Adding an MD to your PharmD

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PharmacyHopeful4life

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Hey guys, long time luker here. What do you guys think? Do the two degrees complement each other? I have a 3.8 GPA w/ my pharmD (rho chi blah blah). I have done alot of community volunteering including doing community service events in underserved populations (organizing and initiating). I did research in pharmacy school on 2 different projects as well as research on 1 project in undergrad and have one publication from my research in pharm school. Also I did a medical missions trip while in pharm school and have a bunch more volunteering activities. I have a BS in biology (3.3 gpa that I completed about 5 years ago). Also my mcat score is a 30 (10, 10, 10). Do you guys think I have a good chance? Is it worth it in this day and age to pursue medicine even though I have a pharmD and job? Thanks for any insight!

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Hey guys, long time luker here. What do you guys think? Do the two degrees complement each other? I have a 3.8 GPA w/ my pharmD (rho chi blah blah). I have done alot of community volunteering including doing community service events in underserved populations (organizing and initiating). I did research in pharmacy school on 2 different projects as well as research on 1 project in undergrad and have one publication from my research in pharm school. Also I did a medical missions trip while in pharm school and have a bunch more volunteering activities. I have a BS in biology (3.3 gpa that I completed about 5 years ago). Also my mcat score is a 30 (10, 10, 10). Do you guys think I have a good chance? Is it worth it in this day and age to pursue medicine even though I have a pharmD and job? Thanks for any insight!

HAHA stop making up things. This was posted just a few months ago in the
"University of Maryland Eastern Shore (UMES) School of Pharmacy" thread:

I really wanted to apply to this pharmacy school, but I have a pcat of 31 and a GPA of 2.71. Based on the previous posts I think I stand a great chance at this school. ShockingPurple, do you think I have a chance?

This is the kind of students that pharmacy schools are now attracting?
 
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I've worked with two PharmD/MD practitioners....really the MD supplants the PharmD aspect of it because of the fact that physicians pretty much have unlimited license to practice medicine.

It did make them extremely knowledgable about the minutiae of kinetics and the workflows of outpatient/inpatient pharmacy, but I personally don't think it's worth the time and expense unless you were in an accelerated 5-6yr program right out of HS.
 
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I'm confused. Are you a pre-pharm, pharmacist, pre-med, or some combination?
 
I've worked with two PharmD/MD practitioners....really the MD supplants the PharmD aspect of it because of the fact that physicians pretty much have unlimited license to practice medicine.

It did make them extremely knowledgable about the minutiae of kinetics and the workflows of outpatient/inpatient pharmacy, but I personally don't think it's worth the time and expense unless you were in an accelerated 5-6yr program right out of HS.

Yeah, the pharmacist/MD combos I know are only practicing medicine. And they all went to pharmacy school in undergraduate (they are older, so they are BSPharm degree holders).
 
I know of two MD RPh (not PharmDs) as well - 1 anesthesiologist and 1 cardiologist. Both only do their respective MD responsibilities (why would they not? They both make triple to quadruple what they would as pharmacists). It depends on what you want to do in medicine - an anesthesiologist only deals with a few drugs, so all of the pharm knowledge you gain in PharmD school is practically unnecessary. Cardiology - same, few drugs. However, if your goal is IM, FP, or to be knowledgable about the entire health care spectrum, yes having a PharmD background will help with that. But, what I usually see/experience are individuals who have gone through PharmD and decide for one reason or another that their true passion is medicine so they go on to MD school (Not pursue PharmD as a via point to their MD for the sake of having both doctorates).
 
Having a PharmD gpa and being in RhoChi it can be inferred that he/she is at least a P3 (5th year of 6 year program, or 7th year of 8 year program). It sounds like he/she is a practicing pharmacist.

The post history is throwing me off.

OP, with a 3.3 and a 30 MCAT it will probably be difficult for you to get into any MD school. I would say that you are probably very competitive for DO schools, though.
 
Oh BMBiology, I knew I would get your attention. The post history isnt accurate as I was trolling on the other thread lol. I am 1 year out of PharmD school. As far as my GPA...the last 2 years of undergrad I had a 3.9 average but the first 2 years were pretty bad (from screwing around). But my BS is really old, actually more like 7 years ago. I dont see how med schools would look at a gpa so old vs a PharmD degree (way harder) w/ a 3.7 out of 150 credits. Anyway I would love to do DO as well. I just feel really limited with all this knowledge that I have to be able to practice the way that I want. Would it be feasible to do part time retail as well as full time MD/DO school? I was really interested in anesthesiology or possibly IM. Anyway I just wanted to get some feedback if this is a really bad plan financially or if I would eventually come out even. Not that money matters to me I just don't want to see my family suffer b/c I want to attend MD school. Thanks for any feedback! No more replies BMBiology!
 
Bad plan financially. You sacrifice 4 years of income for school and add in the cost of tuition. Your loans from pharm school continue to accrue interest. You get paid minimum wage while in residency for at least another 3 years during which your loans still accrue interest. In the end, to become a doc, it will take you at least 7 years and a ton of money. No feasible to work more than 10 hrs a week while in school and if you have a family, then you'd never see them.

Med schools care about your undergrad GPA way more than a pharmd since that's the constant between applicants.
 
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I am 1 year out of PharmD school. As far as my GPA...the last 2 years of undergrad I had a 3.9 average but the first 2 years were pretty bad (from screwing around). But my BS is really old, actually more like 7 years ago. I dont see how med schools would look at a gpa so old vs a PharmD degree (way harder) w/ a 3.7 out of 150 credits.

You have to check with each individual school whether they will accept the pre-reqs from undergrad. Some will have a cut off that they cannot be taken more than 5 or 7 years ago, but I would guess most do not have any cut off. If there is no cutoff, then it doesn't matter how old your undergrad grades are, especially since you have recent academic experience (PharmD). As far as GPA goes, MD schools do not care at all what your PharmD grades were if your undergrad grades were subpar. A 3.3 with a 30 mcat will not likely get you any MD interviews. DO schools on the other hand will care slightly about your PharmD grades, but undergrad is still more important.

Anyway I would love to do DO as well. I just feel really limited with all this knowledge that I have to be able to practice the way that I want.

You are competitive for DO school. I had similar stats to yours when I switched from PharmD to DO and got interviews at 3 out of the 4 places I applied. However, I would say that your essays, volunteer experience, letters of recommendation, interview ability, and exposure to osteopathic medicine will make or break you. You need to shadow a DO for a while and get a letter of recommendation from a DO to apply to almost all DO schools. Even if schools don't "require" the DO letter, it's still *very* important, so you might as well get one. I think you have a valid reason for wanting to switch to medicine, it is the same reason I switched: you have all this knowledge but can't use it, and don't want your scope of practice to be limited.

Would it be feasible to do part time retail as well as full time MD/DO school? I was really interested in anesthesiology or possibly IM. Anyway I just wanted to get some feedback if this is a really bad plan financially or if I would eventually come out even. Not that money matters to me I just don't want to see my family suffer b/c I want to attend MD school. Thanks for any feedback! No more replies BMBiology!

Ok, while it may technically be feasible to do part time retail pharmacy during med school the first 2 years if you are a strong student (meaning you can score in the top 25% of med/pharm students on exams while exerting in the bottom 25% of time and effort), it's not worth it and I wouldn't recommend it.

Anesthesiology would be a great choice for you with your pharm background, or IM if you want a fuller spectrum of medical experience. Now, I know some people are going to tell your this is a terrible financial decision, but I'll tell you it's not, unless maybe if you go into primary care and don't or can't take advantage of PAYE/PSLF. Pharmacists make maybe $120-$140k right. MGMA data from 2012 puts the median anesthesiologist salary at $427k and Today's Hospitalist puts the average hospitalist pay for IM at $252k. DO schools are expensive, especially when you factor cost of living into loans, you could finish residency with an additional $400k of debt, but either use PAYE/PSLF if you need it, or pay them off quickly with an extra $100-200k in salary versus what you likely would make as a pharmacist. You would break even financially eventually, probably ~10 years post-residency, depending on what specialty you go into, how much loans, and whether you take advantage of PAYE/PSLF or not. But most importantly, you should do what makes you happy and provides for your family the best.
 
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Go post on the pre-med forums. There you will find a wealth of information about the application process for med school. A 3.3 undergrad GPA and 30 MCAT makes you nNOT-competitive for MD schools. Many schools will only look at undergrad GPA because it evens the playing field for comparison. Plus if your MCAT is more than 3 years old you have to retake it. you're fine for DO.
 
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It may be a bad decision financially. At least for quite a while until the added MD/DO income catches up to the lost years of pharm income. However, if you think that a career in medicine will make you more fulfilled, happier, whatever, then I think you should give it a shot. I know of plenty of people that switched from other careers at an assumed financial loss.

Also, I would caution against looking at MGMA numbers and thinking that those are going to be what you see when you hit the market in 10 or so years. Just throwing that out there.
 
Money wise:

It's not necessarily a bad decision financially in the long run - just in the short term. You will technically be able to work per diem/moonlighting as RPh to generate some income (having a family, does your wife work, too?). The anesthesiologist I worked with was an RPh in practice for 10 years then decided to take an MCAT review class, take MCAT, apply for MD and got accepted at a state school. If you pick a high paying specialty you will end up breaking even if you work for at least 10 years, which it sounds like you will (no calculation behind this, just logic). Yes, if you have loans, you will continue to gain interest with a reduced ability to pay them off, and gain more loans if you don't obtain a scholarship (so go to the cheapest MD school you can go to, or cheapest DO). You also accrue opportunity cost of being able to contribute to a 401K/IRAs if you (or if you have a working spouse) is unable to generate enough income to contribute to them. Also, it may be difficult to find a per diem/part time RPh position.

Life wise:

You will have a big time burden from going back and trying to work part time RPh. You said "my family" in one of your posts - I think more than suffering from loss of income they would suffer from loss of your time. That being said, whenever I've talked with someone who had a family and went through MD/other professional school, they all have said that their children grew to respect and honor their parent's decision greatly because they really looked up to them for furthering themselves. Question is, can you live with the reduced time with them?

Career wise:

Will you only be fulfilled by going back to school? The anesthesiologist I referenced felt this way, did it, and is doing just fine now. You'll be fine financially in the end, especially only being one year out - its just a question of what you want to do ultimately and if your family can incur the time loss burden. Good luck on your decision!
 
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If you get into high paying MD specialties, it will be worth it. If you go into ped/family, I'd make the same if not more than you with salary + investment return after 7-10 years (4 yr MD + residency). Loss income opportunity is around $1-1.3M for MD training. Going back to school will probably net you -$250-300k extra in student loan, and more if you have a family you fully supported. If you try to moonlight, your grade will suffer and you'd probably end up being in a low paying specialty. So, damned if you do, damned if you don't. If you calculate a break even point, it will be after 10-20 years after becoming an attending. If you choose a bad specialty, you'll never break even after 30-40 years.
 
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If you get into high paying MD specialties, it will be worth it. If you go into ped/family, I'd make the same if not more than you with salary + investment return after 7-10 years (4 yr MD + residency). Loss income opportunity is around $1-1.3M for MD training. Going back to school will probably net you -$250-300k extra in student loan, and more if you have a family you fully supported. If you try to moonlight, your grade will suffer and you'd probably end up being in a low paying specialty. So, damned if you do, damned if you don't. If you calculate a break even point, it will be after 10-20 years after becoming an attending. If you choose a bad specialty, you'll never break even after 30-40 years.

I calculated the break even point being late 50s for myself given a expected salary of at least 200k but not factoring investment income. If you factor in... it is very possible that I will not break even.
 
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I calculated the break even point being late 50s for myself given a expected salary of at least 200k but not factoring investment income. If you factor in... it is very possible that I will not break even.

PS. My board score and performance during rotations will probably benefit from added depth of education. However, I'm not sure if that will translate into a better residency at this point.

Not really. Pharmacology is a small part of what you learn, and by the time you get to the clinical years most of your classmates will have a pretty good understanding of drug therapies. It's definitely not enough of a payoff to justify going to pharm school first.
 
Back in pharmacy school (an eon ago), I briefly looked into going to medical school, and then decided I would be better off just getting a pharmacist job when I graduated (and I'm very glad I did, I greatly enjoy being a pharmacist & have no regrets.) There really is no reason to get a PharmD, if one is planning to be a doctor. If you've already got a PharmD, and have decided being a doctor would be a better job for you, then go for it. Certainly, by having a pharmacy degree, you would have had all the prerequisites required for medical school, and you can look forward to 1 easy class at medical school (pharmacology)--I think a PharmD degree will be a good preparation for medical school, but given the time/cost investment in getting a PharmD, there is really no reason to plan on getting both degrees (exception might be if you wanted to go into research.)
 
Do not do this thing. No no no. Medicine will cost you 7-12(!!) years and at least $1 million (!!!!!!!) in lost income not to mention hundreds of thousands in new student loans. Do not do it.

And going from a licensed pharmacist at the top of the food chain to lowly med student and then lowly resident would just be awful.
 
I am a PharmD applying for MD/DO for 2015. As stated by others, the PharmD will help in certain specialties but from a financial standpoint it is not a good decision at all! Do it only if you are passionate about medicine and still relatively young...

I am 27 years old and single, so for me it is feasible.... you really have to factor in a lot of things such as your financial situation, family, retirement assets, etc.

Another thing to consider... you cannot work as a pharmacist once you receive your MD correct? Wouldnt there be a conflict? But you can while still in school I assume... I will probably call the boards in some states to verify :)
 
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Another thing to consider... you cannot work as a pharmacist once you receive your MD correct? Wouldnt there be a conflict? But you can while still in school I assume... I will probably call the boards in some states to verify :)

You could work as a pharmacist if you have your MD, but why would you? You make less, get treated like crap, and have to tell people where the laundry detergent is. You could work while in school, but you're not going to have enough time to really make it useful.
 
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You misunderstood... I meant at the same time... for example being a pharmacist and doctor working in the same hospital but on different days or in two different institutions within the same state or in two different states

Though I agree... probably wont find time to work... maybe during pharmacology ;)
 
You misunderstood... I meant at the same time... for example being a pharmacist and doctor working in the same hospital but on different days or in two different institutions within the same state or in two different states

Though I agree... probably wont find time to work... maybe during pharmacology ;)

That's a possibility, but again, why would you want to do that? As long as you're not filling the rxs that you've previously written, you're not doing anything against the rules. You're going to work as a part time doctor/part time pharmacist? It makes no sense since you make way less money as a pharmacist. It's the same reason you don't work as a tech on your off days. You could but it would be stupid and economically disadvantageous.
 
Not really. Pharmacology is a small part of what you learn, and by the time you get to the clinical years most of your classmates will have a pretty good understanding of drug therapies. It's definitely not enough of a payoff to justify going to pharm school first.

It's not just the pharmacology that you learn in pharmacy school - you learn logistics of health care, payment systems (most MS4s I talk to don't even know what a PBM is let alone a prior auth), how to talk with patients (i.e. bedside manner), pathophysiology of all major disease states and treatments for them, medical literature interpretation, calculations, professionalism, etc etc... you learn a lot more than just pharmacology.

Do not do this thing. No no no. Medicine will cost you 7-12(!!) years and at least $1 million (!!!!!!!) in lost income not to mention hundreds of thousands in new student loans. Do not do it.

And going from a licensed pharmacist at the top of the food chain to lowly med student and then lowly resident would just be awful.

A pharmacist is most certainly NOT the top of the food chain.
 
Yeah, probably doing per diem as a pharmacist during first or second year only ;)
 
As someone who went to pharmacy school and now is in medical school, you need to be absolutely sure that there is nothing in pharmacy that interests you enough to make a career out of it. I'm not sure how old you are, but if you're <30 going to medical school could be a decent long term investment assuming that you don't end up going in to something primary care related (this may mean that you should strive to go to an MD school instead of a DO one).

On another note, medical school is a completely different beast from pharm school but some of the knowledge I acquired during my 2nd, 3rd and 4th years of rx school have really come in handy during my first year of med school. If you have any specific questions, feel free to PM me.
 
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It's not just the pharmacology that you learn in pharmacy school - you learn logistics of health care, payment systems (most MS4s I talk to don't even know what a PBM is let alone a prior auth), how to talk with patients (i.e. bedside manner), pathophysiology of all major disease states and treatments for them, medical literature interpretation, calculations, professionalism, etc etc... you learn a lot more than just pharmacology.

I went to pharm school prior to med school. My marked advantage in knowing that stuff ended by 2nd year with studying for step 1. By 3rd year, I may know a thing here or there that my classmates don't know, but it's pretty rare. Those non-pharm things you learn are all also covered in med school so skills are not unique to that profession.
 
Not really. Pharmacology is a small part of what you learn, and by the time you get to the clinical years most of your classmates will have a pretty good understanding of drug therapies. It's definitely not enough of a payoff to justify going to pharm school first.

I'm not talking specifically about pharmacology when I made that statement. Nor am I advocating going to pharmacy school and then medical school if your goal is to become a physician. I find what I learned in pharmacy school as being complementary to the material that I am covered in medical school and thereby a deeper understanding of the material.
 
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I went to pharm school prior to med school. My marked advantage in knowing that stuff ended by 2nd year with studying for step 1. By 3rd year, I may know a thing here or there that my classmates don't know, but it's pretty rare. Those non-pharm things you learn are all also covered in med school so skills are not unique to that profession.

I'm not talking specifically about pharmacology when I made that statement. Nor am I advocating going to pharmacy school and then medical school if your goal is to become a physician. I find what I learned in pharmacy school as being complementary to the material that I am covered in medical school and thereby a deeper understanding of the material.

To eagles22, see above by PharMed2016. I recognize and did not intend for anyone to make inferences from my statement that I feel pharmacy is the only profession that learns those listed additional points. I was merely trying to get across what PharMed brought up: that by having a background in these things, one's understanding is deepened on a number of issues, particularly those that take time to develop. I also by no means advocate going to pharmacy school to accomplish this, but if an individual does decide after getting in deep with pharmacy that medicine is what they want to pursue, then they can know that pharmacology isn't the only thing that will help their understanding in the classes to come.
 
Hey guys, long time luker here. What do you guys think? Do the two degrees complement each other? I have a 3.8 GPA w/ my pharmD (rho chi blah blah). I have done alot of community volunteering including doing community service events in underserved populations (organizing and initiating). I did research in pharmacy school on 2 different projects as well as research on 1 project in undergrad and have one publication from my research in pharm school. Also I did a medical missions trip while in pharm school and have a bunch more volunteering activities. I have a BS in biology (3.3 gpa that I completed about 5 years ago). Also my mcat score is a 30 (10, 10, 10). Do you guys think I have a good chance? Is it worth it in this day and age to pursue medicine even though I have a pharmD and job? Thanks for any insight!

I have already posted on this numerous times. It's a financial disaster in certain circumstances. Feel free to read my previous posts.
 
I'm also a Pharm D student applying for MD/DO this coming cycle. Your a good candidate for DO and maybe some MD due to the upward trend during the BS. Don't think about switching for the money at all, you will in all likely hood not even break even financially. Only do it if staying in pharmacy will lead you to be unfulfilled and if being a physician is the only career that will allow you to be happy. I fall into that camp.
 
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Yeah, probably doing per diem as a pharmacist during first or second year only ;)

I'm a Pharm.D. at the end of my MS3 year and have worked per diem all 3 years. It's been hard this past year but still doable.
 
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Nice!

You know... two years ago when I was still in pharm school, I did not think anyone would ever do MD/DO after pharmd... and for good reasons...

But I am glad to see I am not the only crazy one lol.
 
I've considered it myself. I might wind up doing it after crunching numbers and seeing more on how pharmacy residencies are. My state is likely going to pass a collaborative practice bill (cleared state senate today) allowing pharmacists to pretty much have the same legal contracts as NP/PAs. It might allow for more fulfilling and innovative practice models. What I do not want though is to be stuck in chain retail, and the cost associated with med school would be well worth it to avoid that.
 
I've considered it myself. I might wind up doing it after crunching numbers and seeing more on how pharmacy residencies are. My state is likely going to pass a collaborative practice bill (cleared state senate today) allowing pharmacists to pretty much have the same legal contracts as NP/PAs. It might allow for more fulfilling and innovative practice models. What I do not want though is to be stuck in chain retail, and the cost associated with med school would be well worth it to avoid that.

Could you please elaborate on this? Thanks.
 
That's a possibility, but again, why would you want to do that? As long as you're not filling the rxs that you've previously written, you're not doing anything against the rules. You're going to work as a part time doctor/part time pharmacist? It makes no sense since you make way less money as a pharmacist. It's the same reason you don't work as a tech on your off days. You could but it would be stupid and economically disadvantageous.

No this is actually illegal. You cannot work both as a pharmacist and an MD. It is a complete conflict of interest. I learned in my pharmacy law class that this is not possible. You actually cannot hold a license in both
 
Another pharmacist/physician joining in. I worked for a year as a pharmacist before going back to med school. There were three PharmD's in my class. All of us worked per diem throughout first and second year. I continued to work until MS4 because I was lucky I got a gig at the campus student health clinic. Average working 5-10 hours/week throughout. Not bad money at all for a student. Being a pharmacist helped a during pharmacology class but only a little bit. Those med students are smart people, they still beat us on the grade, say I got a 90%, someone else got 100% (and not one of the other two pharmacists in class). During Step 1, I got a lot of pharmacology questions that I was very grateful for. Other than that, everything is new, new concepts to learn on how to diagnose, pathophysiology, pathology etc. Now in residency the only advantage is that I can do discharge order for outpatient without looking up the dosage. But all of my fellow interns learn dosings and such very quickly too.
Bottom line, going back to med school was a great adventure and I enjoyed it very much. Residency is a different game however.
 
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Another pharmacist/physician joining in. I worked for a year as a pharmacist before going back to med school. There were three PharmD's in my class. All of us worked per diem throughout first and second year. I continued to work until MS4 because I was lucky I got a gig at the campus student health clinic. Average working 5-10 hours/week throughout. Not bad money at all for a student. Being a pharmacist helped a during pharmacology class but only a little bit. Those med students are smart people, they still beat us on the grade, say I got a 90%, someone else got 100% (and not one of the other two pharmacists in class). During Step 1, I got a lot of pharmacology questions that I was very grateful for. Other than that, everything is new, new concepts to learn on how to diagnose, pathophysiology, pathology etc. Now in residency the only advantage is that I can do discharge order for outpatient without looking up the dosage. But all of my fellow interns learn dosings and such very quickly too.
Bottom line, going back to med school was a great adventure and I enjoyed it very much. Residency is a different game however.
Thank you for sharing!
 
Is it harder to work in MS3/4 year due to the clinical rotations taking pretty much full time labor like P4 year or due to the material/exams being too intense to devote time to work and school?

Could you please elaborate on this? Thanks.

It's basically a law that allows pharmacists to have more legal power to do what they are already doing. Right now pharmacists can "write" scripts and manage diseases under medical orders, but with a CPA agreement it makes things easier and allows pharmacists to manage care and write scripts under contract similar to what NPs and PAs have and not under a medical order. Some other states have a system like this. Basically, you aren't limited to working only on one patient for which a specific medical order is issued. You would have a broader range of practice under a supervising physician with an agreement. The proposal is also backed by our state medical association, nursing association and pharmacy association. It also allows for a more expanded scope under the contract as a physician deems necessary.
 
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You have to check with each individual school whether they will accept the pre-reqs from undergrad. Some will have a cut off that they cannot be taken more than 5 or 7 years ago, but I would guess most do not have any cut off. If there is no cutoff, then it doesn't matter how old your undergrad grades are, especially since you have recent academic experience (PharmD). As far as GPA goes, MD schools do not care at all what your PharmD grades were if your undergrad grades were subpar. A 3.3 with a 30 mcat will not likely get you any MD interviews. DO schools on the other hand will care slightly about your PharmD grades, but undergrad is still more important.



You are competitive for DO school. I had similar stats to yours when I switched from PharmD to DO and got interviews at 3 out of the 4 places I applied. However, I would say that your essays, volunteer experience, letters of recommendation, interview ability, and exposure to osteopathic medicine will make or break you. You need to shadow a DO for a while and get a letter of recommendation from a DO to apply to almost all DO schools. Even if schools don't "require" the DO letter, it's still *very* important, so you might as well get one. I think you have a valid reason for wanting to switch to medicine, it is the same reason I switched: you have all this knowledge but can't use it, and don't want your scope of practice to be limited.



Ok, while it may technically be feasible to do part time retail pharmacy during med school the first 2 years if you are a strong student (meaning you can score in the top 25% of med/pharm students on exams while exerting in the bottom 25% of time and effort), it's not worth it and I wouldn't recommend it.

Anesthesiology would be a great choice for you with your pharm background, or IM if you want a fuller spectrum of medical experience. Now, I know some people are going to tell your this is a terrible financial decision, but I'll tell you it's not, unless maybe if you go into primary care and don't or can't take advantage of PAYE/PSLF. Pharmacists make maybe $120-$140k right. MGMA data from 2012 puts the median anesthesiologist salary at $427k and Today's Hospitalist puts the average hospitalist pay for IM at $252k. DO schools are expensive, especially when you factor cost of living into loans, you could finish residency with an additional $400k of debt, but either use PAYE/PSLF if you need it, or pay them off quickly with an extra $100-200k in salary versus what you likely would make as a pharmacist. You would break even financially eventually, probably ~10 years post-residency, depending on what specialty you go into, how much loans, and whether you take advantage of PAYE/PSLF or not. But most importantly, you should do what makes you happy and provides for your family the best.


great info !!
 
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I agree.

On a more substantial note, most anesthesiologists are being replaced by nurse anesthesiologists since medicine is more of a team game now.

CRNAs have all but won the fight and will have independent practice authority soon, undoubtedly. Despite this, I think anesthesiologists will always be in demand, however they may have to shrink the field and reduce residency spots in the specialty since CRNAs will be doing more of the workload. They already do about half of cases I believe. Anesthesiologists are just doing different tasks than in the past, and this will become true more and more. They are doing more supervision of nurses doing lower level cases (ASA 1-3), but when it comes to more complicated cases (ASA 4-6) CRNAs will never be able to handle these cases as safely, ensuring that anesthesiologists always have a necessary role in addition to supervision.

Primary care physicians are really the ones most in danger of losing their jobs to nurses. As American healthcare changes, more and more patients will be seeing nurses as first line care, putting primary care physicians out of jobs. These nurses will order a lot more labs, imaging and consults/referrals to physician specialists because of their relative lack of training, ensuring that specialists have a steady stream of patients. The outlook for physicians in primary care is not good, but specialists have a more secure future. The more cerebral the specialty (ie. radiology, pathology), the safer it is from nurses, but of course each field has its own challenges.
 
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I'll chime in on this topic and give my quick advice since I just graduated medical school. During my P4 year, I decided I actually wanted to go into medicine. I had no intentions and hated medicine during college. After graduating pharmacy school, I worked a year and then got into medical school. Having the PharmD background and what we learned helped somewhat for physio and clinical pathophysio, but med school was definitely more advance. Pharmacology was a breeze and what you learn in med school wasn't very much in detail. The big advantage I encountered was on the clinical side. You are better prepared giving patient presentations and most importantly you know treatment and have many other options you can use. That is where I found opportunities to shine since you already know what to use, side effects, and what to monitor, and helping patients have access to medications. I also worked all 4 years in medical school as a pharmacist once a week for 8 hours, only taking off if I had call that day.

My advice, do medicine only if you love it. It will cost $$, medicine these days is a poor investment with all the schooling and loans, time consuming, and social and enjoying life with the amount of studying is much harder. Pharmacy school was a breeze and I did quite well. Medical school was a whole different ballgame. I do not regret my decision in choosing medicine and absolutely love what I do. I am starting my internship, so that may change...ha. Best of luck and I am glad I got my PharmD it helped me so much in medical school, but would not recommend to do both if you ultimately want to be a physician as your wasting time. PM if you got any questions. GOOD LUCK!
 
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Ever heard of a PharmD going to PA school?
 
Ever heard of a PharmD going to PA school?

I don't know if that would make financial sense. A community pharmacist makes the same if not more than a PA (at least where I live).
 
Ever heard of a PharmD going to PA school?

No, but I know of people doing combined PharmD/PA programs. According to one of the faculty members of the combined program whom I spoke to, most students traditionally practice solely as pharmacists afterward.
 
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