How to go about shadowing for those with the least leeway: Not young, not well connected, etc.

[Gauss44]

1. I'm looking for some real-life examples of how, especially older less connected, non-traditional students have gone about asking a doctor to shadow?

2. Please provide any CAUTIONs about any inappropriate, or even mildly inappropriate things, that an uninformed pre-meds with otherwise fine social skills might do? Example: Not being aware of a hospital policy, if that applies.

3. Details and scripts are welcome.

This is designed to help someone who (does NOT have a PCP, has not done research and) will NOT get any leeway for being young, for fitting in (he gets along fine, but a stranger might take one look at him and decide he doesn't belong in the club, or that they don't want to work with him), of a different class, of a different heritage than most of the area, risks being seen as an outsider for other types of uniqueness, etc. ...and may (or may not) be held to tougher standards than the cutest, classiest, youngest, most well connected pre-med. How to approach shadowing for those with the least leeway...

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[Apollo1]

Are you asking for yourself, or for another (i.e. third-person referencing)? Second, how have you actively been here for almost two years & only now broach this subject? Your italicized reasonings seem a bit absurd.

Get a PCP (for reasons beyond shadowing)--->Ask PCP--->If no, then ask person(s) at facility where you volunteer (if you are volunteering)--->If no, then use premed group on school campus as a gateway--->If no, then mass-email docs in your area.

 

[kraskadva]

1. I'm looking for some real-life examples of how, especially older less connected, non-traditional students have gone about asking a doctor to shadow?

2. Please provide any CAUTIONs about any inappropriate, or even mildly inappropriate things, that an uninformed pre-meds with otherwise fine social skills might do? Example: Not being aware of a hospital policy, if that applies.

3. Details and scripts are welcome.

This is designed to help someone who (does NOT have a PCP, has not done research and) will NOT get any leeway for being young, for fitting in (he gets along fine, but a stranger might take one look at him and decide he doesn't belong in the club, or that they don't want to work with him), of a different class, of a different heritage than most of the area, risks being seen as an outsider for other types of uniqueness, etc. ...and may (or may not) be held to tougher standards than the cutest, classiest, youngest, most well connected pre-med. How to approach shadowing for those with the least leeway...

^The bit in red...is this just paranoia or is there something physically and categorically different about him/her/you than the general populace? And why would this person have less leeway than other premeds? Because short of showing up in a completely unprofessional way (dishevelled, smelly, intoxicated) I'm having trouble thinking of an attribute that would set every medical professional against someone...

To answer the questions as best I can without this potentially pertinent detail....
1) I personally wrote letters. <1 page, business style letters, explaining in brief my background, why I wanted to shadow that person (interest in medicine/specialty), and giving my contact information (phone & email). I attached my condensed CV (i.e. 1 pg, no references, just basic job/ed list) with previous medical & academic experiences. I got calls back from all the docs I wrote to and shadowing opportunities from most. I mailed mine, but could also drop off at the front desk. This was a way to bypass the guardian of the gate (reception/office mgr) and address the doc directly without being intrusive or demanding. Also it stood out for them, because hey, who writes letters anymore? I would perhaps be willing to share my letter format, PM me if you want to talk about it.

2)Typical advice...
Know the general idea of HIPPA & err on the side of keeping your mouth shut. If unsure of office/hospital policy ask at the beginning of the day/shadowing time.
Don't talk in front of the patient without being invited to do so, and then keep it brief. A "thank you." to the patient after they say you can observe (the doc should ask them if it's ok) is usually nice.
Don't give any medical opinion ever, especially in front of the patients.
Asking questions of the doc is fine and encouraged, but only outside the exam room and don't barrage them.
Dress nice, wear comfortable shoes, be on time, always be polite.

 

[QofQuimica]

^The bit in red...is this just paranoia or is there something physically and categorically different about him/her/you than the general populace? And why would this person have less leeway than other premeds? Because short of showing up in a completely unprofessional way (dishevelled, smelly, intoxicated) I'm having trouble thinking of an attribute that would set every medical professional against someone...

Agree. I had plenty of people (both premeds and preclinical med students) shadow me during residency. The one thing I cared about was their attitude. If they showed up when scheduled, looked professional, acted interested, and kept out of my way when things were busy, I was happy to have them along. I'd feel the same way now as an attending, although I don't know what the shadowing policy is for premeds at my new hospital. Happy to find out though if anyone in FL is looking for shadowing and can follow the "Typical advice" kraskadva mentioned.

2)Typical advice...
Know the general idea of HIPPA & err on the side of keeping your mouth shut. If unsure of office/hospital policy ask at the beginning of the day/shadowing time.
Don't talk in front of the patient without being invited to do so, and then keep it brief. A "thank you." to the patient after they say you can observe (the doc should ask them if it's ok) is usually nice.
Don't give any medical opinion ever, especially in front of the patients.
Asking questions of the doc is fine and encouraged, but only outside the exam room and don't barrage them.
Dress nice, wear comfortable shoes, be on time, always be polite.

 

[Gauss44]

The part in red has already happened to the person I'm speaking about, albeit not in medicine yet. I'm sure that without providing more specifics, someone on here will understand. It's not that uncommon.

This person has not been a student for years, has no CV due to lack of research, and as I mentioned does NOT have a PCP.

 

[Gauss44]

Are you asking for yourself, or for another (i.e. third-person referencing)? Second, how have you actively been here for almost two years & only now broach this subject? Your italicized reasonings seem a bit absurd.

Get a PCP (for reasons beyond shadowing)--->Ask PCP--->If no, then ask person(s) at facility where you volunteer (if you are volunteering)--->If no, then use premed group on school campus as a gateway--->If no, then mass-email docs in your area.

I've already done some of my shadowing and found it easy to network my way in. I'm GRATEFUL that this has gone well for me.

I don't take this sort of thing for granted, nor do I believe that it's 100% to my merit (that I had an easy time shadowing): I'm grateful for having a normal looking face and body; grateful for being in a wonderful city where essentially no one frowns upon my race; I'm so grateful to be well-educated and reasonably well spoken (which helps me fit in with doctors).... This is just not the case for every intelligent deserving professional hard working person. It is great to be me, and perhaps great to be you too.

 

[kraskadva]

So as far as I understand, you're implying that this person either has an 'abnormal' face/body, or that race might be an issue, or perhaps that they are not well educated/well spoken.

Let's start with the least problematic and work up:

• Race shouldn't be an issue for any medical professional. Not to say that issues never occur, but in this day and age, I feel like you'd be hard pressed to find a doctor in the US who would deny someone the opportunity to shadow because of their race. And I feel like it would be nigh on impossible to find a whole city, or even an entire small town, full of such people.
• I'm still not sure what you mean by setting yourself up as the juxtaposed 'normal' face and body, but there are a few possibilities that come to mind. If this person has a congenital defect of some sort, I would reiterate what I said above, I can think of very few things that would universally turn medical professionals away. If it's visible tattoos/piercing in professional dress, then this person would need to investigate methods of cover-up/removal anyway if they're considering medicine. If it is a surgical issue (I'm thinking transgender) then you may run into more obstacles, but again, medical professionals shouldn't be universally against them.
• If this person is neither well educated not well spoken, then with help they may be able to land a shadowing experience for a day or so, but there likely will be bigger issues in terms of sitting for the MCAT and making it through med school. Though, with the intelligence comments, I don't think this is what you're referring to.

As far as what I included on my CV when asking for shadowing, most of the recent (within 10 years) stuff was non-medical. The only point, for me, of including my CV was to show that 1) I was older and 2) that I had some work experience in fields where confidentiality was important. It doesn't have to be a super-premed resume, the cover letter is far more important in terms of expressing interest.