- Joined
- Dec 16, 2009
- Messages
- 25
- Reaction score
- 0
What materials do we need for oup apps for CH? Do we need letters, essays, and transcripts?
Maybe someone knows form last year?
Maybe someone knows form last year?
2010-2011 Internship Thread
- Thread starter cmuhooligan
- Start date
Go here: http://www.appic.org/clearinghouse/6_1_clearinghouse_applicants.html#accessing
They list it all out on that site. But, to sum it up quickly: initially you need just you CV, cover letter is optional (10 page limit total). But, you may need ur AAPI, LORs and DCT Verification upon sites' requests.
I would def read through the link I sent you. It's dense and I am only about half way thus far.
Good luck!
- Joined
- Oct 7, 2006
- Messages
- 22,380
- Reaction score
- 4,315
I wanted to second this sentiment. I know the first time I went through the process I was crushed and I felt like a failure. There is good news is that it can still work out. I went to CH, and there were solid sites to be had. There was a top consortium, a number of solid hospitals, some counseling centers, etc. My offers weren't the right fit....but many good people found sites.
I used the next year to round out my training, and it landed me a great site. I'm happy to say that I'm now fielding offers from some top post-docs, most of which probably wouldn't be contacting me if I didn't put in that extra year. I'm not saying it was easy to see most of my friends leave for internship, but now I know that it worked out for the best.
As for those people who matched....enjoy it, as your next year will FLY by. If people in your program didn't match...it can REALLY help to offer support, because they'll be rushing around trying to gather themselves for Monday. Last year a friend of mine picked up some food for her friends, and that was one less thing for them to worry about.
Last edited:
The assumption that CH sites will only consider those in their geopraphic region is incorrect. I know 2 people from my program in FL that got sites through CH in CA and Nevada. Hope this helps!
- Joined
- Jan 11, 2008
- Messages
- 23
- Reaction score
- 0
I matched and I am relieved 
Congratulations to those who matched!!!
For those who didn't match I extend my good thoughts for CH!!!
Congratulations to those who matched!!!
For those who didn't match I extend my good thoughts for CH!!!
- Joined
- May 18, 2008
- Messages
- 13
- Reaction score
- 0
How many people in your programs matched/didn't match? I feel like the numbers for people unmatched seems to be growing...
I've been getting somewhat contradictory advice about this, so I wanted to see what you all thought. With respect to personalizing cover letters or emails to sites in order to apply for Clearinghouse, what is the best way to go about this? Should you write personal emails regarding your training or aspects of fit and then attach a generic cover letter and vita or should you try to personalize each cover letter and just attach it to a blank/generic email to the TD? Any thoughts?
Of 5 students I was the only one in my program who did not match. I heard through my DCT that an anticipated 30% of applicants would not match this year.
I also assume the imbalance between sites and applicants has increased this year, but don't know by how much.
According to the instructions for CH, sites do NOT expect a personalized cover letter. In fact, it isn't even required! However, the say the best thing is to have a few generics ready (ex: one for children, one for adults, etc). Also, from what I have heard from ppl via the intern network, in past years people have not taken the time to make personalized cover letters and have gotten placed.
Remember: Monday morning goes VERY fast!
Hope that helps!
As someone who has been on the receiving end of Clearinghouse, I would say compose a concise email naming your strengths and interests and attach your c.v. (and ref letters if allowed.) Cover letters tend to all sound the same after the first 3 and no one expects disappointed Match candidates to write stunning and personalized ones at this stage. I think most sites are skimming to find c.v.s that match their needs and may look at refs briefly, then move on to getting pdf APPIs via email from good-fit candidates.
I don't know about other sites, but I'd say if you can convey a sense of humor and optimism at this stage and keep the email brief and to the point that wouldn't be all bad either. Sites are in an easier situation at this point than you are, but they aren't all that happy to be plowing through CH either.
I don't know about other sites, but I'd say if you can convey a sense of humor and optimism at this stage and keep the email brief and to the point that wouldn't be all bad either. Sites are in an easier situation at this point than you are, but they aren't all that happy to be plowing through CH either.
The advice I've received is that the CH moves rapidly, and so you will need to, as well. There will be a great deal of postings, especially early Monday. Also, many sites will move quickly to approach a "good" applicant, without necessarily waiting to select the best possible applicant.
Your best bet (again from advice I've been given), may be to prep a cover letter for each of the types of sites to which you expect to apply (e.g., counseling center, VA hospital, inpatient psych unit, etc.). Then add your vita and create a single document that can be distributed at a moment's notice. Whether you have time to customize these documents to an individual program may depend on how selective you are (e.g., APA/CPA accreditation, program setting) in applying.
Be sure to check out the APPIC clearinghouse site (an earlier post today provided the web address) for official submission guidelines and recommendations. Best wishes!
- Joined
- Oct 7, 2006
- Messages
- 22,380
- Reaction score
- 4,315
Absolutely. This was my first year reviewing internship applications, and the cover letters were almost exactly the same, which made them hard to follow....I blame that APPIC book about internship.
I paid much closer attention to the person's CV and APPI. Like docma said, sites are looking for the nuts and bolts, and colorful writing is nice, but CH is about finding the best fit....first.
So running an internship program takes a fair investment of administrative time and $$$...
I had always figured that once I land my first job, I'll be happy to let others take care of the administrative details involved in training the next generation. Let them deal with the accreditation visits, sift through the stacks of applications, and coordinate scores of interviews, year in and year out. As for me, I'll enjoy meeting the applicants over refreshments at the department social.
That is, until I received my "Do Not pass go, Do Not collect $200" notice from the match service...
After probably 10 minutes staring at the computer screen, I felt (along with acute disappointment and embarrassment) a growing sense of injustice--angry--angry about the shortage of training relevant to my career goals (peds neuropsych). Angry to find myself at the losing end of 6-to-1, even 9-to-1 odds for landing spots at the excellent sites where I interviewed. Angry to have invested so much of my own energy and $$$ to brave these odds and return unrewarded.
Why aren't there more peds neuro internship tracks at hospitals? I asked myself. In the APPIC directory, I sure saw a lot of hospitals listed that offered only adult neuro tracks, or hospitals without any neuro track at all. What's up with that? Surely these hospitals have neuropsychologists, right? They have medical departments that rely on neuropyschologists?!? Why aren't they offering training?
Well, I'm sure the answer is in many cases complicated and related to funding. But perhaps in some cases it's at least in part due to lack of awareness of a general training shortage and the effect it has on the students who are "left behind" (or at least temporarily stranded).
So, here's how I'm feeling now...If I find myself someday at a hospital without an accredited program in my specialty, I think I'll be a little more apt to ask the question, "so why don't we have a peds neuro internship program here...?" And by golly, even though our department may not have a prestigious name, we'll find a way to set up a high quality training program that keeps some poor sap on track to achieve the career of his or her dreams.
Anyone else (whatever their hoped-for career track may be) with similar feelings?
I had always figured that once I land my first job, I'll be happy to let others take care of the administrative details involved in training the next generation. Let them deal with the accreditation visits, sift through the stacks of applications, and coordinate scores of interviews, year in and year out. As for me, I'll enjoy meeting the applicants over refreshments at the department social.
That is, until I received my "Do Not pass go, Do Not collect $200" notice from the match service...
After probably 10 minutes staring at the computer screen, I felt (along with acute disappointment and embarrassment) a growing sense of injustice--angry--angry about the shortage of training relevant to my career goals (peds neuropsych). Angry to find myself at the losing end of 6-to-1, even 9-to-1 odds for landing spots at the excellent sites where I interviewed. Angry to have invested so much of my own energy and $$$ to brave these odds and return unrewarded.
Why aren't there more peds neuro internship tracks at hospitals? I asked myself. In the APPIC directory, I sure saw a lot of hospitals listed that offered only adult neuro tracks, or hospitals without any neuro track at all. What's up with that? Surely these hospitals have neuropsychologists, right? They have medical departments that rely on neuropyschologists?!? Why aren't they offering training?
Well, I'm sure the answer is in many cases complicated and related to funding. But perhaps in some cases it's at least in part due to lack of awareness of a general training shortage and the effect it has on the students who are "left behind" (or at least temporarily stranded).
So, here's how I'm feeling now...If I find myself someday at a hospital without an accredited program in my specialty, I think I'll be a little more apt to ask the question, "so why don't we have a peds neuro internship program here...?" And by golly, even though our department may not have a prestigious name, we'll find a way to set up a high quality training program that keeps some poor sap on track to achieve the career of his or her dreams.
Anyone else (whatever their hoped-for career track may be) with similar feelings?
Last edited:
- Joined
- Oct 7, 2006
- Messages
- 22,380
- Reaction score
- 4,315
I am definitely concerned about the internship process. I can definitely understand your frustration with peds neuro, as there only seem to be a handful open at any given time.
I went through the internship process for the first time as a training program, and it was much more involved that I realized. If given the opportunity to run an internship program, I'd probably run the other way.
It takes a great deal of time, effort, and patience....and I think I lack all three in the amounts needed to do it right.This is true, especially if TD's are expected to carry administrative duties on top of a full clinical workload. Despite my aspirations, I'm not sure I'm efficient enough to do both, either, if the funding support for administrative hours isn't available.
- Joined
- Oct 22, 2009
- Messages
- 107
- Reaction score
- 0
I am definitely concerned about the internship process. I can definitely understand your frustration with peds neuro, as there only seem to be a handful open at any given time.
I went through the internship process for the first time as a training program, and it was much more involved that I realized. If given the opportunity to run an internship program, I'd probably run the other way.
It is a bumpy ride right now but after the rain there's always sunshine.
Last edited:
- Joined
- Jan 11, 2008
- Messages
- 23
- Reaction score
- 0
We only had 3 students including myself in the match this year and all three matched. Last year 3 students matched, 1 student received a position during CH, and 1 person didn't match.
- Joined
- Feb 21, 2010
- Messages
- 9
- Reaction score
- 0
Does anyone have a copy of the list from last years clearinghouse? I ask because it might give clues as to internships that potentially will be on this year's clearing house.
I'm a devistated fiance of a PhD canididate that did not match. we are due to be married in less than two months, and I want to assist her to the best of my ability.
I'm a devistated fiance of a PhD canididate that did not match. we are due to be married in less than two months, and I want to assist her to the best of my ability.
- Joined
- Oct 7, 2006
- Messages
- 22,380
- Reaction score
- 4,315
Unfortunately there is no rhyme or reason to who will be included on the list Monday. I'm sure if someone aggregated the last 10 years they'd see some trends, but realistically there isn't a way to hedge bets as to which sites will appear.
I'd recommend reading a couple pages back, as there were some good recommendations for how applicants can best tackle Clearing House.
7 out of 8 of us matched this year in my program (clinical). Even though we did pretty well, my advisor went on a rant to me about the injustices of the process and told me that our generation needs to change the system
I told him I'd do my best...I attend a relatively large program, and haven't talked to everyone who applied (nor have I been keeping close track since recieving my bad news), but I would say I have heard from about 10 people. Of those, 6 (including yours truly) didn't match, while 4 did.
D
deleted106747
We had an unusually large group applying this year because some people came in with MA degrees and didn't have to do all the coursework, and some people from the year ahead of us waited a year to finish dissertation & get more experience before applying. Of 9 people, 5 matched, 4 didn't.
Dr2B' resilient problem solving focus is admirable. And the "fix" for the current problem definitely needs to be long range. Many possible training sites, especially those who are primarily public-funded, like CMHCs and public hospitals, simply cannot afford the administrative and stipend costs. They do have the potential to provide excellent training experiences and supervision.
I believe that all accredited academic programs should have to fund consortia and support the APA accreditation process for internship positions in their geographic area--and in a number equal to the number of students they admit each year that are not fully-funded.
But until APA and the schools step up in this regard everyone is stuck with this unethical inequity.
I believe that all accredited academic programs should have to fund consortia and support the APA accreditation process for internship positions in their geographic area--and in a number equal to the number of students they admit each year that are not fully-funded.
But until APA and the schools step up in this regard everyone is stuck with this unethical inequity.
- Joined
- Jan 15, 2005
- Messages
- 312
- Reaction score
- 2
We had 8 of 9 match this year, which is fairly typical for my program.
- Joined
- Oct 7, 2006
- Messages
- 22,380
- Reaction score
- 4,315
That's an interesting twist, as typically the solutions proposed are demand side. For a few years I've been looking into the internship process, part of which includes addressing the imbalance and also funding. I don't want to write everything here because I'm looking to draft a manuscript on the topic, but suffice to say there are some things that can be done, and if left unchecked we are going to tank our profession for decades to come.
- Joined
- Aug 14, 2008
- Messages
- 1,179
- Reaction score
- 5
I agree 100%. The academic programs need to step in here. They make plenty of money from their students; it's time they help shoulder the burden of ensuring sufficient accredited internships. It's the right thing to do.
- Joined
- Oct 7, 2006
- Messages
- 22,380
- Reaction score
- 4,315
Just an FYI that came across on the APPIC listserv:
APA sites have gone through a formal accreditation process, which involves submitting extensive documentation that then qualifies you for a site visit and, if all criterion are met, accreditation. This means that an outside APA committee had determined that the site's program meets all of the APA accreditation requirements. Sites pay a fee to apply, a fee for a site visit, and then annual accreditation fees and they must be able to guarantee a minimum stipend for all interns.
All APA accredited pre-doctoral sites are also APPIC members, I believe.
APPIC is a membership organization and runs the Match as well as a range of other programs specifically supporting training and internship sites. Training sites become APPIC members by submitting documentation that they meet all the APPIC site requirements (see the website; they parallel APA guidelines and meet a broad array of licensing standards). Programs have to renew membership regularly and pay an annual membership fee that covers participation in the Match. They are required to regularly submit documentation that they meet standards but they do not receive site visits and do not have a minimum required stipend.
Most APPIC, non-APA sites would be interested in APA standing but can't afford the costs, I believe. They often can provide excellent training, but lack the status APA provides. There are lot of discussions here and a useful FAQ on the APPIC website about the advantages of APA. Meanwhile, APPIC, non APA sites remain a viable path to completing the degree and to licensure.
All APA accredited pre-doctoral sites are also APPIC members, I believe.
APPIC is a membership organization and runs the Match as well as a range of other programs specifically supporting training and internship sites. Training sites become APPIC members by submitting documentation that they meet all the APPIC site requirements (see the website; they parallel APA guidelines and meet a broad array of licensing standards). Programs have to renew membership regularly and pay an annual membership fee that covers participation in the Match. They are required to regularly submit documentation that they meet standards but they do not receive site visits and do not have a minimum required stipend.
Most APPIC, non-APA sites would be interested in APA standing but can't afford the costs, I believe. They often can provide excellent training, but lack the status APA provides. There are lot of discussions here and a useful FAQ on the APPIC website about the advantages of APA. Meanwhile, APPIC, non APA sites remain a viable path to completing the degree and to licensure.
- Joined
- Oct 7, 2006
- Messages
- 22,380
- Reaction score
- 4,315
This is what I've been told by multiple DCTs. The challenge with APA-acred for an internship site is primarily a resource issue. The man hours needed to complete the application is extensive, as well as the money needed to accommodate the various requirements of the APA. I was involved with a re-acred and the documentation required was extensive, and the process took almost a year. I was impressed by the thoroughness, though I wish APA-acred. for programs was as effective.
Your average CMHC doesn't have the resources to spend hundreds of man hours on the process, in addition to the fees and related costs. The additional cost (from APPIC--> APA) is a HARD sell to the funding source because every dollar spent on the process is one less dollar spent on services. Additionally, a training program will cost more than it brings in, so it really takes dedicated people to get, keep, and continue a program because it doesn't make financial sense at most places. Training is a really important part to our profession, and we provide a great deal of services to the community, though at the end of the day someone needs to agree to pay for it.
Pharm.D.'s have a guaranteed internship, which actually includes rotations at multiple sites, but does not pay. Initially I am resistant to not being paid for another year. However, when you consider that some sites pay as little as $15,000 and the max is usually around $30,000 (unless you do military, prison, etc), and doing an extra year of school if you do not match probably costs around $25,000 (assuming a reduced course load, etc, since it is an extra year), then: taking an extra year, followed by a paid internship would actually potentially cause you to be more in dept than if you simply took a non-paying internship the first year.
This is not an argument for taking an APPIC internship, as many people (myself included) feel more comfortable knowing the program has gone through the rigamarole of getting APA accredited. However, perhaps this is an argument for APA not requiring a minimum stipend if the field can not provide APA accredited internships for everyone when it is required.
I wonder, if other fields have figured out how to do provide internships to all students, why have we not more closely tried to mirror their strategies??
Just my thoughts
Pharm.D.'s have a guaranteed internship, which actually includes rotations at multiple sites, but does not pay. Initially I am resistant to not being paid for another year. However, when you consider that some sites pay as little as $15,000 and the max is usually around $30,000 (unless you do military, prison, etc), and doing an extra year of school if you do not match probably costs around $25,000 (assuming a reduced course load, etc, since it is an extra year), then: taking an extra year, followed by a paid internship would actually potentially cause you to be more in dept than if you simply took a non-paying internship the first year.
Hello IsItOver,
There are quite a few suggestions on how to remedy the internship fiasco, but here's an important one that is relevant to the individual student:
Nevermind the imbalance, the funding issues, the difficulty of getting sites APA accredited, etc. Those issues will take years to work out. Much longer than you will probably be in school (hopefully).
Here's the big question, and it pertains to everyone who did not match:
"Do you know why you did not match?"
If you can provide an affirmative answer to this question then ask yourself this one:
"Are you absolutely sure?"
Most will only be able to speculate on these answers and solving this lack of transparency is the best solution that APA can provide to students in the short-term.
I have no illusions about this process. Some of the most creative, original people did not match and will have to explain for a year to others that they did not match. When others ask and you have to shrug your shoulders and murmur "imbalance issues" no one on the outside will understand what you are talking about.
I wish everyone who did not match the best of luck tomorrow. I've been there before and it's unpleasant but necessary at this point.
- Joined
- Dec 13, 2009
- Messages
- 2
- Reaction score
- 0
Does
Last edited:
- Joined
- Dec 14, 2009
- Messages
- 46
- Reaction score
- 0
You should try to get an APA site because it is accredited by the APA and many state licensing boards require an APA internship. An Appic member is any agency who wants to list a position.
- Joined
- Jul 26, 2009
- Messages
- 58
- Reaction score
- 1
The Clearinghouse sites are listed by state and I believe they have a link to the site's page in the APPIC directory.
There are definite advantages to having an APA internship but it is not accurate that states require it for licensure.
For a long time Oklahoma and Mississippi required APA, all other states did not. Currently it does not appear that OK or MI require APA either.
See the APPIC website FAQ item 17 for information on APA vs. APPIC.
It is also not accurate that APPIC is "any" agency that wants to list a position. Also see the APPIC site for more information on this.
For a long time Oklahoma and Mississippi required APA, all other states did not. Currently it does not appear that OK or MI require APA either.
See the APPIC website FAQ item 17 for information on APA vs. APPIC.
It is also not accurate that APPIC is "any" agency that wants to list a position. Also see the APPIC site for more information on this.
7 out of 8 of us matched this year in my program (clinical). Even though we did pretty well, my advisor went on a rant to me about the injustices of the process and told me that our generation needs to change the system
He is absolutely correct. The system is a failure.
Not necessarily...my top ranked choice (*fingers crossed for tomorrow morning*) is an APA-accredited site but is not an APPIC member. Even though they participate in the "match" you can't find them by searching the APPIC guide. I only mention this because it would be a shame to not apply to a site just because it is not an APPIC member, but may be a great site. I have no idea why they choose to not go through APPIC membership.
- Joined
- Feb 9, 2007
- Messages
- 120
- Reaction score
- 0
How do you find out about sites that aren't listed on the APPIC website? Also, don't the sites have to pay some kind of fees to participate in the match? Are there different levels of membership or something, with some only taking part in the match?
I'm not sure about the different levels - that might be the case with this site. I'm sure they do have to pay a fee to participate in the match. I volunteered at the site as an undergrad and heard about the internship there. When I looked them up in the APPIC guide this summer I didn't see them and just figured that they stopped having interns, but then I went to their website and found their brochure and application materials there. Made me wonder how many other sites are out there that people might not know about...
- Joined
- Dec 11, 2009
- Messages
- 3
- Reaction score
- 0
I wish you all much luck in the CH tomorrow. Keep your head up and stay positive. You can and will make it through this process. There will be light at the end of your tunnel...your tunnel just may be a little longer than you had hoped. I am truly sorry that this has to be part of your graduate school experience. Although this may not mean much from a stranger, my thoughts will be with all of you tomorrow.
- Joined
- Jan 29, 2010
- Messages
- 111
- Reaction score
- 0
I'm sure most people going through the CH have heard about this by now, but apparently the listserv is NOT going to be reliable to receive postings in a timely manner. Here is an excerpt of Greg Keilin's email of what you should do instead if you're going through the CH:
-----
We have established an alternate approach that will allow you to view the Clearinghouse e-mail postings in a timely manner, without any delay, and without using e-mail. You may access Clearinghouse postings using the "web interface" simply by entering the following into your internet browser:
http://lyris.appic.org/read/?forum=clearinghouse
You will be taken immediately to a list of all messages that have been posted to the Clearinghouse list, with the most recent posting appearing at the top. Simply use the "reload" button in your browser to update the list. Once the Clearinghouse opens on Monday morning, we recommend leaving this page active in a browser window and pressing "reload" every 5-10 minutes to update the list with the latest postings.
-----
Best of luck to all going through the CH process tomorrow (or today!). For those who matched, would love to hear about your results (e.g. whether you got your first/second/third choice, what type of internship program, etc.)
-----
We have established an alternate approach that will allow you to view the Clearinghouse e-mail postings in a timely manner, without any delay, and without using e-mail. You may access Clearinghouse postings using the "web interface" simply by entering the following into your internet browser:
http://lyris.appic.org/read/?forum=clearinghouse
You will be taken immediately to a list of all messages that have been posted to the Clearinghouse list, with the most recent posting appearing at the top. Simply use the "reload" button in your browser to update the list. Once the Clearinghouse opens on Monday morning, we recommend leaving this page active in a browser window and pressing "reload" every 5-10 minutes to update the list with the latest postings.
-----
Best of luck to all going through the CH process tomorrow (or today!). For those who matched, would love to hear about your results (e.g. whether you got your first/second/third choice, what type of internship program, etc.)
- Joined
- Feb 19, 2010
- Messages
- 4
- Reaction score
- 0
New Jersey VA here I come....wohooo!
- Joined
- Jan 29, 2010
- Messages
- 111
- Reaction score
- 0
Congrats Psychdoc! That was one of my top choices.
I got a VA too in the Northeast... I am pretty satisfied since it's my top choice in terms of professional development as a clinician AND researcher, and I definitely wanted to work in the VA system. Still processing mixed feelings though, because it'll be strange to leave a place I've been for so long, my friends and people who are important to me...
I got a VA too in the Northeast... I am pretty satisfied since it's my top choice in terms of professional development as a clinician AND researcher, and I definitely wanted to work in the VA system. Still processing mixed feelings though, because it'll be strange to leave a place I've been for so long, my friends and people who are important to me...
- Joined
- Oct 7, 2006
- Messages
- 22,380
- Reaction score
- 4,315
While i am slightly biased....the VA system can be a great place to work.Congrats Psychdoc! That was one of my top choices.
I got a VA too in the Northeast... I am pretty satisfied since it's my top choice in terms of professional development as a clinician AND researcher, and I definitely wanted to work in the VA system. Still processing mixed feelings though, because it'll be strange to leave a place I've been for so long, my friends and people who are important to me...
Congrats to both of you!!
For those of you with VA knowledge, I do not have the required 500 hours of face to face. At this point, going through Clearing House, is it worth still applying to VA sites. I have extensive trauma experience in my work history and my dissertation is on PTSD...thoughts?
- Joined
- Oct 7, 2006
- Messages
- 22,380
- Reaction score
- 4,315
I don't think that'd be a mandatory cut, though each site is different. I would think it is worth applying to, though don't only apply to VA sites.
Here is some relevant data from the 2010 statistics. While it can't be assumed that every unmatched position will go to CH, I think it is a safe bet that at least 70 will. I posted this here for the CH people, any discussion about that stats should be directed to the 2010 Internship Match Statistics thread.
APA or CPA Accredited Positions:
Filled in the Match 2,246 (97%)
Remaining Unfilled 74 (3%)
Total 2,320
Non-Accredited Positions
Filled in the Match 577 (70%)
Remaining Unfilled 204 (30%)
Total 781
