Advice on an extremely low uGPA, good graduate GPA

[Voidwalker]

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Hi all,

Thanks for accepting me into your community! I'm a non-trad (29yo) school psychologist about 5 years out from my undergrad.

I was an abysmal student in undergrad (2.45 GPA) but I managed to clean myself up the last year, after which I worked in admin at a hospital for a year before getting into a school psychology graduate program that I finished with a 4.0. I've been working part-time (nights and weekends on-call) as an EMT since education affords a lot of free time and I've also been taking my pre-reqs online through UNE since I didn't have any science courses completed in undergrad. Currently, I have a 4.0 in those as well, though I only have a dozen credits completed thus far.

Anyone have any advice for things I can/should be doing differently? I recognize that my undergrad GPA would typically be considered a knife in the heart, but I'm dedicated to getting into med school and I don't want to be someone who lets my past failures define my future.

Thanks for any input!

 

[Faha]

If you have 30+ hours of science prerequisites with a sGPA of 4.0 you should be fine for some medical schools. Some schools recognize reinvention and will overlook your old undergraduate GPA. Of course, you will need of MCAT of 500+ for some of the newer DO schools and and 508+ for some MD schools. Do not take the MCAT until you have completed all of the medical school prerequisites.

 

[Mr.Smile12]

Ask if your undergraduate program has a policy on retroactive withdrawals for the courses that are a lead anchor on your undergraduate GPA.

GPA Repair and Management for Pre-Health Applicants | Student Doctor Network | SDN

Course load management is key for pre-health students to avoid having to do GPA repair. Learn more about drops, withdrawals, and GPA impacts.

www.studentdoctor.net

Ask medical school admissions representatives for programs closest to your location. Get some encouragement if they will overlook courses taken over 10 years ago.

 

[Dral]

As alluded to above, you're going to have to do well on the MCAT. Anything sub 500 is going to be bad news. You're probably targeting DO schools mainly, but throwing in a few intelligently selected MD schools might give you a chance depending on your MCAT and other parts of your application.

Are you doing any volunteerism? The EMT covers clinical work. Do not forget shadowing. I'd recommend at least one shadowing experience be with a DO physician.

I suspect that your work as a psychologist with the peds group will get you some attention with medical schools, so you will want to play off that (but do not overdo it).

 

[Voidwalker]

As alluded to above, you're going to have to do well on the MCAT. Anything sub 500 is going to be bad news. You're probably targeting DO schools mainly, but throwing in a few intelligently selected MD schools might give you a chance depending on your MCAT and other parts of your application.

Are you doing any volunteerism? The EMT covers clinical work. Do not forget shadowing. I'd recommend at least one shadowing experience be with a DO physician.

I suspect that your work as a psychologist with the peds group will get you some attention with medical schools, so you will want to play off that (but do not overdo it).

Yes! Doing volunteer work as a volunteer firefighter and also hours with the local nursing home and hospice care.

I should be able to get some shadowing in over the next summer.

 

[Voidwalker]

If you have 30+ hours of science prerequisites with a sGPA of 4.0 you should be fine for some medical schools. Some schools recognize reinvention and will overlook your old undergraduate GPA. Of course, you will need of MCAT of 500+ for some of the newer DO schools and and 508+ for some MD schools. Do not take the MCAT until you have completed all of the medical school prerequisites.

Ok good to know. I was planning on applying broadly to DO and to my state MD school as well as a few others that are friendly to reinvention.

 

[vm26]

Hi all,

Thanks for accepting me into your community! I'm a non-trad (29yo) school psychologist about 5 years out from my undergrad.

I was an abysmal student in undergrad (2.45 GPA) but I managed to clean myself up the last year, after which I worked in admin at a hospital for a year before getting into a school psychology graduate program that I finished with a 4.0. I've been working part-time (nights and weekends on-call) as an EMT since education affords a lot of free time and I've also been taking my pre-reqs online through UNE since I didn't have any science courses completed in undergrad. Currently, I have a 4.0 in those as well, though I only have a dozen credits completed thus far.

Anyone have any advice for things I can/should be doing differently? I recognize that my undergrad GPA would typically be considered a knife in the heart, but I'm dedicated to getting into med school and I don't want to be someone who lets my past failures define my future.

Thanks for any input!

My subjective opinion:

To begin with, do not allow externals define you or your future (in any domain of your life). Your "past failures" can be "failures" or they can be experiences that are part of your evolution/growth as an individual.

I was a non-trad back in 2002 (seems like yesterday!), except I was a physical therapist and had a strong GPA. While working, I had to take orgo-chem and then the MCATS which turned out well enough. I applied to 7-8 medical schools and was fortunate enough to get into a solid mid-tier instate MD school.

Entered med school thinking ortho, psych, and radiology. For various reasons, I ended up with rads and was able to match into a middle of the road program but pretty competitive due to location (NYC). I did fellowship and graduated into an abysmal job market in 2013 where I had to move to a cr*ppy place and work for a cr*ppy group for a year before deciding on doing a 2nd fellowship (extremely rare in radiology). Long story short these decisions have worked out well for me-far from "perfect" but good enough.

As mentioned in my other posts, times have changed enormously. Do you/your family has 3-400K free to use, and do you have an extra 5-7 years of life to put on hold? If not I would highly recommend that you look into becoming a PA or NP, or look into other possibilities in psychology. Reimbursement in medicine is an annual downward trend (mainly due to budget neutrality)-most years you will receive reimbursement cuts from CMS/medicare which commercial insurers base their rates on. So unless you end up in a field such as ortho/neuro spine (where you can receive a high salary from a large HC system since their tech fees off your work brings in an exorbitant amount-due to their strong political lobby-$$$), or are able to establish a concierge cash only practice (fields such as IM/psych/derm), the cost benefit analysis is heavily not in your favor.

There is absolutely nothing magical about becoming a physician these days. I understand the feeling of "Knife in the heart" (I'm married with kids 🤣), but its up to you whether you want this arbitrary feeling to guide your career/life decisions. The only time my wife see's a physician versus a midlevel is when they know that I am a physician.

The trend these days is midlevel reimbursement is approaching physician reimbursement (recent law* in OH allowing CRNAs to be reimbursed equal to physician anesthesiologists). Big difference is that these mid-levels do not graduate with mega-med school debt and they spent probably >>>50% time in school/training in able to perform the same skills.

*Ohio law requires health benefit plans to reimburse Certified Registered Nurse Anesthetists (CRNAs) at the same rate as physicians for the same services, prohibiting payment discrimination based on provider licensure type

 

[NontradICUdoc]

I was in a similar boat as you. When I graduated college it was with a 2.56 and there was no way I was going to get into medical school. Fast Forward and started to work and my job had a benefit of tuition reimbursement. I obtained an MS in Biology and graduated with a 3.8. But that was not enough, the MCAT needed to be taken. Now this was when the MCAT was still on paper, only given twice a year, and it was out of 45. I know that things have changed dramatically since then. However, what you need to realize is that the school wants to know that the past is the past and you are not the same person. They need to know that you will be able to handle the high level science that is coming in medical school. Especially in the first year.

when I was on the admissions committee as a student, not only was the MCAT discussed but the applicant's ability. They want to see that you can handle those rigorous courses and the question is does your psychology degree show them this. From what you said that you are taking the courses now, the answer is no. The most important thing that you can do is excel in those science courses.

You should not focus on the MCAT until you complete those courses. Then if you are planning to apply to a DO school, you need to answer the question, Why? Why Osteopathic medicine? Spend time with a DO and then with an MD and look at the difference. While some may say that there is none other than philosophy, as a practicing DO I can tell you that there is. It is in the way that the school teaches you how to think. If you look around, a lot of the major institutions are using "whole patient" as a tag line and the DO community has been practicing this for over 100 years.

Be ready for a long journey ahead. I started my medical school journey of reinvention in 2003 and graduated medical school in 2011. Completed all my training in 2016. It is a looooooooong road ahead. Be prepared.