Wake up call?

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willrocks said:
Opinions?

http://www.modernmedicine.com/moder...Article/detail/651922?contextCategoryId=40159
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If that's true across the whole country, then schools will have to decreases sizes and make admission a lot more competitive. So, if the graduates from a competitive school are still competitive, they will be able to get good jobs. Since the number of graduates are relatively smaller, they should find it easier to find positions after graduating and becoming licensed.

That is, assuming that retail chains will not open up more stores with pharmacies, and hospitals will not build more institutions with pharmacies.
 
I'd say the shortage is, or will be, over. That's not the same as pharmacists being reduced to begging on a street corner, but don't expect sign on bonuses, or for conditions to be as favorable as they used to be.
 
WTF, man. I thought if I had a Pharm.D and a pulse it was life on easy street after that.

Hell with this... I'mma go be a cop or something. Facebook told me they can make $60,000 a year 😱
 
crazybob said:
If that's true across the whole country, then schools will have to decreases sizes and make admission a lot more competitive. So, if the graduates from a competitive school are still competitive, they will be able to get good jobs. Since the number of graduates are relatively smaller, they should find it easier to find positions after graduating and becoming licensed.
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If all pharmacy schools were public, I'd agree with you. They're not. The majority (?) are private. Private schools are there to make money. Why decrease class sizes when plenty of applicants are chasing after a six figure salary? You see here, almost daily, people chasing after a Pharm.D. thinking that it's going to make the more money. Some of them are correct in their assessment, but some aren't (typically the older pre-pharmacy students, no offense, you just have more experience in your current field and less years to benefit from the salary increase - that salary increase has a very large cost associated with it.) Private schools aren't going to willingly decrease their class sizes. They're only going to decrease their class sizes when people stop thinking pharmacy is a (relatively) easy way to make more money. Nothing wrong with pursuing pharmacy for the love of the game, even if it doesn't make financial sense, but let's face it - the salary is what has generated a lot of interest in the field.
 
PonderingChoice said:
If all pharmacy schools were public, I'd agree with you. They're not. The majority (?) are private. Private schools are there to make money. Why decrease class sizes when plenty of applicants are chasing after a six figure salary? You see here, almost daily, people chasing after a Pharm.D. thinking that it's going to make the more money. Some of them are correct in their assessment, but some aren't (typically the older pre-pharmacy students, no offense, you just have more experience in your current field and less years to benefit from the salary increase - that salary increase has a very large cost associated with it.) Private schools aren't going to willingly decrease their class sizes. They're only going to decrease their class sizes when people stop thinking pharmacy is a (relatively) easy way to make more money. Nothing wrong with pursuing pharmacy for the love of the game, even if it doesn't make financial sense, but let's face it - the salary is what has generated a lot of interest in the field.
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So one thing they should do is stop opening up more schools. But they open them up to make money. If their graduates can't find jobs, then they should decrease class sizes to compensate for that. Do any of the new schools do that?
 
Obviously not, and unless it someday becomes widely publicized that pharmacists are in surplus, they never will.
 
I can't imagine that happening any time soon... I remember setting in on presentations by my local COP back in 2000 and them just going ON and ON about the shortage. And of course once the Great Recession hit you couldn't hardly hit F5 on yahoo without an article popping up about 'lol get ur pharmacy degree and make 6 figyas!'
 
crazybob said:
So one thing they should do is stop opening up more schools. But they open them up to make money. If their graduates can't find jobs, then they should decrease class sizes to compensate for that. Do any of the new schools do that?
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What do you mean, should? They're doing this for the money, which you seem to acknowledge, not the well being of their graduates. The well being of their graduates only matters as far as it impacts the schools' long term profitability. Long story short: don't expect private schools to regulate themselves, especially if prospective students still flock to pharmacy after the field has reached its saturation point. Only once prospective students decide that pharmacy school isn't worth the cost will the private schools decrease their class sizes. And they won't be doing it out of the goodness of their hearts, they'll be doing it to save money. So, yes, the shortage will be over soon. If the current number of private schools doesn't solve the shortage, more will open. The wages we saw in the recent past was a bubble - and like all the other economic bubbles, it's going to burst. Hopefully it will be a tiny burst, but it will burst all the same.
 
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This article does not factor many things; but most importantly, it does not factor in the fact that all the baby boomers are going to get older and require more managed care.
 
MRSA Sucks said:
This article does not factor many things; but most importantly, it does not factor in the fact that all the baby boomers are going to get older and require more managed care.
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Or health care reform. Or the recession - three facets to this: pharmacists putting off retirement, retail putting off expansion because financing is difficult, and part time people going back to work or taking more hours.
 
Argentium said:
Or health care reform. Or the recession - three facets to this: pharmacists putting off retirement, retail putting off expansion because financing is difficult, and part time people going back to work or taking more hours.
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Yeah. But I don't think the health care reform will make much of a difference. After all, it's not really reform since its not even a big change. On the other hand, if there is a huge change like to a single payer system, then most people on this board will probably drop pharmacy all together.

But i believe most people on this board are passionate about pharmacy and would do it regardless of a slight decrease in salary.
 
When there is a surplus of pharmacists do you think it will start to matter where you got your pharmD from?
 
MRSA Sucks said:
Yeah. But I don't think the health care reform will make much of a difference. After all, it's not really reform since its not even a big change. On the other hand, if there is a huge change like to a single payer system, then most people on this board will probably drop pharmacy all together.

But i believe most people on this board are passionate about pharmacy and would do it regardless of a slight decrease in salary.
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I agree


I would honestly do it if I made the same money as any other decent job (after loans paid). I don't think people realize how many other horrendous jobs there are out there that pay much much less. How bad is it that you can go to a respected honorable job every day and make a living salary? That is more than most people can say. It sure beats the crap out of waiting on drunk people until 5 am for 10 dollars an hour, and I'm guessing the military folks on here will probably agree that it beats the heck out of getting shot at in other countries while separated from their families.



Some cops will make a lot of money if they have a high cost of living so those facebook things are probably using the highest range of salaries they can find. LOL Everyone wanted to be a cop when I graduated high school because I lived in a small town with relatively zero crime, and the average salary of a regular officer was like 46,000. On the downside... these same cops would be looking at paying about 1300/month for a little one bedroom to live... so it evens out. Those day time television techincal school commercials make me really mad... I feel like they are trying to scam people into throwing 1000's of dollars at them when they could just go to their local CC and probably get farther ahead.
 
jackal head said:
When there is a surplus of pharmacists do you think it will start to matter where you got your pharmD from?
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There is much debate on this topic. IMO, I think it will start to matter when it comes to residencies. It also depends on the region you want to work in. I have been told by pharmacists I work with that it tends to matter more on the east coast and the midwest.

From what I have seen, I think that finding jobs in the larger cities is going to be more difficult. Many graduates are going to have to be more open to relocation- especially to rural areas where there is still a greater need.
 
Tinkerbell22 said:
I don't think people realize how many other horrendous jobs there are out there that pay much much less.
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I don't know about you, but I have better alternatives than being a waiter. I'm sure the same is true of most people on this board.
MRSA sucks said:
this article does not factor many things; but most importantly, it does not factor in the fact that all the baby boomers are going to get older and require more managed care.
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That's true, but the cat's out of the bag - everyone knows about the pharmacist shortage and that there's an aging population to take care of. So what does that mean? Private schools are going to keep opening up until there's equilibrium is reached... and before the equilibrium is reached, there's the possibility of over-saturation. I think you can definitely say the shortage will be over. The shortage only existed as long as the (inflated) pharmacist wages were a secret.
 
PonderingChoice said:
I don't know about you, but I have better alternatives than being a waiter. I'm sure the same is true of most people on this board.
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+1. To have a pharmacy or bust attitude is foolish, especially in this economic climate. It's great to be passionate about becoming a pharmacist, and you have your whole life to obtain that goal, but it may be better to start looking at alternatives if you have been rejected a few times. It's extremely risky to do a postbacc at a university for 2 years and find yourself in even greater debt when you can use those 2 years to gain skills and work experience which can launch you into a stabilizing career. At the same time, you can take JC courses in the evening to continue your strive to become a PharmD.
 
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PonderingChoice said:
I don't know about you, but I have better alternatives than being a waiter. I'm sure the same is true of most people on this board. That's true, but the cat's out of the bag - everyone knows about the pharmacist shortage and that there's an aging population to take care of. So what does that mean? Private schools are going to keep opening up until there's equilibrium is reached... and before the equilibrium is reached, there's the possibility of over-saturation. I think you can definitely say the shortage will be over. The shortage only existed as long as the (inflated) pharmacist wages were a secret.
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Just curious, why do you consider a pharmacist's wage inflated? Retail pharmacy, which is considered the field that requires the least training, is pretty stressful and I've worked with many pharmacists who said it's not even worth the 55/hr wage to them anymore.
 
MRSA Sucks said:
Just curious, why do you consider a pharmacist's wage inflated? Retail pharmacy, which is considered the field that requires the least training, is pretty stressful and I've worked with many pharmacists who said it's not even worth the 55/hr wage to them anymore.
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I'm not making a value judgment, when I say inflated, I'm talking about from a pure economics sense. There was a shortage, so pharmacist wages went higher. Once the shortage is over, and it is or will be, pharmacist wages aren't going to decrease, but they won't necessarily increase with inflation either: they'll stagnate, which is an effective decrease in salary. So, I say inflated because I think the buying power of a pharmacist is going to decrease when compared to its 2006 (or whatever) levels.
 
Also: The stress levels of retail pharmacy aren't going to matter if pharmacy schools keep on popping out pharmacists. After spending 4 years and 100K on your Pharm.D., you're going to want to use it. So you'll take retail pharmacy, even if it sucks, since while there are other options besides retail pharmacy, you're not going to be the only one competing for them. So, instead of being unemployed, especially with your debt from pharmacy school, you're going to work retail. All in all, pharmacist wages are going to stagnate, or maybe: keep up with costs of living increases. Your friend who thinks working for 55/hr. sucks is going to need to find a new job, not look for an increase in wages, IMO.
 
PonderingChoice said:
I'm not making a value judgment, when I say inflated, I'm talking about from a pure economics sense. There was a shortage, so pharmacist wages went higher. Once the shortage is over, and it is or will be, pharmacist wages aren't going to decrease, but they won't necessarily increase with inflation either: they'll stagnate, which is an effective decrease in salary. So, I say inflated because I think the buying power of a pharmacist is going to decrease when compared to its 2006 (or whatever) levels.
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Thanks for the clarification.
 
I wasn't referring to myself, and I never said I had a pharmacy or bust attitude. I have a bachelor's degree that I received in May, and I'm working on my MBA, so if anything I have other options as well. I also helped start a small business dealing in tropical fish that is doing rather well. The only reason I was a waitress is because I went to my undergrad university full time and was involved in competitive cheer and dance, so working a day job wasn't really an option. I was referring to the other people in this world who may not be as fortunate as us to have better prosepcts after college. I don't look down on someone because they're a waiter and don't have better options for whatever reason. If anything I admire hard working people who do these jobs to survive and support themselves rather than sitting around expecting other people to help them.
 
PonderingChoice said:
Also: The stress levels of retail pharmacy aren't going to matter if pharmacy schools keep on popping out pharmacists. After spending 4 years and 100K on your Pharm.D., you're going to want to use it. So you'll take retail pharmacy, even if it sucks, since while there are other options besides retail pharmacy, you're not going to be the only one competing for them. So, instead of being unemployed, especially with your debt from pharmacy school, you're going to work retail. All in all, pharmacist wages are going to stagnate, or maybe: keep up with costs of living increases. Your friend who thinks working for 55/hr. sucks is going to need to find a new job, not look for an increase in wages, IMO.
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This message is irrelevant in this context because you clarified that your wording of "inflated" was not a value judgment.
 
Tinkerbell22 said:
I wasn't referring to myself, and I never said I had a pharmacy or bust attitude. I have a bachelor's degree that I received in May, and I'm working on my MBA, so if anything I have other options as well. I also helped start a small business dealing in tropical fish that is doing rather well. The only reason I was a waitress is because I went to my undergrad university full time and was involved in competitive cheer and dance, so working a day job wasn't really an option. I was referring to the other people in this world who may not be as fortunate as us to have better prosepcts after college. I don't look down on someone because they're a waiter and don't have better options for whatever reason. If anything I admire hard working people who do these jobs to survive and support themselves rather than sitting around expecting other people to help them.
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Nor was I exclusively referring to you 🙂
 
Tinkerbell22 said:
I was referring to the other people in this world who may not be as fortunate as us to have better prosepcts after college. I don't look down on someone because they're a waiter and don't have better options for whatever reason. If anything I admire hard working people who do these jobs to survive and support themselves rather than sitting around expecting other people to help them.
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Oh, I agree. However, while it's good to appreciate your status and respect those who work lower paid jobs, it's also a bit silly to say, "Well, pharmacy is better than being a waitress, so we shouldn't complain about the possibility of stagnant (or decreasing!) wages." We need to compare pharmacy to the alternatives that we, as prospective pharmacy students, have. Pharmacy should come out ahead, either from a financial or happiness sense, than the alternatives. The fact that it's better than being a waitress or a soldier has zero relevance, unless being a waitress for the rest of your life is your back up plan if you get rejected from pharmacy school.
 
PonderingChoice said:
Long story short: don't expect private schools to regulate themselves, especially if prospective students still flock to pharmacy after the field has reached its saturation point. Only once prospective students decide that pharmacy school isn't worth the cost will the private schools decrease their class sizes. And they won't be doing it out of the goodness of their hearts, they'll be doing it to save money.
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The vast majority of public schools have class sizes larger than that of private schools. My school has a class of 75. Most public schools crank out 150-200 grads per year. Who's hurting the field worse?

I love the constant vilification of new schools and the extolling of older schools, as if only newer schools are contributing to the problem.
 
Whats funny is I can use all these same arguments to depict other good careers in a bad light. Its like watching Fox news commentators convince people the US is one transition from becoming a “Nazi Germany”. Its wise to be concerned about the field you're planning to build a career in – but for the sake of reality – don't put too much faith in your econ 101 supply/demand argument.
 
IrishHammer said:
The vast majority of public schools have class sizes larger than that of private schools. My school has a class of 75. Most public schools crank out 150-200 grads per year. Who's hurting the field worse?

I love the constant vilification of new schools and the extolling of older schools, as if only newer schools are contributing to the problem.
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Sorry, I didn't mean to vilify the newer schools. I just wanted to point out that private schools are more likely to have their own self-interests at heart. That we shouldn't expect them to regulate themselves for OUR benefit.
 
yappy said:
Whats funny is I can use all these same arguments to depict other good careers in a bad light. Its like watching Fox news commentators convince people the US is one transition from becoming a “Nazi Germany”. Its wise to be concerned about the field you're planning to build a career in – but for the sake of reality – don't put too much faith in your econ 101 supply/demand argument.
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The supply/demand argument worked pretty damn well during the pharmacist shortage, didn't it? I admit there's a lot of factors to account for. But if you're picking a profession, it behooves you to be slightly pessimistic. If being slightly pessimistic turns you off to the profession, then you should do something else. After all, I'm not suggesting that we're going to be replaced with automated pill-counters or that healthcare reform is going to do a number on our salaries - I'm just suggesting that our wages might not keep up with inflation - leading to an effective 6% to 10% decrease in salaries. That doesn't seem huge, but 10K a year (before taxes) times your working life-time adds up to a big number. Roughly 280K (7K x 40.)
 
I like how the people who say pharmacists wages are over inflated are usually people who either haven't worked in pharmacy or don't know a damned thing about the profession.

They are not overpaid, trust me on that. And those if you who really think retail is 'cake' come work a day with me. You may not be directly saving lives like some pharmacists, but I'll work your balls off over the course of an eight hour day.
 
Again, I'm not suggesting that pharmacists don't earn every penny. But the fact that retail works the balls off of you doesn't matter if there's plenty of graduates who are willing to work retail so they can pay off their loans. Only when people begin pursuing other fields will retail pharmacy correct itself - 'cuz even if retail pharmacy sucks hard, if I'm a 100K in debt, I'm not going to sit on the sidelines.
 
phathead said:
I like how the people who say pharmacists wages are over inflated are usually people who either haven't worked in pharmacy or don't know a damned thing about the profession.

They are not overpaid, trust me on that. And those if you who really think retail is 'cake' come work a day with me. You may not be directly saving lives like some pharmacists, but I'll work your balls off over the course of an eight hour day.
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👍 This is true. You really don't know what retail is like until you have worked there.

They might talk about saturation and shortages, but saturation occurs when too many graduates stay in one area. If those students and pharmacists consider relocating and actually do it, then you wouldn't have to worry about saturation and difficulties in finding positions. People in small towns always need pharmacists, and you don't hear about people having trouble finding jobs there.
 
crazybob said:
People in small towns always need pharmacists, and you don't hear about people having trouble finding jobs there.
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That's true, but small towns are less desirable to some people. I'm not one of those people, but I need to worry about where my SO is going to work. She can't find work in some small town - she (or I) would have to commute at the very least, and trust me, commuting more than 2 hours a day SUCKS. Spending all your time commuting can easily mitigate the benefits of a better paying job.
 
PonderingChoice said:
Again, I'm not suggesting that pharmacists don't earn every penny. But the fact that retail works the balls off of you doesn't matter if there's plenty of graduates who are willing to work retail so they can pay off their loans. Only when people begin pursuing other fields will retail pharmacy correct itself - 'cuz even if retail pharmacy sucks hard, if I'm a 100K in debt, I'm not going to sit on the sidelines.
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You're still missing the point about retail. It's like when people say that docs that are GPs suck compared to a specialist. A GP will almost never be presented with the same case where as a specialist has already had a GP figure out what the hell's going on.

Retail is kinda the same way, you never have any clear bounds on where to start. You have to think on your feet, very quickly, and be able to apply your knowledge in real time. I'm not putting down other flavors of pharmacists, I greatly respect what they do. But you should never brush off retail like that.

Yes, a lot of people go into it to pay off debts. And ya know what, those are the pharmacists that suck ***** at retail pharmacy. They're the ones who give it a bad name.
 
Just to be clear, if I ever insulted retail or said that it sucks, it was based on someone else's, or rather their friend's, comment that retail is not worth being paid $55 an hour. So, no insult intended towards retail.
 
PonderingChoice said:
Just to be clear, if I ever insulted retail or said that it sucks, it was based on someone else's, or rather their friend's, comment that retail is not worth being paid $55 an hour. So, no insult intended towards retail.
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Gotcha, it's more the response that I get from people when I say I want to spend my career in retail.

I think of the pharmacists who spend their days at a cushy desk in a hospital bitching about their jobs and I want to just punch them in the face some days. Maybe I have anger issues lol
 
People who say they hate retail are always the ones that think they're too good for certain things. They're the type to be complaining about so much studying to do and not wanting to sit through boring lectures or presentations. That's at least how I see it at my school from the way people are by observing the ones who say they hate retail.
 
crazybob said:
People who say they hate retail are always the ones that think they're too good for certain things. They're the type to be complaining about so much studying to do and not wanting to sit through boring lectures or presentations. That's at least how I see it at my school from the way people are by observing the ones who say they hate retail.
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You must work in a boring retail pharmacy then. I think you may be missing the point. The reason many people hate retail is not because it is boring and dull. Quite the contrary! They hate it because they constantly have costumers screaming at them along with doctors, insurance companies, corporate. On top of all that chaos, they need to do what they were trained to do: quality assurance of prescriptions. Looks easy, but is very challenging.
 
MRSA Sucks said:
You must work in a boring retail pharmacy then. I think you may be missing the point. The reason many people hate retail is not because it is boring and dull. Quite the contrary! They hate it because they constantly have costumers screaming at them along with doctors, insurance companies, corporate. On top of all that chaos, they need to do what they were trained to do: quality assurance of prescriptions. Looks easy, but is very challenging.
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I know it's the contrary. I've seen busy retail pharmacies and I've heard stories about all of the customers and patients.

I'm just saying that my classmates who work in retail seem to do nothing but complain about everything and everyone. I complain too sometimes, but it's not as bad as my classmates :laugh:

I usually just keep it to myself so it doesn't sound like I'm whining all the time.
 
crazybob said:
I know it's the contrary. I've seen busy retail pharmacies and I've heard stories about all of the customers and patients.

I'm just saying that my classmates who work in retail seem to do nothing but complain about everything and everyone. I complain too sometimes, but it's not as bad as my classmates :laugh:

I usually just keep it to myself so it doesn't sound like I'm whining all the time.
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That is why independent pharmacies are the best!
 
crazybob said:
People who say they hate retail are always the ones that think they're too good for certain things. They're the type to be complaining about so much studying to do and not wanting to sit through boring lectures or presentations. That's at least how I see it at my school from the way people are by observing the ones who say they hate retail.
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"Too good" for retail? The only part of retail I enjoyed was working directly with the patients. Insurance issues = :wtf:
Now, mail order- talk about boring and dull. If you are on the production side of things, all you do is fill, fill, fill and it is completely mindless. I don't think I am "too good" for retail, but hospital is my calling.
 
rxlea said:
"Too good" for retail? The only part of retail I enjoyed was working directly with the patients. Insurance issues = :wtf:
Now, mail order- talk about boring and dull. If you are on the production side of things, all you do is fill, fill, fill and it is completely mindless. I don't think I am "too good" for retail, but hospital is my calling.
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Those classmates who work in retail sometimes think that volunteering for class activities or screenings sounds a little dumb or something. I understand that they wouldn't be able to go to screenings if they're working, but volunteering for things in class is never a big deal. There was one time when a pharmacist gave a lecture in pharmacy practice about communication with our patients, and she asked for a volunteer. I volunteered the first time since no one wanted to. On the second time, I thought at least 1 person out of 119 other people would think about it, but they didn't. So I volunteered again. I know they might have thought it was dumb or whatever, but it doesn't take much effort to volunteer for few minutes during class. Sometimes I think they're just lazy :laugh: I've heard my classmates say that they are whenever they're not working.

I wouldn't mind working in retail or hospital, but I would really like to be a clinical pharmacist. I would get kinda nervous if I had to be completely in charge of everything everyday. It would take me a bit longer to do my work because I would get nervous about being responsible for every single mistake that leaves the pharmacy. Once I feel comfortable, I would be able to speed up a lot, but it might take a while before I feel comfortable enough with everything. One of the pharmacists at school who teaches Drug Info and Dispensing said that "your butt will be on the line" when we are pharmacists in charge.

With clinical, there are doctors and nurses who can catch any mistake I might make and we can look out for each other, so I would feel a little less nervous there.
 
Honestly, retail, like any other, has its pros and cons. It just depends on your characteristics if you can survive it in or not.

The patients are the toughest part of retail. The ridiculous patients that ask the most outrageous requests, then just goes with the first option drives my pharmacist up the wall. Then, the added pressure that everything that goes out of the pharmacy is your responsibility makes it even worst, especially when there is no one else that can cover you if a mistake happens. This added with the pressure to actually counsel patients, maintain the pharmacy, bringing RX scripts up, the business end of Pharmacy, etc, is the reason they are earning so much. They are the sole person that is responsible if something goes wrong.

Retail is hard, but it requires a certain type of person. Honestly, retail would be my last option when I get into the work force, but I would probably to it part time in the long run.
 
The sad thing is, that these articles should be including the factor that people (as I've read on here) are really "setting their ways".... As I've said before- let me reiterate. Just because you have a PharmD doesn't make you anymore qualified than the next person who has a PharmD to work as a clinical pharmacist or hospital pharmacist (or WHATEVER pharmacy job YOU personally want). It seems like you all bash retail, but without a local retail pharmacist many people would have no way to receive their meds.... And dont give me crap about mail order. If I'm Joe Smith, I'm not waiting for my meds, I WANT THEM NAOOOO.

I understand some of you guys may not specifically think retail is your calling, but if there's a "job shortage" I think you'll need to set your biases aside and bite your tongue because we all don't want to be unemployed professional degree holders.... Many of us on here aren't even in a PharmD program and saying "Oh helllll no I'm not working retail (or insert category of pharmacy here)".... please. Get in the program first, go through 3/4 years then say what you want. We all truly don't know what we want until we've gone through the motions...... I can tell you til I'm blue I want to work in a clinical setting but hell who knows maybe I'll sell my soul to Wags and get a sweet sign on bonus 🙂



Take my opinion with a grain of salt, but geez we all need to stop setting our ways and be grateful we've made it this far.....
 
crazybob said:
Those classmates who work in retail sometimes think that volunteering for class activities or screenings sounds a little dumb or something. I understand that they wouldn't be able to go to screenings if they're working, but volunteering for things in class is never a big deal. There was one time when a pharmacist gave a lecture in pharmacy practice about communication with our patients, and she asked for a volunteer. I volunteered the first time since no one wanted to. On the second time, I thought at least 1 person out of 119 other people would think about it, but they didn't. So I volunteered again. I know they might have thought it was dumb or whatever, but it doesn't take much effort to volunteer for few minutes during class. Sometimes I think they're just lazy :laugh: I've heard my classmates say that they are whenever they're not working.

I wouldn't mind working in retail or hospital, but I would really like to be a clinical pharmacist. I would get kinda nervous if I had to be completely in charge of everything everyday. It would take me a bit longer to do my work because I would get nervous about being responsible for every single mistake that leaves the pharmacy. Once I feel comfortable, I would be able to speed up a lot, but it might take a while before I feel comfortable enough with everything. One of the pharmacists at school who teaches Drug Info and Dispensing said that "your butt will be on the line" when we are pharmacists in charge.

With clinical, there are doctors and nurses who can catch any mistake I might make and we can look out for each other, so I would feel a little less nervous there.
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When I say hospital, I mean clinical- preferably critical care. After seeing the pharmacists at my work, I know that is what I want to do.
 
nicolemsm said:
The sad thing is, that these articles should be including the factor that people (as I've read on here) are really "setting their ways".... As I've said before- let me reiterate. Just because you have a PharmD doesn't make you anymore qualified than the next person who has a PharmD to work as a clinical pharmacist or hospital pharmacist (or WHATEVER pharmacy job YOU personally want). It seems like you all bash retail, but without a local retail pharmacist many people would have no way to receive their meds.... And dont give me crap about mail order. If I'm Joe Smith, I'm not waiting for my meds, I WANT THEM NAOOOO.

I understand some of you guys may not specifically think retail is your calling, but if there's a "job shortage" I think you'll need to set your biases aside and bite your tongue because we all don't want to be unemployed professional degree holders.... Many of us on here aren't even in a PharmD program and saying "Oh helllll no I'm not working retail (or insert category of pharmacy here)".... please. Get in the program first, go through 3/4 years then say what you want. We all truly don't know what we want until we've gone through the motions...... I can tell you til I'm blue I want to work in a clinical setting but hell who knows maybe I'll sell my soul to Wags and get a sweet sign on bonus 🙂



Take my opinion with a grain of salt, but geez we all need to stop setting our ways and be grateful we've made it this far.....
Click to expand...

I will never sell my soul to a big box. I would never take a job that I do not enjoy- no matter how high the salary is. I am going to do the best I can to get into a good program and distinguish myself so that I can get to where I want to be. You are right- I am not in a program yet and if I don't get in this year, I will try again.
 
rxlea said:
I will never sell my soul to a big box. I would never take a job that I do not enjoy- no matter how high the salary is. I am going to do the best I can to get into a good program and distinguish myself so that I can get to where I want to be. You are right- I am not in a program yet and if I don't get in this year, I will try again.
Click to expand...

rxlea said:
When I say hospital, I mean clinical- preferably critical care. After seeing the pharmacists at my work, I know that is what I want to do.
Click to expand...
Exactly and I should have rephrased to say what you said. There's a diff b/w being average/ attending okay school and doing stellar going to excellent school or reputable school. But that's what sets you apart from others though, you're willing to work hard and get into a good program to set yourself from the rest. People just doing the bare minimum & not caring where they go who set their ways are in for a rude awakening .... :laugh:
 
Well, looks like I'm late to the party, but my opinion is now as it has been: There'll always be jobs available for someone who:

1) Is talented
2) Is willing to relocate
3) Is willing to accept poor working conditions (time, location, on-call, etc) during their path toward seniority
4) Has a high bull-**** capacity


And a few other traits. I mean think about it... Undoubtedly there are just as many, if not more, college programs turning out auto. mechanics and welders and building inspectors and the list goes on and on, yet where are all the articles whining about the possibility of the difficulty in landing a position?

Non-existant. Why? Because, unlike people who are being drawn into pharmacy because of the promise of a quick paycheck and an easy life, they aren't expecting handouts. Like NaOH remarked, it's no longer sufficient to have a Pharm.D and a pulse and I think that's a really good thing for the profession.

Are there are some folks with 2.8s that make good Pharmacists? Of course. Are there some folks with 4.0s that make bad ones? Of course. But like every other field, those will be outliers. The best pharmacists should always be the ones with the most aptitude in school (and the most ambition and thus, the most success) and so I do not think this is at all a bad thing for the profession.

I'm not worried.
 
Passion4Sci said:
Well, looks like I'm late to the party, but my opinion is now as it has been: There'll always be jobs available for someone who:

1) Is talented
2) Is willing to relocate
3) Is willing to accept poor working conditions (time, location, on-call, etc) during their path toward seniority
4) Has a high bull-**** capacity


And a few other traits. I mean think about it... Undoubtedly there are just as many, if not more, college programs turning out auto. mechanics and welders and building inspectors and the list goes on and on, yet where are all the articles whining about the possibility of the difficulty in landing a position?

Non-existant. Why? Because, unlike people who are being drawn into pharmacy because of the promise of a quick paycheck and an easy life, they aren't expecting handouts. Like NaOH remarked, it's no longer sufficient to have a Pharm.D and a pulse and I think that's a really good thing for the profession.

Are there are some folks with 2.8s that make good Pharmacists? Of course. Are there some folks with 4.0s that make bad ones? Of course. But like every other field, those will be outliers. The best pharmacists should always be the ones with the most aptitude in school (and the most ambition and thus, the most success) and so I do not think this is at all a bad thing for the profession.

I'm not worried.
Click to expand...

👍 You sure know your stuff.

I'm not worried about getting a job in my home state because I'll relocate to pretty much anywhere (except for high crime areas). According to a survey at my school, there's one person who graduated last year and is getting paid 150K to work in retail, but it's probably in a high crime area. They always pay you more to work in unfavorable conditions.
 
crazybob said:
👍 You sure know your stuff.

I'm not worried about getting a job in my home state because I'll relocate to pretty much anywhere (except for high crime areas). According to a survey at my school, there's one person who graduated last year and is getting paid 150K to work in retail, but it's probably in a high crime area. They always pay you more to work in unfavorable conditions.
Click to expand...

Nothing is more unfavorable than Iraq and Afghanistan so I'm fine with working wherever anyone has a store. I'd prefer to work in an inpatient or ambulatory care pharmacy in a clinical capacity since interventions-tracking is one of my favorite things to do as a volunteer but when it comes down to brass tacks, if I need to work in retail for X years in order to get enough experience / wait for a position to open in a hospital, so be it.

Your willingness to be "semper gumbi" (Forever flexible)will put you head and shoulders above people who are either tied to one area because of family or other reasons and who are just afraid of change.
 
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