Starting Salary for DPT new-grads

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I constantly hear about how in demand pts are in my area, but just to test that, I check around my area for job listing for pts, and there's never anything besides >3 years experience or the same crap traveling pt company that no one ever responds to because they pay peanuts.

Myosin - 300K is indeed way too much debt for a PharmD. That's crazy.

Job markets, like real estate markets, are often very local. That's why I don't rely too much on the BLS numbers: they are ok at the macro level, but they don't tell me what the job market is like, right in my city. I think your best bet is to talk to the 3rd-year students. After graduation, a lot of people tend to stay within 250 miles of where they grew up or went to school. So polling the 3rd-year PT students who are about to graduate will give you a decent snapshot of what's going on in your area.

At my school (UNC), all the 3rd-years I have talked to seem to have solid prospects for job offers. But that's only valid for the Charlotte and Triangle areas of NC. And keep in mind the situation can change very quickly: when I got my MBA in 1999, you would get excellent job offers as long as you could fog a mirror: the economy was booming and the dot-com bubble was in full swing. The folks in the class that followed mine (class of 2000) saw their offers rescinded: they would interview in the Fall and sign job offers for starting the following May. April comes around and they would get a letter from the companies saying "Sorry, we can't take you on."

So, talk to the 3rd-years, talk to your professors, talk to the local PTs, and check out the job placement stats at your school. That's the best way to keep your finger on the pulse of the PT job market in your area.

I did some more back-of-the-envelope calculations re new PT schools. As noted in a previous post, there are about 10,250 new grads every year (205 schools currently, and an average of 50 students per graduating class). Let's assume there are 15 schools opening up every year - roughly one new school for every 3 states. So that's 750 additional new grads to add to the pot. If the new schools start their DPT programs in 2014, by 2017 we'll have about 11,000 new PTs entering the workforce each year, and roughly 1,000 more every year after that. By 2020, 14,000 new PTs would graduate.

By comparison, there are 124 pharmacy schools (as of 7/2012) and 12,000 PharmD degrees awarded in 2011. And just like in PT, new pharmacy schools are opening up. Although a pharmacist's job and a PT's job are quite different, I think the general trend is the same: saturation over the long run. Is the "long run" 5 years, 10 years, 20 years? I don't know.

And of course "Obamacare" may throw a big wrench into the works...

Bottom line: get into PT school as fast as you can, go to the least expensive school which accepts you, network a lot while in school, and find a way to stand out from the thousands of new grads each year.

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I remember 5 years ago when I was a student and asked this same question.

After I graduated I worked 2 years at a private clinic saved up some money opened my own clinic and now making close to 250,000 net income.

Although this is probably not your typical example of how much a PT would make but it is possible. You have to have the right personality and be ok with taking big financial risks(it costs money to open a clinic), be a very good Physio so you build a good reputation, work hard and sometimes long hours and be able to have good business skills. Ofcourse you have to be able to deal with some stress along the way.
 
This discussion is so interesting and I'm glad I'm getting a taste of what is to come.

I will be starting PT school in the summer, so I'll be the class of 2016 (seems so far from now). My question is why are fields like PT and pharmacy being saturated and fields like dentistry and medical school not? Is it because most of the graduates open private practices? I know physicians have a hard time with finding residencies, but after that there doesn't seem to be any fear of there being "too many doctors." I know that physical therapists have the ability to open clinics, but the majority of us don't and working in a hospital is more commonplace. I know there are a lot of mixed emotions about Direct Access and how the new title "DPT" is just a name without any substance behind it but what can we do as a profession to "change our fate" so to speak? (Did I just quote the Disney movie Brave?)

Anyway, I know there are a lot of politics around why new schools opening up (really it's just about the money) and 205+ physical therapy programs is a lot. There are only 171 MD/DO schools (granted some of their class sizes are larger) and in the MD/DO forums you don't see the same discussions as Optometry/PT/Pharmacy. I'm sure when I start school I will have a lot more knowledge of these topics, but somethings gotta give. The APTA needs to do better in this regard. It's crazy to watch the plights of other professions and not try and mitigate the damages in PT.
 
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I know physicians have a hard time with finding residencies, but after that there doesn't seem to be any fear of there being "too many doctors."

The AMA has its act together as a lobby and probably has much deeper pockets than APTA. The accreditation process for med schools is arduous, and I am sure the AMA influences it, directly or indirectly. The latest med school to open is Carilion Med School at Va Tech in 2010 and I haven't heard of any other since. Contrast that with PT schools, where a dozen pop up every year.
Another data point: I used to work in the software industry and last year, I helped a PT private practice select a EHR (electronic health records) system. MDs, DOs dentists, and even Chiros get a government subsidy in implementing such a system. PTs do not. Since we have the best Congress money can buy, draw your own conclusions...
 
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Yesterday I ran into an old friend who had considered getting a DVM degree (vet). He gave up his dream some time ago, and over coffee he pointed me to this NYT article which summarizes the situation very well, according to him:
http://www.nytimes.com/2013/02/24/business/high-debt-and-falling-demand-trap-new-veterinarians.html

Some interesting points from the article (I highly recommend you read it):
- The average starting salary for a vet is $45.5K/year (!)
- Average out-of-state tuition is $63K/yr
- There are currently 28 vet schools in the US, and 1 for-profit school in the Caribbean
- Four additional schools are in the planning stages in the US
- There are approx. 91,000 vets (1/10th the number of MDs)
- In 1999, 84% of graduating vets had permanent job offers; in 2012, that percentage dropped to 49%
- Despite those facts, the BLS still states that “overall job opportunities for veterinarians are expected to be good

The conversation with my friend and the above article got me thinking. A PT's job is quite different from a Pharmacist's job: we see one person at a time, for a somewhat long period (30-45 mins, from my shadowing experience) while Pharmacists do not have extended contact with their patients, even in hospital settings. Our job is also different from an Optometrist's job, in that Walmart and Target can't open PT clinics and drive prices down like they have done in decimating the Optos' business.

But would our job be similar to vets'? Vets see one animal at a time. You won't skip seeing a physician, but if money is really really tight you could skip a vet visit for your pet. I personally know some folks who are skipping PT today because they can't afford even the co-pay. But thankfully most of our patients still have insurance.

Frankly, I am not sure where this leaves us, but I wanted to add my thoughts to this thread since it may be useful to folks considering the PT profession. Divining the future is hard but that shouldn't stop us from using the info we have today to try to "see around the corner."
 
I believe it becomes more of an issue when annual tuition in PT school costs more than what a PT makes in a year. Hopefully it doesn't happen to PTs like it has happened to Vets

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What I see as an issue are reliances on on-line and brochure HEPs. People may perceive this as "good enough" and as a norm, rather than relying on true professionals to effectively and safety help them regain (I) in ADLs.
 
What I see as an issue are reliances on on-line and brochure HEPs. People may perceive this as "good enough" and as a norm, rather than relying on true professionals to effectively and safety help them regain (I) in ADLs.

You could say the same thing about MDs, DCs, or any other clinician. Look at the explosive growth in CAM, and the number of people who think they never have to go to the doctor again because they eat a perfect diet. There is in fact a book out there called 'The Perfect Health Diet.' It doesn't exist.

Kevin
 
I remember 5 years ago when I was a student and asked this same question.

After I graduated I worked 2 years at a private clinic saved up some money opened my own clinic and now making close to 250,000 net income.

Although this is probably not your typical example of how much a PT would make but it is possible. You have to have the right personality and be ok with taking big financial risks(it costs money to open a clinic), be a very good Physio so you build a good reputation, work hard and sometimes long hours and be able to have good business skills. Ofcourse you have to be able to deal with some stress along the way.

how many patients are you seeing a day? how long do you spend with each patient? i see a lot of clinics where therapists are pumping out patients really quickly and spend less than 10 minutes doing manual on them. the money is great but they get burnt out real fast
 
I remember 5 years ago when I was a student and asked this same question.

After I graduated I worked 2 years at a private clinic saved up some money opened my own clinic and now making close to 250,000 net income.

Although this is probably not your typical example of how much a PT would make but it is possible. You have to have the right personality and be ok with taking big financial risks(it costs money to open a clinic), be a very good Physio so you build a good reputation, work hard and sometimes long hours and be able to have good business skills. Ofcourse you have to be able to deal with some stress along the way.

What's tax looking like? What state are you in?
 
how many patients are you seeing a day? how long do you spend with each patient? i see a lot of clinics where therapists are pumping out patients really quickly and spend less than 10 minutes doing manual on them. the money is great but they get burnt out real fast

I see about 2-3 patients an hour I work long hours about 10-11 hours a day. So about 30 people a day. I spend about 20-30 mins per patient. I keep my expenses low and I have no partners. I have a massage therapist and do some orthotics as well.
 
I see about 2-3 patients an hour I work long hours about 10-11 hours a day. So about 30 people a day. I spend about 20-30 mins per patient. I keep my expenses low and I have no partners. I have a massage therapist and do some orthotics as well.

30 patients a day is a lot. When do you bill? How are your outcomes? Patient satisfaction?
 
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30 patients a day is a lot. When do you bill? How are your outcomes? Patient satisfaction?

Patient satisfaction is good. Like I said I spend about 20-30mins 1:1 with each patient not including modalities. 2-3 patients per hour is fairly standard in most clinics that have a steady patient flow. It works out to be about 25-30/ patients a day on average usually about 25.
 
ONstudentPT, someone mentioned that they thought you are practicing in Canada, is that true? If so, what province? Do you have a DPT or masters? My husband and I are thinking of moving back when I finish my DPT, I'm curious about my prospects!
 
Just in case yall were still looking for the "hard number" information about pay and such, the Bureau of Labor and Statistics (BLS) has all the information you might be looking for, but do be warned, the website is cumbersome! You'll have to do several searches and clicks to get what you want. Hopefully this link will take you to the page with all the info. You can break it down to the region you live in as well to see what the pay is like for your area but I included the nationwide stats of a PT below (All information are estimates of course and are from 2011, 29-1123 Physical Therapists):

Employment: 185,440
Mean hourly wage: $38.38
Mean annual wage 79,830

Percentile
10% 25% 50% (Median) 75% 90%
Hourly Wage $26.30 $31.66 $37.63 $44.14 $53.21
Annual Wage $54,710 $65,860 $78,270 $91,810 $110,670

Industries with the highest levels of employment in this occupation:
numbers listed below in this order:


Employment, Percent of industry employment, Hourly mean wage, Annual mean wage

Offices of Other Health Practitioners 63,910, 9.27, $37.56, $78,120
General Medical and Surgical Hospitals 48,100, 0.93, $37.84, $78,710
Home Health Care Services 22,010, 1.96, $42.86, $89,150
Nursing Care Facilities 12,860, 0.77, $40.01, $83,220
Offices of Physicians 9,010, 0.38, $38.57, $80,220

Top paying industries for this occupation:
Employment, Percent of industry employment, Hourly mean wage, Annual mean wage


Management, Scientific, and Technical Consulting Services 120, 0.01, $43.76, $91,020
Home Health Care Services 22,010, 1.96, $42.86, $89,150
Employment Services 3,030, 0.10, $40.68, $84,610
Nursing Care Facilities 12,860, 0.77, $40.01, $83,220
Community Care Facilities for the Elderly 1,280, 0.17, $39.83, $82,840

States with the highest employment level in this occupation:

State, Employment, Employment per thousand jobs, Location quotient, Hourly mean, wage, Annual mean wage


California 15,420, 1.10, 0.76, $41.78, $86,890
New York 13,490, 1.60, 1.11, $37.90, $78,840
Florida 12,020, 1.68, 1.16, $39.45, $82,050
Texas 11,880, 1.15, 0.80, $43.51, $90,500
Pennsylvania 9,370, 1.69, 1.17, $36.85, $76,640

Percentile wage estimates for this occupation:

Percentile 10% 25% 50% (Median) 75% 90%
Hourly Wage $26.30 $31.66 $37.63 $44.14 $53.21
Annual Wage (2) $54,710 $65,860 $78,270 $91,810 $110,670

Industries with the highest levels of employment in this occupation:

Industry Employment, Percent of industry employment, Hourly mean wage, Annual mean wage

Offices of Other Health Practitioners 63,910, 9.27, $37.56, $78,120
General Medical and Surgical Hospitals 48,100, 0.93, $37.84, $78,710
Home Health Care Services 22,010, 1.96, $42.86, $89,150
Nursing Care Facilities 12,860, 0.77, $40.01, $83,220
Offices of Physicians 9,010, 0.38, $38.57, $80,220

Industries with the highest concentration of employment in this occupation:

Industry, Employment, Percent of industry employment, Hourly mean wage, Annual mean wage

Offices of Other Health Practitioners 63,910, 9.27 $37.56 $78,120
Specialty (except Psychiatric and Substance Abuse) Hospitals 6,570, 2.98, $38.13, $79,320
Home Health Care Services 22,010, 1.96, $42.86, $89,150
General Medical and Surgical Hospitals 48,100, 0.93, $37.84, $78,710
Nursing Care Facilities 12,860, 0.77, $40.01, $83,220

Top paying industries for this occupation:

Industry, Employment, Percent of industry employment, Hourly mean wage, Annual mean wage

Management, Scientific, and Technical Consulting Services 120, 0.01, $43.76, $91,020
Home Health Care Services 22,010, 1.96, $42.86, $89,150
Employment Services 3,030, 0.10, $40.68, $84,610
Nursing Care Facilities 12,860, 0.77, $40.01, $83,220
Community Care Facilities for the Elderly 1,280, 0.17, $39.83, $82,840

States with the highest employment level in this occupation:
State, Employment, Employment per thousand jobs, Location quotient, Hourly mean wage, Annual mean wage
California 15,420, 1.10, 0.76, $41.78, $86,890
New York 13,490, 1.60, 1.11, $37.90, $78,840
Florida 12,020, 1.68, 1.16, $39.45, $82,050
Texas 11,880, 1.15, 0.80, $43.51, $90,500
Pennsylvania 9,370 , 1.69, 1.17, $36.85, $76,640

States with the highest concentration of jobs and location quotients in this occupation:

State, Employment, Employment per thousand jobs, Location quotient, Hourly mean wage, Annual mean wage
Rhode Island 1,050, 2.33, 1.61, $39.54, $82,240
Vermont 660, 2.26, 1.57, $34.67, $72,110
Maine 1,300, 2.26, 1.56, $35.73, $74,320
Connecticut 3,530, 2.19, 1.52, $38.70, $80,490
Massachusetts 6,880, 2.18, 1.51, $37.65, $78,310

Top paying States for this occupation:

State, Employment, Employment per thousand jobs, Location quotient, Hourly mean wage, Annual mean wage

Nevada 1,370, 1.23, 0.85, $47.03, $97,810
Alaska 410, 1.31, 0.91, $44.23, $91,990
Texas 11,880, 1.15, 0.80, $43.51, $90,500
District of Columbia 400, 0.62, 0.43, $42.94, $89,300
New Jersey 6,330, 1.68, 1.16, $42.44, $88,270
 
ONstudentPT, someone mentioned that they thought you are practicing in Canada, is that true? If so, what province? Do you have a DPT or masters? My husband and I are thinking of moving back when I finish my DPT, I'm curious about my prospects!


Owning a business is not easy and is not for everyone. You have to be able to sleep at night not knowing where your next paycheck is coming from and dealing with the burden of covering many expenses regardless of how well your business is doing. It is easier to make this kind of money as a medical doctor. However my point was that it is also possible to make good money as a PT.

I see many people complaining about how much PT's make but even if you do not own your own business and work as an independent contractor on a percentage split you can still make around 75-100k.
 
Owning a business is not easy and is not for everyone. You have to be able to sleep at night not knowing where your next paycheck is coming from and dealing with the burden of covering many expenses regardless of how well your business is doing. It is easier to make this kind of money as a medical doctor. However my point was that it is also possible to make good money as a PT.

I see many people complaining about how much PT's make but even if you do not own your own business and work as an independent contractor on a percentage split you can still make around 75-100k.

Yes- I always wonder where people are coming from who think 75K is BAD. That's about what my parents make combined.

I've also noticed you have not confirmed you're canadian (as the previous poster asked), but I am guessing you are from Ontario ;)
 
Aside from SDN, I also keep an eye on several other PT discussion boards. There's one where Travel PTs congregate (therapistcentric.com). I just saw the following exchange in a discussion that started in Feb 2013. That's one more data point in the big picture for us.

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We have started hearing from multiple staffing agencies in the last couple weeks that the amount of contracts available have been slowly dropping in the past few months. Has anyone else seen this type of trend? We were looking for contracts in Oregon for March and things seemed to have suddenly dried up (as far as PT).

We've been doing this enough to know that the positions posted on most job boards are "fishing positions" that don't actually exist anymore, but this is actual confirmation from companies saying they just haven't seen as much come in and their facilities aren't calling them with need as frequently as they are used to receiving, though the need is obviously still there...

We just want to make sure this isn't an isolated event for us and it is happening for other travelers too. Thanks!


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I have been experiencing the exact same thing :( I'm also a PT, but I have been looking for jobs in Texas, Arizona, and California. My recruiter said that Texas usually has 80 jobs on the PT list at any given time... late last month when I was looking for my new contract, they had FOUR jobs! It was the worst he'd seen it since 2008. I ended up taking a job at a town in Texas where I would normally never consider working, but I had to take it because it was this or nothing. Fingers crossed that things get better soon because this is making it even more stressful than usual to find new contracts! Good luck with your search :)

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Thanks for the response, it helps to hear from other therapists and recruiters that we aren't the only ones. I hope things get better in the meantime. Good luck!

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I have been looking in New York and North Carolina. I have been traveling for two years and have never seen this before. I'm a PTA with seven years experience in several areas. I'm sorry to hear that I am not alone.

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I'm a PT as well and even at my current facility they are ending ALL contracts (PT, OT, Nursing). My contract cut short by 4 weeks!!!

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I'm curious to see what will happen in September and December when we have 10,000 new physical therapists(225 schools x avg of 50 graduates = roughly 10,000). The place where I observe hours HR dept told me that there is an overabundance of physical therapists in the Southern CA region and that starting pay has declined. Getting a little bit scared as I am applying this summer.

Another interesting topic - In CA, several Law graduate programs are being sued due to giving misleading information on employment data for recent graduates. Several of these schools would list that their employment rates for graduates after 3-6 months of graduating was the high 90 percentage rate. The universities did not state that not all graduates were working as lawyers - some were working at starbucks, retail stores, and other non-degree required jobs. The true rate for law graduates working as lawyers were actually in the 50 percent rate. I hope this is not occurring in the physical therapy world with employment data statistics.
 
Considering the beautiful climate in Southern Cal, it's no surprise that it has a surplus of pharmacists, PTs, ODs and probably every other profession you can think of. As for the law students suing their schools, I think that's ridiculous... They (the students) should have checked out the stats more carefully before plunking down $100K+ for their degree. If that's the next crop of lawyers coming into the profession, we can expect to see even more inane lawsuits...
Personally, I think the PT job outlook isn't too bad (yet), provided you are flexible. It may mean working several part-time gigs, do PRN, or moving to an underserved area.
 
Personally, I think the PT job outlook isn't too bad (yet), provided you are flexible. It may mean working several part-time gigs, do PRN, or moving to an underserved area.

Consider also working longer and in a setting you might not want: SNF's, acute care, etc. BTW, what is the outlook for PT's who specialize in burns and wounds?

Kevin
 
I think PTs who work with wounds and burns would most likely be found in acute settings, so I expect the job outlook and starting salary for them to be similar to that of PTs working in hospitals. I don't know if there are PTs who would work exclusively with burn patients... May be in a burn center? Usually the more unique the niche, the more competitive the position - but also the better the salary.
 
Considering the beautiful climate in Southern Cal, it's no surprise that it has a surplus of pharmacists, PTs, ODs and probably every other profession you can think of. As for the law students suing their schools, I think that's ridiculous... They (the students) should have checked out the stats more carefully before plunking down $100K+ for their degree. If that's the next crop of lawyers coming into the profession, we can expect to see even more inane lawsuits...
Personally, I think the PT job outlook isn't too bad (yet), provided you are flexible. It may mean working several part-time gigs, do PRN, or moving to an underserved area.

CA also has an abundance of PT schools...haah flooded their own market
 
Hey guys. I just graduated in Dec and passed boards in Jan. I currently work 50-55hrs/week and I am on pace to make 110k this year.

I make 75k salary at my outpatient job and I also do per diem home health. I see 10 patients per week. 75$ for a 45 min revisit and 90$ for a 60min eval.

If you want to work the money is out there.

This is in NOVA.
 
This is in NOVA.

Where $1000/month gets you a studio apartment. Everything is relative, but $110k anywhere is good money. If you work more than 50 hours, then yes you can make good money. Don't listen to people who say that Americans are overworked working 40 hours a week.

Kevin
 
RLW how do you like doing NOVA and home health? I have had a couple of friends work for NOVA and they each see about 20 patients a day.
 
RLW how do you like doing NOVA and home health? I have had a couple of friends work for NOVA and they each see about 20 patients a day.

I think the poster was referring to Northern Virginia.....

Also, 20 patients a day in home health???
 
RLW how do you like doing NOVA and home health? I have had a couple of friends work for NOVA and they each see about 20 patients a day.

Yes I was referring to NOrthern VirginiA, although INOVA is a good health care network in NOVA.

Kevin
 
I think I can explain it: in NoVa (Northern Va) there is a hospital system named Inova. These hospitals are often called "Nova" for short. My father was hospitalized in one of them several times.

So I think rlw237 meant that he is on track to make $110K in Northern Va, while DPTErudition has friends working in the Inova hospital system. Please correct me if I'm wrong.
 
jblil:

Yes that sound right. INOVA is the health care system, but NOVA is the common abbreviation for Northern Virginia. INOVA operates in NOVA. I've never seen so much confusion in one thread.

Kevin
 
Hey everyone. Sorry, bachelor party weekend so I was off the grid for awhile haha. I work in Northern Virgina. Job A is outpatient 40-45hrs week. Job b is home health. I do not work for inova healthcare but do get referrals from their physicians.

I know cost of living here is higher, but I moved down for my girl to be closer to her family. Coming from Pittsburgh we paid 1000/mth for a one bedroom apt in the city. Here we are going to get a 4 floor townhouse to Start for 1250/mth mortgage. Idk if that info is relevant to any of you or not haha. Living in Pittsburgh my fiancé was making 36k and I was offered outpatiwnt jobs at 48.5-55k. We decided to move to Va and my wife now makes 48k for doing the same job, and I stated my figures above. Therefore, by moving to VA we are making 32k more than PIttsburgh not including the home health job).I know cost of living is higher but I couldn't justify staying in Pittsburgh, being away from our fam and leaving 32k + home health per diem on the table. Hope it works out. Student loans Were essential for us to get our degrees, but repayment is god awful.
 
rlw237 just curious, how hard was it finding a job in Pittsburgh and NOVA?
 
Pittsburgh. Awful. Only had float positions or travel because UPMC-CRS saturates the PT market there. Also, since UPMC pays full time therapists (outpatient) 48-55k to Start, private clinics don't offer much higher either

NOVA. Applied on a Thursday, called back Friday, interviewed Saturday, and had a job on Monday.
 
Ah, I see.

NOVAcare is an occupational medicine outpatient group that pays really well, but you typically see a ridiculous amount of patients each day. I guess it doesn't help that NOVA is apparently so common an abbreviation.

Glad we got that straightened out, haha
 
I'm graduating next week and accepted a job offer at an outpatient/urgent care clinic that sees a high volume of workers comp but accepts private insurance. We are expected to see 11 pts/day and anything beyond that goes towards a productivity bonus program. My base salary is 70K and I'm receiving 5K/yr for 3 years in loan repayment because I did a clinical with this company. Also they pay for a 2 year manual therapy fellowship course on the weekends every 8 weeks which leads to OCS certification and opportunity to pursue FAAOMPT credentials if you wish.

The best decision I made was to take the NPTE in January of this year, certain states allow you to take the test early ~within 90 days of graduation ( I took it through Ohio although I'm working in Arizona, I didn't know where'd I'd be working at the time). This made me very marketable. I wish everyone the best of luck, there are great jobs out there, just do what you can to put yourself in the best position.
 
Seeing these types of threads makes me worried about the future of PT. I'm in undergrad as a Biomechanics major at CSUN, and although I really like PT.. I also want to be compensated accordingly for the work I'm doing.

If this over-saturation of Physical Therapists / Physical Therapy schools in Southern California is correct.. I think I might have to start re-thinking my options.
 
Wanting good compensation for what you're doing is one thing, but if you are going into PT for the money you're pursuing the wrong field.
 
Wanting good compensation for what you're doing is one thing, but if you are going into PT for the money you're pursuing the wrong field.

I am passionate about Physical Therapy, the human body's capabilities and its maintenance. But as my father always told me: "Pick something your passionate about, but also factor what type of lifestyle that passion or career provides you".

My passion is biomechanics, quality of life, movement, sports, and physical therapy. But if it does not support a good enough living, I will be forced to reconsider.

When I say a good enough living, I mean a nice house in a middle class neighborhood, kids, reasonable vehicle (not like some 50,000+ luxury car), establish a good enough income and assets to where my wife would not need to work full-time, and maybe a small vacation a year.

To my knowledge of money, 55,000-65k a year is probably not going to cut it. Which is why I am concerned. :/
 
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a nice house in a middle class neighborhood, kids, reasonable vehicle (not like some 50,000+ luxury car), establish a good enough income and assets to where my wife would not need to work full-time, and maybe a small vacation a year.

All those things are attainable on a PT's salary, although probably not right away on a new grad's pay. If you want to stay in the Allied Health field, I think the best salary, taking into account the number of years of schooling, would be for PAs. It's only 2 years, but the patient-experience requirement is usually quite high.

Or you can get a MBA from a good school and start making 6-fig upon graduation. But the stress level will be considerably higher.
 
Speaking of MBA's, does anyone have/know a PT who has obtained an MBA? I've heard that some hospitals and outpatient PT companies will pay for their employee's MBA in exchange for a number of years of service. I am interested in this because I'm not sure if I will be able to physically handle the ware and tear of being a PT when I'm 50. An MBA is a great way to move up the ranks in a hospital and those supervisors and directors can make some big bucks. Just wondering yall's opinions on this.
 
I did things in reverse: I got my MBA first, and am now going for a DPT. IMHO do not think of a MBA as a gateway to higher-paid administrative positions as the degree has lost a lot of its luster over the last 10 years. What a MBA gives you is a framework for solving business problems. If you can effectively solve problems for your employer, you will definitely move up through the ranks. Tuition refund schemes are ok as long as they don't tie you down to one employer for too long. A couple of years are acceptable, anything longer than that I'd decline and fund the degree on my own. For me, the MBA has been the most useful in teaching me how to invest.
 
I am passionate about Physical Therapy, the human body's capabilities and its maintenance. But as my father always told me: "Pick something your passionate about, but also factor what type of lifestyle that passion or career provides you".

My passion is biomechanics, quality of life, movement, sports, and physical therapy. But if it does not support a good enough living, I will be forced to reconsider.

When I say a good enough living, I mean a nice house in a middle class neighborhood, kids, reasonable vehicle (not like some 50,000+ luxury car), establish a good enough income and assets to where my wife would not need to work full-time, and maybe a small vacation a year.

To my knowledge of money, 55,000-65k a year is probably not going to cut it. Which is why I am concerned. :/

I think your first quote applies more to people who major in sculpting in undergrad. If you want to make lots of money, then go into engineering.
 
I think your first quote applies more to people who major in sculpting in undergrad. If you want to make lots of money, then go into engineering.

Its not that physical therapy doesn't make money. It's that physical therapy is underpaid/over worked. You are not compensated based on the amount of work that is actually being done and produced. In reality there is no such thing as underpaid/overworked. Only undervalued and overvalued and physical therapy isn't compensating based on the amount of effort and education in the career. One can say, this is a poor investment.

Face it, money is an issue and always will be not matter what career you choose, you want/need money, you wouldn't want to go 100k on loans and work min wage would you? that is undervalued.

Yeah there are other reasons besides money to go into physical therapy,

but nobody likes to be cheated.
 
I started my "career search" quite a few months ago by being interested in PT. Since then I have researched literally dozens of careers over the course of hundreds of hours, and spent the most time on careers in healthcare (as I am a biology major). I recently realized I'd gotten to the point of "analysis to paralysis"...

I have seen every one of these dozens of times over: MD's saying they wish they would have gone to PA school. PA's being frustrated that they didn't just stick it out and go to med school. Pharmacists moaning about every freakin' thing known to man. Law school students saying they should have done computer science. Comp. sci. grads going to law school. Engineers going back to school to go into health care. Health care people telling people to go into engineering instead. Humanities PhD's working at Starbucks (wait that's not surprising actually :laugh:)...

Point is that the internet is not a representative sample of reality. A good source of information? Yes. What you should entirely base major life changing decisions on? Not so much. The interwebs are highly biased towards the views of the pissed off and the frustrated. Literally every career option I've have looked at, be it MD, PharmD, PhD, DPT, PA, nursing, law, computer science, engineering, you name it, has led me to find people all over the internet talking about a glut of new graduates and a lack of the job they were dreaming of, and telling prospective students to really think about picking something else.

Well no fake! The economy is bad. People are going to college like never before. People don't have the money to spend on things that they did in times past. But should everybody in every profession throw their hands in the air and go on the internet telling everyone to pick a profession other than their own. Nope. Do something that will make you happy. You'll be fine. I'm choosing PT because it was what I was interested in from the beginning, not because some people posting comments on Yahoo Voices tell me I should or shouldn't.

Rant over :D
 
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Its not that physical therapy doesn't make money. It's that physical therapy is underpaid/over worked. You are not compensated based on the amount of work that is actually being done and produced. In reality there is no such thing as underpaid/overworked. Only undervalued and overvalued and physical therapy isn't compensating based on the amount of effort and education in the career. One can say, this is a poor investment.

Face it, money is an issue and always will be not matter what career you choose, you want/need money, you wouldn't want to go 100k on loans and work min wage would you? that is undervalued.

Yeah there are other reasons besides money to go into physical therapy,

but nobody likes to be cheated.

Of course not. I am not devaluing a nice paycheck at all, but each person has to consider what they are willing to handle. I would never encourage someone to go 100K in debt if you're only going to start out making 60K (ideally you would go to a cheap state school), but lots of people do it. It is a matter of if you can stomach it and what sacrifices you're willing to make. It is not for everyone.

No one on this board is going to argue against your points, and no one is going to be able to make that decision for whether or not someone should go to PT school. I stand by my original statement... if you want good money, then go into engineering if you have the capability. I have a ME friend making 130K and he's 28 with no debt... but would you be happy being an engineer?
 
I started my "career search" quite a few months ago by being interested in PT. Since then I have researched literally dozens of careers over the course of hundreds of hours, and spent the most time on careers in healthcare (as I am a biology major). I recently realized I'd gotten to the point of "analysis to paralysis"...

I have seen every one of these dozens of times over: MD's saying they wish they would have gone to PA school. PA's being frustrated that they didn't just stick it out and go to med school. Pharmacists moaning about every freakin' thing known to man. Law school students saying they should have done computer science. Comp. sci. grads going to law school. Engineers going back to school to go into health care. Health care people telling people to go into engineering instead. Humanities PhD's working at Starbucks (wait that's not surprising actually :laugh:)...

Point is that the internet is not a representative sample of reality. A good source of information? Yes. What you should entirely base major life changing decisions on? Not so much. The interwebs are highly biased towards the views of the pissed off and the frustrated. Literally every career option I've have looked at, be it MD, PharmD, PhD, DPT, PA, nursing, law, computer science, engineering, you name it, has led me to find people all over the internet talking about a glut of new graduates and a lack of the job they were dreaming of, and telling prospective students to really think about picking something else.

Well no fake! The economy is bad. People are going to college like never before. People don't have the money to spend on things that they did in times past. But should everybody in every profession throw their hands in the air and go on the internet telling everyone to pick a profession other than their own. Nope. Do something that will make you happy. You'll be fine. I'm choosing PT because it was what I was interested in from the beginning, not because some people posting comments on Yahoo Voices tell me I should or shouldn't.

Rant over :D

THIS.
Before I went to PT school, I used to get sick over reading negative comments about debt, etc etc...but in the end, I had to make that final decision and not let anonymous people sway my major life choices. So yes, be informed but sometimes you just gotta jump.
 
THIS.
Before I went to PT school, I used to get sick over reading negative comments about debt, etc etc...but in the end, I had to make that final decision and not let anonymous people sway my major life choices. So yes, be informed but sometimes you just gotta jump.

:highfive:
 
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