interviewees assessed in the mmi format? Would performing well in the majority of the stations help compensate for the ones you did worse in?
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cornchiu said:
Would performing well in the majority of the stations help compensate for the ones you did worse in?
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Every single school that I've done an mmi at has said that "one bad station won't keep you out of medical school." Many schools end up averaging the scores AND some drop your lowest. They try to minimize the stress of these things as best they can, without completely sugar-coating it.
 
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How would you feel about an applicant who has plenty of volunteer stuff with patient contact in outpatient settings, but none in a hospital?
 
Along with that, you mentioned, Goro, that you'd like to see more traditional clinical experience in addition to being an EMT and involved with Search and Rescue. I've been both a street EMT and on a SAR team for a while, and my hospital volunteering right now is clinical research...in an ER. Would you advise me to branch out from emergency medicine? This summer I did volunteer in a clinic on weekends, but one summer of non-EM clinical experience doesn't seem too substantial (to me as a non-trad with many summers under my belt!), and I'm concerned that's a weak area on my application. Thanks!
 
nkolstate96 said:
Thank you for answering our questions!
I'm currently unable to work or volunteer outside of school full-time, because I share my car with my mother (2 weeks with it, 2 weeks without it)
I participate in other volunteer efforts through miscellaneous service clubs, but nothing I attend weekly or more frequently.
in an attempt to be productive until I can have my own mode of transportation, I've developed a program with my local Women's hospital where I donate hand-made crocheted baby blankets to their NICU. I'm hoping that through this interaction, I may establish a rapport with the volunteer staff and be able to volunteer there once I can nab a permanent mode of transportation.
Is this a good EC/volunteer effort to participate in until I get a car full-time? I enjoy making these blankets, and I hope I may use this on my app so adcoms don't think I wasted my freshman year doing nothing.

Thanks again and I hope to hear from you soon!
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I am no adcom... but are you at a big school? Every university has an outpatient clinic at the least...so you can at least see if you can hang around there for your freshman year. It may be difficult to get in, but if you explained your hardship, it might work.
What you are doing is an awesome thing though!
 
100% fine with that, and other non-hospital venues as well. I have a very high opinion of anyone who works in a hospice, for example.

Doug Underhill said:
How would you feel about an applicant who has plenty of volunteer stuff with patient contact in outpatient settings, but none in a hospital?
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Your experience is fine!

I've been both a street EMT and on a SAR team for a while, and my hospital volunteering right now is clinical research...in an ER. Would you advise me to branch out from emergency medicine? This summer I did volunteer in a clinic on weekends, but one summer of non-EM clinical experience doesn't seem too substantial (to me as a non-trad with many summers under my belt!), and I'm concerned that's a weak area on my application.
 
How does being labeled 'EO1 disadvantaged' play into a person's application?
 
Just a random question, out of curiosity.. I'm sure you've already answered these.

1. Are you aware of any automated cut offs (Ex. GPA <3.75).
2.a. What value do you put into MCAT scores vs GPA, in relation to 3.0-3.5 gpa and a high MCAT (or vice versa).
2.b. If invited for an interview, what would you ask a student who did better/poorer on his/her MCAT than their GPA would suggest?
 
Goro said:
100% fine with that, and other non-hospital venues as well. I have a very high opinion of anyone who works in a hospice, for example.




Your experience is fine!

I've been both a street EMT and on a SAR team for a while, and my hospital volunteering right now is clinical research...in an ER. Would you advise me to branch out from emergency medicine? This summer I did volunteer in a clinic on weekends, but one summer of non-EM clinical experience doesn't seem too substantial (to me as a non-trad with many summers under my belt!), and I'm concerned that's a weak area on my application.
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I had the opportunity to informal speak (I was one of many random people there) with an admissions counselor at a med school, about a month ago. I asked about the importance of research (which she said they look at but place little importance in) and volunteering even if you've worked your undergrad at a hospital. I was told limited volunteer hours outside of a hospital would essentially be a no-go (in most cases).

Now I'm years out from applying and I'll have no problems with this, but it seems kind of unfair to expect such a high amount volunteering even for those who hold down jobs and have obligations outside of school, no?
 
They do exist, but eyeballs go onto all apps. A machine doesn't do the culling.

1. Are you aware of any automated cut offs (Ex. GPA <3.75).

My Dean (and those at a few other schools) like high MCAT scores. Other schools like high GPAs and will take a lower MCAT. MD schools have the luxury of wanting and getting both.

2.a. What value do you put into MCAT scores vs GPA, in relation to 3.0-3.5 gpa and a high MCAT (or vice versa).

I wouldn't ask a question like that, but someone might ask "there's a big disconnect between your GPA and your MCAT. How come?"

2.b. If invited for an interview, what would you ask a student who did better/poorer on his/her MCAT than their GPA would suggest?

I can't imagine why someone with lots of clinical experience would be penalized by not volunteering in a hospital. that policy might unique to that particular school. Non-trads are expected to show us that they know what they're getting into, etc, but we also tend to cut them some slack because they do, after all, have lives.

I had the opportunity to informal speak (I was one of many random people there) with an admissions counselor at a med school, about a month ago. I asked about the importance of research (which she said they look at but place little importance in) and volunteering even if you've worked your undergrad at a hospital. I was told limited volunteer hours outside of a hospital would essentially be a no-go (in most cases).

Now I'm years out from applying and I'll have no problems with this, but it seems kind of unfair to expect such a high amount volunteering even for those who hold down jobs and have obligations outside of school, no?
 
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At the end of a recent interview, the interviewer tells me, "I hope to see you here next fall." I replied "So do I!!"

Lol was he just being polite or does that mean I have a really high chance to get in? The interview didn't go THAT well, it was kinda average and I've had better for sure, so I'm thinking he was just being polite.
 
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Shams al Deen said:
At the end of a recent interview, the interviewer tells me, "I hope to see you here next fall." I replied "So do I!!"

Lol was he just being polite or does that mean I have a really high chance to get in? The interview didn't go THAT well, it was kinda average and I've had better for sure, so I'm thinking he was just being polite.
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They were probably being polite.

That said, you interviewed therefore you do have a chance... I wouldn't read into it.
 
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Shams al Deen said:
At the end of a recent interview, the interviewer tells me, "I hope to see you here next fall." I replied "So do I!!"

Lol was he just being polite or does that mean I have a really high chance to get in? The interview didn't go THAT well, it was kinda average and I've had better for sure, so I'm thinking he was just being polite.
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I heard that from an interview and was accepted a month later
 
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He was just being polite. We're trained to do that.

Lol was he just being polite or does that mean I have a really high chance to get in? The interview didn't go THAT well, it was kinda average and I've had better for sure, so I'm thinking he was just being polite.
 
Checking back in. @Goro, you are truly a maniac for keeping this thread going. I assumed it died out months ago.
 
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Memberships in professional societies: helpful or fluff? I let my AAAS membership lapse a few years ago.
 
They're not anything I pay attention to.
Doug Underhill said:
Memberships in professional societies: helpful or fluff? I let my AAAS membership lapse a few years ago.
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I do hope that you don't mind me poaching the threads, colleague!

Checking back in. @@Goro, you are truly a maniac for keeping this thread going. I assumed it died out months ago.
 
Shams al Deen said:
At the end of a recent interview, the interviewer tells me, "I hope to see you here next fall." I replied "So do I!!"

Lol was he just being polite or does that mean I have a really high chance to get in? The interview didn't go THAT well, it was kinda average and I've had better for sure, so I'm thinking he was just being polite.
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It was good to express your enthusiasm.
 
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Goro, how does it look if you take a semester off to focus fully on work (without skimping on any volunteering, shadowing, or research) to save up funds to pay for school the next semester (aka financial limitations preventing taking classes that semester)? Especially when it's during a GPA repair post-bacc? Thanks!
 
Perfectly acceptable.


Ailleurs said:
Goro, how does it look if you take a semester off to focus fully on work (without skimping on any volunteering, shadowing, or research) to save up funds to pay for school the next semester (aka financial limitations preventing taking classes that semester)? Especially when it's during a GPA repair post-bacc? Thanks!
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Hi Goro, thank you for your responses in this thread - they've been really helpful to me. :)

I had to take a semester off (with withdrawals for the term) for personal and family reasons during sophomore year and can't really provide documentation for it, and cut off ECs besides research during this time. I don't have 4.0 but my GPA is very high and I don't have a single W outside of the term. Would the withdrawal raise eyebrows?
 
I made the cliche mistake of doing poorly my freshman year of college (C+ in either Bio I or II I don't remember and a C in Bio II Lab). Now lets fast forward to my junior year, after completing a stellar sophomore year of getting mostly A's, I made the mistake of taking organic and physics at the same time which lead me to get C's in both Orgo labs and a C+ in physics II lecture. Will adcoms look down on this even though I spent my senior year overloading on upper level bio courses and getting A's in them (including Biochem, Genetics w/ lab, evolution, etc.)? I ended up graduating with a 3.47 gpa and my EC's are on point.
 
Goro said:
He was just being polite. We're trained to do that.

Lol was he just being polite or does that mean I have a really high chance to get in? The interview didn't go THAT well, it was kinda average and I've had better for sure, so I'm thinking he was just being polite.
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Related question. At the end of one MSTP interview, the interviewer told me, "Well Pluto101, I think you're an excellent candidate, I think you will be accepted, and when you come back for revisit day I want you to talk to me about rotating in my lab."

Obviously that's a good way to end an interview. But to what degree can this be taken literally? I've been telling myself that even if that interviewer was being 100% honest, one positive recommendation is not enough to garner an acceptance.
 
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This sounds like he was being honest and not merely polite.

The decision will be in the hands of the Adcom. If the interviewer attends and can argue for you, you should be fine for an acceptance.

pluto101 said:
Related question. At the end of one MSTP interview, the interviewer told me, "Well Pluto101, I think you're an excellent candidate, I think you will be accepted, and when you come back for revisit day I want you to talk to me about rotating in my lab."

Obviously that's a good way to end an interview. But to what degree can this be taken literally? I've been telling myself that even if that interviewer was being 100% honest, one positive recommendation is not enough to garner an acceptance.
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Hushcom,
How would mentioning religion as a motivator for altruism effect any possible interview decisions? I'm currently in a Christian service based fraternity, and have two ongoing community service projects that are about 6 hours a week for a year now. I love serving others and it's a huge motivator for me to enter medicine. Is there a tactical way to approach it in interviews?
 
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As someone currently working at a pharma startup and looking to go into research (MD/PhD most likely), will the history in pharma cast any doubt on my claims that I truly want to do academic research (vs. a pharma/industry career)? I've seen more than a few old school academics show distaste for people who go into pharma/don't practice after getting an MD. How can I make it clear that I'm not headed down that route?
 
dboyhaaan said:
I made the cliche mistake of doing poorly my freshman year of college (C+ in either Bio I or II I don't remember and a C in Bio II Lab). Now lets fast forward to my junior year, after completing a stellar sophomore year of getting mostly A's, I made the mistake of taking organic and physics at the same time which lead me to get C's in both Orgo labs and a C+ in physics II lecture. Will adcoms look down on this even though I spent my senior year overloading on upper level bio courses and getting A's in them (including Biochem, Genetics w/ lab, evolution, etc.)? I ended up graduating with a 3.47 gpa and my EC's are on point.
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If I may, yes, that will be a strike against you. How could it not be? Plenty of people take orgo and physics at the same time and pull B's or better. No sense dwelling on it, though. If the rest of your record is solid then racking up a few C's won't kill your app.
 
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DrShephardWannabe said:
Hushcom,
How would mentioning religion as a motivator for altruism effect any possible interview decisions? I'm currently in a Christian service based fraternity, and have two ongoing community service projects that are about 6 hours a week for a year now. I love serving others and it's a huge motivator for me to enter medicine. Is there a tactical way to approach it in interviews?
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We have many candidates with similar proclamations of faith interview, and it is generally seen as a positive. It's difficult to argue with service to the community. About the worst I can imagine is if someone asks you about dealing with patients who have markedly different belief systems.
 
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hushcom said:
If I may, yes, that will be a strike against you. How could it not be? Plenty of people take orgo and physics at the same time and pull B's or better. No sense dwelling on it, though. If the rest of your record is solid then racking up a few C's won't kill your app.
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Thanks for the response, I know people are able to do better and I'm sure plenty have been able to even pull off A's. That being said I don't have any other excuse than the courses were simply difficult for me and I gave it all I got. I hope my brutal honesty and the extra courses I did well in up help me down the road.
 
Welcome back, colleague! I will cease poaching on your thread, and look forward to your insight.


hushcom said:
We have many candidates with similar proclamations of faith interview, and it is generally seen as a positive. It's difficult to argue with service to the community. About the worst I can imagine is if someone asks you about dealing with patients who have markedly different belief systems.
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@Goro or @hushcom, how are the levels of competitiveness for candidates who interview later in the season (post January 1st)? I thought I was done with interviewing for awhile after my last one this month, but I am now going to have another interview after the new year. Will I still meet plenty of fellow interviewees who are confident, smart, accomplished, and strong candidates for admission? Or is there a possibility that I will meet mostly candidates who are lackluster compared to those who interview earlier? This question is based off the fact that those who interview early during the season for any given school are usually superstar applicants or otherwise highly competitive for that school.
 
Ace Khalifa said:
@Goro or @hushcom, how are the levels of competitiveness for candidates who interview later in the season (post January 1st)? I thought I was done with interviewing for awhile after my last one this month, but I am now going to have another interview after the new year. Will I still meet plenty of fellow interviewees who are confident, smart, accomplished, and strong candidates for admission? Or is there a possibility that I will meet mostly candidates who are lackluster compared to those who interview earlier? This question is based off the fact that those who interview early during the season for any given school are usually superstar applicants or otherwise highly competitive for that school.
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Well I have a late interview or two and I can assure you I'm thoroughly lackluster :)
 
Dear @Goro or @hushcom

When is it time to start worrying about reapplying? I applied very broadly (21 schools, both MD and DO). I've been very fortunate to receive 8 ii. However, I've been waitlisted at one and deferred to later meetings at 2 others. I am still waiting to hear from 3 post ii, and have 3 interviews in January. I've been rejected pre-ii from 2 schools.

The reason I am so worried is because my GPA is very low (cgpa 3.4, sgpa 3.3, grad GPA from a non-smp hard science program 3.8). My mcat is average at 31 (9 ps 11 v 11 bs) .I am considering submitting more do apps after finals (lecom, western) which I didn't submit earlier because I ran out if funds.

Any advice? Many thanks!!!
 
Is sending a post interview letter of intent before decisions come out a bad idea?
 
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I believe that this will be ignored, unless the school expressly says that they welcome LOI.
Dr Turkelton said:
Is sending a post interview letter of intent before decisions come out a bad idea?
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You should always have a backup plan, and always think in terms of worst-case scenario. So, start thinking about reapplying now, and hope to be pleasantly surprised by a late II.

When is it time to start worrying about reapplying? I applied very broadly (21 schools, both MD and DO). I've been very fortunate to receive 8 ii. However, I've been waitlisted at one and deferred to later meetings at 2 others. I am still waiting to hear from 3 post ii, and have 3 interviews in January. I've been rejected pre-ii from 2 schools.

On the one hand, candidates might be competitive, but on the other hand, as schools fill up their seats, they get much more picky.
how are the levels of competitiveness for candidates who interview later in the season (post January 1st)?


 
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How do you view an applicant who doesn't have much community service, but instead has a lot of time devoted towards TAing classes and research? I only have 1 semester where I volunteered in a hospital for 4 hrs a week, and the rest of my ECs are centered around TAing (have TA'd for 3 classes so far) and research (two summers, one semester).

I feel like my time is better spent TAing than volunteering in the hospital, honestly, but I realize that it may not help me when I am applying.
 
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