Postdoc issues

[neurotic_cow]

I've debated posting something on here for a while now, but have refrained due to concerns about people figuring out my identity. However, I've decided to just go ahead and do it and see what advice/suggestions I can get from others because I'm reaching a breaking point.

Long story short, I've just finished 1 year of my 2 year postdoc and quite honestly it's been terrible so far. I feel like the entire postdoc program was misrepresented and is not at all what I was told it would be like (very little didactics, other training opportunities). I get very little (if any) supervision and feedback about my work and I feel like I've just been used as cheap labor (and in fact, my supervisor has made comments about this and often seems to take joy in having me do 90% of the work and jokes about how little money I make). I fiercely disagree with my supervisor's approach to patient care and I have concerns about the quality of my training. I have basically been trying to do much of the didactics and whatnot on my own to try to make up for it and I have also been trying to bring up articles/presentations/topics to discuss with my supervisor to try to get some semblance of supervision/didactics. I have been throwing around the idea of leaving because I am miserable and honestly it has been sucking the life out of me BUT I don't want to quit now being only 1 year away if doing so will be catastrophic for my career. I only work with one supervisor and have no contact with any other psychologists and I am afraid of saying something and having it blow up in my face as I have no other option to work with a different supervisor. Obviously it's too late for me to apply to a different postdoc and I don't have it in me to do another 2 year postdoc. So I guess I'm just looking for any advice or recommendations anyone might have about my situation.

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[AcronymAllergy]

Wow, that's tough, I'm sorry you've been put in that situation (and shame on your supervisor, given the description of the postdoc and their interactions with you). It sounds like this is an informal postdoc, so unfortunately, your options for recourse are pretty limited. Given what you've also said about re-applying, honestly, your only choice may be to just stick it out as best you can for another year, supplementing your training and didactics in whatever way possible. You could reach out to supervisors you've worked with in the past to see if they have specific resources they'd recommend, continue checking professional societies for conferences and other CE options, and perhaps join a state psych association to see if they have a mentoring-type program available. Sadly, it doesn't sound like your supervisor is going to be very receptive to requests to increase your supervision or didactic quality/amount, but you could certainly continue to request this (or at least the time to pursue it on your own, as above).

Based on your username and this being a two-year postdoc, it seems like you're neuro-oriented. If that's the case, and if you're wanting to practice neuropsych and possibly pursue board certification, I don't think there's any way around finishing this current "program."

 

[neurotic_cow]

Wow, that's tough, I'm sorry you've been put in that situation (and shame on your supervisor, given the description of the postdoc and their interactions with you). It sounds like this is an informal postdoc, so unfortunately, your options for recourse are pretty limited. Given what you've also said about re-applying, honestly, your only choice may be to just stick it out as best you can for another year, supplementing your training and didactics in whatever way possible. You could reach out to supervisors you've worked with in the past to see if they have specific resources they'd recommend, continue checking professional societies for conferences and other CE options, and perhaps join a state psych association to see if they have a mentoring-type program available. Sadly, it doesn't sound like your supervisor is going to be very receptive to requests to increase your supervision or didactic quality/amount, but you could certainly continue to request this (or at least the time to pursue it on your own, as above).

Based on your username and this being a two-year postdoc, it seems like you're neuro-oriented. If that's the case, and if you're wanting to practice neuropsych and possibly pursue board certification, I don't think there's any way around finishing this current "program."

Thank you! Sadly, this is a formal postdoc and has been approved by neuropsych board, and so I just feel like I've been lured in under false pretenses and lied to. I'll definitely keep working on supplementing my training with various CE and didactic sources I can find. Board certification is definitely the goal (if not a requirement), so I just have to figure out how to make it through the next year and not run myself completely into the ground.

 

[AcronymAllergy]

Thank you! Sadly, this is a formal postdoc and has been approved by neuropsych board, and so I just feel like I've been lured in under false pretenses and lied to. I'll definitely keep working on supplementing my training with various CE and didactic sources I can find. Board certification is definitely the goal (if not a requirement), so I just have to figure out how to make it through the next year and not run myself completely into the ground.

Hmm, the postdoc should ideally have some sort of process in place to pursue grievances, then, if you opt to go that route. And/or you may have more weight behind requests for the fellowship to live up to its advertised experiences. At the very least, I'd encourage you to provide your feedback to the approving board afterward.

 

[thebalmofhurtminds]

Is your supervisor the Training Director or are you able to potentially discuss some of your concerns with the TD?

 

[WisNeuro]

Thank you! Sadly, this is a formal postdoc and has been approved by neuropsych board, and so I just feel like I've been lured in under false pretenses and lied to. I'll definitely keep working on supplementing my training with various CE and didactic sources I can find. Board certification is definitely the goal (if not a requirement), so I just have to figure out how to make it through the next year and not run myself completely into the ground.

By approved by neuropsych board, do you mean APPCN? If so, they will have formal grievance procedures as required for inclusion there.

 

[neurotic_cow]

Is your supervisor the Training Director or are you able to potentially discuss some of your concerns with the TD?

Yes, my supervisor is the training director. There is a person "above" them in the organization that I'm supposedly able to discuss concerns like this with; however, they're friends and I have concerns about how it would go over if I did express my grievances.

 

[thebalmofhurtminds]

Yes, my supervisor is the training director. There is a person "above" them in the organization that I'm supposedly able to discuss concerns like this with; however, they're friends and I have concerns about how it would go over if I did express my grievances.

Oof that's rough. No other neuropsychologists on staff that are part of training at all?

 

[singasongofjoy]

Sounds like a ****ty situation that would also likely be ****ty in a few different ways if you ducked out so I'd prob do my best to stick it out if it's really "just" one more year (quotations because I realize a year can feel like an eternity until it's over) for the sake of expediency towards licensure etc.

Did you have opportunity to talk to previous postdocs / are you in contact witih them and how similar are your experiences? I wonder how much of the current divergence from what was marketed is related to a plethora of COVID-related changes/effects known and unknown. In my clinic we've done our best to get creative and provide solid training amidst constant changes, but oof. Amid staff being out, sometime for weeks at a time, or being redeployed elsewhere in my AMC or pulled to support other needs within my program, and having to play a wild game of space-tetris to accommodate a convergence of factors... for this upcoming semester we've (very unexpectedly compared to back when we were planning) got 5 trainees and 3 (possibly 2, we'll find out tomorrow) psychologists in my clinic and it just might drive me to private practice if this year is like the last. I think we're doing better than some other local sites at providing for trainees but it is still so far from what it is during "normal" times and the quality of supervision is undoubtedly affected by severely diminished bandwidth due to scrambling to keep up with constant change and unexpected understaffing.

All that to say I don't think it's a good time to be a trainee of any sort by any stretch of the imagination so a mediocre site during normal times (perhaps your site?) could conceivably be just tanked right now but it might take some digging to accurately assess if other options would be enough better to warrant the disruption a change would cause. I'd probably grumble, seek unofficial supports/supervision elsewhere in the program if possible, bury my head and grind through so as to leave it all behind more quickly and move on with life though whether that's ultimately the "best" approach, idk- and also I'm not neuro. Good luck and godspeed.

 

[futureapppsy2]

I'm sorry the position isn't good, to say the least. Honestly, unless you see something truly dangerous/unethical going on, I'd keep you head down, say nothing, and finish the postdoc to check off that box for board certification.

 

[cara susanna]

I don't feel like I can give any better help or suggestions than the previous posters in this thread, but I just want to say... laughing about your low pay? Jebus.

 

[R. Matey]

At this risk of sounding glib, I just want to add that powering through a bad time professionally can be really demoralizing so please take care of yourself if you decide to stay. I hated my internship year and had to self-care hard to make it through. Having very strict boundaries didn't solve it, but it made the situation much more bearable. Agree with others that staying and supplementing seems to make most sense unless there is a huge ethics concern, but it doesn't mean it sucks less.

 

[Eye-eye]

By approved by neuropsych board, do you mean APPCN? If so, they will have formal grievance procedures as required for inclusion there.

Even though his boss is the person you're supposed to be able to talk to, is there any way to explain to APPCN / through formal grievance procedures that you're uncomfortable going to them, and to go through someone in APPCN instead? This isn't my field, but I would hope there's such a contingency somewhere.

Also, are you the only trainee under this guy? If so, any complaint could result in backlash, but if he's being an @$$ to a bunch of people, could anonymous grievances be made, either to his boss or through someone in APPCN, such that it would not be obvious who was making them?

 

[WisNeuro]

Even though his boss is the person you're supposed to be able to talk to, is there any way to explain to APPCN / through formal grievance procedures that you're uncomfortable going to them, and to go through someone in APPCN instead? This isn't my field, but I would hope there's such a contingency somewhere.

Also, are you the only trainee under this guy? If so, any complaint could result in backlash, but if he's being an @$$ to a bunch of people, could anonymous grievances be made, either to his boss or through someone in APPCN, such that it would not be obvious who was making them?

Unless there was a grievous violation (e.g., patient safety issues, very clear ethics code violations) the trainee likely needs to follow the grievance guidelines in their program first. Also, if there was any follow-up to complaint, given the low n of trainees (usually 1 or 2 in a given cohort) it would probably be obvious where the complaint came from. If the violation was bad enough to lead to some kind of formal intervention, APPCN or whoever investigates would have to talk to the program and people involved to do a fact-finding process.

 

[Eye-eye]

Unless there was a grievous violation (e.g., patient safety issues, very clear ethics code violations) the trainee likely needs to follow the grievance guidelines in their program first. Also, if there was any follow-up to complaint, given the low n of trainees (usually 1 or 2 in a given cohort) it would probably be obvious where the complaint came from. If the violation was bad enough to lead to some kind of formal intervention, APPCN or whoever investigates would have to talk to the program and people involved to do a fact-finding process.

Ah. That sucks. But I understand the situation... My postdoc position is horrible, but there's really not anything I can do about it for similar reasons. I'm sorry, @OP. Sometimes life gives you lemons, unfortunately.

 

[espressopsych]

I know this isn’t helpful, but try to stick through your last year. Once you are out of post doc, you’ll be glad you didn’t leave. This is coming from someone who was close to packing up everything and leaving during the second year. I just couldn’t handle the obvious favoritism, the bragging about using humiliation as a learning tactic, and extra responsibilities that provided more coverage than training opportunities. My advice is to do as many things as you can for yourself to stay sane. I remember when my husband was so happy to hear me laugh at something and that’s when I realized my post doc was changing me. My friends and I had a countdown and had a celebration once a month when it hit another so many months left. I planned a bucket list for the location I was at so I could have things to look forward to keep me motivated. It became easier to tolerate after I accepted a job back home as well.