abortion taught in med school?

[neleponea]

Does anyone know which medical schools teach abortion procedures or expose you to surgical abortions during your ob/gyn rotations?

Thanks!

---

Members don't see this ad.

 

[yehhhboiii]

wtf...

 

[Doctor Strange]

 

[CooIBreeze]

u wot m8?

 

[Koalafied]

Does anyone know which medical schools teach abortion procedures or expose you to surgical abortions during your ob/gyn rotations?

Thanks!

Why do you ask?

 

[The Bunk]

Why do you want to know this?

 

[neleponea]

Why do you ask?

I'm interested in "community" medicine, possibly OB, and looking at schools that boast about service to underserved, urban areas, but I can't find any information about whether elective abortions are taught at all. I feel as if moonlighting in a family planning clinic during residency would be a good way to give back - I've always read about a shortage of abortion doctors. And either way, it's something I would like to learn about!

So, I would like to know: is this something I can learn about in medical school?

 

[Womb Raider]

nosy nosy ^^

 

[Goro]

Hazy as to which ones do it, but I know that some states require knowledge of abortion as a medical subject. No one will ever force you to do one, and, I suspect, watch one either.

Does anyone know which medical schools teach abortion procedures or expose you to surgical abortions during your ob/gyn rotations?

Thanks!

 

[neleponea]

Hazy as to which ones do it, but I know that some states require knowledge of abortion as a medical subject. No one will ever force you to do one, and, I suspect, watch one either.

Thanks for your answer, but I'm actually on the other side of the spectrum...

 

[DrBowtie]

Usually in residency type of thing unless you have an active MSFC organization.

 

[freakingoutabit]

I'm interested in "community" medicine, possibly OB, and looking at schools that boast about service to underserved, urban areas, but I can't find any information about whether elective abortions are taught at all. I feel as if moonlighting in a family planning clinic during residency would be a good way to give back - I've always read about a shortage of abortion doctors. And either way, it's something I would like to learn about!

So, I would like to know: is this something I can learn about in medical school?

I cannot imagine that you would have the licensure or training to do anything other than prescribe mifepristone when you start residency.

 

[psswrd]

I'm guessing that the more specific surgical stuff will be taught during residency. I can only guess but I'm sure the different methods of abortion could be discussed in med school. Wish I knew more.

I don't know why people act all surprised. Abortions are still done legally in this country. It's a legitimate question to ask if one is interested in helping those population in need of such services.

 

[neleponea]

Usually in residency type of thing unless you have an active MSFC organization.

THAT is really helpful. Just went to the MSFC site. So I guess if you want to learn that curriculum, you contact them or the school's chapter? It looks like most students do an MSFC externship in their 2nd or 4th that counts as an elective rotation.

Great! Looks like all my schools - even the ones I wouldn't expect - have a chapter. Thanks so much! (and thanks psswrd)

*** and to those users who made awkward comments at the beginning of this thread: grow up. it's a legal, medical procedure that 3 in 10 women will have over the course of their lifetimes. Why wouldn't I want to learn about it in MS?

 

[psswrd]

.

 

[freakingoutabit]

I'm guessing that the more specific surgical stuff will be taught during residency. I can only guess but I'm sure the different methods of abortion could be discussed in med school. Wish I knew more.

I don't know why people act all surprised. Abortions are still done legally in this country. It's a legitimate question to ask if one is interested in helping those population in need of such services.

*** and to those users who made awkward comments at the beginning of this thread: grow up. it's a legal, medical procedure that 3 in 10 women will have over the course of their lifetimes. Why wouldn't I want to learn about it in MS?

I think people seemed surprised because they assumed the OP was trying to avoid learning about abortions.

 

[redpanda]

Exposure to therapeutic abortion: yes. Actually doing the procedure: no. As a med student, your job is to be competent in procedures such as bimanual and speculum exams, Pap smears, and to sort of know something about how you could deliver a baby in a real pinch.

In our OB/GYN clerkship, there is an option to spend time at the local Planned Parenthood or in the OR when therapeutic abortions are performed. Unfortunately, our clerkship here is so short that I chose not to go because I needed more time to be competent at the things that everyone is tested on. The other option is to find a rotation with Med Students for Choice which can hook you up with a rotation with abortion providers around the country.

 

[Koalafied]

Ah... seems like we share similar views about "community" medicine.

I'm interested in "community" medicine, possibly OB, and looking at schools that boast about service to underserved, urban areas, but I can't find any information about whether elective abortions are taught at all. I feel as if moonlighting in a family planning clinic during residency would be a good way to give back - I've always read about a shortage of abortion doctors. And either way, it's something I would like to learn about!

EDIT:

I'm interested in "community" medicine, possibly OMFS, and looking at schools that boast about service to underserved, urban areas, but I can't find any information about whether craniofacial surgery are taught at all. I feel as if moonlighting in a family planning clinic during residency would be a good way to give back - I've always read about a shortage of OMFS doctors, especially female OMFS's. And either way, it's something I would like to learn about!

And that's meeeee!!!!! I prefer treating cleft lip and palate in the future.
And here are some pics of what my, hopefully if I become an OMFS that is, unfortunate-future patients may look like:

So, I would like to know: is this something I can learn about in medical school?

Broadly speaking, of course; anytime and anywhere in fact.

Anyhooo.... awwww they're soooo adorable I just want to treat their unfortunate facial cleft and palate. They have such a bright future ahead of them don't you think?

 

[Pipers]

Does anyone know which medical schools teach abortion procedures or expose you to surgical abortions during your ob/gyn rotations?

Thanks!

It is not necessarily related to the medical school. If you just want lecture instruction, schools generally have to teach the subject because it is a lawful medical procedure. Keep in mind, though, that this won't consume a lot of teaching time compared to other reproductive contents they have to teach.

As far as clinical exposure, it is obviously depends on whether or not the Ob/Gyn dept has faculty that do abortions. If the Ob/Gyn dept at your institution has a family planning fellowship or faculty with such credentials, then most likely yes. Otherwise it could be difficult to know - most people don't publicly scream that they do abortions. Another way to maybe (maybe maybe) get some insight into this is to figure out how many abortion providers are in the area. If you go to med school in south dakota, you will get no exposure. Come to California, however, and we have many more providers.

Another option is to find a Planned Parenthood in the area and make connections with those providers. Network and maybe get exposure that way.

 

[Pipers]

I cannot imagine that you would have the licensure or training to do anything other than prescribe mifepristone when you start residency.

Interns at my hospital are doing abortions. The attendings are, of course, present in the OR. Someone has to sign your Rx until you get your license anyways (around 2nd year), so most interns don't/can't moonlight.

 

[freakingoutabit]

Interns at my hospital are doing abortions. The attendings are, of course, present in the OR. Someone has to sign your Rx until you get your license anyways (around 2nd year), so most interns don't/can't moonlight.

I understand that, but doing abortions as a moonlighting doctor? I'd be very surprised if a resident* was allowed to do that (unless they received outside extra training).

*assuming they were allowed to moonlight at all

 

[MadRadLad]

Not to derail the topic, but is moonlighting technically illegal or is it just frowned upon from a legal perspective?

 

[KnuxNole]

Not to derail the topic, but is moonlighting technically illegal or is it just frowned upon from a legal perspective?

Moonlighting as a resident isn't illegal.

 

[freakingoutabit]

Not to derail the topic, but is moonlighting technically illegal or is it just frowned upon from a legal perspective?

Depends on the licensing requirements in your state and the rules of the your residency program. If your state and program allow it, it wouldn't be illegal or frowned upon.

 

[calvnandhobbs68]

Just checked out MSFC as well. Looks like they provide training for both med students and residents.

And,

They don't exactly teach you how to do a D+C...it's more like educate people about birth control and abortion options.

Anyway, you don't really learn about them the first two years because, pathophysiologically, there's not much to talk about.

 

[Pipers]

I understand that, but doing abortions as a moonlighting doctor? I'd be very surprised if a resident* was allowed to do that (unless they received outside extra training).

*assuming they were allowed to moonlight at all

Yeah I'm just saying that Ob/Gyn interns do get OR time for D&Cs. Whether or not a facility lets them moonlight later on as a PGY2-4, I don't know. I'm curious enough to ask my Ob/Gyn resident friends.

 

[ur2l8]

THAT is really helpful. Just went to the MSFC site. So I guess if you want to learn that curriculum, you contact them or the school's chapter? It looks like most students do an MSFC externship in their 2nd or 4th that counts as an elective rotation.

Great! Looks like all my schools - even the ones I wouldn't expect - have a chapter. Thanks so much! (and thanks psswrd)

*** and to those users who made awkward comments at the beginning of this thread: grow up. it's a legal, medical procedure that 3 in 10 women will have over the course of their lifetimes. Why wouldn't I want to learn about it in MS?

Because, murder.

 

[URHere]

They don't exactly teach you how to do a D+C...it's more like educate people about birth control and abortion options.

My school's MSFC chapter hosted a conference during my MS1 year and they had several procedural stations (including a D+C practice station on Papayas, and a vasectomy station with little tubing units).

Of course it isn't equivalent to real patient-based learning, but it was certainly enlightening.

 

[khrisskhoras]

I know that some states require knowledge of abortion as a medical subject.

probably some socialist state like mass or RI

 

[487806]

probably some socialist state like mass or RI

... why did you quote a spam post?

 

[khrisskhoras]

... why did you quote a spam post?

im the most interesting man in the world

"I dont always quote posts, but when I do I prefer spam posts....keep posting, my friends"

 

[gettheleadout]

Because, murder.

Here we go...

 

[Wordead]

My school's MSFC chapter hosted a conference during my MS1 year and they had several procedural stations (including a D+C practice station on Papayas, and a vasectomy station with little tubing units).

Of course it isn't equivalent to real patient-based learning, but it was certainly enlightening.

Our chapter had this too. It was pretty interesting.

You can contact local docs that do it and ask to let you be involved, though. The people interested in womens health or OB did that.

 

[deleted407021]

Here we go...

I don't know if you agree with it or not but our society should not condone the killing of human beings in a social setting ie. abortion and execution. It destroys the potential of those individuals and sets an unnerving standard for our society's progression. We shouldn't let the killing of unborn people become anymore normal than it, unfortunately, already is.

 

[487806]

I don't know if you agree with it or not but our society should not condone the killing of human beings in a social setting ie. abortion and execution. It destroys the potential of those individuals and sets an unnerving standard for our society's progression. We shouldn't let the killing of unborn people become anymore normal than it, unfortunately, already is.

How is this related to the purpose of the thread? I agree with you, but the New Left sentiment politicizes science, but discussion of such matter is reserved for the lounge.

 

[circulus vitios]

I don't know if you agree with it or not but our society should not condone the killing of human beings in a social setting ie. abortion and execution. It destroys the potential of those individuals and sets an unnerving standard for our society's progression. We shouldn't let the killing of unborn people become anymore normal than it, unfortunately, already is.

Cool, thanks for debating someone who doesn't exist.

 

[deleted407021]

How is this related to the purpose of the thread? I agree with you, but the New Left sentiment politicizes science, but discussion of such matter is reserved for the lounge.

Don't let it bother you. I was directing my post to a specific quote. Additionally, the last thing we should do is politicize science, however, we should go about our investigations and implementations with a respect for life, especially human life. Otherwise, like I said, we are setting an unnerving path for progression.

 

[touchpause13]

I'm very interested in this as well but aside from msfc I don't think we can get any real exposure before residency

 

[KnuxNole]

Here we go...

I always shake my head at people who have that extremist view...

 

[Wordead]

I'm very interested in this as well but aside from msfc I don't think we can get any real exposure before residency

You can get exposure to literally any procedure you want as a medical student. You just need to find a helpful doctor in a hospital you have privileges in. Some will let you do more than others.

 

[touchpause13]

You can get exposure to literally any procedure you want as a medical student. You just need to find a helpful doctor in a hospital you have privileges in. Some will let you do more than others.

Thanks I will keep that in mind

 

[Donald Juan]

I don't know if you agree with it or not but our society should not condone the killing of human beings in a social setting ie. abortion and execution. It destroys the potential of those individuals and sets an unnerving standard for our society's progression. We shouldn't let the killing of unborn people become anymore normal than it, unfortunately, already is.

I guess you think discussing the probable outcomes of an anencephalic child or a child with Edward's syndrome with the parents and informing them of their legal medical options in a private room is the same as condoning murder in a "social setting."

 

[khrisskhoras]

I guess you think discussing the probable outcomes of an anencephalic child or a child with Edward's syndrome with the parents and informing them of their legal medical options in a private room is the same as condoning murder in a "social setting."

Yes, because responsible parents-to-be would follow through with their decision to have the child, regardless of consequences (unless the woman's life becomes at risk during the pregnancy). An anencephalic child has as much a right to live as a healthy child.

 

[Donald Juan]

Yes, because responsible parents-to-be would follow through with their decision to have the child, regardless of consequences (unless the woman's life becomes at risk during the pregnancy). An anencephalic child has as much a right to live as a healthy child.

....anancephalic infants don't live. It's not about "rights," it's about what God decided He wanted for the child, and some children He doesn't want to have brains. Things aren't always black and white.

 

[RogueUnicorn]

How is this related to the purpose of the thread? I agree with you, but the New Left sentiment politicizes science, but discussion of such matter is reserved for the lounge.

Yes, because responsible parents-to-be would follow through with their decision to have the child, regardless of consequences (unless the woman's life becomes at risk during the pregnancy). An anencephalic child has as much a right to live as a healthy child.

bro do you know what anencephalic means?

 

[deleted407021]

....anancephalic infants don't live. It's not about "rights," it's about what God decided He wanted for the child, and some children He doesn't want to have brains. Things aren't always black and white.

That is not a scientific argument, though I do understand that anencephalic children do not survive. All humans have the right to life, that is established. Killing an infant, even if that infant's chance of survival is almost non existent should not be acceptable as it sets a bad path for progression as I have stated twice already. Killing people in a social setting (aside from self defense) ie. outside of warfare, should not be a societal institution we foster.

 

[yehhhboiii]

Yes, because responsible parents-to-be would follow through with their decision to have the child, regardless of consequences (unless the woman's life becomes at risk during the pregnancy). An anencephalic child has as much a right to live as a healthy child.

lol no one has a right to live
everyone else is just tolerating your existence temporarily

 

[touchpause13]

My cousin (who is on welfare and food stamps) had a child who had trisomy, and not the kind that gives you downs. She found out at 20 weeks. The doctors didn't think it would make it to birth. The infant lived for 5 months. Over the course of her miserable life she had 2 surgeries and was hooked up to tubes that did I don't know what. All this girl knew was pain. What kind of a life is that? Because my white trash cousin said do everything you can to the doctors, Medicaid has the bill. How is what she did the ethical decision? Now she has a dead kid and another who is probably freakin traumatized by the whole ordeal.

 

[Donald Juan]

That is not a scientific argument, though I do understand that anencephalic children do not survive. All humans have the right to life, that is established. Killing an infant, even if that infant's chance of survival is almost non existent should not be acceptable as it sets a bad path for progression as I have stated twice already. Killing people in a social setting (aside from self defense) ie. outside of warfare, should not be a societal institution we foster.

Of course, I wasn't trying to be scientific. If you want to be scientific, noone in the medical field openly states it is acceptable to kill an infant.

I'll assume you say "killing an infant" as a mistake, not to try and evoke emotion into a genuine discussion.

 

[Doctor Strange]

So... This is going to turn into an abortion debate, isn't it?