Family Practice Today - What is it like??

[OnMyWayThere]

PACtoDOC, I am pasting my private message to you because your box is full.

I wanted to thank you first for answering questions that I posted on the FP thread, you've been a lot of help in clearing up many important facts!
I realize a family doc can focus on dermatology and advertise "Dermatology". I've seen several successful practices doing such out here in Los Angeles. I am wondering, will your malpractice insurance charge you higher premiums because you are not a board certified dermatologist doing those procedures (using Dermatology as an example here, not my particular interest)? Will they even cover you if you screw up since that's not what you were trained to do in your post graduate training? I realize you are given the title of Physician and Surgeon and can do virtually anything that you know how to, but doesn't liability play a factor in this such as those I mentioned (coverage, higher costs, etc.)?

Sorry about the ignorance in this area! I appreciate you filling me in. Thanks a lot!

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[erichaj]

I do these procedures in my office.

I had to pay extra. It is considered under catagory 2 in my state. Catagory 3 would be if I did ER as well. Catagory 2 is the level of Urgent care medicine.

It was not that much more.

EH.

 

[thanks]

I do these procedures in my office.

I had to pay extra. It is considered under catagory 2 in my state. Catagory 3 would be if I did ER as well. Catagory 2 is the level of Urgent care medicine.

It was not that much more.

EH.

If you don't mind sharing, may I ask what state you're in and approximately what premiums run there? Here in AZ I believe our FP's pay 14K per year for the basic premium. And what is the differential for category 2 and 3?

 

[2006MD]

what procedures can you do as an FP in a big city?

 

[novacek88]

Eric

Did you have to attend many seminars or courses to become comfortable with these procedures, or did performing these procedures feel natural to you?

 

[jpro]

Hmm, I'm just trying to wrap around your father's past income. So he made more than a million dollars a year? At a time when a house cost like $10K?

I can just imagine life at your house: "What's that, OnMyWayThere, you want a new car? Sure, Daddy will just work 3 extra hours this week".

It just seems a little unbelievable.

At medicaleconomics.com you can find the average incomes per specialty. FP is beaten by everyone except pediatricians and GPs (which is a dying breed anyway). I have always theorized that the income distribution for FPs has a larger SD than other specialties because of the broad practice scope, though, but I don't know if that's true.

Interesting topic, btw.

I often thought about this also. I think part of the reason these surveys show such low salaries may be due to women starting a family and working less. My wifes last physician worked for a group part time (~20hr/wk) because she had a few kids and didn't want to work that much. She said she was making like 80K, but her husband more than made up for her missed income. There could be many stories like this that bring down the stats. Look at the salary survey for FP (w/o OB) below. It actually goes down at the >3yrs in practice. Maybe thats a typo, but I can't explain it any other way.

http://www.allied-physicians.com/salary_surveys/physician-salaries.htm

 

[8744]

Let me chime in here with my fourth year medical student opinion which is worth what it is worth as I have gleaned it from medical students, residents, practicing FPs, and administrators:

As you may know, I scrambled into Familiy Practice and have only recently learned a little about the compensation available for FPs. I am feeling better and better about it the more I learn.

1. It may be true that the median income for FPs is only 130,000 per year. But it is also true that most of the 130,000 per year jobs I have seen listed are for four days per week of eight hour days. Seems like a pretty good salary for a lifetime of three-day weekends.

2. It is also true that the median income might be dragged down by a few factors. First, the survey does not take into account all forms of compensation. An FP (who wants to do the survey) might dutifully report only his salary but not his production bonus, his moonlighting, or the big chunk of his student loans that many of the jobs I have seen posted agree to pay off (usually in the form of a loan which is forgiven if the doctor stays for a contractually agreed upon time).

Second, there are a few major markets where a glut of all physicians leads to lower slaries. I understand that the 120K and below salaries are typical of the East Coast, the West Coast, and places like Colorado. You take a salary hit for wanting to live in a place where you can get designer sushi at 4 AM. If you are willing to practice in "flyover country," however, not only will greater demand drive up your compensation but the cost of living is lower allowing you to live better. In my hometown (where I plan on returning), $300,000 buys you a 4000 square foot mansion on 2 acres. In San Francisco it buys you what we would call a **** hole here in Louisiana.

Folks. Indianapolis, Omaha, Dubuque, Little Rock, Shreveport, and half a hundred up and coming American cities are great places to live.

I know an FP who told me that in exchange for working in a small town in Louisiana, he got a 16,000/month salary guarantee for three years, a 50,000 loan to pay back his studeent loans which would be forgiven after three years and he practices in an underserved area so the state pays off 15,000 of his student loans per year (for three years).

3. I have been told (so I don't know if its true) that patients are in plentiful supply wherever you go. Consequently, your income is limited to a large extent by how hard you want to work. I imagine that a four-day per week job supplemented with a little moonlighting in an ED or in an urgent care clinic (or even working five days as opposed to four per week) would boost your income considerably.

Are we going to get rich in familiy practice? Probably not. On the other hand we have a three year, relativley benign residency which gives you a lot of flexibility and the opportunity make a respectable amount of money in a useful and respected career. Will we have to work harder than some other specialties to make the same money they can make working four day weeks? Probably but those are the breaks. You can always work 20 hours per week and still make an income which puts you in the top one percent of wage earners in my state. Hell, many of my neighbors salivate at the idea that I will be making the princely sum of $40,000 per year as a resident. This is a lot of money down here. Many families live on about that or less.

 

[dr_almondjoy_do]

Well have you heard of any doctors that travel long distances? I am interested in working in one area that is underserved in the midwest and does compensate well, but if I do this I want to work 3-4 days a week and commute home. I know there are locum tenens jobs that may allow this, but I don't know..

 

[DOtobe]

Hell, many of my neighbors salivate at the idea that I will be making the princely sum of $40,000 per year as a resident. This is a lot of money down here. Many families live on about that or less.

Exactly!

This is why people annoy me who say, "Oh, we will only be making $130k." Only??? In the town I am from this is a ton of money. I will be more than happy to make $130K as an FP.

 

[8744]

Exactly!

This is why people annoy me who say, "Oh, we will only be making $130k." Only??? In the town I am from this is a ton of money. I will be more than happy to make $130K as an FP.

FPs make a lot more than 130K in my neck of the woods. Of course, it depends on how you practice, how much you want to work, and your priorities. 130K is the salary for for a typical four-day-per-week schedule.

I think the only thing you give up salary-wise as an FP compared to other specialities is that you generally have to live in a more rural area to maximize your compensation. This is no sacrifice for me as I want to live in a rural area. If you want to live in the San Francisco Bay area, on the other hand, you might not even be able to afford a decent house as an FP.

Medicaid, for example, only pays 35 dollars for a "well-child" visit in our city but 90 dollars for the exact same visit in a rural area. This is a huge difference, especially since this kind of patient is going to be a big part of your practice in FP (and Peds, of course).

Additionally, there is a shortage of doctors almost everywhere in "flyover country" so you will have plenty of patients wherever you go. There is a huge demand for FPs and other primary care doctors everywhere except the coasts and a few other metropolitan conglomerates.

 

[dr_almondjoy_do]

please define "flyaway" state....i know what i coastal state is, but just making sure..

 

[cooldreams]

please define "flyaway" state....i know what i coastal state is, but just making sure..

i think you mean flyover, and it basically means country that has nothing particularly interesting or any attractions to itlike large cities or museums, operas, famous restaurants, etc.... we are talking about farm land, ranches, swamps, and the like....



http://www.urbandictionary.com/define.php?term=flyover+country&defid=235463

http://www.wordspy.com/words/flyovercountry.asp

 

[8744]

i think you mean flyover, and it basically means country that has nothing particularly interesting or any attractions to itlike large cities or museums, operas, famous restaurants, etc.... we are talking about farm land, ranches, swamps, and the like....



http://www.urbandictionary.com/define.php?term=flyover+country&defid=235463

http://www.wordspy.com/words/flyovercountry.asp

It means a state which is held in disdain by those who live on the coasts even though its inhabitants probably enjoy a higher quality of life for much less money.

For the price that my twin brother paid for a 1400 square foot house in the Boston area you can get a house three times the size with a huge yard and a swimming pool here in Shreveport.

Certainly there is more "culture" in Boston but like Joesph Geobbels when I hear the word "culture" I reach for my revolver.

 

[daelroy]

PACtoDOC, I am pasting my private message to you because your box is full.

I wanted to thank you first for answering questions that I posted on the FP thread, you've been a lot of help in clearing up many important facts!
I realize a family doc can focus on dermatology and advertise "Dermatology". I've seen several successful practices doing such out here in Los Angeles.

There is a caveat to all this A Family Doc can hang "dermatology" on his shingle but he can't hang dermatologist on it. You can practice dermatology much the same way a general dentist can practice orthodontistry. However,a general dentist can't call himself an orthodontis and a Family Doc can't call himself a dermatologist.

The idea of the FP playing the dermatologist is catching on and is becoming pretty common. By the time you graduate, nearly every FP is going to incorporate dermatology and cosmetic procedures in his or her practice. General internists are doing the same thing. It doesn't take much expertise to hire a technician and attend some weekend seminars to acquire some vauge dermatology credentials or be a part of some vague cosmetic/dermatology board. The FP docs that are doing this at the moment are reaping close to a 1/2 a million dollars per year but as more and more FP's and Internists catch on, the market is going to be saturated especially by the time you graduate. And it doesn't help that news organizations like Dateline are allerting the public of the difference between an FP and a dermatologist. At the moment, the public is not aware of any distinction between the two but that will soon change. It has for other procedures.

Don't get me wrong, i don't think there is anything ethically, morally or legally wrong with an FP practicing dermatology. I think this is a turf war issue. But a major reason these FP's are receiving cosmetic related business is the public is pretty ignorant as to what constitutes an FP practicing dermatology vs. a dermatologist much like they don't know the difference between a board certified plastic sugeon vs. a general surgeon/oral surgeon w/a 1 year cosmetic fellowship.

 

[daelroy]

It means a state which is held in disdain by those who live on the coasts even though its inhabitants probably enjoy a higher quality of life for much less money.

For the price that my twin brother paid for a 1400 square foot house in the Boston area you can get a house three times the size with a huge yard and a swimming pool here in Shreveport.

Certainly there is more "culture" in Boston but like Joesph Geobbels when I hear the word "culture" I reach for my revolver.

It's always funny when I hear big city people talk as if small town America is some paradise. I grew up in a small city in Texas much like Shreveport; population was ~ 150K. Let's just say that I'm not white. Growing up there was an experience because your race, religion and nationality is always an issue. Most of the time, it's not a bad issue but you are constantly treated as if you are foreigner despite the fact that I was born and raised in the U.S. and is a red blooded American male just like anyone else. I would get asked all the time why I didn't have an accent when i spoke English. When i told them that I was born and raised in the U.S., they still didn't get it. It was just so unbelievable to them that a person of a different race could speak English with an American accent because they assumed my parents taugh me English so I should have an accent like them. When it came to dating, there were issues too because I wasn't Christian. People would come up to me and say they are going to pray for me because they thought I was going to hell. They would remind me to my face that I was going to hell. Some women wouldn't date me because their parents frowned on dating someone of a different race. It was okay for me to be friends with their daughter but I wasn't allowed to date them.

And lastly, the racial jokes were irritating. In the South and in small towns, people there believe it's okay to use racial epithets on a regular basis. It's strange because these people were not racist per say,they were not trying to offend me but they thought it was okay to use the word N word, gook or camel jockey in a joking manner and that I should just go along with it because they were trying to be funny. And my race was always an issue. If someone met me, the first they noticed about me was my race and ask what country I was from. Even my so-called friends tried to make me out as a stereotype as opposed to a person. Again, these people had very little exposure so they didn't know better.

While we are at it. Let's talk about the quality or lack thereof of high school education. Football and sports were number one at my school. The education was substandard. We spent an entire year, learning to write one term paper. We had an "honors" system at my high school but it was more or less a class distinction. The preppy kids were in the honors classes despite the rigor of the classes were not much more difficult than the regular classes. They just found a way to prevent the rich kids from being in class with the blue collar kids. The odd thing is the blue collar kids and the rich kids had the same mentality. Unlike wealthy parents in more diverse cities, in our city, the wealthy inherited their wealth so their mentality was very blue collar. Most rich parents didn't make anything of themselves and usually inherited property, oil wells or some business like the local mill or bottling company. My classmates that chose to attend college usually went to the state school for the purpose of joining a frat and partying.

I live in a large city now and I would never expose my children to that backward life I experienced. It's funny because I'm treated like a normal person now but it was quite a challenge growing up in the South. My parents chose to live in small town America to escape the hustle of living in New York City. Yes, the cost of living was low and the stress on my parents (physicians) was low because small town life has it's perks.

I think if you are a white, conservative and Christian, small town life is great. I think you will fit in but if you are liberal, and/or not white, small town life can be hell. It was for me. And I think liberal is a strong word to describe me. I'm not liberal in the sense that most people define liberal but relative to where I was, I was pretty liberal.

I'm just presenting this view because I keep hearing on SDN about how these physicians think it's going to be perfect when they move to some small city in the South because they can make a lot of money and have a low cost of living not to mention reduced stress. But there is definitely a price to paid for lving in a small city. I'm not an intellectual snob. I don't need to live in a city like Boston to have access to great restaraunts and museums. But I realize now that living in a large metropolitan city on one of the coasts has it's advantages because you get to be around normal people. I don't think it is asking too much to be surrounded by people who educated and tolerant. That is a huge perk in and of itself.

 

[cooldreams]

There is a caveat to all this A Family Doc can hang "dermatology" on his shingle but he can't hang dermatologist on it. You can practice dermatology much the same way a general dentist can practice orthodontistry. However,a general dentist can't call himself an orthodontis and a Family Doc can't call himself a dermatologist.

The idea of the FP playing the dermatologist is catching on and is becoming pretty common. By the time you graduate, nearly every FP is going to incorporate dermatology and cosmetic procedures in his or her practice. General internists are doing the same thing. It doesn't take much expertise to hire a technician and attend some weekend seminars to acquire some vauge dermatology credentials or be a part of some vague cosmetic/dermatology board. The FP docs that are doing this at the moment are reaping close to a 1/2 a million dollars per year but as more and more FP's and Internists catch on, the market is going to be saturated especially by the time you graduate. And it doesn't help that news organizations like Dateline are allerting the public of the difference between an FP and a dermatologist. At the moment, the public is not aware of any distinction between the two but that will soon change. It has for other procedures.

Don't get me wrong, i don't think there is anything ethically, morally or legally wrong with an FP practicing dermatology. I think this is a turf war issue. But a major reason these FP's are receiving cosmetic related business is the public is pretty ignorant as to what constitutes an FP practicing dermatology vs. a dermatologist much like they don't know the difference between a board certified plastic sugeon vs. a general surgeon/oral surgeon w/a 1 year cosmetic fellowship. Once the public becomes informed, you will see the demand drop as they become more selective as to where they get their cosmetic prodedures.

sure they can. dermatologist = someone who practices dermatology.

you just cannont say you are bc/be in dermatology. but sure, dermatologist? go ahead....

 

[cooldreams]

It's always funny when I hear big city people talk as if small town America is some paradise. I grew up in a small city in Texas much like Shreveport; population was ~ 150K. Let's just say that I'm not white. Growing up there was an experience because your race, religion and nationality is always an issue. Most of the time, it's not a bad issue but you are constantly treated as if you are foreigner despite the fact that I was born and raised in the U.S. and is a red blooded American male just like anyone else. I would get asked all the time why I didn't have an accent when i spoke English. When i told them that I was born and raised in the U.S., they still didn't get it. It was just so unbelievable to them that a person of a different race could speak English with an American accent because they assumed my parents taugh me English so I should have an accent like them. When it came to dating, there were issues too because I wasn't Christian. People would come up to me and say they are going to pray for me because they thought I was going to hell. Some women wouldn't date me because their parents frowned on dating someone of a different race. It was okay for me to be friends with their daughter but I wasn't allowed to date them.

And lastly, the racial jokes were irritating. In the South and in small towns, people there believe it's okay to use racial epithets on a regular basis. It's strange because these people were not racist per say,they were not trying to offend me but they thought it was okay to use the word gook or camel jockey in a joking manner and that I should just go along with it because they were trying to be funny. And my race was always an issue. If someone met me, the first they noticed about me was my race and ask what country I was from.

While we are at it. Let's talk about the quality or lack thereof of high school education. Football and sports were number one at my school. The education was substandard. We spent an entire year, learning to write one term paper. We had an "honors" system at my high school but it was more or less a class distinction. The preppy kids were in the honors classes despite the rigor of the classes were not much more difficult than the regular classes. They just found a way to prevent the rich kids from being in class with the blue collar kids. The odd thing is the blue collar kids and the rich kids had the same mentality. Unlike wealthy parents in more diverse cities, in our city, the wealthy inherited their wealth so their mentality was very blue collar. Most rich parents didn't make anything of themselves and usually inherited property, oil wells or some business like the local mill or bottling company. My classmates that chose to attend college usually went to the state school for the purpose of joining a frat and partying.

I live in a large city now and I would never expose my children to that backward life I experienced. It's funny because I'm treated like a normal person now but it was quite a challenge growing up in the South. My parents chose to live in small town America to escape the hustle of living in New York City. Yes, the cost of living was low and the stress on my parents (physicians) was low because small town life has it's perks.

I think if you are white, conservative and Christian, small town life is great. I think you will fit in but if you are liberal, and not white, small town life can be hell. It was for me. And I think liberal is a strong word to describe me. I'm not liberal in the sense that most people define liberal but relative to where I was, I was pretty liberal.

I'm just presenting this view because I keep hearing on SDN about how these physicians think it's going to be perfect when they move to some small city in the South because they can make a lot of money and have a low cost of living not to mention reduced stress. But their is definitely a price to paid for lving in a small city. I'm not an intellectual snob. I don't need to live in a city like Boston to have access to great restaraunts and museums. But I realize now that living in a large metropolitan city on one of the coasts has it's advantages because you get to be around normal people. That is a huge perk in and of itself.

forgive me, but you sound like you are whinning. i grew up in a big city and occasionally got the chance to get out to a small town. i think what you saw was that most ppl fell into these clics. same thing happens in a big city, just that the minority groups have more members so you dont notice it as much.

for some of us, the ppl on the coasts or big cities are NOT normal, and so the small towns are more pleasant/peaceful and more inviting to us.

apparently you did not have this feeling. but some of us do.

if you want to practice medicine in a big city. go ahead, most doctors do.

 

[daelroy]

sure they can. dermatologist = someone who practices dermatology.

you just cannont say you are bc/be in dermatology. but sure, dermatologist? go ahead....

I would be careful before assuming this information. This could be considered some type of fraud or misrepresentation. I personally know a lot of FP docs who practice as dermatologists and they are careful not to refer to themselves as a dermatologist. I will ask them to clarify and post my findings.

 

[daelroy]

forgive me, but you sound like you are whinning. i grew up in a big city and occasionally got the chance to get out to a small town. i think what you saw was that most ppl fell into these clics. same thing happens in a big city, just that the minority groups have more members so you dont notice it as much.

for some of us, the ppl on the coasts or big cities are NOT normal, and so the small towns are more pleasant/peaceful and more inviting to us.

apparently you did not have this feeling. but some of us do.

if you want to practice medicine in a big city. go ahead, most doctors do.

No offense but your response didn't suprise me. When I saw jesus freak in your label, I immediately realized you are representative of the people I described so obviously you took offense of my account. How else do you explain how someone could ignore the racist and closed minded elements I spoke of and justify that as merely being cliquish. You and I obvously have very different values.

 

[novacek88]

forgive me, but you sound like you are whinning. i grew up in a big city and occasionally got the chance to get out to a small town. i think what you saw was that most ppl fell into these clics. same thing happens in a big city, just that the minority groups have more members so you dont notice it as much.

for some of us, the ppl on the coasts or big cities are NOT normal, and so the small towns are more pleasant/peaceful and more inviting to us.

apparently you did not have this feeling. but some of us do.

if you want to practice medicine in a big city. go ahead, most doctors do.

I guess you missed that part where he said "I think if you are white, conservative and Christian, small town life is great." Most self admitted "Jesus freaks" like yourself tend to fit this descrpition. He wasn't referring to people like you. He was referring to people like me who are not religious or conservative. I'm considering practicing in a small town for the lifestyle, not for it's cultural values. I enjoyed reading Daelroy's account and he touched upon issues I had not considered. Anyway, i think if you two want to continue this discussion just pm each other. Let's not turn this into a liberal vs. conservative values thread.

 

[novacek88]

sure they can. dermatologist = someone who practices dermatology.

you just cannont say you are bc/be in dermatology. but sure, dermatologist? go ahead....

This is simply not the case. That person does in fact have to be bc/be in dermatology. Advertising "dermatology" is one thing. Advertisising as a dermatologist is something entirely different.

 

[bansheeDO]

forgive me, but you sound like you are whinning. i grew up in a big city and occasionally got the chance to get out to a small town. i think what you saw was that most ppl fell into these clics. same thing happens in a big city, just that the minority groups have more members so you dont notice it as much.

for some of us, the ppl on the coasts or big cities are NOT normal, and so the small towns are more pleasant/peaceful and more inviting to us.

apparently you did not have this feeling. but some of us do.

if you want to practice medicine in a big city. go ahead, most doctors do.

You are pretty rude if you ask me. He was merely offering an account of his life and you completely belittled his experience. You sound like a typical closed minded, conservative person who has no tolerance for other cultures or faiths. Apparently racism and religious intolerance don't seem to be major vices in your view so maybe small town life in the deep south might serve you well.

To Daelroy

I wouldn't depict all small towns as being conservative. I grew up in a small town in New England. Many towns in New England are small but very liberal and open minded. Schools in those areas are known for being excellent as well. I hope you don't depict all small towns as the one you grew up in. I'm considering moving back and should you ever consider small town life, check out New England.

 

[cooldreams]

No offense but your response didn't suprise me. When I saw jesus freak in your label, I immediately realized you are representative of the people I described so obviously you took offense of my account. How else do you explain how someone could ignore the racist and closed minded elements I spoke of and justify that as merely being cliquish. You and I obvously have very different values.

i still live in the city, and everyday i encounter ppl who are mock me for believeing in Jesus or people of different races who talk a different language to get around me or look at me strange. the neighborhood i live in is predominantly a different race than i am.

am i offended by your accounts? no. i am just giving you my prospective on yours since i am already in a big city.

 

[bansheeDO]

i still live in the city, and everyday i encounter ppl who are mock me for believeing in Jesus or people of different races who talk a different language to get around me or look at me strange. the neighborhood i live in is predominantly a different race than i am.

am i offended by your accounts? no. i am just giving you my prospective on yours since i am already in a big city.

Did it ever cross your mind that maybe you offend people by trying to push your religion on others? I'm Catholic but I'm not a freak about my religion? I don't know how you act but many jesus freaks are very pushy with their religion and can tend to annoy people. And many people speak a different language because they don't speak English well and it's easier to communicate in their native language out of ease. I don't think they are speaking a second language just to talk behind your back.

 

[cooldreams]

You are pretty rude if you ask me. He was merely offering an account of his life and you completely belittled his experience. You sound like a typical closed minded, conservative person who has no tolerance for other cultures or faiths. Apparently racism and religious intolerance don't seem to be major vices in your view so maybe small town life in the deep south might serve you well.

to me he was being rude, putting anyone who is white or christian or conservative as equal to racist small town idiots.

any generalization you can make, will backfire. just because im christian does not mean im white, and just because im christian does not mean im racist.

 

[cooldreams]

Did it ever cross your mind that maybe you offend people by trying to push your religion on others? I'm Catholic but I'm not a freak about my religion? I don't know how you act but many jesus freaks are very pushy with their religion and can tend to annoy people. And many people speak a different language because they don't speak English well and it's easier to communicate in their native language out of ease. I don't think they are speaking a second language just to talk behind your back.

actually i had a few friends that actually understood them and said a few of the things they were saying were pretty mean. its easy to make fun of someone when you are "behind a mask"....

im sure people can become offended if you try to push your religion on them, or tell them what people in their religion are like, just as has been done here to me. I do not push my religion on anyone. if you would like to discuss christianity, i will be more than glad to comply. but i believe that God gave everyone one power - to chose, so no matter what you do/say you are never going to force someone to believe whatever someone else believes. it is always that person's choice.

i am a Jesus freak, because many people around me, some of my friends, and some close family are very synical about christianity and think of me as a freak. so i have personally taken the name as a sort of honor actually.

 

[bansheeDO]

to me he was being rude, putting anyone who is white or christian or conservative as equal to racist small town idiots.

any generalization you can make, will backfire. just because im christian does not mean im white, and just because im christian does not mean im racist.

He never said that. He said if you are a combination of white, christian and conservative, then you might enjoy the South. You misread it completely. And it's true for the most part. Let's be honest, many people in small towns in the rural south are caucasian, southern baptist and conservative.

 

[novacek88]

to me he was being rude, putting anyone who is white or christian or conservative as equal to racist small town idiots.

any generalization you can make, will backfire. just because im christian does not mean im white, and just because im christian does not mean im racist.

How do you know that he is wrong? Are you a non-white and non-Christian person who was raised in a small town in the South? Maybe there is some validity to his account? I didn't get the notion that he was generalizing. It sounded autobiographical to me. And you have to be careful about lumping Christians because there are so many denominations and not every denomination shares the same beliefs. Southern Baptists are very different from Episcopaleans for example. There is a major difference between a fundamentalist Christian and a non-practicing one. Maybe you attract attention because you are a fundamentalist Christian?

 

[v-tach]

He never said that. He said if you are a combination of white, christian and conservative, then you might enjoy the South. You misread it completely. And it's true for the most part. Let's be honest, many people in small towns in the rural south are caucasian, southern baptist and conservative.

I wonder how it would be for someone who's Christian but not Southern Baptist--would they "fit in" or have some of the same problems?

 

[RDickerson]

Wow, so this is why the FP forum is dead

 

[8744]

Gentlemen, Gentlemen. (and Ladies, of course)

I was just pointing out that it costs less, generally, to live in a small city in middle-America then it does in Boston or LA and that your material quality of life will be a lot higher.

I didn't mean for this to devolve into a liberal versus conservative thread. Obviously not all small towns are conservative and cheap to live in. My own home town of Norwhich, Vermont is both extremely liberal and extremely expensive.

Come on, folks. If you all want to argue then I invite you to my usual stomping grounds, the Everyone Forum, where you can argue to your heart's content.

 

[raptor5]

Gentlemen, Gentlemen. (and Ladies, of course)

I was just pointing out that it costs less, generally, to live in a small city in middle-America then it does in Boston or LA and that your material quality of life will be a lot higher.

I didn't mean for this to devolve into a liberal versus conservative thread. Obviously not all small towns are conservative and cheap to live in. My own home town of Norwhich, Vermont is both extremely liberal and extremely expensive.

Come on, folks. If you all want to argue then I invite you to my usual stomping grounds, the Everyone Forum, where you can argue to your heart's content.

I agree. Take it somewhere else.

 

[dr_almondjoy_do]

ummm, so going back to the original question, a flyover state would be a non coastal state like in the midwest?

does anyone know how much more an fp would make in the midwest than the coasts? salary.com has a NY fp making more than a IA fp, for example... just asking.....

all denominations and religious parties can answer please... lol

 

[MedSchoolFool]

man...this thread fizzled out right quick, huh? It was interesting until the fight broke out. But I'm from Shreveport, Louisiana myself, now living in Delaware, though. I have to agree that the small town (and medium sized, too) South is not ideal. I am white and I am Christian but I'm not a redneck, so, really, I never enjoyed it all that much and was glad when I got out. Delaware isn't much better, and the truth is, there are rednecks everywhere, even in California, which I found surprising.

That being said, I would prefer "flyover country" to the big city strictly for the financial advantages. You just get more bang for your buck.

 

[FMbound]

ummm, so going back to the original question, a flyover state would be a non coastal state like in the midwest?

does anyone know how much more an fp would make in the midwest than the coasts? salary.com has a NY fp making more than a IA fp, for example... just asking.....

all denominations and religious parties can answer please... lol

I think you make about $80K to start right out of residency. When it comes to FP it's all about volume from what I have seen.

 

[raptor5]

I think you make about $80K to start right out of residency. When it comes to FP it's all about volume from what I have seen.

Where at Cananda? There are PAs and Pharmacists making more than that.

 

[iatrosB]

Where at Cananda? There are PAs and Pharmacists making more than that.

Sounds low to me too.

 

[primadonna22274]

He'd make double that if he had 2 PAs because we (for some idiotic reason) will work just as hard for half as much $$. I routinely bill $32-36k/month for my services but my salary is $75k/yr. I earn it. I'm not complaining but the docs make 2x that with production incentive. I don't get production because "we don't pay the midlevels that way" (FYI, the other midlevels--ick, hate that word--work at the college health center and see 6-12 patients a day, 9 months of the year).
Lisa PA-C
(applying to med school 2006)

OnMyWayThere

One of the great parts about family practice is there are so many options. If you read some of the previous threads you will see people talk at length about this issue, one option is to acquire the training for many different procedures. If a family physician does lots of procedures and has other doctors working under him he has the potential to make a very adequate income, probably not what your father was making. But it's not unreasonable for a family physician doing procedures to make 150,000-250,000. Then if he has 2 doctors working under him, he would probably pocket 30,000-60,000 dollars from each doctor.
Just my thoughts, as a 3rd year medical student, take it for what it's worth