Sit the MCATS w/o O-Chem II?

[omniatlas]

Is this advisable? I haven't taken O-Chem part II (don't intend to, until next year); however I have already taken part I.

How much of O-Chem part II is there in the MCAT? Can I learn this stuff with the examkracker/princeton/kaplan books?

Thanks.

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[jebus]

I think this is a bad idea.
In my experience most the of MCAT orgo stuff is spectroscopy, benzene ring chemistry, aldehyde/ketone chemistry, carboxylic acid and the derivatives chemistry, and sugar chemistry. I think you will do much better with orgo II experience - I re-taught myself this material after 5 years out of orgo but re-learning concepts is much different than learning it by yourself for the first time. Also, I think examkrackers, TPR, etc., are to review the content and not to teach you the material.

 

[omniatlas]

I think this is a bad idea.
In my experience most the of MCAT orgo stuff is spectroscopy, benzene ring chemistry, aldehyde/ketone chemistry, carboxylic acid and the derivatives chemistry, and sugar chemistry. I think you will do much better with orgo II experience - I re-taught myself this material after 5 years out of orgo but re-learning concepts is much different than learning it by yourself for the first time. Also, I think examkrackers, TPR, etc., are to review the content and not to teach you the material.

doh -- I was considering also considering taking the MCAT in August because it would have been the last paper-based MCAT and I don't know how well I will fare on the computer.

 

[Mr. Tee]

Is it doable? Certainly...anything is possible.

Is it recommended? I wouldn't suggest it...

 

[letsrun4it]

I think this is a bad idea.
In my experience most the of MCAT orgo stuff is spectroscopy, benzene ring chemistry, aldehyde/ketone chemistry, carboxylic acid and the derivatives chemistry, and sugar chemistry. I think you will do much better with orgo II experience - I re-taught myself this material after 5 years out of orgo but re-learning concepts is much different than learning it by yourself for the first time. Also, I think examkrackers, TPR, etc., are to review the content and not to teach you the material.

What you say about relearning is different than learning for the first time is SOOO true. I took AP chemistry in high school and 6-7 years later there is still enough there to where relearning it is WAAAY easier than learning say physics for the first time.

 

[omniatlas]

I guess the concensus is to take the MCAT after I'm done with OChem II.

Anyone frustrated with the whole pre-med process? I'll be taking Physics II next semester and so I'll have to wait one whole year before taking O-Chem II, then prob the Aug 2007 MCATs -- and we all know how everyone says not to take the aug test because you'll be 'late' in the application (more spots already taken up).

 

[jebus]

I guess the concensus is to take the MCAT after I'm done with OChem II.

Anyone frustrated with the whole pre-med process? I'll be taking Physics II next semester and so I'll have to wait one whole year before taking O-Chem II, then prob the Aug 2007 MCATs -- and we all know how everyone says not to take the aug test because you'll be 'late' in the application (more spots already taken up).

For real, man or lady, don't take the August MCAT. I'm learning the hard way that even with good scores (36) you need to get your app in early. I wish I was complete at schools in September rather than November.

 

[Anastasis]

I guess the concensus is to take the MCAT after I'm done with OChem II.

Anyone frustrated with the whole pre-med process? I'll be taking Physics II next semester and so I'll have to wait one whole year before taking O-Chem II, then prob the Aug 2007 MCATs -- and we all know how everyone says not to take the aug test because you'll be 'late' in the application (more spots already taken up).

Why can't you take O-Chem II in the summer? That sucks that you have to wait awhole year!

 

[omniatlas]

For real, man or lady, don't take the August MCAT. I'm learning the hard way that even with good scores (36) you need to get your app in early. I wish I was complete at schools in September rather than November.

Sorry to hear -- thats a good (great) score -- did you only apply to top tier programs?

Do you think preparing for the o-chem (w/o part II) with examkrackers books and flashcards and their audio osmosis series will be adequate enough?

I know that next year the MCATs will be offerred on a weekly basis, so there will be more flexibility -- but I will still be busy with classes until about June, so that leaves under 3 months to prepare for the august MCAT 2007 -- again I'll be in the same predicament.

One last question (before I drive you all insane) -- I took o-chem part I last year and got a B- , not too great -- would you suggest I take it again, to help with O-Chem part II and for a better grade?

Anastatis -- I could take O-Chem over the summer but it would be hell working a job. I've heard horror stories that it would be extremely difficult. I would also be paying about $3000 more if I took it over the summer than in the fall

 

[Nikki2002]

i don't think you need to retake O-chem I--I don't think it will affect your grade in O-chem II that greatly. The mcat is gonna be offered on a weekly basis? hell yeah!

 

[alex_shimp]

oh -- I was considering also considering taking the MCAT in August because it would have been the last paper-based MCAT and I don't know how well I will fare on the computer.

What do you mean the last paper based MCAT?

 

[omniatlas]

What do you mean the last paper based MCAT?

August 2006 will be the last time the MCAT will be paper-based. It will also be the last time it will be a grueling 8 hour exam. Starting next year the test will be shortened to 5.5 hrs, there will only be one essay, and it will be computer based.

I don't know how confortable you are with taking tests on a computer, but I much prefer to take it on paper

 

[alex_shimp]

August 2006 will be the last time the MCAT will be paper-based. It will also be the last time it will be a grueling 8 hour exam. Starting next year the test will be shortened to 5.5 hrs, there will only be one essay, and it will be computer based.

I don't know how confortable you are with taking tests on a computer, but I much prefer to take it on paper

So they reduce it to 5.5 hours how? less breaks or less material ?

 

[omniatlas]

So they reduce it to 5.5 hours how? less breaks or less material ?

Breaks are optional, 33% less questions, only one exam essay.

To take new MCAT, or to take old MCAT, that is the question.

 

[omniatlas]

So I talked to KAPLAN yesterday, and they recommended I take it next year after I'm done with O-Chem II. The reason I wanted to take it early was so I wouldn't be late with the application cycle; but I realized, now that scores will be released in 2 weeks, that doesn't really put you late as medschools only start evaluating your application in August.

 

[scrubs07]

I don't understand why you can't take orgo II in the summer, I mean, it will all be fresh in your head for the August MCAT. I'm on the same boat, was gonna take it next fall but will end up doing it this summer. To be honest I think you should take the August, you have plenty of time right now to start studying so try some diagnostic tests and teach yourself some of the material, ask an organic professor at your college to give you some prep materials or even tutoring or something. Get confident but don't focus too much on orgoII though, to make up for the loss of not having that course study more on the other subjects and I'm sure your score will be great. If your score doesn't turn out that way, you have an entire year to get yourself ready for next April and the computer based testing. The medical school process is of course looong and I for one am done with college, just want to graduate and jump in, if you're like me - try August. Yeah I really wish they had more dates to take the exam, SAT was like every 2 months, now that was smart. Best of luck.

 

[ND2005]

For real, man or lady, don't take the August MCAT. I'm learning the hard way that even with good scores (36) you need to get your app in early. I wish I was complete at schools in September rather than November.

The August MCAT is a tough way to go. For me though, the extra year of my life it's giving me is very much worth it. I'd rather be a little behind the 8-ball in this application cycle than have to wait for the '07 cycle.

I'm confident that I will be studying medicine next fall at a good program. Maybe I would have had more options in 2007, but it's still not worth giving up a full year (at least not in my opinion).

 

[omniatlas]

I don't understand why you can't take orgo II in the summer, I mean, it will all be fresh in your head for the August MCAT. I'm on the same boat, was gonna take it next fall but will end up doing it this summer. To be honest I think you should take the August, you have plenty of time right now to start studying so try some diagnostic tests and teach yourself some of the material, ask an organic professor at your college to give you some prep materials or even tutoring or something. Get confident but don't focus too much on orgoII though, to make up for the loss of not having that course study more on the other subjects and I'm sure your score will be great. If your score doesn't turn out that way, you have an entire year to get yourself ready for next April and the computer based testing. The medical school process is of course looong and I for one am done with college, just want to graduate and jump in, if you're like me - try August. Yeah I really wish they had more dates to take the exam, SAT was like every 2 months, now that was smart. Best of luck.

I would love to take O-Chem in the summer but it would be difficult because of 1. Cost (its cheaper at the extension school at harvard in the fall) and 2. Time (I'll be working 40hrs/week) ; and we all know the time commitment you need with O-chem. I'm also planning to get EMT certified this summer but will have to shelf those plans if I'll be sitting for the MCAT.

I think the advantages of taking the MCAT in August 2006 are:

1. Paper-based; familar format, passages can be annotated; KAPLAN/PRINCETON/EK are geared towards the paper-based test
2. You'll start preparing for the MCAT earlier -- if you don't do so well you can always take it again later
3. Have the choice of taking the computer test later, but not the otherway around.
4. Getting the damn test out of the way early.

The advantages of taking the MCAT in 2007:

1. 33% Less questions, one essay (although some might say this might be a disadvantage)
2. Multiple test dates with a 2-week turn around score (If you take the test in august you can also apply in august)
3. Be done with all my pre-med requirements and therefore studying for the MCAT will be REVIEWING and not learning new material!


I guess I am going to take a AAMC practice test and see how well I fare; and depending on how well I do make a judgement call. The kaplan person did say we read about 30% slower on the computer so I'll have to see how well I do on computer based test as well.

You all have been very helpful; thanks again

 

[omniatlas]

The August MCAT is a tough way to go. For me though, the extra year of my life it's giving me is very much worth it. I'd rather be a little behind the 8-ball in this application cycle than have to wait for the '07 cycle.

I'm confident that I will be studying medicine next fall at a good program. Maybe I would have had more options in 2007, but it's still not worth giving up a full year (at least not in my opinion).

Don't medical schools only review your applications in August? If the new MCAT has a shortened turn-around scoring, and multiple dates to take the test we shouldn't run into any more application cycle problems right?

 

[jebus]

Med schools review your app when when it's complete. But they only review it once.
The cycle problems arise because of this. Some schools get >11000 applications (GWU), a lot of people apply early. I remember LizzyM said that fully 25% of the applications are done within the first month (and this includes 2ºs). Schools only have a finite number of interview spots. If you are one of the first complete applicants you have a better chance to get one of these spots than if you are complete at the end of the cycle when there are fewer open interview spots.
I suspect that the changes to the MCAT administrations (with regard to frequency) will only push that date forward such that an applicant will need to be complete even earlier. They say that there will be MCATs administered in April and possibly June. Well, I think that June date will be very popular and will greatly skew the application cycle. Once test takers finish that exam they will probably concentrate on applications - just like they do now after the August test and after the April results get released.
So, you're at HES, what do the advisors there tell you to do?

 

[Sundarban1]

Don't medical schools only review your applications in August? If the new MCAT has a shortened turn-around scoring, and multiple dates to take the test we shouldn't run into any more application cycle problems right?

Omni, Norteastern (off the green line in Boston) offers Ochem I/II over the summer at night. I'm also in HES and considering taking it there this summer. It is also a lot less expensive, around the price of a regular 1 semester class at HES during the year. Just a thought.

 

[omniatlas]

I

 

[omniatlas]

I think the question remains whether medical schools will change their policy of reviewing applications in 2007. Students already have the choice to take the MCAT in april, yet schools still do not review applications until Oct (according to the kaplan person) -- do you think it would be extremely difficult for medical schools to push for earlier application review?

I'm not officially in the HES program -- just taking classes over there so I do not have access to their advisors.

Sundarban -- thanks for the info, I did not know that. However I've heard it is extremely difficult to take o-chem over the summer. I went to one of the HEPPS talk and there was an anesthesiologist on the panel who recommended NOT to take o-chem over the summer like he did -- he found it extremely challenging, even more challenging than going through residency

Med schools review your app when when it's complete. But they only review it once.
The cycle problems arise because of this. Some schools get >11000 applications (GWU), a lot of people apply early. I remember LizzyM said that fully 25% of the applications are done within the first month (and this includes 2ºs). Schools only have a finite number of interview spots. If you are one of the first complete applicants you have a better chance to get one of these spots than if you are complete at the end of the cycle when there are fewer open interview spots.
I suspect that the changes to the MCAT administrations (with regard to frequency) will only push that date forward such that an applicant will need to be complete even earlier. They say that there will be MCATs administered in April and possibly June. Well, I think that June date will be very popular and will greatly skew the application cycle. Once test takers finish that exam they will probably concentrate on applications - just like they do now after the August test and after the April results get released.
So, you're at HES, what do the advisors there tell you to do?

 

[omniatlas]

I

 

[ND2005]

I think the question remains whether medical schools will change their policy of reviewing applications in 2007. Students already have the choice to take the MCAT in april, yet schools still do not review applications until Oct (according to the kaplan person) -- do you think it would be extremely difficult for medical schools to push for earlier application review?

Your Kaplan contact is giving you incorrect information. Schools review applications as soon as they receive them (early June). Schools begin granting interviews in early August, and almost all schools begin accepting students in early/mid October (except for the non-rolling schools).

The change in the MCAT will not enable schools to start reviewing earlier, since the current hold-up in the review process is the receipt of the AMCAS application, not the receipt of MCAT scores.

The only potential change that the new MCAT format will bring is that fewer people will suffer from the August MCAT penalty, since there will be less of a reason to wait that long to take the MCAT (when there are options to take the exam in June/July).

 

[Sundarban1]

Sundarban -- thanks for the info, I did not know that. However I've heard it is extremely difficult to take o-chem over the summer.

Yes, this is true. Let it be said that the reason that it is taught at night is for adults who work during the day, so I'm hoping that although the material is rigorous, there is some understanding that a majority of the people taking the class are adults with full time jobs, whereas at Harvard during the summer the majority of of the class are undergraduate students, so the class goes a lot quicker.

I went to one of the HEPPS talk and there was an anesthesiologist on the panel who recommended NOT to take o-chem over the summer like he did -- he found it extremely challenging, even more challenging than going through residency

I find this hard to believe (not that he said it). Like I said each school teaches the class at different pace and expects different things from their students. Being offered through the adult education curriculum I assume it was not be as rough as someone taking it during the day at a 4 year college with other undergraduates.

In an ideal world we'd all be able to take it full time during the year, but that is not reality for non traditional students. If you are pressed for time I think it would be a good idea to look into the course. Just my thoughts.

 

[Mr. Tee]

The August MCAT is a tough way to go. For me though, the extra year of my life it's giving me is very much worth it. I'd rather be a little behind the 8-ball in this application cycle than have to wait for the '07 cycle.

Thanks, that means I have no competition from you when my time comes next year!

I went to one of the HEPPS talk and there was an anesthesiologist on the panel who recommended NOT to take o-chem over the summer like he did -- he found it extremely challenging, even more challenging than going through residency

I look forward to residency then!!

 

[Lindyhopper]

These things always depend on individual circumstances & abilities, but, for most people the the MCAT is hard enough without a handicap.
One highly recommended rescource is EK's 1001 questions in Ochem. I find that Ochem, Gchem, & physics are like math in that they are best learned through doing problems. If one can work through the 1001 Question books, & practice Mcat passages they're good to go. (& I happen to teach for the competition.)

 

[omniatlas]

Is there a certain rush to get into medical school? All the residents/post-residents I talk to say that they had wish they had taken some time off after college and spent their 20's doing something else. One even told me if she could have gone back she would have done it again, done something else, and even be more happy

At this point I've been out of college for nearly two years and would like to start medical school as soon as possible -- but am I doing this the right way? The majority of you seem to be suggesting I take the MCAT in August -- I hope there will be sufficient time to prepare as I am also managing b/w a job and classes.

 

[omniatlas]

These things always depend on individual circumstances & abilities, but, for most people the the MCAT is hard enough without a handicap.
One highly recommended rescource is EK's 1001 questions in Ochem. I find that Ochem, Gchem, & physics are like math in that they are best learned through doing problems. If one can work through the 1001 Question books, & practice Mcat passages they're good to go. (& I happen to teach for the competition.)

Thanks Lindy -- I'll take a look at the books.

 

[Nikki2002]

ok if taking o-chem over the summer is harder than residency, then hell yeah!! i'm making the right career decision