10% of new grads "scrambling" for work.

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You live in NY dude. Most pharmacy students and even RPh's down south would give you a funny look when you say Rutgers or Ernest Mario.
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jinga said:
Ok, I live in South Dakota. The jig is up. North Dakota still mandates that 50% of pharmacies are privately owned. I'm making plans for independent ownership in my 10-year future. I worked for an independent for a year in rural Nebraska; it was very very successful.

Has anyone here heard of Wall Drug in Wall, SD? It's probably the most successful pharmacy in the whole state.

My pharmacy education will cost me ~$50K. I'm not too worried. I've worked on farms, construction, confinements, restaurants, as a tutor, everything. If I can't find a job, I'll make something happen.

I could probably build my own pharmacy with my construction experience.
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Same! lol I have no kids, no husband, no obligations... If I can't find a job I will move... join the military... do something else until I can find one... etc. Life won't end... I'm not just going to pharmacy school for the money/job prospects, although I'll definitely take my chances with pharmacy over accounting, marketing, business or communications degree, etc.

If it really came down to it I would bleed my loan payments back as much as I could afford every month, live with roommates, with my parents, etc until I could make enough money to support myself. The all **** freezing over, apocalyptic, sky is falling, situation doesn't scare me. I've been through/seen enough in my short life to be happy just to wake up and breathe in the morning. lol
 
p-rog said:
Rutgers is a great school, no doubt about it. Don't go too hard on the guy though....Rutgers does have a few "typical diploma mill" characteristics (0-6 program, huge class size) that could throw off someone who hadn't really heard of the school before.
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Granted the program has a few things that (in my opinion) need to be worked out, saying its a diploma mill is still flat wrong.

FYI USP has the same characteristics and its the oldest pharmacy school in the country.

Also, it isn't a strict 0-6 program, its also a 2+4 and even 3+4 for some students. Thus far, it seems to accept only roughly 10-20 B.S. holders per year for such a large class size, a lot less than most B.S. holders would like.
 
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PharmaTope said:
i know for a fact the numbers exceeded 200 and were closer to 300 (at graduation time) with actual numbers of students enrolled in their curriculumn exceeding 300.
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last i checked my class was at 170 + incoming transfers. but yes, you know better than me.
 
Argentium said:
last i checked my class was at 170 + incoming transfers. but yes, you know better than me.
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Golly, i guess the site visit from the accreditation council 2 years ago that sited a major problem of massive class number and lack of labs with a number of classes made them start requiring the PCAT and more strict requirements to continue on to professional years......
 
Speaking of diploma mills... disgusting.

http://www.baltimoresun.com/news/maryland/bs-md-notre-dame-pharmacy-20100507,0,4256471.story

Notre Dame breaks ground on new School of Pharmacy 25,000-square-foot building will allow school to expand to 300 students

The College of Notre Dame broke ground on a 25,000-square-foot building to house its new School of Pharmacy on Friday, a project that will allow the school to expand from 70 to 300 students. Notre Dame opened the school last fall in response to studies that showed an underserved demand for pharmacy education in Maryland. The co-educational college, the first of its kind on a traditionally all-women's campus, chose its initial class of 70 from 500 applicants but has received 950 applications for the 70 spots in next year's class. Construction on the $13 million project is expected to be complete by summer 2011. U.S. Sen. Benjamin L. Cardin, who helped secure federal money for the project, said the expanded school will "help close a gap that could seriously affect our nation's delivery of health care services." [email protected]
 
IrishHammer said:
New-Mexico-Flag.jpg


Doesn't New Mexico have fairly high crime and murder rates, or did the guy who told me that not know what the **** he was talking about?
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Crime rates are pretty high in ABQ
 
Jetninjin said:
Speaking of diploma mills... disgusting.

http://www.baltimoresun.com/news/maryland/bs-md-notre-dame-pharmacy-20100507,0,4256471.story

Notre Dame breaks ground on new School of Pharmacy 25,000-square-foot building will allow school to expand to 300 students

The College of Notre Dame broke ground on a 25,000-square-foot building to house its new School of Pharmacy on Friday, a project that will allow the school to expand from 70 to 300 students. Notre Dame opened the school last fall in response to studies that showed an underserved demand for pharmacy education in Maryland. The co-educational college, the first of its kind on a traditionally all-women's campus, chose its initial class of 70 from 500 applicants but has received 950 applications for the 70 spots in next year's class. Construction on the $13 million project is expected to be complete by summer 2011. U.S. Sen. Benjamin L. Cardin, who helped secure federal money for the project, said the expanded school will "help close a gap that could seriously affect our nation's delivery of health care services." [email protected]
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Since they're still a new school, can't ACPE step in and block that? I mean, I'm sure it would only be a temporary thing, as should they get full accreditation, they could do it then anyway, but as long as they're still under ACPE's watch, isn't there some kind of HICP inspired rule against that aggressive of an expansion?
 
rxlea said:
Crime rates are pretty high in ABQ
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And that's why I prefer BBQ!

*rimshot*

Is it just in Albuquerque, or is it also a problem in Santa Fe and other cities in New Mexico?
 
PharmaTope said:
Golly, i guess the site visit from the accreditation council 2 years ago that sited a major problem of massive class number and lack of labs with a number of classes made them start requiring the PCAT and more strict requirements to continue on to professional years......
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Jetninjin said:
Speaking of diploma mills... disgusting.

http://www.baltimoresun.com/news/maryland/bs-md-notre-dame-pharmacy-20100507,0,4256471.story

Notre Dame breaks ground on new School of Pharmacy 25,000-square-foot building will allow school to expand to 300 students

The College of Notre Dame broke ground on a 25,000-square-foot building to house its new School of Pharmacy on Friday, a project that will allow the school to expand from 70 to 300 students. Notre Dame opened the school last fall in response to studies that showed an underserved demand for pharmacy education in Maryland. The co-educational college, the first of its kind on a traditionally all-women's campus, chose its initial class of 70 from 500 applicants but has received 950 applications for the 70 spots in next year's class. Construction on the $13 million project is expected to be complete by summer 2011. U.S. Sen. Benjamin L. Cardin, who helped secure federal money for the project, said the expanded school will "help close a gap that could seriously affect our nation's delivery of health care services." [email protected]
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Hah, I love how the accreditation council prefers to take out the "whip" on established programs, yet lets programs have been in existence for less than 5 years increase their student body from 70-300...

ACPE = Bunch of idiots.
 
IrishHammer said:
And that's why I prefer BBQ!

*rimshot*

Is it just in Albuquerque, or is it also a problem in Santa Fe and other cities in New Mexico?
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Not sure about Santa Fe, but if there is anything I have learned by living in a border state, it is that the crime rate increases as you get closer to the border.
 
rxlea said:
Not sure about Santa Fe, but if there is anything I have learned by living in a border state, it is that the crime rate increases as you get closer to the border.
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Not with the Canada border :lol:

sorry, couldn't resist Lea...
 
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type b pharmD said:
how to win when the pharmacy job market gets tough

http://www2.tech.purdue.edu/cgt/courses/cgt411/covey/48_laws_of_power.htm
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Are those for real? Most of them sound like they are taken from an article in The Onion. My fav so far:

Law 7


Get others to do the Work for you, but Always Take the Credit ​


Use the wisdom, knowledge, and legwork of other people to further your own cause. Not only will such assistance save you valuable time and energy, it will give you a godlike aura of efficiency and speed. In the end your helpers will be forgotten and you will be remembered. Never do yourself what others can do for you.

Edit: Nevermind about "are they for real". I looked it up. Most of them still sound like jokes to me.
 
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Jetninjin said:
Speaking of diploma mills... disgusting.

http://www.baltimoresun.com/news/maryland/bs-md-notre-dame-pharmacy-20100507,0,4256471.story

Notre Dame breaks ground on new School of Pharmacy 25,000-square-foot building will allow school to expand to 300 students

The College of Notre Dame broke ground on a 25,000-square-foot building to house its new School of Pharmacy on Friday, a project that will allow the school to expand from 70 to 300 students. Notre Dame opened the school last fall in response to studies that showed an underserved demand for pharmacy education in Maryland. The co-educational college, the first of its kind on a traditionally all-women's campus, chose its initial class of 70 from 500 applicants but has received 950 applications for the 70 spots in next year's class. Construction on the $13 million project is expected to be complete by summer 2011. U.S. Sen. Benjamin L. Cardin, who helped secure federal money for the project, said the expanded school will "help close a gap that could seriously affect our nation's delivery of health care services." [email protected]
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Maybe, and this is just a thought, the number 300 is referring to total enrollment, not per-class enrollment.
 
PharmaTope said:
Rutgers in NJ graduates almost 300 pharmacists a year. I would call that a diploma mill. Most schools graduate 80-125. Rutgers is graduating around 3x as many. There is also supposed to be another pharmacy school in NJ opening in north NJ.
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is it FDU?
 
Filler said:
You have no idea what your talking about, Ernest Mario SOP is probably one of the toughest programs to get into, your reasoning of would also label USP as a diploma mill too as it pumps out more than, if not close to Rutgers class size.

Farleigh Dickinson on the other hand...
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PharmaTope and I happen to be graduates of EMSOP Class of 2008...

our graduating class was at 240, looking back on it it didn't make much sense to have a class that big
 
IrishHammer said:
And that's why I prefer BBQ!

*rimshot*

Is it just in Albuquerque, or is it also a problem in Santa Fe and other cities in New Mexico?
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Living in multiple places of New Mexico. I must ask WTF are you guys talking about. Crime rate in Albuquerque is no worse then any city of similar size. New Mexico is a great place to live. I have never felt unsafe even in the south valley of albuquerque.
However, I agree, im glad 98% of people don't want to live in New Mexico. Its all MINE!!!!!!! There is a reason many people call it the Land of Entrapment. Many people don't feel like leaving once they visit.
 
117906-004-918F6802.jpg

Thats right, I get to see these everyday. How about that:cool:.
 
Shall I post a picture of the alfalfa field I live by? I seriously live by an alfalfa field.
 
Nobody said ABQ sucked or anything. I loved it when I visited, but it DOES have high crime rates...If I wasn't on my phone, I could post a link that shows ABQ crime rates in relation to other major cities. You might be surprised...and yes, the closer you get to the southern border, the more crime there is. That is why Tucson is rated a 1 in crime. This means that Tucson has more crime than 99% of major cities.
 
rxlea said:
Nobody said ABQ sucked or anything. I loved it when I visited, but it DOES have high crime rates...If I wasn't on my phone, I could post a link that shows ABQ crime rates in relation to other major cities. You might be surprised...and yes, the closer you get to the southern border, the more crime there is. That is why Tucson is rated a 1 in crime. This means that Tucson has more crime than 99% of major cities.
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http://www.morganquitno.com/cit07pop.htm#25
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/United_States_cities_by_crime_rate
Albuquerque is higher then most.
On another note, AVOID ST. LOUIS.
Living in a larger city has it's crime. Im still sticking with feeling safe however.
 
I just thought I would note something here: my sister graduated from a very reputable teaching school here in the Midwest. 10% of her graduating class found work; she was one of the fortunate few. Teaching is generally viewed as a pretty secure profession. I would venture to guess pharmacy, at its current state, is probably in better shape OVERALL.
 
Everyone says the **** is hitting the fan but it is all specualtion and, as many have said before, dependent upon region. Yes, we should be concerned with the number of jobs available but, IMO, the quality of graduates is far more important. We don't need incompetent pharmacists taking away jobs from experienced pharmacists who are genuinely interested in helping their patients. Sometimes I wonder if it would be better to see a slight decrease in salary. It might dissuade people from going into this profession for the wrong reasons. But, as many have pointed out before, there is no way to discern competent from incompetent except maybe on rotations (and I have seen both types come through our pharmacy). It is going to come down to the best and the brightest + who you know. I would sooner be a networking gunner than a grade gunner. :)
 
p-rog said:
You live in NY dude. Most pharmacy students and even RPh's down south would give you a funny look when you say Rutgers or Ernest Mario.
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I thought the thread that was titled "Buffalo vs. Ernest Mario" was about a boxing match or something.

I don't know anything about NY/NJ haha
 
rxlea said:
NJ "the oil and petrol refinery state"
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Spoken by someone who obviously hasn't visited New Jersey (other than, maybe, the area surrounding Newark airport). South Jersey is very nice...
 
It was actually a line from the movie Miss Congeniality.

I've been to more than one area in Jersey. It isn't as bad as everyone thinks :)
 
rxlea said:
It was actually a line from the movie Miss Congeniality.

I've been to more than one area in Jersey. It isn't as bad as everyone thinks :)
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Eh, my first impression of New Jersey when I flew in to look for an apartment was that it is old, rundown and depressing. And no one knows how to take care of their lawn. Then I went further southeast, and saw that in fact there are nice places, and even very, very nice areas in this state. Though the only properties with properly manicured lawns are the multi-million dollar villas. :) And I still can't get over the fact that really nice neighborhoods can be bordering directly with really, really ugly ones. There are supposed to be some miles between the two, otherwise it just defeats the purpose...
 
jinga said:
I just thought I would note something here: my sister graduated from a very reputable teaching school here in the Midwest. 10% of her graduating class found work; she was one of the fortunate few. Teaching is generally viewed as a pretty secure profession. I would venture to guess pharmacy, at its current state, is probably in better shape OVERALL.
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Availability of teaching jobs is and has been for a long time, extremely regional. The midwest pumps out a lot of teachers and has a huge surplus of teachers. Some regions pretty much anyone with a license can get a teaching job but no one want to.
 
New Jersey
"The Armpit of America"

Jersey sucks so bad, people actually pay to leave the state ;)


j/k
 
WVUPharm2007 said:
New Jersey
"Our citizens are too stupid to trust with pumping their own gas."
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Now, don't be so obviously envious of the fact that I don't have to get out of my car in rain/snow/frigid cold just to put gas in it, AND I still pay less than you for it. :D

gotdrugs said:
Jersey sucks so bad, people actually pay to leave the state ;)
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And that's only 10000000th or so time I hear that joke, including the few times I said it myself. :D

Come on, how many states do you know where you are never more than an hour away from a major airport? :p And many other nice things to boot.
 
IndustryPharmD said:
Now, don't be so obviously envious of the fact that I don't have to get out of my car in rain/snow/frigid cold just to put gas in it, AND I still pay less than you for it. :D


And that's only 10000000th or so time I hear that joke, including the few times I said it myself. :D

Come on, how many states do you know where you are never more than an hour away from a major airport? :p And many other nice things to boot.
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You've heard the joke 10 million times cuz it's true.

Plus, I noticed how you never denied the fact that it's the armpit of america. :D
 
IndustryPharmD said:
Come on, how many states do you know where you are never more than an hour away from a major airport? :p And many other nice things to boot.
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Do you really want to live an hour away from an airport?
 
BMBiology said:
Do you really want to live an hour away from an airport?
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I personally prefer living half an hour away from an airport (as I do now) or closer. When you fly 10-20 times a year, it does matter. :) And the noise is only a problem within the five mile radius or so. When you land at 2am after 14 hour flight and all the delays, the last thing you want to do is drive another hour or two. Or, if you took a taxi, distance increases the bill rather dramatically.

And it's good to be close to a few airports, so no matter where you are giong you can get a good deal. :)
 
IndustryPharmD said:
Come on, how many states do you know where you are never more than an hour away from a major airport? :p And many other nice things to boot.
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Connecticut :)

I don't consider southern New Jersey to be "Jersey;" they're practically different states to me. The people I meet from north NJ & south NJ are very different. I've met quite a few of them too. It seems like half of NJ goes to UConn (not the SOP).
 
Why do MD's always say this?

"I remember writing one of my first prescriptions when I moved back to North Dakota after practicing in another state and telling my patient that he could get all this for $20 at Wal-Mart," Dr. Thompson said. "I was shocked when I learned we don't have those kinds of pharmacies in North Dakota. Those old pharmacy ownership laws have created a monopoly for pharmacists and higher drug prices for my patients."

Why don't we tell our patients that they can go to Dr. X and be seen in 15 minutes and it will cost $10 even if they don't have insurance?
 
PharmaTope said:
Rutgers in NJ graduates almost 300 pharmacists a year. I would call that a diploma mill. Most schools graduate 80-125. Rutgers is graduating around 3x as many. There is also supposed to be another pharmacy school in NJ opening in north NJ.
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Please don't talk if you don't know what you're talking about. First of all, the biggest class out of Rutgers that I've seen was around 230-ish...Rutgers is the only pharmacy school in the whole state of New Jersey...it is ultra-competitive to get into...so for it to have 50-80 more graduates a year is not a big deal. A lot of the saturation in the tri-state area (NJ,PA,NY) is largely due to the diploma mills in Philly (3 schools and 2 more in the works?) and NY.
 
OUTexan said:
Why don't we tell our patients that they can go to Dr. X and be seen in 15 minutes and it will cost $10 even if they don't have insurance?
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While we're talking about economically abusive monopolies, why not Jane Doe NP? or Jane Doe PA? John Doe CRNA?
 
I posted this in one of the other ZOMGNOJOBZ!!!!!!11! threads, but I got an email looking for 6 FT retail pharmacists in Iglooville and surrounding areas yesterday. Have also seen a few LTC, PBM and hospital staff positions open.
 
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