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Anyone know of some neurosurg training programs that are still 6 years? It seems like there's been a big push in recent years to go to 7....anyone know of any holdouts?
6-year N-surg Programs
- Thread starter lipoyl
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I too have been looking around: it seems that the trend everywhere is going to 7 years, which just seems painful, especially considering the call, etc.
Searching through the websites of places in the midwest, I have found these that are still 6 years, though one wonders how long it would last: U of Illinois at Peoria, Vanderbilt, U of Virginia, U of Chicago. The following are all 7: U Minnesota, Mayo, U Cincinnati, Case Western, Cleveland Clinic, Ohio State, U Wisc, Medical College Wisconsin, U Michigan.
Does anyone know why it is moving to 7 years, seemingly everywhere?
Searching through the websites of places in the midwest, I have found these that are still 6 years, though one wonders how long it would last: U of Illinois at Peoria, Vanderbilt, U of Virginia, U of Chicago. The following are all 7: U Minnesota, Mayo, U Cincinnati, Case Western, Cleveland Clinic, Ohio State, U Wisc, Medical College Wisconsin, U Michigan.
Does anyone know why it is moving to 7 years, seemingly everywhere?
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I can say with almost 100% certainty that UVa is 7 years, and actually 8 years in many cases. John Jane likes to have his grads go to England/New Zealand for a year before becoming chief.
As far as why, I would imagine that it's a financial issue...most neurosurgery depts are cash cows, and having residents stay an extra year is another way of extracting cheap labor. I guess the upside (I hope) is that call will improve with the extra year of residents.
As far as why, I would imagine that it's a financial issue...most neurosurgery depts are cash cows, and having residents stay an extra year is another way of extracting cheap labor. I guess the upside (I hope) is that call will improve with the extra year of residents.
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the sad part is, that neurosurg is such a desired sought after residency that they could push it to 10 years and there would still probably be ample applicants ready to take it.
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When I matched a few years ago Baylor was 6 years. I still think they are...but it's never really six years. You do research, your a chief somewhere, there is all sorts of ways they extract more years out of you. It is always longer then you were ever told...that's the whole point.
That's why I cancelled my offer. I knew the truth before I started. Now almost every guy that matched my year, has left his program. Oh well, live and you learn.
That's why I cancelled my offer. I knew the truth before I started. Now almost every guy that matched my year, has left his program. Oh well, live and you learn.
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I've seen CVs of current neurosurgeons who do an internship in general surgery for one year and then go directly into a neurosurgery residency.
Is this "general surgery internship" a required part of the neurosurgery match process or is it indicative of those who applied for a general surgery residency, did the first year of general surgery internship, then decided to transfer into a neurosurgery residency.
Is it at all possible to transfer into a more specialized surgery (i.e. neurosurgery, orthoped surg, etc.) after being accepted into a "general surgery" residency?
Is this "general surgery internship" a required part of the neurosurgery match process or is it indicative of those who applied for a general surgery residency, did the first year of general surgery internship, then decided to transfer into a neurosurgery residency.
Is it at all possible to transfer into a more specialized surgery (i.e. neurosurgery, orthoped surg, etc.) after being accepted into a "general surgery" residency?
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Traditionally, neurosurgical programs have required a general surgery intern year before starting neurosurgical training as a PGY-2 (ie the match is for a PGY-2 neurosurgical spot). Nowadays however, more and more programs are integrating PGY-1 year with the rest of the training program to ease the transition into PGY-2, which is probably the most brutal year for many neurosurgery programs (bad call schedule, lots of floor work and little OR time).
I suppose it is possible to transfer into a subspecialty after being accepted to general surg. program alone, but keep in mind that most programs would have filled their spots by this time, so you'd really only be competing for a handful of programs that either didn't fill, or whose residents dropped out. The match rate for US grads is significantly lower than for US seniors for this reason.
I suppose it is possible to transfer into a subspecialty after being accepted to general surg. program alone, but keep in mind that most programs would have filled their spots by this time, so you'd really only be competing for a handful of programs that either didn't fill, or whose residents dropped out. The match rate for US grads is significantly lower than for US seniors for this reason.
To brownman (and others),
Scary what you said about almost everyone you know who matched having left his/her program...So by that you mean they left the field completely? Can you tell me a little more about your decision to refuse your offer? Regrets or relief in having made the right choice? And is the attrition rate really that high? Thanks
Scary what you said about almost everyone you know who matched having left his/her program...So by that you mean they left the field completely? Can you tell me a little more about your decision to refuse your offer? Regrets or relief in having made the right choice? And is the attrition rate really that high? Thanks
