UIW Rosenberg SCHOOL OF OPTOMETRY

[Tippytoe]

If you are invited for an interview your application is complete. If they invited 172 for interviews out of 569 and accepted 64 that means there was no shortage of people to choose from. To assume that most people decided not to interview is pure speculation. Some people who arent serious about going there still interview as a backup. There is no shortage of people trying to get into optometry school using any channel they can so these newer schools can afford to be selective and still fill up their classes. With all these new schools you do have to ask about the externship sites and residency opportunities. Im sure MCPHS will be lacking in those areas at first. Even at western and rso they had issues with the first few classes as far as curriculum because they kept tweaking things and some faculty came and left as well. Bottom line do your research and know what you're getting into otherwise you're in for an unpleasant surprise.

Except that 569 probably applied to more than one OD school ...probably all of them.

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[balltc]

Except that 569 probably applied to more than one OD school ...probably all of them.

sure, and so did thousands of other people. again, theres a limited amount of spots and theres more than enough applicants so any school can afford to be selective. some obviously more than others.

 

[Jason K]

sure, and so did thousands of other people. again, theres a limited amount of spots and theres more than enough applicants so any school can afford to be selective. some obviously more than others.

Schools can't fill a class with top-tier applicants. They have to take some from their top-tier, some from the middle, and some from the lower end of the spectrum. The problem with the new programs is that they have a very difficult time filling seats for the "top-tier" portion of their class and even the middle one. They might end up accepting a few who apply, but those students will nearly always choose a better program. The result is a class in which the "average" is well below average. What that yields is a final product that is.....you guessed it....below average.

The new schools are around for the SOLE purpose of making money. They have no functional purpose in optometry other than to profit from students who can't get in anywhere else.

Their reputation is already tarnished, before they've even started. Take a look at the poll on ODWire concerning new programs. 95% of respondents were opposed to the new programs, with over 90% strongly opposed. There is a lot of animosity in the optometry community about the new schools and the reasons are obvious.

Choosing to go into optometry right now will prove to be a regrettable mistake for most who would enter the profession. Choosing one of the new programs will multiply that regret 10 fold.

 

[janedoe88]

Schools can't fill a class with top-tier applicants. They have to take some from their top-tier, some from the middle, and some from the lower end of the spectrum. The problem with the new programs is that they have a very difficult time filling seats for the "top-tier" portion of their class and even the middle one. They might end up accepting a few who apply, but those students will nearly always choose a better program. The result is a class in which the "average" is well below average. What that yields is a final product that is.....you guessed it....below average.

The new schools are around for the SOLE purpose of making money. They have no functional purpose in optometry other than to profit from students who can't get in anywhere else.

Their reputation is already tarnished, before they've even started. Take a look at the poll on ODWire concerning new programs. 95% of respondents were opposed to the new programs, with over 90% strongly opposed. There is a lot of animosity in the optometry community about the new schools and the reasons are obvious.

Choosing to go into optometry right now will prove to be a regrettable mistake for most who would enter the profession. Choosing one of the new programs will multiply that regret 10 fold.

If everyone is screwed, does it really matter which optometry school people attend? Are you saying students attending Berk or SCCO might actually have a chance to succeed?? lol

 

[Jason K]

If everyone is screwed, does it really matter which optometry school people attend? Are you saying students attending Berk or SCCO might actually have a chance to succeed?? lol

The quote below is from another thread...

For what it's worth, students leaving SCCO and Berkley might be better positioned for finding one of the few good PP jobs available compared to their garbage school counterparts, but they're all jumping onto the same deck on the same sinking ship. In 10 years, it won't matter who went where since everyone who entered the profession at that time will have already "gone down with the ship."

It will not matter where you go to school because you are all entering the same doomed profession. If I was not clear, private practice owners who would be in a position to hire a new grad will turn a blind eye to those coming out of the crap new schools. I'm not going to bother explaining the reasons why for 800th time. The vast majority of grads who seek employment anywhere they can, will do so in the competitive sea of commercial garbage positions. Those positions....NOT the private practice ones, will not care where you went to school. If you went to Berkely or some optometry school run out of some guy's basement - it won't matter to them since all they want is a warm body with the legal right to prescribe correction.

 

[janedoe88]

The quote below is from another thread...

For what it's worth, students leaving SCCO and Berkley might be better positioned for finding one of the few good PP jobs available compared to their garbage school counterparts, but they're all jumping onto the same deck on the same sinking ship. In 10 years, it won't matter who went where since everyone who entered the profession at that time will have already "gone down with the ship."

nice

 

[Tippytoe]

To repeat and to counter the often spewed retort "well what do you think I should do then, flip burgers at McDonadlds" I offer the following:

If you are really set to go into health care (good for you), please investigate the following fields which are growing a very fast rate and need good applicants:

MD- Family medicine - Desperately needed.
Physician Assistants- Are hired before they even graduate at $80,000+
Nurse Practioners- Same as PAs
Dentist (the best in my opinion)- Little insurance, no MD competition, no-line competition, little box store competition.

Those 4 are growing (among others). Optometry and Pharmacy are not. You will feel much better about yourself if you are in a profession where you feel NEEDED and patients seek you out as opposed to one where you have to constantly hunt for patients everywhere you go (grocery store, gas station, farmers market, etc...), bow down to idiot insurance companies, take whatever your stupid national association throws at you and succumb to the silly "customer is always right" philosophy.

 

[q1we3]

To repeat and to counter the often spewed retort "well what do you think I should do then, flip burgers at McDonadlds" I offer the following:

If you are really set to go into health care (good for you), please investigate the following fields which are growing a very fast rate and need good applicants:

MD- Family medicine - Desperately needed.
Physician Assistants- Are hired before they even graduate at $80,000+
Nurse Practioners- Same as PAs
Dentist (the best in my opinion)- Little insurance, no MD competition, no-line competition, little box store competition.

Those 4 are growing (among others). Optometry and Pharmacy are not. You will feel much better about yourself if you are in a profession where you feel NEEDED and patients seek you out as opposed to one where you have to constantly hunt for patients everywhere you go (grocery store, gas station, farmers market, etc...), bow down to idiot insurance companies, take whatever your stupid national association throws at you and succumb to the silly "customer is always right" philosophy.

what if your GPA/MCAT is not good enough to get into med school?
what if you have no interest in working with teeth?

Medicine and dentistry are both better than optometry in terms of respect, potential income, and opportunity. But not everyone can do that. One can always switch to PA or nursing later on if things totally go down the toilet.

 

[optoapp2012]

To repeat and to counter the often spewed retort "well what do you think I should do then, flip burgers at McDonadlds" I offer the following:

If you are really set to go into health care (good for you), please investigate the following fields which are growing a very fast rate and need good applicants:

MD- Family medicine - Desperately needed.
Physician Assistants- Are hired before they even graduate at $80,000+
Nurse Practioners- Same as PAs
Dentist (the best in my opinion)- Little insurance, no MD competition, no-line competition, little box store competition.

Those 4 are growing (among others). Optometry and Pharmacy are not. You will feel much better about yourself if you are in a profession where you feel NEEDED and patients seek you out as opposed to one where you have to constantly hunt for patients everywhere you go (grocery store, gas station, farmers market, etc...), bow down to idiot insurance companies, take whatever your stupid national association throws at you and succumb to the silly "customer is always right" philosophy.

Dentists also have a disproportionately high suicide rate...just throwing that out there...

 

[Shnurek]

Dentists also have a disproportionately high suicide rate...just throwing that out there...

That's actually a myth. Physicians are actually more likely to commit suicide especially female physicians.

"Moreover, suicide among women physicians is especially high, with a rate from 250 to 400 percent higher than females in other professions (the rate in male physicians is 70 percent higher than in other professions)"

Source:
http://www.everydayhealth.com/blog/...ssion-and-suicide-documentary-airs-this-week/
More technical source:
http://ajp.psychiatryonline.org/article.aspx?articleID=177227

 

[optoapp2012]

That's actually a myth. Physicians are actually more likely to commit suicide especially female physicians.

"Moreover, suicide among women physicians is especially high, with a rate from 250 to 400 percent higher than females in other professions (the rate in male physicians is 70 percent higher than in other professions)"

Source:
http://www.everydayhealth.com/blog/...ssion-and-suicide-documentary-airs-this-week/
More technical source:
http://ajp.psychiatryonline.org/article.aspx?articleID=177227

I think the sources of data vary and tell different things. This website uses pretty old data (1990) and openly admits they didn't do multiple regression to factor out other potential reasons than occupation, but regardless...different studies seem to show different things.
http://www.businessinsider.com/jobs-commit-suicide-2010-10#

 

[Shnurek]

'

 

[blazenmadison]

what if your GPA/MCAT is not good enough to get into med school?

Then you should retake courses/MCAT until you get a good GPA/score. Consider getting a masters as well to boost your admissions into med school.

If you first don't succeed, try try again!

Do not use optometry school as a back-up to med school, otherwise you will live a very very unhappy life (as indicated from our veteran posters here).

 

[Shnurek]

Do not use optometry school as a back-up to med school, otherwise you will live a very very unhappy life (as indicated from our veteran posters here).

 

[q1we3]

you will live a very very unhappy life

 

[Jason K]

Do not use optometry school as a back-up to med school, otherwise you will live a very very unhappy life (as indicated from our veteran posters here).

Not everyone who regrets their decision to enter optometry, chose the profession because it was a backup to an MD. I chose optometry - it didn't choose me. That's the primary reason I'm on here. If the real face of optometry was available for viewing when I was deciding, I'd never have committed to 25 years of indentured servitude for a degree that will probably be as useful as a certificate in word processor repair from from ITT Tech in a decade or so.

Anyone with a solid academic record who chooses optometry had better be ready to be seriously disappointed with the outcome. If you're a 2.1 student with high 200s on the OAT, then fine, if you have your heart set on a healthcare career, maybe there's nothing else for you to do but spin dials doing 60 exams per day at America's Best. If you've got a record that could lead other directions within healthcare, choosing an OD will likely prove to be a huge regret, given what's happening to the field.

 

[thecgrblue]

what if your GPA/MCAT is not good enough to get into med school?
what if you have no interest in working with teeth?

Medicine and dentistry are both better than optometry in terms of respect, potential income, and opportunity. But not everyone can do that. One can always switch to PA or nursing later on if things totally go down the toilet.

Then you put yourself on track to graduate 2 years later than you would if you went to OD school and pursue what you come to realize your true passion is.

There are post-bacc programs designed just for those with poor stats that need to prove they can handle med school. You can learn all about them on these forums.

One doesn't simply, "Switch to PA." Some of those programs are just as difficult to get in as soon dental and med programs. Besides, if you're going to spend $200k to see if it works out...then go into realty where at least your $$ will give you a physical asset.

 

[Tippytoe]

Congratulation whiners. You've succeed in giving me a 'warning' from some moderator and in turn chasing away another 'real life' OD just like you did moderator Ken Elder and many others that have the nerve to tell you how optometry life really is.

Apparantly this site only wants rainbow in the sky types. They don't want students to have a real life (and successful) professional's view of the profession (even if you don't like it doesn't make it not real).

Fair enough. Not my site. I wish you all good luck and I'll see you on the outside, head hanged down and popping the antidepressants.

 

[Tippytoe]

By the way, this is the post I was warned about. Somebody asked a smart-ass question and this was my response.

Originally Posted by iceman132

It's fine to be mean and tell the truth. I have no problem being told that I'm not guaranteed a job after I graduate.

This is the problem.... You're not providing a SOLUTION. You're bitching for the sake of bitching. It's what teenage girls do and it's pathetic."

Below was my reply. Now who was being rude and insulting? Who called who a teenage girl who is pathetic and bitching? Hint: Not Me! My post should have been very helpful to those considering a career in health care. My post has no profanity or insults. It is common sense to understand that we need family physicans and nurses right now. Everyone does need to know this.

"Of course I'm offering a solution. DON'T GO INTO AN OVERCROWED FIELD LIKE PHARMACY OR OPTOMETRY OR LAW. GO INTO A FIELD THAT DESPERATELY NEEDS PEOPLE LIKE FAMILY PRACTICE MD, NURSE, PHYSICIAN ASSISTANT or COMPUTER PROGRAMING PERHAPS.

Did you really need me to spell that out for you? Really? It's sorta common sense, right."


Anyhow, I really do have better things to do so I will join Ken Elder and wish you a fond fairwell and feel sorry for the incompetent moderators (kudos to the good ones).

 

[janedoe88]

Not everyone who regrets their decision to enter optometry, chose the profession because it was a backup to an MD. I chose optometry - it didn't choose me. That's the primary reason I'm on here. If the real face of optometry was available for viewing when I was deciding, I'd never have committed to 25 years of indentured servitude for a degree that will probably be as useful as a certificate in word processor repair from from ITT Tech in a decade or so.

Anyone with a solid academic record who chooses optometry had better be ready to be seriously disappointed with the outcome. If you're a 2.1 student with high 200s on the OAT, then fine, if you have your heart set on a healthcare career, maybe there's nothing else for you to do but spin dials doing 60 exams per day at America's Best. If you've got a record that could lead other directions within healthcare, choosing an OD will likely prove to be a huge regret, given what's happening to the field.

I completely agree, my stats are so low that there's no way I would get accepted to MD or PA or Dentistry (around a 3.0 GPA). I find it kind of nuts that kids with over a 3.5 would chose Optometry over being an MD, I would love to be an actual doctor if I had the stats. I think what most students should take from this website if that you actually have the stats to go to med school or become a nurse practitioner, then you should really go for it!

 

[q1we3]

Tippytoe, didn't you call someone ****** idiot or something for getting a tattoo? Lol. Don't worry you can always make a new account if you get banned.

 

[Jason K]

It's fine to be mean and tell the truth. I have no problem being told that I'm not guaranteed a job after I graduate.

This is the problem.... You're not providing a SOLUTION. You're bitching for the sake of bitching. It's what teenage girls do and it's pathetic."

What is this? Do the ODs on here owe you something? Newsflash, hoss....there is NO solution and even if there was, no one is under any obligation to give it to you. Life is not a video game in which there's always a way out. The only solution to the oversupply problem is to not get caught up in it in the first place. We're not on here "bitching for the sake of bitching."

We're on here to inform the duped masses that they are throwing away time and money by investing in optometry. It's a beached whale now, and the stink from the rotting carcass is only beginning. If you choose to ignore that message, go for it. When you're fingers are bleeding from spinning the sphere dial faster than an airplane propeller at America's Best, you'll think back a little differently on some of the "bitching" you read about on this forum.

 

[blazenmadison]

I completely agree, my stats are so low that there's no way I would get accepted to MD or PA or Dentistry (around a 3.0 GPA). I find it kind of nuts that kids with over a 3.5 would chose Optometry over being an MD, I would love to be an actual doctor if I had the stats. I think what most students should take from this website if that you actually have the stats to go to med school or become a nurse practitioner, then you should really go for it!

Please say that in your interview. I promise you'll have a very bright future in optometry.

 

[Shnurek]

Please say that in your interview. I promise you'll have a very bright future in optometry.

There is no shortage of pre-opt kids. They can be more thick than the pre-med ones.

 

[Jeanius1]

exactly, like I applied but never went for the interview. Also on my ranking I would say:

Western > RSO > Midwestern > MCPHS

cause at least Midwestern has a couple years on MCPHS that just opened its doors this year (and late this year i might add)

why would you choose RSO over midwestern? Just curious. I have been accepted to midwestern and have an interview at RSO and not sure if I wanna go for interview? hmmmm please help

 

[OATAcer]

why would you choose RSO over midwestern? Just curious. I have been accepted to midwestern and have an interview at RSO and not sure if I wanna go for interview? hmmmm please help

Because RSO's admissions staff is professional and their faculty have Phd's and fellowships and O.D's and are more experienced. In addition, their faculty have good connections in tx. Faculty in mwu are young and mostly OD and currently working on their fellowship. Plus san Antonio is better then phoenix.

Sent from my Galaxy Nexus using Tapatalk

 

[blaba]

I'm glad Jason K is still here to represent the naysayers. Not many optometrists will speak out like this about their own professions - just to deliver some truth into our heads.

The real trolls are the ones denying the facts.

 

[Shnurek]

I'm glad Jason K is still here to represent the naysayers. Not many optometrists will speak out like this about their own professions - just to deliver some truth into our heads.

The real trolls are the ones denying the facts.

The naysayers that hate optometry and hate their lives should not be in optometry. If you are a slave to the profession because you took out $200k or whatever in loans. Well, you have no one to blame but yourself. Nobody put a gun to your head and said you have to go to optometry school.

 

[OATAcer]

The naysayers that hate optometry and hate their lives should not be in optometry. If you are a slave to the profession because you took out $200k or whatever in loans. Well, you have no one to blame but yourself. Nobody put a gun to your head and said you have to go to optometry school.

Indeed. Well said.

Sent from my Galaxy Nexus using Tapatalk

 

[Jason K]

The naysayers that hate optometry and hate their lives should not be in optometry. If you are a slave to the profession because you took out $200k or whatever in loans. Well, you have no one to blame but yourself. Nobody put a gun to your head and said you have to go to optometry school.

Shnurek, you're so blissfully unaware of what lay ahead of you, it's terrifying. No one on here "hates" optometry. No one on here "hates" their lives. What they do find troubling is that thousands of lemmings, such as yourself, are devoting years of training and hundreds of thousands of dollars in student loans to a profession that is ailing. If you "love" optometry, you love it because you are a 1st year OD student who hasn't a clue what it really is. You guys have been duped into buying a profession that's on its way out. In 10 years, when many of your current classmates have left the profession and you, yourself, realize what you've gotten yourself into, the "naysayers" on this forum will seem a lot more realistic. Oh, I forgot....you're heading to a Walmart in rural Nebraska so you should be just fine.

I love the optimism, it's cute.

 

[HAFCB]

Wow.... you really burst my bubble.. Jason K but you are right about the practice... I'm from Canada and as for job placement its not that bad here. It's 100% job placement. My father is an optometrist and hopefully I can follow in his footsteps but I do agree with you about the refractive part that you talked about. That's why in Quebec they are looking into letting opticians do the refractive part and optometrists do the pathology part. And to think that I thought Rosenberg was a good school... What about IAUPR? I just got admitted for an interview there, any good?

 

[swtster]

What about IAUPR? I just got admitted for an interview there, any good?

My experience with IAUPR was a memorable one.

I was offered an interview even after I neglected to pay the supplemental fees and withdrew my application. I declined but then I was still given an offer of admission. And they spelled my first name wrong in all of their correspondence.

I, personally, wasn't impressed.

 

[HAFCB]

My experience with IAUPR was a memorable one.

I was offered an interview even after I neglected to pay the supplemental fees and withdrew my application. I declined but then I was still given an offer of admission. And they spelled my first name wrong in all of their correspondence.

I, personally, wasn't impressed.

Crap ... where are you now?

 

[swtster]

Crap ... where are you now?

I'll be starting at ICO.

 

[Jason K]

What about IAUPR? I just got admitted for an interview there, any good?

I don't mean to pick on their program, but I attended an NBEO prep course when I was in optometry school and sat next to a group of students from IAUPR. On several occasions, students from their group asked questions that were truly horrifying. I can distinctly remember the instructor's expression which read something like "Oh my dear god, did someone really just ask that question....am I really here?? Is this the Twilight Zone?" My impression is that they may not receive the best preclinical/academic preparation. I realize that this single experience is no basis for broad generalization, but it left an impression on me.

On the upside, you get to study in a tropical vacation destination so it's not all bad.

 

[love4eyes]

Wow.... you really burst my bubble.. Jason K but you are right about the practice... I'm from Canada and as for job placement its not that bad here. It's 100% job placement. My father is an optometrist and hopefully I can follow in his footsteps but I do agree with you about the refractive part that you talked about. That's why in Quebec they are looking into letting opticians do the refractive part and optometrists do the pathology part. And to think that I thought Rosenberg was a good school... What about IAUPR? I just got admitted for an interview there, any good?

Hello HAFCB. In regards to IAUPR, connect with current students and Alumni of the school either posting or PMing them here: http://forums.studentdoctor.net/showthread.php?t=805769&page=2

Ask questions that will enable you to formulate if this is a school you might consider. Have a good day!

 

[Akki6]

I went through this whole second page and now I am worrying a little bit. I always wanted to do Optometry because I think its an interesting profession with good pay and 8 years of work. Do you guys still think Optometry won't grow fast in future? So do you think that if I wanted to be an Opto., I wouldn't be able to find a job in future?

 

[luckyfeet]

Due to rising rates of diabetes I think optometry will remain steady throughout the future!


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[thecgrblue]

Due to rising rates of diabetes I think optometry will remain steady throughout the future!


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Diabetes will not single-handedly support the optometric profession.

 

[thecgrblue]

I went through this whole second page and now I am worrying a little bit. I always wanted to do Optometry because I think its an interesting profession with good pay and 8 years of work. Do you guys still think Optometry won't grow fast in future? So do you think that if I wanted to be an Opto., I wouldn't be able to find a job in future?

Do a little exercise I have done a number of times. Google, yahoo, whatever search for a job in various fields; optometry, medical specialties, etc. etc.

It is an obvious given that google and other various job search devices aren't nearly as effective as networking, but I was still blown away by the relative lack of listed postings for a full-time optometrist.

 

[jcpwn2004]

Pros: new equipment
Cons: depressing prison like facility, san antonio is a crappy place to live, they'll accept anyone to get tuition money (hence why everyone hates new schools), no good relations (externships/alumni etc...), optometrists from other schools will look down on you for coming from a new school.

I was accepted to some of the new schools and even given scholarships. If I wasn't accepted to one of my top choices I would have had a really hard time deciding on sitting out another year and applying again, that should tell you something about how bad the OD world looks at the new schools.