I think you can't discount geographic self selection as it's been discussed. If you want a mid-Atlantic residency for example, going to UCLA or Oregon would be ill-advised.
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2009 Match Lists
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I think you can't discount geographic self selection as it's been discussed. If you want a mid-Atlantic residency for example, going to UCLA or Oregon would be ill-advised.
please enlighten us lowly premeds more.
problem is that many people can't really self-select themselves into medical school in the region. think california.
I'm not discounting geography, but prestige matters a lot.
If one can prove to a mid-Atlantic program that one is serious about moving there, a reasonably strong UCLA applicant should be able to match, with recognition given to the prestige of that school.
There are always notable exceptions - graduates from relatively unknown allopathic programs matching at the most competitive programs in the most competitive fields - but an applicant from the bottom-half of the class at Stanford (or even the bottom, since my understanding is they really have no way to differentiate students there) is going to have a lot more options than someone from the bottom-half at Random State University.
The Step I exam is how places differentiate. Class rank (if there is one) comes into play lower on the criteria. School name comes into play much much lower on the criteria. Meaning you have to have the numbers and the evals and the research for the top positions or you aren't getting looked at, regardless of school. So in general, the bottom half of anyplace isn't going to set you up for anything. If you have dreams of top specialties/programs, the bottom of the class isn't going to do it for you, and it really doesn't matter which med school you go to. There is a danger on pre-allo that people seem to think that if they get into a prestigious med school they are "set". In fact it doesn't work that way. You might be saying that if you tank med school, you are better off doing it at a top school than a bottom, and I probably would agree with that, at least you'd have "something" going for you. But don't kid yourself into thinking that you can afford to be at the bottom of the class anyplace if you want something competitive. Getting into med school is not getting to the mountaintop -- it's getting to base camp. The climb is all still ahead. And the mountain is steep no matter what school emblem flies over your base camp.
It's not random chance at all -- it's a selection effect. Schools select for different things on admissions. The person who chooses a good midwest state school might have good numerical stats, but their application otherwise would look very different than a person who chooses a prestigious northeastern med school. Each school chooses people who will be a "good fit" for their school. Good fit isn't about numbers, and it's not just a term to let students not feel bad when they come up short. And it absolutely has some bearing on what people will want to go into at the other end. If you focus on people who are motivated to eg have lots of patient contact in their future, or express an interest in certain fields, or come from certain communities, you are going to get very different match lists than if you focus on folks whose application is research heavy with goals of finding "the cancer gene", and a certain kind of undergrad experience or pedigree. It's different kinds of applicants who are deemed "good fit" by different places, even where numbers aren't far apart (and in fact the numerical stats range amongst med schools isn't all that vast and overlaps at every school).
Each school strives to put together a diverse class in terms of backgrounds and interests, but the "average" student within each diverse mix isn't going to be interchangeable, they will have certain attributes the school finds most suited for that school. It's sort of why fraternities look the same year after year -- the jocks pick jocks as pledges, the music oriented pick musicians, etc. Med schools have their own internal biases as to what is a good fit. It's just the hazing of med school is more substantial.🙂
So the bottom line is that what you end up going into and where very much depends on your own efforts more than the school, but schools are very good at picking who fits a certain mold, and so the same type of person who is going to be uber intense 4 years to get derm is probably the same person a school that certain schools consider a good fit. The side corollary of this is that the same person could really achieve the same things anywhere, he'd simply be doing it at a school that doesn't select for his kind of personality.
Nope -- malignant isn't an individual judgment call, it's an objective state, not a subjective one. A place is malignant if they have a culture where they treat the residents a certain way. If you are a masochist, you may perhaps like being treated that way, but that doesn't make it non-malignant. It simply means you aren't bothered by the malignancy. Much as someone who doesn't mind having cancer might not be bothered by the malignancy. the cancer isn't gone because you have your own way of dealing. The term is not dependent on the likes or dislikes of the victims -- it is an objective concept.
Second, most people get one of their top selections FROM WHAT THEY ARE ABLE TO RANK. You can only rank places you get interviews at. Meaning if you want ortho, and you only get 2 interviews, you can only rank 2 programs. So NRMP is going to publish that you got one of your top 2 choices and it statistically sounds good, but in fact you may have APPLIED to 50 programs, gotten interviews at 2, ranked both, and ended up with the latter, so it would really be your 50th choice. That's why match statistics are misleading. As for what percentage rank a malignant program #1 or #2, again that depends on how many interviews you get. If you are applying to a very competitive fields, you often won't get as many interviews as you'd like, so it's possible that you are stuck ranking the places that talked to you or choosing another specialty. For some, going to, say, a malignant ortho program is better than their fallback of gen surg, and so you see folks ranking the 1-2 ortho programs they got interviews at at the top of their list, notwithstanding that the surgery programs they ranked lower are more benign. This happens EXTREMELY FREQUENTLY when folks shoot for very competitive things with only moderately competitive numbers. So you rank the two ortho spots you got interviews at, end up with #2, a malignant program, and shrug and say "oh well, at least I get to be an orthopod if I survive this". It isn't really your dream, but beggars can't be choosers. Which is fine, but then some pre-allo person sees ortho on a rank list at a big name place and, because s/he doesn't know good from malignant, inappropriately thinks this is an amazing match, even though when you started applying this was going to be the 50th option, and you might even be feeling bad about and second guessing it. That's all I'm saying. And that's why you can't just look at program names on a match list and decide -- this is good, this isn't. You sit down with a mentor late in med school and get the real skinny, or you can't know.
Wanted to agree with Law2Doc here. The only think unique about Harvard is that they post their non-medical "matches" publicly. Most schools do not, as they're rather frowned upon.
Consulting, as we all know, recruits unknown, untested people to the world of finance in the hope that their credentials will impress clients. Else no newly-minted doctor in the world would be hired for such a gig.
And as someone who went through that phase a few years ago, I can assure you that the starting salaries are in the low $100s, and only the rare few rise up to make substantially more than that (on partnership track).
I'm not sure why people have such a problem with schools posting that their graduates have gone into consulting jobs. Maybe a better term for match list would be post-graduate appointment list. Schools not only include consulting jobs but post-doctoral fellowships for their MD-PhDs. Should schools not include these because it is not a match? I would want to know what all students did after graduating, not just the ones who "match". Secondly, since when is it the job of a medical school to produce only people who practice medicine? There are many MD-PhDs that only practice biomedical research...is it wrong that schools train researchers? Nowhere does it say that medical schools have to train clinicians. There are many things a physician can do to have an impact on health care. Policy issues, research, pharmaceuticals, biotechnology, law, hospital management all need intelligent people who understand the healthcare system and the practice of medicine. I would much rather have an MD running my hospital than some MBA who has no idea what they are talking about. Other professions like law create graduates that go into all types of fields that you can imagine from I-banking to traditional law. Why can't an MD degree do the same thing.
Do you know what goes into running a hospital?
Agree. A hospital is a business, and a fairly complicated one, at that. Doctors are notoriously bad in this area (not all, but the trend is there). The fact that most premeds are sci majors and the fact that numerous prereqs make substantial education in business, law and accounting (the things necessary to aptly run a business) impractical almost guaranty that obtaining the basics necessary to tackle this kind of business operation as a premed or med student is unrealistic. Countless pre-allo threads which suggest a lack of understanding of "time value of money" and other basic finance and accounting concepts are a testament to this. An MD with an MBA and decent business experience might be qualified to do this. But otherwise, the next best person to tackle this would be an MBA with business experience, and thereafter probably a lawyer or accountant. Because healthcare isn't any different than widgets from a managerial point of view. Nothing you learn in med school is useful for running a hospital. Everything you learn in an MBA program, JD program or working in a business industry might be.
And yes it does say this in the mission statement of most med schools, and the charters of all state schools.
I don't know how you can justify your opinion with this worst case scenario. If you look at the 2007 data, even orthos who didn't match ranked a median of 5 contiguous ranks. Of those who matched, it was 11. How rampant does malignancy have to be for it to make match lists uninterpretable?
I agree that you never know if the individual person is happy with a match based on a match list alone. However, I think the match system works for the applicant, and that people are fairly happy with it on average...and therefore you can get a general feel for a match list.
Aside from the fact that the average premed:
-has no idea what the "competitive" residences are aside from recognizing Ivy League names
-has no idea what the percentages of matched students are i.e. 7 people matching ortho isn't so hot if 14 were applying
-has no idea how far people fell on their rank list
-has no idea what confounding variables like desire for location or couples match came into play for a particular individual
You get a great feel from a match list.
-has no idea what the "competitive" residences are aside from recognizing Ivy League names
-has no idea what the percentages of matched students are i.e. 7 people matching ortho isn't so hot if 14 were applying
-has no idea how far people fell on their rank list
-has no idea what confounding variables like desire for location or couples match came into play for a particular individual
You get a great feel from a match list.
From their website
Why is this so bothersome? I understand that one of the major reasons behind many of our health care system's shortcomings is the shortage of practicing physicians (especially primary care physicians). However, health care consultants play an important role in making health care delivery more efficient (considering how much we spend for health care in this country, why not get more out of that investment).
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Exactly.
Medicine
60
Surgery
12
Family Medicine
10
Anesthesia
10
Pediatrics3
21
Ob/Gyn
9
Emergency Medicine
10
Dermatology
1
Orthopedics
8
Ophthalmology
4
Radiology
8
Radiation Oncology
2
Psychiatry
4
Urology
3
Pathology
2
Otolaryngology
2
Neurology
3
Neurological Surgery
1
Transitional
5
Surgery-Plastic Surgery
1
Pediatrics-Prelim Neurology
1
Medicine-Pediatrics
3
Sites
District of Columbia:
George Washington University, DC (20)
Washington Hospital Center, DC (4)
Georgetown University, DC (2)
Childrens National Medical Center, DC (2)
Alaska:
Alaska Family Medical/Providence Hospital
Arizona:
Banner Good Samaritan Medical Center, AZ
University of Arizona Affiliated Hospitals, AZ
California:
Harbor-UCLA, CA (2)
Stanford University Program, CA (4)
UC San Francisco, CA (3)
Childrens Hospital, Los Angeles, CA
Kaiser Permanente Southern CA
Loma Linda University, CA
Santa Barbara Cottage Hospital, CA
USC, CA
UC Davis, Sacramento, CA
UC San Diego Medical Center, CA
UCLA, CA (3)
Santa Clara Valley Medical Center, CA
Cedars-Sinai Medical Center, CA
David Grant Medical Center, CA (2)
Colorado:
University of Colorado-Denver, CO
Connecticut:
Yale University, CT (5)
Florida:
Jackson Memorial Hospital, FL (3)
Orlando Health, FL
Georgia:
Emory University, GA (2)
Medical College of Georgia, Augusta, GA
Eisenhower Army Medical Center, GA
Hawaii:
Tripler Army Medical Center
Idaho:
Family Medicine Residency of Idaho
Illinois:
Loyola University Medical Center, IL (2)
Rush University Medical Center, IL (2)
McGaw Medical Center-Northwestern University, IL
Maryland:
University of Maryland Baltimore, MD (4)
University Of Maryland
Johns Hopkins, MD (3)
Johns Hopkins, Bayview, MD
Johns Hopkins, Sinai, MD
National Naval Medical Center, MD
NCC, Bethesda, MD
Massachusetts:
Boston University Medical Center, MA (6)
Tufts Medical Center (4)
Cambridge Health Alliance
Harvard Longwood Psychiatry, MA
Childrens Hospital Boston
Lemuel Shattuck Hospital, MA
Massachusetts General Hospital (2)
Beth Israel Deaconess Hospital, MA (2)
Michigan
Grand Rapids Medical Education, MI
Mississippi:
University Hospital, Jackson, MI
Missouri:
Barnes-Jewish Hospital, MO
New Hampshire:
Dartmouth-Hitchcock Medical Center, NH (4)
New York:
Mt. Sinai Hospital, NY (4)
NYP Hosptial/Columbia University (3)
NYP Hospital/Cornell, NY (5)
Einstein/Montefiore Medical Center, NY (2)
St. Lukes Roosevelt, NY
SUNY HSC, Brooklyn, NY
University Rochester/Strong Memorial, NY
NYU School of Medicine, NY
Westchester Medical Center, NY
Winthrop University Hospital, NY
Nassau University Medical Center, NY
University of Rochester
New Jersey:
UMDNJ Newark, NJ
North Carolina:
Wake Forest Baptist Medical Center, NC
Carolinas Medical Center
New Hanover Regional Medical Center, NC
Ohio:
Cincinnati Childrens Hospital Medical Center, OH (2)
Ohio State University, OH (2)
University Hospital Case Medical Center, OH (2)
Cleveland Clinic, OH
Case Western/Metro Health Medical Center, OH (2)
Pennsylvania:
Childrens Hospital, PA (3)
Hospital of the University of Pennsylvania, PA (2)
Lehigh Valley Hospital, PA
Temple University Hosptial, PA (2)
Thomas Jefferson University (3)
UPMC Medical Education Program, PA (2)
Western Pennsylvania Hospital, PA
Albert Einstein Medical Center, PA
Texas:
Baylor College Medical, Houston, TX
University of Texas, SW, Dallas, TX (2)
Virginia:
Virginia Commonwealth University, VA (2)
INOVA Fairfax Hosptial, VA
VCU Fairfax Family Medical Residency, VA
National Medical Center, Portsmouth, VA
Washington:
Madigan Army Medical Center, WA (2)
Wisconsin:
Medical College of Wisconsin Affiliated Hospitals
60
Surgery
12
Family Medicine
10
Anesthesia
10
Pediatrics3
21
Ob/Gyn
9
Emergency Medicine
10
Dermatology
1
Orthopedics
8
Ophthalmology
4
Radiology
8
Radiation Oncology
2
Psychiatry
4
Urology
3
Pathology
2
Otolaryngology
2
Neurology
3
Neurological Surgery
1
Transitional
5
Surgery-Plastic Surgery
1
Pediatrics-Prelim Neurology
1
Medicine-Pediatrics
3
Sites
District of Columbia:
George Washington University, DC (20)
Washington Hospital Center, DC (4)
Georgetown University, DC (2)
Childrens National Medical Center, DC (2)
Alaska:
Alaska Family Medical/Providence Hospital
Arizona:
Banner Good Samaritan Medical Center, AZ
University of Arizona Affiliated Hospitals, AZ
California:
Harbor-UCLA, CA (2)
Stanford University Program, CA (4)
UC San Francisco, CA (3)
Childrens Hospital, Los Angeles, CA
Kaiser Permanente Southern CA
Loma Linda University, CA
Santa Barbara Cottage Hospital, CA
USC, CA
UC Davis, Sacramento, CA
UC San Diego Medical Center, CA
UCLA, CA (3)
Santa Clara Valley Medical Center, CA
Cedars-Sinai Medical Center, CA
David Grant Medical Center, CA (2)
Colorado:
University of Colorado-Denver, CO
Connecticut:
Yale University, CT (5)
Florida:
Jackson Memorial Hospital, FL (3)
Orlando Health, FL
Georgia:
Emory University, GA (2)
Medical College of Georgia, Augusta, GA
Eisenhower Army Medical Center, GA
Hawaii:
Tripler Army Medical Center
Idaho:
Family Medicine Residency of Idaho
Illinois:
Loyola University Medical Center, IL (2)
Rush University Medical Center, IL (2)
McGaw Medical Center-Northwestern University, IL
Maryland:
University of Maryland Baltimore, MD (4)
University Of Maryland
Johns Hopkins, MD (3)
Johns Hopkins, Bayview, MD
Johns Hopkins, Sinai, MD
National Naval Medical Center, MD
NCC, Bethesda, MD
Massachusetts:
Boston University Medical Center, MA (6)
Tufts Medical Center (4)
Cambridge Health Alliance
Harvard Longwood Psychiatry, MA
Childrens Hospital Boston
Lemuel Shattuck Hospital, MA
Massachusetts General Hospital (2)
Beth Israel Deaconess Hospital, MA (2)
Michigan
Grand Rapids Medical Education, MI
Mississippi:
University Hospital, Jackson, MI
Missouri:
Barnes-Jewish Hospital, MO
New Hampshire:
Dartmouth-Hitchcock Medical Center, NH (4)
New York:
Mt. Sinai Hospital, NY (4)
NYP Hosptial/Columbia University (3)
NYP Hospital/Cornell, NY (5)
Einstein/Montefiore Medical Center, NY (2)
St. Lukes Roosevelt, NY
SUNY HSC, Brooklyn, NY
University Rochester/Strong Memorial, NY
NYU School of Medicine, NY
Westchester Medical Center, NY
Winthrop University Hospital, NY
Nassau University Medical Center, NY
University of Rochester
New Jersey:
UMDNJ Newark, NJ
North Carolina:
Wake Forest Baptist Medical Center, NC
Carolinas Medical Center
New Hanover Regional Medical Center, NC
Ohio:
Cincinnati Childrens Hospital Medical Center, OH (2)
Ohio State University, OH (2)
University Hospital Case Medical Center, OH (2)
Cleveland Clinic, OH
Case Western/Metro Health Medical Center, OH (2)
Pennsylvania:
Childrens Hospital, PA (3)
Hospital of the University of Pennsylvania, PA (2)
Lehigh Valley Hospital, PA
Temple University Hosptial, PA (2)
Thomas Jefferson University (3)
UPMC Medical Education Program, PA (2)
Western Pennsylvania Hospital, PA
Albert Einstein Medical Center, PA
Texas:
Baylor College Medical, Houston, TX
University of Texas, SW, Dallas, TX (2)
Virginia:
Virginia Commonwealth University, VA (2)
INOVA Fairfax Hosptial, VA
VCU Fairfax Family Medical Residency, VA
National Medical Center, Portsmouth, VA
Washington:
Madigan Army Medical Center, WA (2)
Wisconsin:
Medical College of Wisconsin Affiliated Hospitals
Some of these "malignant" places also have incredible training. I know people who would prefer to go to the residency where they will get the best training, regardless of whether or not the program is "malignant".
"U.S. seniors who graduated from top 40 NIH research intensive medical schools and who preferred the competitive specialties had median predicted probabilities of match success of .98 compared to .97 for graduates of other medical schools. Being a graduate of a top 40 NIH research medical school was not a significant predictor of match success for U.S. seniors who preferred highly competitive specialties."
The two problems with that statement are:
#1 - The top 40 out of how many med schools? Like 120ish? So... that's comparing the top 1/3 with the bottom 2/3... I'd be more interested if it looked at like the top 20, which are the only ones that seem to have any "prestige" or name recognition associated with them anyway.
#2 - Success at matching says nothing about where you were offered interviews, or where you ended up matching. Of course, matching > not matching, but most people have some preference as to where they'd like to go.
And those people are idiots, or just very naive.
Lots of the people who want to go to medical school have been told their entire lives to sacrifice themselves for the good of others. They have never learned to properly care for themselves, and that is one reason why there is such rampant depression and suicide among medical students and residents.
I understand the importance of working hard, but not to the point of torturing yourself.
I understand the importance of working hard, but not to the point of torturing yourself.
As already pointed out, some people simply aren't bothered by it. My home program has several residency programs that have been labeled "malignant", and why I could see how some people may not want to deal with it, I don't think it would have bothered me that much.
But looking at a match list, you don't know if that person ranked a malignant program low and just feel that far, or if they're ever so excited to bear that cross. So even if some people are the latter, it's a moot point.
I would also venture that one has no idea what a malignant program is like until one lives it on a daily basis for 3-5 years.
ANESTHESIOLOGY
Loyola Univ Med Ctr-IL IL Anesthesiology
Univ of Chicago Med Ctr-IL IL Anesthesiology
UCLA Medical Center-CA CA Anesthesiology
U Washington Affil Hosps WA Anesthesiology
PGY2 Virginia Mason Med Ctr-WA WA Anesthesiology
PGY2 Northwestern McGaw/NMH/VA-IL IL Anesthesiology
Northwestern McGaw/NMH/VA-IL IL Anesthesiology
PGY2 Northwestern McGaw/NMH/VA-IL IL Anesthesiology
DERMATOLOGY
PGY2 Univ of Chicago Med Ctr-IL IL Dermatology
PGY2 Mayo School of Grad Med Educ-MNMN Dermatology
EMERGENCY MEDICINE
Harbor-UCLA Med Ctr-CA CA Emergency Medicine
Northwestern McGaw/NMH/VA-IL IL Emergency Medicine
Univ of Chicago Med Ctr-IL IL Emergency Medicine
Hennepin Co Med Ctr-MN MN Emergency Medicine
FAMILY MEDICINE
UC San Francisco-CA CA Family Medicine
GENERAL SURGERY
Brigham & Womens Hosp-MA MA General Surgery
NYU School Of Medicine NY General Surgery
Univ of Chicago Med Ctr-IL IL General Surgery
U Washington Affil Hosps WA General Surgery
Howard Univ Hosp-DC DC General Surgery
SUNY Upstate Med University NY General Surgery
Yale-New Haven Hosp-CT CT General Surgery
Univ of Chicago Med Ctr-IL IL General Surgery
INTERNAL MEDICINE
Hosp of the Univ of PA PA Internal Medicine
NYP Hosp-Columbia Univ Med Ctr-NNY Internal Medicine
Hosp of the Univ of PA PA Internal Medicine
Stanford Univ Progs-CA CA Internal Medicine
Univ of Chicago Med Ctr-IL IL Internal Medicine
Univ of Chicago Med Ctr-IL IL Internal Medicine
Stanford Univ Progs-CA CA Internal Medicine
Massachusetts Gen Hosp MA Internal Medicine
NYU School Of Medicine NY Internal Medicine
George Washington Univ-DC DC Internal Medicine
Winthrop-Univ Hosp-NY NY Internal Medicine
Emory Univ SOM-GA GA Internal Medicine
Mayo School of Grad Med Educ-MNMN Internal Medicine
NYU School Of Medicine NY Internal Medicine
Northwestern McGaw/NMH/VA-IL IL Internal Medicine
Northwestern McGaw/NMH/VA-IL IL Internal Medicine
University of Hawaii HI Internal Medicine
Santa Clara Valley MC-CA CA Internal Medicine
Hosp of the Univ of PA PA Internal Medicine
Barnes-Jewish Hosp-MO MO Internal Medicine
U Texas SW Med Sch-Dallas TX Internal Medicine
B I Deaconess Med Ctr-MA MA Internal Medicine
University of Virginia VA Internal Medicine
U Texas SW Med Sch-Dallas TX Internal Medicine
NYP Hosp-Columbia Univ Med Ctr-NNY Internal Medicine
U Utah Affil Hospitals UT Internal Medicine
Barnes-Jewish Hosp-MO MO Internal Medicine
U Michigan Hosps-Ann Arbor MI Internal Medicine
NEUROLOGICAL SURGERY
Rush University Med Ctr-IL IL Neurological Surgery
OB/GYN
U Illinois COM-Chicago IL Obstetrics-Gynecology
Loyola Univ Med Ctr-IL IL Obstetrics-Gynecology
Meharry/Metro General-TN TN Obstetrics-Gynecology
Yale-New Haven Hosp-CT CT Obstetrics-Gynecology
Johns Hopkins Hosp-MD MD Obstetrics-Gynecology
OPHTHALMOLOGY
PGY2 Med College Wisconsin WI Ophthalmology
PGY2 Baylor College of Medicine TX Ophthalmology
ORTHOPAEDIC SURGERY
Univ of Chicago Med Ctr-IL IL Orthopaedic Surgery
Detroit Med Ctr Corporation-MI MI Orthopaedic Surgery
Mt Sinai Hospital-NY NY Orthopaedic Surgery
UC San Francisco-CA CA Orthopaedic Surgery
U Colorado SOM-Denver CO Orthopaedic Surgery
Univ of Chicago Med Ctr-IL IL Orthopaedic Surgery
Univ of Chicago Med Ctr-IL IL Orthopaedic Surgery
U Utah Affil Hospitals UT Orthopaedic Surgery
Baylor Coll Med-Houston-TX TX Orthopaedic Surgery
OTOLARYNGOLOGY
Loyola Univ Med Ctr-IL IL Otolaryngology
Univ of Chicago Med Ctr-IL IL Otolaryngology
PATHOLOGY
U Rochester/Strong Mem-NY NY Pathology
Univ of Chicago Med Ctr-IL IL Pathology
PEDIATRICS
Stanford Univ Progs-CA CA Pediatrics
Childrens Hosp-Philadelphia-PA PA Pediatrics
Stanford Univ Progs-CA CA Pediatrics
St Louis Childrens-MO MO Pediatrics
Johns Hopkins Hosp-MD MD Pediatrics
U Minnesota Med School MN Pediatrics
St Louis Childrens-MO MO Pediatrics
UC San Francisco-CA CA Pediatrics
Dartmouth-Hitchcock Med Ctr-NH NH Pediatrics
Med Coll Wisconsin Affil Hosps WI Pediatrics
UCLA Medical Center-CA CA Pediatrics
Advocate Christ Medical Center IL Pediatrics
Northwestern McGaw/CMH-IL IL Pediatrics
U Washington Affil Hosps WA Pediatrics
PLASTIC SURGERY
Univ of Chicago Med Ctr-IL IL Plastic Surgery
PSYCHIATRY
Northwestern McGaw/NMH/VA-IL IL Psychiatry
Cambridge Health Alliance MA Psychiatry
U Maryland Med Ctr MD Psychiatry
Univ of Chicago Med Ctr-IL IL Psychiatry
Univ of Chicago Med Ctr-IL IL Psychiatry
Massachusetts Gen Hosp MA Psychiatry
RADIOLOGY - ONCOLOGY
PGY2 Stanford Univ Progs-CA CA Radiation-Oncology
PGY2 Univ of Chicago Med Ctr-IL IL Radiation-Oncology
PGY2 Vanderbilt Univ Med Ctr-TN TN Radiation Oncology
RADIOLOGY - DIAGNOSTIC
PGY2 Barnes-Jewish Hosp-MO MO Radiology-Diagnostic
PGY2 Northwestern McGaw/NMH/VA-IL IL Radiology-Diagnostic
PGY2 U Michigan Hosps-Ann Arbor MI Radiology-Diagnostic
Univ of Chicago Med Ctr-IL IL Radiology-Diagnostic
PGY2 Brigham & Womens Hosp-MA MA Radiology-Diagnostic
PGY2 U Washington Affil Hosps WA Radiology-Diagnostic
PGY2 Stanford Univ Progs-CA CA Radiology-Diagnostic
PGY2 Duke Univ Med Ctr-NC NC Radiology-Diagnostic
UROLOGY
PGY2 Johns Hopkins Hosp-MD MD Urology
PGY2 UC San Diego Med Ctr-CA CA Surg-Prelim/Urology
Loyola Univ Med Ctr-IL IL Anesthesiology
Univ of Chicago Med Ctr-IL IL Anesthesiology
UCLA Medical Center-CA CA Anesthesiology
U Washington Affil Hosps WA Anesthesiology
PGY2 Virginia Mason Med Ctr-WA WA Anesthesiology
PGY2 Northwestern McGaw/NMH/VA-IL IL Anesthesiology
Northwestern McGaw/NMH/VA-IL IL Anesthesiology
PGY2 Northwestern McGaw/NMH/VA-IL IL Anesthesiology
DERMATOLOGY
PGY2 Univ of Chicago Med Ctr-IL IL Dermatology
PGY2 Mayo School of Grad Med Educ-MNMN Dermatology
EMERGENCY MEDICINE
Harbor-UCLA Med Ctr-CA CA Emergency Medicine
Northwestern McGaw/NMH/VA-IL IL Emergency Medicine
Univ of Chicago Med Ctr-IL IL Emergency Medicine
Hennepin Co Med Ctr-MN MN Emergency Medicine
FAMILY MEDICINE
UC San Francisco-CA CA Family Medicine
GENERAL SURGERY
Brigham & Womens Hosp-MA MA General Surgery
NYU School Of Medicine NY General Surgery
Univ of Chicago Med Ctr-IL IL General Surgery
U Washington Affil Hosps WA General Surgery
Howard Univ Hosp-DC DC General Surgery
SUNY Upstate Med University NY General Surgery
Yale-New Haven Hosp-CT CT General Surgery
Univ of Chicago Med Ctr-IL IL General Surgery
INTERNAL MEDICINE
Hosp of the Univ of PA PA Internal Medicine
NYP Hosp-Columbia Univ Med Ctr-NNY Internal Medicine
Hosp of the Univ of PA PA Internal Medicine
Stanford Univ Progs-CA CA Internal Medicine
Univ of Chicago Med Ctr-IL IL Internal Medicine
Univ of Chicago Med Ctr-IL IL Internal Medicine
Stanford Univ Progs-CA CA Internal Medicine
Massachusetts Gen Hosp MA Internal Medicine
NYU School Of Medicine NY Internal Medicine
George Washington Univ-DC DC Internal Medicine
Winthrop-Univ Hosp-NY NY Internal Medicine
Emory Univ SOM-GA GA Internal Medicine
Mayo School of Grad Med Educ-MNMN Internal Medicine
NYU School Of Medicine NY Internal Medicine
Northwestern McGaw/NMH/VA-IL IL Internal Medicine
Northwestern McGaw/NMH/VA-IL IL Internal Medicine
University of Hawaii HI Internal Medicine
Santa Clara Valley MC-CA CA Internal Medicine
Hosp of the Univ of PA PA Internal Medicine
Barnes-Jewish Hosp-MO MO Internal Medicine
U Texas SW Med Sch-Dallas TX Internal Medicine
B I Deaconess Med Ctr-MA MA Internal Medicine
University of Virginia VA Internal Medicine
U Texas SW Med Sch-Dallas TX Internal Medicine
NYP Hosp-Columbia Univ Med Ctr-NNY Internal Medicine
U Utah Affil Hospitals UT Internal Medicine
Barnes-Jewish Hosp-MO MO Internal Medicine
U Michigan Hosps-Ann Arbor MI Internal Medicine
NEUROLOGICAL SURGERY
Rush University Med Ctr-IL IL Neurological Surgery
OB/GYN
U Illinois COM-Chicago IL Obstetrics-Gynecology
Loyola Univ Med Ctr-IL IL Obstetrics-Gynecology
Meharry/Metro General-TN TN Obstetrics-Gynecology
Yale-New Haven Hosp-CT CT Obstetrics-Gynecology
Johns Hopkins Hosp-MD MD Obstetrics-Gynecology
OPHTHALMOLOGY
PGY2 Med College Wisconsin WI Ophthalmology
PGY2 Baylor College of Medicine TX Ophthalmology
ORTHOPAEDIC SURGERY
Univ of Chicago Med Ctr-IL IL Orthopaedic Surgery
Detroit Med Ctr Corporation-MI MI Orthopaedic Surgery
Mt Sinai Hospital-NY NY Orthopaedic Surgery
UC San Francisco-CA CA Orthopaedic Surgery
U Colorado SOM-Denver CO Orthopaedic Surgery
Univ of Chicago Med Ctr-IL IL Orthopaedic Surgery
Univ of Chicago Med Ctr-IL IL Orthopaedic Surgery
U Utah Affil Hospitals UT Orthopaedic Surgery
Baylor Coll Med-Houston-TX TX Orthopaedic Surgery
OTOLARYNGOLOGY
Loyola Univ Med Ctr-IL IL Otolaryngology
Univ of Chicago Med Ctr-IL IL Otolaryngology
PATHOLOGY
U Rochester/Strong Mem-NY NY Pathology
Univ of Chicago Med Ctr-IL IL Pathology
PEDIATRICS
Stanford Univ Progs-CA CA Pediatrics
Childrens Hosp-Philadelphia-PA PA Pediatrics
Stanford Univ Progs-CA CA Pediatrics
St Louis Childrens-MO MO Pediatrics
Johns Hopkins Hosp-MD MD Pediatrics
U Minnesota Med School MN Pediatrics
St Louis Childrens-MO MO Pediatrics
UC San Francisco-CA CA Pediatrics
Dartmouth-Hitchcock Med Ctr-NH NH Pediatrics
Med Coll Wisconsin Affil Hosps WI Pediatrics
UCLA Medical Center-CA CA Pediatrics
Advocate Christ Medical Center IL Pediatrics
Northwestern McGaw/CMH-IL IL Pediatrics
U Washington Affil Hosps WA Pediatrics
PLASTIC SURGERY
Univ of Chicago Med Ctr-IL IL Plastic Surgery
PSYCHIATRY
Northwestern McGaw/NMH/VA-IL IL Psychiatry
Cambridge Health Alliance MA Psychiatry
U Maryland Med Ctr MD Psychiatry
Univ of Chicago Med Ctr-IL IL Psychiatry
Univ of Chicago Med Ctr-IL IL Psychiatry
Massachusetts Gen Hosp MA Psychiatry
RADIOLOGY - ONCOLOGY
PGY2 Stanford Univ Progs-CA CA Radiation-Oncology
PGY2 Univ of Chicago Med Ctr-IL IL Radiation-Oncology
PGY2 Vanderbilt Univ Med Ctr-TN TN Radiation Oncology
RADIOLOGY - DIAGNOSTIC
PGY2 Barnes-Jewish Hosp-MO MO Radiology-Diagnostic
PGY2 Northwestern McGaw/NMH/VA-IL IL Radiology-Diagnostic
PGY2 U Michigan Hosps-Ann Arbor MI Radiology-Diagnostic
Univ of Chicago Med Ctr-IL IL Radiology-Diagnostic
PGY2 Brigham & Womens Hosp-MA MA Radiology-Diagnostic
PGY2 U Washington Affil Hosps WA Radiology-Diagnostic
PGY2 Stanford Univ Progs-CA CA Radiology-Diagnostic
PGY2 Duke Univ Med Ctr-NC NC Radiology-Diagnostic
UROLOGY
PGY2 Johns Hopkins Hosp-MD MD Urology
PGY2 UC San Diego Med Ctr-CA CA Surg-Prelim/Urology
University of Kentucky
Anesthesiology
U of KY (2)
Dermatology
Mayo - FL
Diagnostic Radiology
Univ Hosp Jackson MS
Indiana U
Jackson Memorial Hosp - FL
SIU - IL
Wash U - MO
Virginia Commonwealth
U of KY
Family Medicine
St Elizabeth Med Ctr - KY
West Suburban Med Ctr- IL
Ohio State U
St Francis Hosp - IN
Ball Memorial Hosp - IN
UT - Jackson
U of KY (2)
Bayfront Med Ctr - FL
Ft Collins Fam Med - CO
Emergency Medicine
U FL - Jacksonville
U of Louisville
Madigan Army Med Ctr - WA
U of KY (3)
West Virginia U
U IL - St Francis
U of Cincinnati
General Surgery
Hosp of St Raphael - CT
U of KY
Internal Medicine
Presbyterian Hosp - Dallas, TX
U of Virginia
Univ Hosp Jackson MS
U of KY (5 incl 3 primary-care track)
Medical U of SC
Washington U - MO
Ohio State U
UMDNJ-Piscataway - NJ
Duke
Tulane
Medicine-Pediatrics
U of KY (4)
Vanderbilt
UT-Memphis
Neurology
U of KY (2)
Vanderbilt U
Indiana U
Obstetrics and Gynecology
Univ Hosp Jackson MS
Drexel - PA
U of KY
Emory
Oral and Maxillofacial Surgery
U Florida-Jacksonville
Orthopedic Surgery
SIU - IL
U of KY (2)
UVM/Fletcher - VT
U of NM
McGill U
Univ Hosp Jackson MS
Pathology
U Michigan-Ann Arbor
U of KY
Stanford
Pediatrics
U of KY (2)
U of Louisville
Wright Patterson - OH
Wright State - OH
Stony Brook - NY
Physical Med and Rehab
U of KY
NCC-Walter Reed
Psychiatry
UC-San Francisco
U of KY (2)
Indiana U
U of Cincinnati
Radiation Oncology
Columbia
U of KY
Surgery - Preliminary
U Mass
Anesthesiology
U of KY (2)
Dermatology
Mayo - FL
Diagnostic Radiology
Univ Hosp Jackson MS
Indiana U
Jackson Memorial Hosp - FL
SIU - IL
Wash U - MO
Virginia Commonwealth
U of KY
Family Medicine
St Elizabeth Med Ctr - KY
West Suburban Med Ctr- IL
Ohio State U
St Francis Hosp - IN
Ball Memorial Hosp - IN
UT - Jackson
U of KY (2)
Bayfront Med Ctr - FL
Ft Collins Fam Med - CO
Emergency Medicine
U FL - Jacksonville
U of Louisville
Madigan Army Med Ctr - WA
U of KY (3)
West Virginia U
U IL - St Francis
U of Cincinnati
General Surgery
Hosp of St Raphael - CT
U of KY
Internal Medicine
Presbyterian Hosp - Dallas, TX
U of Virginia
Univ Hosp Jackson MS
U of KY (5 incl 3 primary-care track)
Medical U of SC
Washington U - MO
Ohio State U
UMDNJ-Piscataway - NJ
Duke
Tulane
Medicine-Pediatrics
U of KY (4)
Vanderbilt
UT-Memphis
Neurology
U of KY (2)
Vanderbilt U
Indiana U
Obstetrics and Gynecology
Univ Hosp Jackson MS
Drexel - PA
U of KY
Emory
Oral and Maxillofacial Surgery
U Florida-Jacksonville
Orthopedic Surgery
SIU - IL
U of KY (2)
UVM/Fletcher - VT
U of NM
McGill U
Univ Hosp Jackson MS
Pathology
U Michigan-Ann Arbor
U of KY
Stanford
Pediatrics
U of KY (2)
U of Louisville
Wright Patterson - OH
Wright State - OH
Stony Brook - NY
Physical Med and Rehab
U of KY
NCC-Walter Reed
Psychiatry
UC-San Francisco
U of KY (2)
Indiana U
U of Cincinnati
Radiation Oncology
Columbia
U of KY
Surgery - Preliminary
U Mass
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Anyone have the 2009 list for Mount Sinai, Jefferson, or NYU?
Anyone have Drexel's list?
University of Pittsburgh's Match List (UPMC):
Anesthesia (10):
Case
Hopkins
Mass General
UVA
Penn (2)
UPMC (3)
UCLA
Derm (4):
San Antonio Uniformed Services
Mass General
UPMC
Maryland
EM (18):
Brigham
Beth Israel Deaconess (2)
Hennepin
UPMC (7)
Penn
Michigan (2)
UVA
USC
UMDNJ
U. Chicago
Carolinas Medical Center
Family (10):
U. Wisconsin
Greater Lawrence, Lawrence, MA
Carolinas Medical Center
Oregon Health & Science
Swedish, Seattle, WA
Lancaster General
Brown/Memorial
U. Coloroda
UCSF
Belleville, IL
Internal Med (23):
Barnes-Jewish
UPMC (4)
UC-Davis
Northwestern
Michigan (3)
U. Washington (2)
Hopkins-Bayview
UCSF
U. Wisconsin
Mass. General
Emory (2)
NYU (2)
Loyola
UCLA
Mt. Sinai
Peds (10):
Emory
UPMC (2)
UCLA
Boston Childrens
Cincinnati
Med. Col. Wisc.
Northwestern
UT-Houston
U. Buffalo
Gen Surg (5):
Northwestern
LSU, New Orleans
Guthrie, Sayre, PA
Duke
Hopkins
Psyh (7):
Mass General
UPMC
Ny Presby (2)
UCLA
Mt. Sinai
Jackson Memorial, FL
Urology (4):
Michigan
Vanderbilt
Geisinger
UPMC
Neurology (5):
Stanford
Mass Gen (2)
UPMC
Northwester
Radiology (6):
U. Washington
UCLA
UPMC (2)
North Shore, NY
Med. Col. Wisonsin
Orthopedic Surgery (7):
UPMC (3)
Rochester/Strong
U. Mass.
Brown
Long Island Jewish
Ob/Gyn (9):
UPMC (3)
Minnesota
U. Washington
Yale
U. Mass.
Cincinnati
Rochester/Strong
Plastic Surgery (3):
UCSF
UPMC
Hershey
Otolaryngology (4):
UPMC
University of Minnesota
U. Washington
Hopkins
Opthalmology (3):
UPMC (2)
Stanford
OMFS (2):
UPMC (2)
Radiation Oncology (1):
U. Colorado
Pathology (1):
UPMC
Int Med/Womens Health (1):
UPMC
Neurologial Surgery (2):
UPMC
Barrow
Anesthesia (10):
Case
Hopkins
Mass General
UVA
Penn (2)
UPMC (3)
UCLA
Derm (4):
San Antonio Uniformed Services
Mass General
UPMC
Maryland
EM (18):
Brigham
Beth Israel Deaconess (2)
Hennepin
UPMC (7)
Penn
Michigan (2)
UVA
USC
UMDNJ
U. Chicago
Carolinas Medical Center
Family (10):
U. Wisconsin
Greater Lawrence, Lawrence, MA
Carolinas Medical Center
Oregon Health & Science
Swedish, Seattle, WA
Lancaster General
Brown/Memorial
U. Coloroda
UCSF
Belleville, IL
Internal Med (23):
Barnes-Jewish
UPMC (4)
UC-Davis
Northwestern
Michigan (3)
U. Washington (2)
Hopkins-Bayview
UCSF
U. Wisconsin
Mass. General
Emory (2)
NYU (2)
Loyola
UCLA
Mt. Sinai
Peds (10):
Emory
UPMC (2)
UCLA
Boston Childrens
Cincinnati
Med. Col. Wisc.
Northwestern
UT-Houston
U. Buffalo
Gen Surg (5):
Northwestern
LSU, New Orleans
Guthrie, Sayre, PA
Duke
Hopkins
Psyh (7):
Mass General
UPMC
Ny Presby (2)
UCLA
Mt. Sinai
Jackson Memorial, FL
Urology (4):
Michigan
Vanderbilt
Geisinger
UPMC
Neurology (5):
Stanford
Mass Gen (2)
UPMC
Northwester
Radiology (6):
U. Washington
UCLA
UPMC (2)
North Shore, NY
Med. Col. Wisonsin
Orthopedic Surgery (7):
UPMC (3)
Rochester/Strong
U. Mass.
Brown
Long Island Jewish
Ob/Gyn (9):
UPMC (3)
Minnesota
U. Washington
Yale
U. Mass.
Cincinnati
Rochester/Strong
Plastic Surgery (3):
UCSF
UPMC
Hershey
Otolaryngology (4):
UPMC
University of Minnesota
U. Washington
Hopkins
Opthalmology (3):
UPMC (2)
Stanford
OMFS (2):
UPMC (2)
Radiation Oncology (1):
U. Colorado
Pathology (1):
UPMC
Int Med/Womens Health (1):
UPMC
Neurologial Surgery (2):
UPMC
Barrow
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So not everyone got their releases in on time, thus some of the discrepancies in numbers listed and programs listed. Also, I have no idea what happened with the pediatrics listings (I have 7 programs listed for 6 people). I must have written down peds instead of path or something. And it says we have one family medicine match but it wasn't listed on the match list. But here it is, for the most part...
Anesthesiology - 9
Duke x 2
University of Washington
Brigham and Women's (Harvard)
Michigan
University of Virginia
Stanford
Massachussets General Hospital
Barnes-Jewish Hospital (Wash U in St. Louis)
Dermatology - 3
Barnes-Jewish (Wash U in St Louis)
Mayo
Stanford
Emergency Medicine - 6
Duke x 2
Mt. Sinai
UCLA
U of New Mexico
Ohio State
General Surgery - 5 categorical, 2 prelim
Duke
Wake Forest
UCLA
Stanford
UCSF
Washington Hospitals- DC
Naval Medical Center
Internal Medicine - 25
Duke x 6
Massachussets General Hospital x 2
Beth Israel Deaconess (Harvard) x 2
Brigham and Women's x 2
University of Washington x 2
Johns Hopkins
Stanford
Columbia
UT-Southwestern
Michigan
Pittsburgh Memorial
Internal Medicine-Pediatrics - 6
Duke x 3
Indiana
University of North Carolina
Michigan
Neurology- 1
UCSF
Neurosurgery - 4
Duke
Mayo
UCLA
NYU
Ob/Gyn
Einstein/Montefiore (NY)
Ophthalmology - 12
Duke x 2
Massachussets Eye and Ear x 2
Johns Hopkins x 2
New York Eye and Ear
Pitt
Howard
LSU
Wayne St.
NYMC
Orthopaedic Surgery - 4
Duke
Boston University
Carolinas Medical Center
Utah
Pathology - 5
Duke
UCSF
Columbia
University of Alabama-Birmingham
Pediatrics - 6?
Duke x 3
University of North Carolina
Children's Hospital- Philadelphia
Vanderbilt
LSU
Plastic Surgery - 1
Michigan
Psychiatry - 2
UT-Southwestern
Palmetto Health (SC)
Radiation Oncology - 1
University of Maryland
Radiology - 10
Duke x 2
University of Southern California
Johns Hopkins
Stanford
U Miami- Jackson Memorial
Michigan x 2
Medical University of South Carolina
Emory
Consulting -1
Boston Consulting Group
-hahaha, sorry. I had to put this in there.
Anesthesiology - 9
Duke x 2
University of Washington
Brigham and Women's (Harvard)
Michigan
University of Virginia
Stanford
Massachussets General Hospital
Barnes-Jewish Hospital (Wash U in St. Louis)
Dermatology - 3
Barnes-Jewish (Wash U in St Louis)
Mayo
Stanford
Emergency Medicine - 6
Duke x 2
Mt. Sinai
UCLA
U of New Mexico
Ohio State
General Surgery - 5 categorical, 2 prelim
Duke
Wake Forest
UCLA
Stanford
UCSF
Washington Hospitals- DC
Naval Medical Center
Internal Medicine - 25
Duke x 6
Massachussets General Hospital x 2
Beth Israel Deaconess (Harvard) x 2
Brigham and Women's x 2
University of Washington x 2
Johns Hopkins
Stanford
Columbia
UT-Southwestern
Michigan
Pittsburgh Memorial
Internal Medicine-Pediatrics - 6
Duke x 3
Indiana
University of North Carolina
Michigan
Neurology- 1
UCSF
Neurosurgery - 4
Duke
Mayo
UCLA
NYU
Ob/Gyn
Einstein/Montefiore (NY)
Ophthalmology - 12
Duke x 2
Massachussets Eye and Ear x 2
Johns Hopkins x 2
New York Eye and Ear
Pitt
Howard
LSU
Wayne St.
NYMC
Orthopaedic Surgery - 4
Duke
Boston University
Carolinas Medical Center
Utah
Pathology - 5
Duke
UCSF
Columbia
University of Alabama-Birmingham
Pediatrics - 6?
Duke x 3
University of North Carolina
Children's Hospital- Philadelphia
Vanderbilt
LSU
Plastic Surgery - 1
Michigan
Psychiatry - 2
UT-Southwestern
Palmetto Health (SC)
Radiation Oncology - 1
University of Maryland
Radiology - 10
Duke x 2
University of Southern California
Johns Hopkins
Stanford
U Miami- Jackson Memorial
Michigan x 2
Medical University of South Carolina
Emory
Consulting -1
Boston Consulting Group
-hahaha, sorry. I had to put this in there.
Last edited:
^^^
"That sound you hear is primary care slowly choking to death. That other sound you hear is people dying as unqualified providers try to fill the void. I don't blame anyone, because there is no way in hell I'm going into primary care as the situation is right now. It just doesn't make economic sense.
Kind of sad, I think."
-meister
Btw, this is one of my favorite quotes on SDN.
"That sound you hear is primary care slowly choking to death. That other sound you hear is people dying as unqualified providers try to fill the void. I don't blame anyone, because there is no way in hell I'm going into primary care as the situation is right now. It just doesn't make economic sense.
Kind of sad, I think."
-meister
Btw, this is one of my favorite quotes on SDN.
Yep. My school is not a primary care-focused school, I have never pretended otherwise.
Also, it depends on the year.
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Here's UCSD.
Unless 20 applied?
My understanding is that 13 applied, 12 entered the match (one decided on a different field after interviews). My year will probably be another big year in ophtho...not really sure why, the eye creeps me out personally.
Edit: and I think originally 17 planned on ophtho but 4 opted out prior to application season.
Last edited:
lol
Beauty is in the eye of the beholder. There! I said it.
I am glad I am not the only person in our class who thinks the eye is gross!
yah. I see what you are saying. There seems to be less involved in the eye then say the brain or heart. I think the brain is the most fascinating organ, followed by the heart.
