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[wanderingstudent10.10]

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[Green Grass]

Hey, first of all, congrats on getting over that period of your life - I'm sure it wasn't easy. You've got this lasting issue, but you're here now, so let's make the most of it.

I would probably recommend against the tattoo. If you get the tattoo, you're likely still going to feel like you need to cover it up. Medicine isn't ready for physicians with tattoos down their arms. May we get there? Sure. But not right now. I'd stick with the long sleeves or white coat and go about your business.

Good luck!

 

[Monkey.King]

I agree with Green Grass. I made a thread a while ago about tattoos, as I have some down to my elbow and wanted more on my forearm. Thinking back on it, it was a foolish post but for reasons that are completely stupid on my part.

Also OP, don't be embarrassed of that. That was a rough time in your life and shouldn't be held against you by anyone. Everyone has times in their life that they aren't proud of, and if people had any sense of being "professional", they will keep their comments and thoughts to themselves. Stick with the long sleeves and coat if you must. With something as significant as trying to take your own life possibles multiple times, I would assume that it had a big part in shaping who are you now. If I were you, I wouldn't even cover it up with makeup. Sure, it's not something you're proud of, nor should it be, but what's done is done and it seems the appearance of them is the only thing holding you back in life.

One more thing, since I can't really speak of any experience or things I heard regarding self inflicted scars, have you ever been questioned about them or do you believe you have been discriminated from opportunities because of these scars? The answer to that could better help you decide on what to do

 

[jtd2081]

Not saying that everyone will understand what you have been through but there is, to some degree, a thought in communities that doctors don't understand the things that people are going through. While this can be true there are also many cases where physicians do understand. I think that patients going through tough times will be able to look at you and know that you understand what they are going through. I know you are not proud of your past, but it has made you into who you are today. They make you unique and special in your own way. Embrace that. You are strong enough to get past things that have happened in your life and I have nothing but respect for you.

 

[Law2Doc]

White coat/long sleeves won't work in any setting where you need to scrub.

But Instead of a tattoo just come up with a good story -- an animal attack or MVC maybe-- in case anyone asks. In most cases a cover up draws more attention than the scars.

 

[binko]

I have some pretty obvious scars of the same provenance. I used to be really worried about them but eventually I stopped caring if people saw them. In the last 5 years I think I have been asked about them twice, and both times the conversation went like this:

Someone: "What's that from?"
Me: "Oh, that's really old. Anyway did you hear about... [completely other topic]"
Them: [doesn't bother to bring it up again].

I also have a big tattoo with a lot of dark ink and I don't know if tattoos will necessarily cover up the scars as well as you hope, given my experience. They might just end up drawing more attention to them. I have to cover my tattoo and it's only on my upper arm, almost to my elbow. I can't imagine how uncomfortably hot it would feel on a warm day to have to wear sleeves to cover tats all the way to the wrist. It already feels like a big bother just having to make sure my arms are covered to the elbow.

 

[Thatsnotmyname.]

I can somewhat sympathize with you. I was 300lbs as a teenager and have maintained a 100+lb weight loss for 8yrs now. My childhood weight gain left a ton of stretchmarks on my torso and my entire bicep all the way down into the fold of my elbow is covered in 100s of white stretch marks. They will be very noticeable in scrubs and as someone who has only worn long sleeves for the past 6 yrs, I'm a little nervous. I'm not one of those people who flaunts before and after photos and no one who met me since high school knows about my past, haha.

I feel like it will all be fine once you get over that initial mental barrier. It sucks to have your vulnerabilities hanging out like that, but once we get used to being exposed, I suspect we'll get over it. Scars are a proud reminder of the unique experiences we've had and a symbol of resilience (even if it is hard to believe sometimes). And you won't be alone in your concerns!

Tattoos will draw attention to the issue, unless you look into tattoos specifically for covering up scars.

 

[JustAPhD]

Getting a sleeve to cover up your scars is a bad idea I believe. Getting tattoos, especially ones so drastic as a full sleeve, is an incredibly important decision and should not be made lightly. If you did not have these scars would you still consider it? If not I would pass on the idea. Your scars are your past, and perhaps an important reminder of where you were and how far you've come. I think you'll come to find your classmates will be very understanding of them.

 

[Pyruvate]

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[mehc012]

I had an advisee a few years ago who had the same issues and the same fears as you, carrying both scars and the need to continue therapy from those issue. With the many issues she had to overcome on her path to medical school, she was still in terrible fear of how her classmates and the school would react. The near terror she felt the week before classes was real. All of these fears completely and utterly dissipated in her first week of school. No one, absolutely no one ever asked her about the scars on her arms. Never came up. never was an issue. The school has faculty psychiatrists who she started seeing. moving her prescriptions over and settling in for therapy with nothing but support. Indeed, she has never felt more comfortable, supported, and, if I dare say, free in the environment where you have been accepted because they believe you do the work needed to become a physician.

PM me if you would like to discuss further

This surprises me...as someone with my own fairly prominent scars, I can say that they evoke comments at least 99% of the time that they are visible. Not from everyone, obviously, but eventually SOMEone will ask, usually in the midst of the group. When they do, it's fairly obvious by people's reactions that they were curious too but didn't want to be the one to say anything. To be honest, I guess I prefer people asking to them making their own conclusions and judgements without saying anything to me, but then, I have the luxury that mine are higher up and thus concealable unless I'm comfortable enough with people to either forget around them or decide I'm ready to stop putting effort into hiding them in order to make others feel more comfortable. Having seen healthcare attitudes towards mental health issues, I may never reach that level of comfort in the hospital.

When I decided to apt to med school, I did it knowing that it meant possibly going back to hiding my scars, something I rather proudly decided to STOP worrying about years ago. If it goes that way, it's going to be a pain, since I've finally stopped thinking about it and I've gotten used to feeling comfortable in my own skin...that would feel like going backwards. Who knows, maybe my med classmates will be awesome and I'll decide to keep on being open about it but I'd be utterly shocked if I did that and they just...never asked or commented.

To OP: you're certainly not alone in this, and I'd personally say that since you can't cover 100% of the time (seems unlikely once you hit the OR, and unpleasant for dissecting)...go with it and don't feel the need to cover up at all. Most people are actually great once the awkward initial question is past, so everyday is no more awkward that a single time, and it's SO wonderful not to worry about it. And congrats on having scars, not scabs!

 

[Dr Nicholas Riviera]

I worked in a tattoo shop for 9 years, so I can give you an educated opinion on this. More than likely the scar will show through. If you do a solid region of color over the area, you'll see a difference in the tones. You can get something designed that will work with the scar, allowing you to cover portions and obscure the rest. I know we've pulled that off with various surgery scars.

I personally wouldn't get the tattoo just to hide the scars. I would hate for you to end up regretting the tattoo along with everything else. If there is a design that means the world to you, always has and it always will, then so be it. I would advise against getting one just for a utilitarian purpose. All that being said, super proud of you for the work you've done for yourself.

 

[anonymoose1640]

Not sure if you've already pursued this option but I know some plastic surgeons prescribe gels/ointments that help reduce the appearance of scars over time (not eliminate, but reduce). My sister had scars all over her legs (she was rowdy when she was little and fell all the time) and got a prescription for a gel that I can't remember the name of now and it has dramatically reduced the severity of the scars on her legs. Although you have absolutely nothing to be ashamed of with your scars, if you wish they were lighter then that's an option you could pursue.

 

[mehc012]

I worked in a tattoo shop for 9 years, so I can give you an educated opinion on this. More than likely the scar will show through. If you do a solid region of color over the area, you'll see a difference in the tones. You can get something designed that will work with the scar, allowing you to cover portions and obscure the rest. I know we've pulled that off with various surgery scars.

I personally wouldn't get the tattoo just to hide the scars. I would hate for you to end up regretting the tattoo along with everything else. If there is a design that means the world to you, always has and it always will, then so be it. I would advise against getting one just for a utilitarian purpose. All that being said, super proud of you for the work you've done for yourself.

Given the situation but highly unlikely that it's just 1 scar comma meaning it will be difficult to design a tattoo around it. I'd agree with you that a cover-up is probably not the best move, but whatever works for OP

Sent from my phone, sorry for any typos or brevity.

 

[DrChef94]

I would also recommend against it. I have a tattoo that has a lot of personal meaning for me on my upper inner arm so it's relatively hidden but I still worry about having to cover it up with sleeves whenever I'm in a professional setting. Also, a lot of tattoo artists will not tattoo over scar tissue (it doesn't take ink as well and has a much higher risk of blowing out), so even if you got a tattoo to cover them up, there's a chance it could look worse off than before since the ink will take differently for scar tissue vs. healthy tissue.

 

[idontwatchgreysanatomy]

I'll second what was mentioned above about tattooing over scars. From what I've seen, it often makes the scars more obvious. I just wanted to give my two cents about arm tattoos in medicine:

N=1, but my arms are covered in tattoos and I've never had an issue. Granted, I'm not a med student yet so I can't speak for the impact they have on rotations or in pre-clinical years. I've worked in a hospital and a clinic for some time, never once were they mentioned nor was I treated any differently. I've had great relationships with doctors who say that they doubt it'll be an issue beyond interviews. I even had two doctors go so far to say that the tattoos add to the diversity of practice, as tattoos can often be something that patients see as relatable, removing the association of doctors being uptight and conservative. Granted, the city I live in is extremely accepting of tattoos, so YMMV. Just wanted to give my experience, we will see how it plays out in the future.

 

[vegetara83]

I'm a little late to the party here, but I wanted to weigh in.

I was a super angsty teenager who also self-harmed. I, too, was extremely embarrassed by my scars. For awhile I tried making up a story, though I think others could tell it wasn't the truth. For my scars anyway, they are too precise (as in, they are all in straight lines) for any story I could think of to make sense. So now if anyone asks I've gotten to the point in my life where I simply tell them the truth. There's still stigma, of course, but the only way to get rid of that is to be open about it. And I say that as a general statement because I personally have never had a negative reaction (to my face, anyway).

The majority of my scars are on my upper arms since at the time I was cutting I was trying to hide it. I did, however, decide to get a tattoo. It wasn't so much to cover the scars because I did my research and the artist said that the ink doesn't really cover scars, just as others have mentioned above. I wouldn't say it necessarily makes it more obvious though. Plus, I really love tattoos and this one ended up being my 3rd one. It's a 1/2 sleeve on my right upper arm, and it's likely I would have gotten it anyway even without the scars. I've wanted a 1/2 sleeve since forever! I did think about it quite a bit because I do believe that tattoos should mean something, and what I ended up getting is extremely meaningful to me. It was finished about 2 years before I applied to medical school, and the only people who were upset about it were my parents. And while I do cover it in professional settings, I'm not at all embarrassed about my tattoo like I was the scars.

It does go from my shoulder to my elbow, so there's no hiding it in scrubs. However, I worked in a hospital prior to applying to medical school and I can say I have had absolutely zero issues with having the tattoo. I'm now an osteopathic medical student, so we had OMM labs weekly where we'd have to take off our shirts often to practice and no one ever said a thing about it. Even after 2 years of schooling and getting half naked with them every week, I still have classmates say to me that they didn't realize I had a tattoo. Surgery is probably the only time when it will be difficult to cover. Fortunately for me, the hospital where I'll be doing my surgery rotation early next year actually has no policy whatsoever regarding visible tattoos. The lead scrub nurse, a woman, has full sleeves on both of her arms. So I really lucked out. Though of course, reactions will differ based upon location and local culture.

But overall, I think if it's something you really want and would make you feel better, then go for it! Just cover it when you need to and don't be a jerk if someone asks you to cover it. If covering is not an option, such as in surgery, be open and honest about it. There was a decent article in The DO magazine regarding this subject awhile back: http://thedo.osteopathic.org/2012/02/is-the-world-ready-for-tattooed-pierced-physicians/

 

[IsleyOfTheNorth]

I don't really have any other options unless I want to drop a few thousand and risk infection with some skin grafts.

I don't understand why everyone is skipping this option. It's expensive yes, but wouldn't it be worth it? Heck, a tattoo would cost a good bit of money as well. If you have insurance, they may cover part of the cost as well. I would definitely explore this option further before eliminating it.

 

[mehc012]

Exactly...get a tattoo if you would get one anyway, it can look really striking. But I wouldn't get one solely because you have scars, that's all.

 

[mehc012]

I don't understand why everyone is skipping this option. It's expensive yes, but wouldn't it be worth it? Heck, a tattoo would cost a good bit of money as well. If you have insurance, they may cover part of the cost as well. I would definitely explore this option further before eliminating it.

I don't want to erase my past, even though it may occasionally cause me problems. That's just me, though.

 

[idontwatchgreysanatomy]

I don't understand why everyone is skipping this option. It's expensive yes, but wouldn't it be worth it? Heck, a tattoo would cost a good bit of money as well. If you have insurance, they may cover part of the cost as well. I would definitely explore this option further before eliminating it.

Getting a skin graft to remove self-harm scars is not what most would call a viable option. I imagine you'll be hard pressed to find an insurance company that would even entertain the idea.

 

[Avicenna]

I am considering getting a coverup tattoo

how about getting a tattoo over the scars then getting it removed so you have tattoo removal scars completely covering self harm scars. For best results, go the doctor with the lowest rating on yelp so the scars left by the removal process will be as obstrusive as possible.
That way it looks like you're hiding a past of bad decisions instead of hiding a past of mental/emotional instability.
It eould be much easier to explain to adcoms because i would think an emotionally instable past is a much bigger red flag than a past of unprofessional impulsive decisions. It's not such a serious issue and you could even joke about it saying you got a tattoo of a former boyfriend's name, or some dumb thing you got when you were drunk.

 

[mehc012]

op if you aren't messing with us, how about getting a tattoo over the scars then getting it removed so you have tattoo removal scars completely covering self harm scars. That way it looks like you're hiding a past of bad decisions instead of hiding a past of mental/emotional instability.
It eould be much easier to explain to adcoms because i would think an emotionally instable past is a much bigger red flag than a past of unprofessional impulsive decisions. It's not such a serious issue and you could even joke about it saying you got a tattoo of a former boyfriend's name, or some dumb thing you got when you were drunk.

They're not worried about adcoms, but rather the career after that. Not that I think adcoms would react particularly well to a history of bad decisions either, particularly drunken ones...this is just out of the frying pan and into the fire.

Beyond that, this plan is so needlessly convoluted and expensive that I don't even know where to begin...if you're going to lie about the coverup scars, why not just remove the scars and then lie to say it was a tattoo removal? The whole idea is to avoid being questioned about it in the first place. It doesn't feel particularly good to have to constantly lie, evade, and actively hide a part of your past, whether you're successful or not. Far better if it just...stays in the past without requiring attention. I know I'd prefer that no one have their eye caught by them and have questions (note that I didn't say "prefer that no one ask"...once they notice and wonder, I'd usually rather they just ask me about it directly instead of speculating, though I wish they didn't tend to insist on doing it in the middle of group gatherings)...even though once they ask, I tell the truth. It's not necessarily about having a good cover story, it's just often better if the whole thing is avoided. No form of removal would leave OP with zero cues to catch people's eye.

Finally, why the hell would OP be messing with us here, and why would not going the nuclear route imply that they're making the whole thing up?

 

[Avicenna]

They're not worried about adcoms, but rather the career after that. Not that I think adcoms would react particularly well to a history of bad decisions either, particularly drunken ones...this is just out of the frying pan and into the fire.

Beyond that, this plan is so needlessly convoluted and expensive that I don't even know where to begin...if you're going to lie about the coverup scars, why not just remove the scars and then lie to say it was a tattoo removal? The whole idea is to avoid being questioned about it in the first place. It doesn't feel particularly good to have to constantly lie, evade, and actively hide a part of your past, whether you're successful or not. Far better if it just...stays in the past without requiring attention. I know I'd prefer that no one have their eye caught by them and have questions (note that I didn't say "prefer that no one ask"...once they notice and wonder, I'd usually rather they just ask me about it directly instead of speculating, though I wish they didn't tend to insist on doing it in the middle of group gatherings)...even though once they ask, I tell the truth. It's not necessarily about having a good cover story, it's just often better if the whole thing is avoided. No form of removal would leave OP with zero cues to catch people's eye.

Finally, why the hell would OP be messing with us here, and why would not going the nuclear route imply that they're making the whole thing up?

You're right, op probably wants to avoid the issue completely. but i think lying and evading her past is a required step to avoid the issue completely.
Before i go any further i want to congratulate op on her bravery to stop self harming, but I don't think lying/hiding fron the past takes away from her bravery at all. The fact of the matter is there are people in the medical community who will judge op for her scars, she's simply being pragmatic by doing what she has to in order to avert the negative attention.

With that said, new plan to avoid attention completely. Skin colored tattoo over the scars. It'll take a skilled tattoo artist, but you wouldn't have to deal with constantly applying makeup every day, and if done well enough, op's scars could go completely unnoticed

 

[mehc012]

You're right, op probably wants to avoid the issue completely. but i think lying and evading her past is a required step to avoid the issue completely.
Before i go any further i want to congratulate op on her bravery to stop self harming, but I don't think lying/hiding fron the past takes away from her bravery at all. The fact of the matter is there are people in the medical community who will judge op for her scars, she's simply being pragmatic by doing what she has to in order to avert the negative attention.

With that said, new plan to avoid attention completely. Skin colored tattoo over the scars. It'll take a skilled tattoo artist, but you wouldn't have to deal with constantly applying makeup every day, and if done well enough, op's scars could go completely unnoticed

There's a difference between 'hiding from' the past and simply letting it become distant as time passes. The latter happens all the time, and it can be frustrating when there's something preventing it. I'm not trying to judge OP in any way for wanting to put their past behind them...we all want that, whether we have skeletons in the closet or just normal, boring, personality changes as we age. I also understand the judgement that is out there (esp. in medicine, trust me) and the need for pragmatism. I'm just saying that it's not as easy as just 'lie about it'.
There are valid reasons why OP may not want to or feel able to lie, or why they may not want to eliminate them entirely...explaining or lying about self-harm scars is often something that causes a lot of complex reactions for people. For example, some people just want them gone; others consider them a sign of how far they've come, or a reminder to continue not harming or...the list goes on. The point is that I'm not trying to say that they shouldn't lie, or that it's a bad thing, or that they can't get them removed. Those just may not be the solutions they're looking for, for various reasons, and that's perfectly fine. There are a lot of routes you can take that may be a better fit.

At any rate, no tattoo will alter textures. My scars are all skin colored by now (finally), but they still get noticed from across the room sometimes. Scars also a) don't take color normally and b) it is hard to match skin tone and c) hard to cover up red with a light color

 

[Avicenna]

There's a difference between 'hiding from' the past and simply letting it become distant as time passes. The latter happens all the time, and it can be frustrating when there's something preventing it. I'm not trying to judge OP in any way for wanting to put their past behind them...we all want that, whether we have skeletons in the closet or just normal, boring, personality changes as we age. I also understand the judgement that is out there (esp. in medicine, trust me) and the need for pragmatism. I'm just saying that it's not as easy as just 'lie about it'.
There are valid reasons why OP may not want to or feel able to lie, or why they may not want to eliminate them entirely...explaining or lying about self-harm scars is often something that causes a lot of complex reactions for people. For example, some people just want them gone; others consider them a sign of how far they've come, or a reminder to continue not harming or...the list goes on. The point is that I'm not trying to say that they shouldn't lie, or that it's a bad thing, or that they can't get them removed. Those just may not be the solutions they're looking for, for various reasons, and that's perfectly fine. There are a lot of routes you can take that may be a better fit.

At any rate, no tattoo will alter textures. My scars are all skin colored by now (finally), but they still get noticed from across the room sometimes. Scars also a) don't take color normally and b) it is hard to match skin tone and c) hard to cover up red with a light color

fine, we'll avoid tattoos, but OP sounds like she wants her scars hidden and I don't want her to have to compromise. You say your scars still get noticed? I'm happy you've made progress but the fact is they're still there and I'm betting OP would be so much happier not having to face that kind of judgment, and never giving up is a very good attribute for doctors to have (be it on patient lives, in their own studies, or even their willingness to avoid judgment).

If op will avoid tattoos completely then I think the next best option is always wearing long sleeves. But in order to do this naturally, she'd have to movr someplace cold. Depending on how willing she is to hide the scars (and as I said, determination is a very admirable trait) she could live someplace like Saskatchewan, where even in the summer she'd have to wear long sleeves. The only time she would wear short sleeves is at home, and people close enough to visit her there will be close enough to know she isn't defined by her past struggles.
After living there for 5 or 6 more years, I'd bet the scars would be completely gone and OP could return to the US.

 

[Crayola227]

@mehc012 we're clearly getting trolled by @Avicenna

which is really uncool given the OP's situation

the one thing that is correct from Avicenna, is that some people will notice and might judge you for it, and some will notice and not think bad of you, just curiosity. And some people can be surprisingly unobservant, even docs who are trained to "examine" people and catch the little things.

Anyone in med school and beyond knows the level of surface togetherness it takes and the general badassery you must possess to be where you are. OK? You have some street cred just for being accepted and showing up to hang out with this "elite" crew of perfectionistic workaholics that are **** ups in more hidden ways.

If they look old and faded and not fresh and new people will likely assume you went through some sort of crazy adolescent/young adult phase that so many of us do. It's not that unusual in the gen pop and more common than you would ever guess in med professionals. If anyone is gonna have some familiarity and not be shocked, it's gonna be us. We get some training on the concept. We tend to value results now over whatever is your backstory.

FFS, most of the time you can wear your white coat and its long sleeves. Some people will still roll them up and risk exposure and feel insecure about it, but eventually that goes away when years go by and no one says anything, or people do out of curiosity not harsh judgement (people are too afraid to, afraid of confrontation in general, most who would ask are people who have some reason they're sympathetic, some "excuse" they feel that they can ask and not come off like an dingus but someone trying to relate).

Try not to ever come off "crazy." Show yourself to be an enthusiastic, empathetic, caring person sensitive to all around you and with a high emotional IQ, and most people who noticed, that might have had preconceptions, will likely chalk it up to you being one of the "special flavor awesome insert____ diversity empathy patient centered care buzzwords" type docs that we're trying to create these days. Be that doc. Use whatever experience was behind these scars, to understand your patients and wow everyone with that understanding. That is not only how you will *be* a survivor but will be *seen* as one.

Or you can confirm any existing suspicion that you're not all together because yeah, sometimes people see what they want or you make mistakes. And it won't matter if you show up do your job and grit your teeth, which is what you have to do anyway, you'll pass, and you'll get a whole new crew in 4 weeks. It's only a small group of faculty and students that really stay the same and you develop a rep with. Med school has cliques, and you're likely to find yourself with the non-trads. The ones that are older, switching careers, have kids, have been to war, have seen some ****, have had crazy parents, or have a mental illness themselves, whatever makes them "less than traditional" yet they band together into a tribe that seems to "get it" better than the rest. People are sensitive to judgement and the empathetic crew I'm speaking of tends to find each other.

I won't lie. Anything in medicine that makes you stick out needs to either be leveraged to a strength or be seen as weakness. Luckily, there's a lot you can do about it. And it's not tattoos or surgery or a shirt, it's your attitude. You need to just be confident, and if asked, just say, "I went through a hard time and this: *points to scars* was not the best coping mechanism for the pain. You live, you learn." Boom. That's it. If they ask more, just say it's a long story you'd rather not get into. Or a story for another time maybe.

That's from the side of your peers and the rest of the establishment, which frankly at this point and for many years their opinion is the most important thing.

Patients? They are so ****ing clueless. They usually have what they consider way bigger problems and don't consider your humanity as much as you do.
The only time I think they might notice is if they have some themselves, or other experience first hand. People don't recognize where they come from unless they've learned.

They will either like you more for this, or maybe they'll assume you're "crazy" like whatever was their past experience and project onto you. Here's the thing, and you'll get training, it's assertiveness. It doesn't matter who you are, there will be a patient that finds a reason to challenge your "authority." So, the above approach still applies. So for your friends it might be that they were too male, too female, too old, too young, too not Jewish, look too much like their ex next door neighbor they hate. I dunno; patients are the crazy. For you it might be the scars. So be it, there will always be something anyway. So don't ever let a patient make you feel ashamed over bull****. If they want to criticize your bedside manner, your oral instruction skills, the fact you didn't give them more Dilaudid, more power to them. I'm not saying you should ignore patient whatever, just that there are times they are dinguses and wrong. But YOU are the Student Doctor, so if your skin isn't pretty enough for them, hold your head high anyway. Even if you don't feel you deserve to, even though you do. That white coat can make you feel like an imposter, it can also be a shield if you let it.

Basically, you need to start to see this clinically, I'll call it "doctor eyes." That means, sort of, like, impartially, scientifically the way you might a patient who had these and is a successful recovered doctor. Imagine this patient of yours that is a doctor. Imagine a doctor that you really admire right now, and that what you never knew was that they have the same collection of scars, but under their pants on their thighs. Psychoanalyze them a bit, about why they did this, and why they don't now. Do you admire them less now?? Now look at yourself with doctor eyes. With the same cold objective admiration.

There's also patients who ask because they legit think you lost a fight with a weed whacker. "Oh, this, it's a long story. Let's talk about...." move on to clinically relevant topic. You will learn this awkward unnatural form of communication we use called transactional communication. You will learn to interrupt people mid sentence and ask/say whatever you need to with no flow at all.

Basically, it really will be OK. It might suck sometimes. It might even occasionally surprise you with good. But if you don't let it get to you, you will be more than fine. Schools want to graduate you, residency programs just want you to sign ****. You don't realize it yet but you are a unit of production. You are one of 20 cans of beans left in the zombie apocolypse only your can got a little dented. Do you think in my example it ****ing matters? No, it doesn't. The pace is too fast, just do your job, and you'll get eaten alive along with everyone else.

In this case, I'll sling out there, that this was the n=1 of one MD. And I mentioned friends, right? I can safely say this would be the reaction of many doctors I know. Not all, but many. OK? You already have people in the profession that *get* it, that relate, that admire your unique journey from the creation of those scars to a colleague spitting mad science and rhymes like treating and streeting!

/lecture on professionalism blah blah in medicine

 

[idontwatchgreysanatomy]

how about getting a tattoo over the scars then getting it removed so you have tattoo removal scars completely covering self harm scars. For best results, go the doctor with the lowest rating on yelp so the scars left by the removal process will be as obstrusive as possible.
That way it looks like you're hiding a past of bad decisions instead of hiding a past of mental/emotional instability.
It eould be much easier to explain to adcoms because i would think an emotionally instable past is a much bigger red flag than a past of unprofessional impulsive decisions. It's not such a serious issue and you could even joke about it saying you got a tattoo of a former boyfriend's name, or some dumb thing you got when you were drunk.

Aside from this being a horrible suggestion, scarring from laser tattoo removal is incredibly rare. I work in a tattoo removal clinic and I've seen scarring only a couple times, usually from patients prone to keloid scarring. Hypopigmentation is slightly more common, but most patients I've seen have a completely successful removal.

 

[Gryffindor20]

@mehc012 we're clearly getting trolled by @Avicenna

which is really uncool given the OP's situation

the one thing that is correct from Avicenna, is that some people will notice and might judge you for it, and some will notice and not think bad of you, just curiosity. And some people can be surprisingly unobservant, even docs who are trained to "examine" people and catch the little things.

Anyone in med school and beyond knows the level of surface togetherness it takes and the general badassery you must possess to be where you are. OK? You have some street cred just for being accepted and showing up to hang out with this "elite" crew of perfectionistic workaholics that are **** ups in more hidden ways.

If they look old and faded and not fresh and new people will likely assume you went through some sort of crazy adolescent/young adult phase that so many of us do. It's not that unusual in the gen pop and more common than you would ever guess in med professionals. If anyone is gonna have some familiarity and not be shocked, it's gonna be us. We get some training on the concept. We tend to value results now over whatever is your backstory.

FFS, most of the time you can wear your white coat and its long sleeves. Some people will still roll them up and risk exposure and feel insecure about it, but eventually that goes away when years go by and no one says anything, or people do out of curiosity not harsh judgement (people are too afraid to, afraid of confrontation in general, most who would ask are people who have some reason they're sympathetic, some "excuse" they feel that they can ask and not come off like an dingus but someone trying to relate).

Try not to ever come off "crazy." Show yourself to be an enthusiastic, empathetic, caring person sensitive to all around you and with a high emotional IQ, and most people who noticed, that might have had preconceptions, will likely chalk it up to you being one of the "special flavor awesome insert____ diversity empathy patient centered care buzzwords" type docs that we're trying to create these days. Be that doc. Use whatever experience was behind these scars, to understand your patients and wow everyone with that understanding. That is not only how you will *be* a survivor but will be *seen* as one.

Or you can confirm any existing suspicion that you're not all together because yeah, sometimes people see what they want or you make mistakes. And it won't matter if you show up do your job and grit your teeth, which is what you have to do anyway, you'll pass, and you'll get a whole new crew in 4 weeks. It's only a small group of faculty and students that really stay the same and you develop a rep with. Med school has cliques, and you're likely to find yourself with the non-trads. The ones that are older, switching careers, have kids, have been to war, have seen some ****, have had crazy parents, or have a mental illness themselves, whatever makes them "less than traditional" yet they band together into a tribe that seems to "get it" better than the rest. People are sensitive to judgement and the empathetic crew I'm speaking of tends to find each other.

I won't lie. Anything in medicine that makes you stick out needs to either be leveraged to a strength or be seen as weakness. Luckily, there's a lot you can do about it. And it's not tattoos or surgery or a shirt, it's your attitude. You need to just be confident, and if asked, just say, "I went through a hard time and this: *points to scars* was not the best coping mechanism for the pain. You live, you learn." Boom. That's it. If they ask more, just say it's a long story you'd rather not get into. Or a story for another time maybe.

That's from the side of your peers and the rest of the establishment, which frankly at this point and for many years their opinion is the most important thing.

Patients? They are so ****ing clueless. They usually have what they consider way bigger problems and don't consider your humanity as much as you do.
The only time I think they might notice is if they have some themselves, or other experience first hand. People don't recognize where they come from unless they've learned.

They will either like you more for this, or maybe they'll assume you're "crazy" like whatever was their past experience and project onto you. Here's the thing, and you'll get training, it's assertiveness. It doesn't matter who you are, there will be a patient that finds a reason to challenge your "authority." So, the above approach still applies. So for your friends it might be that they were too male, too female, too old, too young, too not Jewish, look too much like their ex next door neighbor they hate. I dunno; patients are the crazy. For you it might be the scars. So be it, there will always be something anyway. So don't ever let a patient make you feel ashamed over bull****. If they want to criticize your bedside manner, your oral instruction skills, the fact you didn't give them more Dilaudid, more power to them. I'm not saying you should ignore patient whatever, just that there are times they are dinguses and wrong. But YOU are the Student Doctor, so if your skin isn't pretty enough for them, hold your head high anyway. Even if you don't feel you deserve to, even though you do. That white coat can make you feel like an imposter, it can also be a shield if you let it.

Basically, you need to start to see this clinically, I'll call it "doctor eyes." That means, sort of, like, impartially, scientifically the way you might a patient who had these and is a successful recovered doctor. Imagine this patient of yours that is a doctor. Imagine a doctor that you really admire right now, and that what you never knew was that they have the same collection of scars, but under their pants on their thighs. Psychoanalyze them a bit, about why they did this, and why they don't now. Do you admire them less now?? Now look at yourself with doctor eyes. With the same cold objective admiration.

There's also patients who ask because they legit think you lost a fight with a weed whacker. "Oh, this, it's a long story. Let's talk about...." move on to clinically relevant topic. You will learn this awkward unnatural form of communication we use called transactional communication. You will learn to interrupt people mid sentence and ask/say whatever you need to with no flow at all.

Basically, it really will be OK. It might suck sometimes. It might even occasionally surprise you with good. But if you don't let it get to you, you will be more than fine. Schools want to graduate you, residency programs just want you to sign ****. You don't realize it yet but you are a unit of production. You are one of 20 cans of beans left in the zombie apocolypse only your can got a little dented. Do you think in my example it ****ing matters? No, it doesn't. The pace is too fast, just do your job, and you'll get eaten alive along with everyone else.

In this case, I'll sling out there, that this was the n=1 of one MD. And I mentioned friends, right? I can safely say this would be the reaction of many doctors I know. Not all, but many. OK? You already have people in the profession that *get* it, that relate, that admire your unique journey from the creation of those scars to a colleague spitting mad science and rhymes like treating and streeting!

/lecture on professionalism blah blah in medicine

Crayola, you are awesome. That's all.

 

[wanderingstudent10.10]

@mehc012 we're clearly getting trolled by @Avicenna

which is really uncool given the OP's situation

the one thing that is correct from Avicenna, is that some people will notice and might judge you for it, and some will notice and not think bad of you, just curiosity. And some people can be surprisingly unobservant, even docs who are trained to "examine" people and catch the little things.

Anyone in med school and beyond knows the level of surface togetherness it takes and the general badassery you must possess to be where you are. OK? You have some street cred just for being accepted and showing up to hang out with this "elite" crew of perfectionistic workaholics that are **** ups in more hidden ways.

If they look old and faded and not fresh and new people will likely assume you went through some sort of crazy adolescent/young adult phase that so many of us do. It's not that unusual in the gen pop and more common than you would ever guess in med professionals. If anyone is gonna have some familiarity and not be shocked, it's gonna be us. We get some training on the concept. We tend to value results now over whatever is your backstory.

FFS, most of the time you can wear your white coat and its long sleeves. Some people will still roll them up and risk exposure and feel insecure about it, but eventually that goes away when years go by and no one says anything, or people do out of curiosity not harsh judgement (people are too afraid to, afraid of confrontation in general, most who would ask are people who have some reason they're sympathetic, some "excuse" they feel that they can ask and not come off like an dingus but someone trying to relate).

Try not to ever come off "crazy." Show yourself to be an enthusiastic, empathetic, caring person sensitive to all around you and with a high emotional IQ, and most people who noticed, that might have had preconceptions, will likely chalk it up to you being one of the "special flavor awesome insert____ diversity empathy patient centered care buzzwords" type docs that we're trying to create these days. Be that doc. Use whatever experience was behind these scars, to understand your patients and wow everyone with that understanding. That is not only how you will *be* a survivor but will be *seen* as one.

Or you can confirm any existing suspicion that you're not all together because yeah, sometimes people see what they want or you make mistakes. And it won't matter if you show up do your job and grit your teeth, which is what you have to do anyway, you'll pass, and you'll get a whole new crew in 4 weeks. It's only a small group of faculty and students that really stay the same and you develop a rep with. Med school has cliques, and you're likely to find yourself with the non-trads. The ones that are older, switching careers, have kids, have been to war, have seen some ****, have had crazy parents, or have a mental illness themselves, whatever makes them "less than traditional" yet they band together into a tribe that seems to "get it" better than the rest. People are sensitive to judgement and the empathetic crew I'm speaking of tends to find each other.

I won't lie. Anything in medicine that makes you stick out needs to either be leveraged to a strength or be seen as weakness. Luckily, there's a lot you can do about it. And it's not tattoos or surgery or a shirt, it's your attitude. You need to just be confident, and if asked, just say, "I went through a hard time and this: *points to scars* was not the best coping mechanism for the pain. You live, you learn." Boom. That's it. If they ask more, just say it's a long story you'd rather not get into. Or a story for another time maybe.

That's from the side of your peers and the rest of the establishment, which frankly at this point and for many years their opinion is the most important thing.

Patients? They are so ****ing clueless. They usually have what they consider way bigger problems and don't consider your humanity as much as you do.
The only time I think they might notice is if they have some themselves, or other experience first hand. People don't recognize where they come from unless they've learned.

They will either like you more for this, or maybe they'll assume you're "crazy" like whatever was their past experience and project onto you. Here's the thing, and you'll get training, it's assertiveness. It doesn't matter who you are, there will be a patient that finds a reason to challenge your "authority." So, the above approach still applies. So for your friends it might be that they were too male, too female, too old, too young, too not Jewish, look too much like their ex next door neighbor they hate. I dunno; patients are the crazy. For you it might be the scars. So be it, there will always be something anyway. So don't ever let a patient make you feel ashamed over bull****. If they want to criticize your bedside manner, your oral instruction skills, the fact you didn't give them more Dilaudid, more power to them. I'm not saying you should ignore patient whatever, just that there are times they are dinguses and wrong. But YOU are the Student Doctor, so if your skin isn't pretty enough for them, hold your head high anyway. Even if you don't feel you deserve to, even though you do. That white coat can make you feel like an imposter, it can also be a shield if you let it.

Basically, you need to start to see this clinically, I'll call it "doctor eyes." That means, sort of, like, impartially, scientifically the way you might a patient who had these and is a successful recovered doctor. Imagine this patient of yours that is a doctor. Imagine a doctor that you really admire right now, and that what you never knew was that they have the same collection of scars, but under their pants on their thighs. Psychoanalyze them a bit, about why they did this, and why they don't now. Do you admire them less now?? Now look at yourself with doctor eyes. With the same cold objective admiration.

There's also patients who ask because they legit think you lost a fight with a weed whacker. "Oh, this, it's a long story. Let's talk about...." move on to clinically relevant topic. You will learn this awkward unnatural form of communication we use called transactional communication. You will learn to interrupt people mid sentence and ask/say whatever you need to with no flow at all.

Basically, it really will be OK. It might suck sometimes. It might even occasionally surprise you with good. But if you don't let it get to you, you will be more than fine. Schools want to graduate you, residency programs just want you to sign ****. You don't realize it yet but you are a unit of production. You are one of 20 cans of beans left in the zombie apocolypse only your can got a little dented. Do you think in my example it ****ing matters? No, it doesn't. The pace is too fast, just do your job, and you'll get eaten alive along with everyone else.

In this case, I'll sling out there, that this was the n=1 of one MD. And I mentioned friends, right? I can safely say this would be the reaction of many doctors I know. Not all, but many. OK? You already have people in the profession that *get* it, that relate, that admire your unique journey from the creation of those scars to a colleague spitting mad science and rhymes like treating and streeting!

/lecture on professionalism blah blah in medicine

Hi all! I'm back, not on here very often (this place caters wonderfully to my neuroticism, so I try to limit myself). First off, for all the advice and input, I just wanted to say thank you. I appreciate everyone weighing in on my situation and not being insensitive or rude. I am still deciding what to do, I plan to consult with a dermatologist when I can and perhaps also a tattoo artist with experience in surgical scar tattoos to at least see what my options are both ways. My scars don't bother me too much on a personal level, I know I have my **** together now and I'm *almost* grateful for my experience with mental illness because it has given me an understanding of mental illness and propelled me to help out in the mental health community. I think that my experience has value, as crappy as it was. I also understand that professionally, the scars can be a liability. The stigma is still definitely there, but I will try my level best to make what happened a strength and not a weakness.

 

[vegetara83]

So I randomly saw this on Buzzfeed today: 34 Beautiful Tattoos People Got To Cover Their Self-Harm Scars

https://www.buzzfeed.com/sallytamarkin/beautiful-tattoos-683?utm_term=.yfPqaGeBb2#.mbWb4QdBOk

I thought it might give you a better idea of how tats look over scars. The personal stories are there along with the pics.

 

[777137]

Hey All!
First off, I just want to ask everyone to please be kind. This is an immensely personal issue, and I'm not looking for your evaluation of whether I am stable, or your criticism of my ability to handle stress or anything of the sort. I'm looking strictly for advice on where I should go from here based on my career goals. Thanks for your consideration!

So here's the deal, I have self harm scars. Numerous, very visible, very old (all are from 7+ years ago, lining the outside and inside of my lower arm). I have not self harmed or had other issues for many many years. I'm not proud of them, I am embarrassed by them, and I would like them gone. Needless to say, surgical scar removal won't completely eliminate them and while I do use a cover makeup, they are still visible, though not very apparent.

I already work in the medical field, and am able to cover up with long sleeves under scrubs, etc. I like to be professional, and as a very private person, I don't like a lot of inquiry into my past, or worse, people questioning my ability to care for them. I will be applying to medical school next year, and I understand that may not be able to cover up all the time while in school or in the hospital and that worries me.

I am considering getting a coverup tattoo, however I am worried that a tattoo may be even worse. I know the medical profession isn't particularly friendly towards tattoos. I would have to get a large tattoo that wraps around my arm to cover adequately. So my question to you all is, is a tattoo a smart option career wise? Or should I just try to hide under long sleeves and use cover makeup the rest of my career? I know neither are optimal situations, however I don't really have any other options unless I want to drop a few thousand and risk infection with some skin grafts.

I don't think you should worry about it. Maybe its just me, but I don't notice that kind of stuff. Had an ex with them and I didn't notice until like 6 months in when she explicitly told me.