ADT Clerkships, what to expect...?

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MaximusD

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Hey guys, it's been a while.

I've scheduled to go to Lackland AFB for two clerkships in the coming months in IM (Hem/Onc) and Anesthesiology in July and October, respectively. I'm wondering what I can expect in terms of housing (apt, roommates, dorm style, etc), transportation allowance, security clearance requirements as well as off-base privileges.

I'm purposely leaving this open-ended as I know very little about how this will work. The only ADT I have taken thus far was COT, and I am hoping (and assuming) that this is more laid-back than training. Nonetheless, I don't want to be clueless.

Thanks for any input you can offer in advance.

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My Army ADTs were pretty much like any other rotation except that I was in uniform. I cannot imagine the Air Force would be more strict than the Army experience.
 
My Army ADTs were pretty much like any other rotation except that I was in uniform. I cannot imagine the Air Force would be more strict than the Army experience.

So mostly ABUs then?

Also, I noticed AFIT site says the following:

During the time of your ADT, it is important to remember that you are being paid for your time and service at your training location. Personal travel outside the Air Force training facility is strictly prohibited. Weekend trips, residency interviews, or vacations should not be scheduled during the same time as your ADT's. If you know you have an exam coming up at your school during an ADT you will not be released from the ADT to go take the exam and return to the ADT, nor will you be released early to return to school for an exam. You need to schedule your ADT's around your school exam schedule.

Is this strictly enforced... I have family/friends that live(s) in Texas. I am just wondering, because I was assuming I'd be able to visit during the weekends. Will I have to request leave, etc?
 
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Scheduled Anes a few months ago. Scheduled Hem/Onc this past week.

Difficulty is almost directly correlated with specialty competitiveness, in my experience.

How far in advance can I schedule? I know on the AFIT website it says that I can do it up to a year in advance. Anyone scheduled that far in advance?

I'm interested in surgical subspecialties. I'm thinking about applying to 2 specialties since each only has one program at WHMC/BAMC.
 
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How far in advance can I schedule? I know on the AFIT website it says that I can do it up to a year in advance. Anyone scheduled that far in advance?

I'm interested in surgical subspecialties. I'm thinking about applying to 2 specialties since each only has one program at WHMC/BAMC.

I don't know. I have no interest in surgery other than Anes which is only associated by physical proximity :)

If you go to the AFIT website (http://www.afit.edu/cip), login, and expand the Medical Corps Information menu option on the right, you'll see "Active Duty Tours." Lots of good information there, particularly under the first page entitled "ADT Checklist". I found the embedded links in the the third subsection to be most useful: the Specialty Table and the ADT Location/Specialty Coordinator List

Specialty Table by Location

https://www.afit.edu/cip/docs/Air_Force_HPSP_Rotation_Facilities.doc

Shows what specialty is available for rotations at what location/AFB/Hospital.

ADT Locations & Specialties with Rotation Coordinator Info

https://www.afit.edu/cip/s_adt_content.cfm?page=adt_locations

Hope this helped!

edit: Not sure why...maybe it's af security but those links were properly input and don't seem to work properly... ??
 
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So mostly ABUs then?

Also, I noticed AFIT site says the following:



Is this strictly enforced... I have family/friends that live(s) in Texas. I am just wondering, because I was assuming I'd be able to visit during the weekends. Will I have to request leave, etc?

Blues on Mondays, ABUs on Tu-Fr, dress casual on the weekends. Nobody cares what medical students do on their off time, although I wouldn't recommend going anywhere near the TexMex border.
 
So mostly ABUs then?

Also, I noticed AFIT site says the following:



Is this strictly enforced... I have family/friends that live(s) in Texas. I am just wondering, because I was assuming I'd be able to visit during the weekends. Will I have to request leave, etc?


Yep, I wore ACUs every day. My orders stated to in-process in Class B but nobody does that. I worked with some Air Force people at Tripler and they had to wear Class B every Monday or something like that.

When I did my ADT near where I live, I booked a room at the BOQ but still commuted every day from home. I stayed in the BOQ a few times when I was too tired to go home or had to be back hella early.

Please keep in mind, this is all Army. I have no idea how the AF varies.
 
Blues on Mondays, ABUs on Tu-Fr, dress casual on the weekends. Nobody cares what medical students do on their off time, although I wouldn't recommend going anywhere near the TexMex border.

1. Weird practicing/learning medicine in your uniform? Will be a new experience.

2. Housing?

3. How is San Antonio? Were the other milmed students cool to work with?

4. Hours/call/etc?

You can answer all or some of that, whatever works. Thanks for your input so far. :thumbup:
 
1. Weird practicing/learning medicine in your uniform? Will be a new experience.

2. Housing?

3. How is San Antonio? Were the other milmed students cool to work with?

4. Hours/call/etc?

You can answer all or some of that, whatever works. Thanks for your input so far. :thumbup:

I've worked with other students from all services. The HPSP and USUHS people tend to be just like any other med student. People who went from a military academy to USUHS can be a little more prickish.
 
1. Weird practicing/learning medicine in your uniform? Will be a new experience.

2. Housing?

3. How is San Antonio? Were the other milmed students cool to work with?

4. Hours/call/etc?

You can answer all or some of that, whatever works. Thanks for your input so far. :thumbup:

I never did Heme/Onc as a medstud and can only speak for resident life. Wilford Hall has an inpatient service (65hr/wk+) and a consult one (most weekends off). No call - the IM ward team covers. There's also outpatient clinic and procedures to see, so I would recommend as a learning experience to diversify your time as much as possible. Doing IP for a whole month would be both boring and exhausting. You'll likely stay on base at the 'hotel', which is fairly decent as hotels go. And San Antonio is literally built around keeping soldiers and airmen entertained, there's tons to do. I'd recommend Alamo drafthouse > $15 watered-down Riverwalk margaritas though.

Kinda weird that you're doing time in such disparate specialties. I know nothing about anesthesia btw but can hazard a guess that you'll have plenty of free time. It's freakin' anesthesia.
 
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I never did Heme/Onc as a medstud and can only speak for resident life. Wilford Hall has an inpatient service (65hr/wk+) and a consult one (most weekends off). No call - the IM ward team covers. There's also outpatient clinic and procedures to see, so I would recommend as a learning experience to diversify your time as much as possible. Doing IP for a whole month would be both boring and exhausting. You'll likely stay on base at the 'hotel', which is fairly decent as hotels go. And San Antonio is literally built around keeping soldiers and airmen entertained, there's tons to do. I'd recommend Alamo drafthouse > $15 watered-down Riverwalk margaritas though.

Kinda weird that you're doing time in such disparate specialties. I know nothing about anesthesia btw but can hazard a guess that you'll have plenty of free time. It's freakin' anesthesia.

Interested in IM and Anesthesia. I chose heme/onc bc I feel like I've learned very little about it and bc I want exposure to IM at Wilford Hall.

Haven't made my decision yet between Anes and IM. I wanted to split it up 2-and-2 between two different IM subspecialties but no such luck.

Going to do a 2-wk stint in Anes this summer to see how interested in it I actually am. If I don't like it like I did the first time, I will probably drop the Anes rotation in Sept/Oct and switch to another IM spot...possibly in the MICU.

Sounds like a good plan, or a ******ed one? I can take the heat ;)
 
One of the hardest things for me during my sub-I at BAMC was learning the ranks of all the different services. I ended up making myself flashcards on day 2. You're literally all mixed together with enlisted people and officers from everywhere and anywhere. Also, the USUHS folks are from all the branches. Then you have your civilians. Most of the civilians were retired military. So... You may call someone Dr.___, but you might write them as LTC____. Bleh. It was a lot to get quickly. I made the flashcards after I referred to a Navy Chief Petty Officer (E-7) as "Sarge". He was quite friendly about the whole thing (he was a cool guy), but I felt like a tool. also the Navy calls their ranks, "rates". None of this is going to stop the world from spinning but... keep it in mind. And there are Marine Corps medics with the Navy called "Corpsmen" but the Navy medics are also "Corpsmen"... These are the things that I didn't learn at Army OBLC. So... If you meet someone who says, he's a "Corpsman", make no assumptions! Also there's more icing on the cake. Technically, the Navy Hospital Corpsmen have their own special rates. So... If you see an individual in the Navy who is an E-4 doing medical stuff, s/he could be a "Petty Officer", a "Hospital Corpsman" or whatever their job is like a "Culinary Specialist" (with another rate altogether)! So when people introduce themselves, LISTEN! I've also started to ask, "How do I write that?" so that there's no confusion later.

Also this is minor and silly. But I don't think you're supposed to say that you're rotating at, "Lackland AFB" or "Ft Sam". We were told not to refer it as "BAMC" anymore either. Because it's a joint command, you're supposed to call it either "SAMMC" (North or South) or "SAUSHEC". (there are signs which read "BRAC-a new beginning" EVERYWHERE)

One thing that I didn't like was that you're not supposed to wear scrubs in the parking lot... So if you've been in scrubs all day, that means that you have to change before you leave. So if you're dirty, you have to change into a non-work outfit to head home before you shower. That was really my only complaint about the whole ordeal.

Wait, that's a lie. Parking WAS HORRIBLE! I was able to get a rental car with three other people. However, there is so much friggin' construction going on... It ended up being more convenient to hop on the bus which dropped me off down the street from my building, than it was to walk to the car. Again, the heat is no joke. The bus schedules could be a bit more reliable. But I really enjoyed the 30min chats that I had while waiting for the bus with the Enlisted folks. (tangent- They were great and hilarious! Some of them should be on SNL!)

I thought the meal plan at SAMMC was the best that I've encountered so far! You have several options in and outside of the hospital where to use it. There was no way that I could have eaten my daily rations. I got plenty of good coffee 24/7. Interesting enough, I had more free good coffee at SAMMC than any other military base that I've worked. And it was the first time I encountered K-cups. Now I'm an addict.

And if you're interviewing check on what your interview uniform will be. Also I ended up buying a mess dress uniform to attend ONE EVENT! I could have not gone but I'm nose-y so I had to see what all the fuss was about. And since I'm a girl, I bought the skirt, then I changed my mind and bought the long dress... I should have worn the skirt it was a thousand degrees. but there are rules about length when the sun goes down etc. AND, after that event, I was able to attend another event (a wedding) in my mess uniform. So now, I've started packing all my uniforms for these ADTs. I totally use that 3rd bag when on orders!

Also, my biggie advice that I wish I knew before, is to interview with anything that you think you MIGHT be interested in while you're there. Now, I even interview with the transitional PD! It's so that they can know me AND I can know them. I still don't have a final preference list planned. FML. anyhow, I'm working on it.

I heard that 15% of civilian residents change their field.... I think that no one knows what the hell s/he want to do! So, I don't feel so bad about it!

Oh, and I will go ahead and tell my lil' secret. If you drink, you're going to end up drinking with other folks from other branches. Quite often you end up "coin checking" in a bar somewhere. It always happens... Some wise kid who is the son of ____ is going to drop a coin and think he's the only one that has one ready. i'm ALWAYS ready for this! I buy ~50 coins from my local base and have them in my purse at all times. If I haven't drank them all up, then I give them to the personnel that really helped me along during the rotation. and I've given some to the mean nurses that haven't helped as well... It's like a "swap" in girl scouting. I think it helps.

Also I had call nights. I guess it depends on what you're going into and what your residents are doing. They never "force" the issue, but I generally try to do whatever my intern is doing. They do say that "Everyday is an interview day." Lastly, "Never say what isn't in your job description, until you know what your job is." Be prepared to do it all. It's actually a GOOD part of the rotation. I really learned how to do ABGs at SAMMC. When I came back to my home school, I thought I was the coolest thing since slice bread!

Now I'm jealous that you have these great rotations lined up! I wish I did! :(
You're going to have a swell time! And since you're going to be a tourist, you MUST get yourself a tour of the Burn Center and the Center for the Intrepid. Prepare yourself to be AMAZED! And they have a kick ass sim center as well. although they could be a bit less stingy with the time allowed in it...

If SAMMC wasn't in Texas, it'd be #1 easily!
 
Interested in IM and Anesthesia. I chose heme/onc bc I feel like I've learned very little about it and bc I want exposure to IM at Wilford Hall.

Haven't made my decision yet between Anes and IM. I wanted to split it up 2-and-2 between two different IM subspecialties but no such luck.

Going to do a 2-wk stint in Anes this summer to see how interested in it I actually am. If I don't like it like I did the first time, I will probably drop the Anes rotation in Sept/Oct and switch to another IM spot...possibly in the MICU.

Sounds like a good plan, or a ******ed one? I can take the heat ;)

Getting ICU exposure is one of the best things you can do as a medical student. If you decide to pursue gas I'd recommend still doing a SICU block. But if you're interested in IM why not do at least 1 sub-I in general IM wards? I'd also suggest doing at least one of your rotations at BAMC if possible; Wilford Hall is scheduled to close in the next couple of years.
 
Getting ICU exposure is one of the best things you can do as a medical student. If you decide to pursue gas I'd recommend still doing a SICU block. But if you're interested in IM why not do at least 1 sub-I in general IM wards? I'd also suggest doing at least one of your rotations at BAMC if possible; Wilford Hall is scheduled to close in the next couple of years.

I have a subi in medicine for my school at a civvie spot. Do you think I should switch my hemonc rotation to micu? Thanks for the input. It's hard at this pt seeig as I only have two adts to work with and have not decided between anes and im. If I apply anes, do I apply directly or after an internship/preliminary year? Ps sorryfor the typos am on the iPhone today.
 
So say I like 2 surgical subspecialties and do 2 audition rotations, is there a downside to ranking 2 specialties if each specialty only has one AF training program?
 
Seriously how dumb do you have to be to do drugs as a third year medical student and military officer?
+1. I'm all for la vida loca, but at a certain point in life, you have to shelve the bong. Your first tentative steps learning patient care and raising your hand to become commissioned are both pretty good times.
 
Well, I'd like to know because I take amphetamines for ADHD (diagnosed after joining) and would rather not disclose that for fear of repercussions/discrimination during residency selection. If someone could answer or has other advice that would be helpful. thanks
 
Well, I'd like to know because I take amphetamines for ADHD (diagnosed after joining) and would rather not disclose that for fear of repercussions/discrimination during residency selection. If someone could answer or has other advice that would be helpful. thanks

Geez what a little punk. WHEN you get called for a random pee test (which can happen any time you're on AD orders), your amphetamines will show up.

You: "Oh no Colonel, it's all a big mistake. I've got ADHD, here's my adderall prescription."
Colonel Hardass: "So you're telling me you've been committing fraud on your annual physical all these years?"
You: "Er..."
 
Well, I'd like to know because I take amphetamines for ADHD (diagnosed after joining) and would rather not disclose that for fear of repercussions/discrimination during residency selection. If someone could answer or has other advice that would be helpful. thanks
Do you want to face possible discrimination as a residency applicant:

A. With diagnosed and treated ADHD.
B. Someone who failed a drug test. His explanation was that he broke policy and did not disclose prescription drug use.

Your call.
 
so i'm heading out to an ADT soon for the air force. just wondering if i need to have the medical service corps badge on my ABU or on my other uniforms. thanks.
 
I had a quick question for those of you who have done an ADT already. Did you do a re-commissioning physical while on rotation?
 
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