A nurse is my preceptor on surgery rotation
Started by sylvanthus
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That was the case for me, usually. But I did have time to review the case and introduce myself to the patient, often in prep and holding. I didn't explore the opportunity of going to clinic.
Reading a quick H&P pretty much summed everything up for me in addition to looking at a scan or two. The post-operative period was important and I think you need that in order to learn surgical medicine. My pre-surgical medicine happened on my call nights where I was asked to do consults and then would be able to discuss if cases should be added to service.
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People asked what school and im sure most people were wondering which school
Not trying to stir things up..I would remove the last part of my comment but you quoted it.
Regardless, your situation, as stated in the OP, is unfortunate and I hope it works out
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This is PNWU we're talking about here, this is the norm. Start off by making lots of promises during interview, get you to put down a deposit, and then do just about everything else as half assed as possible. Oh and shove propaganda down your throat as you wish you could study for your exams and learn the material you know other students at other schools are learning. I'm not surprised that the third and fourth years were and are still obviously afterthoughts. The first year is and from the second year students I hear a lot of the same complaints. Just have to survive, work hard enough to get what you want/need on the boards and remember that this is just four years and it will end.
I don't see how this became an allopathic/osteopathic issue. This sounds plausible, he has a high post count, and no one is reporting anything out of the ordinary about him. Why would anyone doubt it?
The only possible way to read your statement is "I have a DO and I'm tired of people ragging on it, wah wah." Nobody was, stop being so sensitive.
It became a MD vs DO issue because there is no way that the LCME would allow a MD school to do this. Unfortunately, COCA doesn't seem to be as strict about the quality of rotations for the schools they accredit.
Update: My school apparently knows about it as another student also had this nurse as his preceptor, but shocker has neither done anything about it nor contacted me to discuss it. This does not surprise me in the least. Communication is EXTREMELY weak at my school. Ahh well, year and a half to go.
We return to your regularly scheduled DO bashing. Carry on.
We return to your regularly scheduled DO bashing. Carry on.
Could you whistleblow to the appropriate osteopathic accrediting agency? I would love to see what their reaction is.
Probably take action against the school, why would anyone want to jeopardize the accreditation of their school? that's just not smart.
If they do anything, unless the school is already on probation, I bet the worst that would happen is probation or a reprimand. But, it will force the school to take some action, and this costs them money.
The backlash against me would make it a very stupid thing to do.
+1 you would be hated by the school so much it would be ridiculous.
Wow. I've had bad preceptors before, but having a nurse as your preceptor has got to be an all time low for medical students. I don't feel like this is a MD/DO issue. It certainly isn't the norm at allopathic schools by any margin, but I don't feel like this situation happens with regularity at osteopathic schools either. The person in charge of setting up your rotations is doing a bad job. Poor administrators exist everywhere. Maybe with higher frequency at osteopathic schools? Who knows.
Obviously the person in charge of your rotations is doing their job in a grossly suboptimal manner and should be relieved but what can you do? If you go over their head, you open yourself up to their wrath. You have a lot to lose right now. You could stand on principle I guess or try having student government (lol) advocate on your behalf but I really don't think it's worth it.
If I were you, I'd make the best out of a terrible situation. Hog all the mundane stuff like starting IVs, getting ABG's, etc. Know all the H&P's, assessment's, plan of all the patients you see and do reading to see what the trends in management are. Be blunt with her and say things like: "Hey...I saw that the patient is 602 has pathology Y. I've read about it but I've never actually seen it be treated. Would you mind if I see if any of patient X's team needs help?" If she's hell bent on having you do stupid **** the entire time you're with her, there's nothing really you can do I guess but try to get away from her in a polite way as often as you can. If you're at a hospital with any decent teaching staff, hopefully one of them will go out on a limb for you. My first intubations/epidurals were from randomly wandering around the floor and bumping into another attending.
Best of luck!
Obviously the person in charge of your rotations is doing their job in a grossly suboptimal manner and should be relieved but what can you do? If you go over their head, you open yourself up to their wrath. You have a lot to lose right now. You could stand on principle I guess or try having student government (lol) advocate on your behalf but I really don't think it's worth it.
If I were you, I'd make the best out of a terrible situation. Hog all the mundane stuff like starting IVs, getting ABG's, etc. Know all the H&P's, assessment's, plan of all the patients you see and do reading to see what the trends in management are. Be blunt with her and say things like: "Hey...I saw that the patient is 602 has pathology Y. I've read about it but I've never actually seen it be treated. Would you mind if I see if any of patient X's team needs help?" If she's hell bent on having you do stupid **** the entire time you're with her, there's nothing really you can do I guess but try to get away from her in a polite way as often as you can. If you're at a hospital with any decent teaching staff, hopefully one of them will go out on a limb for you. My first intubations/epidurals were from randomly wandering around the floor and bumping into another attending.
Best of luck!
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is she hot?
Heh already answered that on the first page yo.
honestly...if the nurse is super hot and the hours are nice, I would just treat it like a 4-wk vacation block ;-)
This is not an acceptable situation; your education needs are not being met. And you are paying lots of $$$ so that your education needs are met.
Go first to the clerkship director, then escalate up the chain of command if needed. Noone is going to "get you" if you follow proper protocol and report things in a professional manner. Don't pre-judge anyone either; the clerkship director may not be aware of it for all you know.
Go first to the clerkship director, then escalate up the chain of command if needed. Noone is going to "get you" if you follow proper protocol and report things in a professional manner. Don't pre-judge anyone either; the clerkship director may not be aware of it for all you know.
That sucks. I learned the MOST on my surgery rotation by following patients from the pre-op clinic visit to the surgery and inpatient stay to the post-op clinic visits. Actually performing the surgery is but a small part of the experience.
Well, thanks for the feedback guys. Only have one more real day of surgery for this rotation and the rotation is over. Going to see what I can do to make the next rotation better.
No matter who your preceptor is, our how much your rotation sucks, you should always try to get the most out of your rotations. There is a lot that NPs can teach you, especially those with a lot of experience. Ultimately what you learn in medical school will depend on how proactive you are.
Not really sure where you are getting NP from. This is an RN. Also, could you state the obvious some more please?
At a certain point it's going to be time for this whole DO experiment to be ended
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Not even close. I can't believe you actually wrote that out with a straight face. The OR nurse puts on the SCDs, preps the field, charts a bunch of stuff about who/what/when is in the room, and gets more supplies as needed. Paraphrased, of course, but there's zero zip nada about determining who needs which operation and why, and how to manage them before, during and after.
If they're allowed to continue their lobbying DNPs will price a lot of the mediocre DO students out of the primary care market and as long as MD schools keep standards high, MD kids will generally out-compete DOs for the more competitive residencies.
For-profit domestic DO schools have the potential to do to medicine what the fly-by-nights have done to Law.
ok napoleon
Lol wut?
The LCME has been stepping up their game recently and putting a lot of schools on probation. 5 MD schools are currently on probation, several of them because of issues with rotations, and I can guarantee nothing close to this was happening at any of them.
Either COCA is OK with this sort of thing happening, or they aren't paying attention. From what I've heard from multiple sources about the quality of rotations at MD vs DO schools, it seems to be the former.
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