Advice on Ethical Dilemma Choices

[wao]

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I'm a non-traditional student, but I studied basic sciences in India many years ago and I've got more than 1300 hours of clinical experience. I applied to 6 DO schools this cycle and was able to get 1 interview. I'm not poor, but I don't have very much money otherwise I would have applied to more schools. Unfortunately I found out today via email that I was rejected from the 1 school where I interviewed. During the day of the interview I was reminded many times about it being illegal for students to diagnose or treat anyone without physician supervision. I fully understand that.

After the interview I met up with someone in the city where I was interviewing who does not trust physicians and discussed some health issues he was having and asked for my opinion. This person is from an undeserved community, and did not graduate high school. I told him that I could not give him a diagnosis because I am not a doctor or a physician and am only applying to medical school. He discussed with me some medical concerns anyway and one of them seemed serious enough to me that he should have it checked out properly. He told me that he didn't have the money for the copay so I told him I would cover it and he politely declined. Instead he told me that after I'm a doctor that he'll come and see me.

I might not meet the parameters to be qualified to attend medical school this year, and I don't know if I'll ever get in, but I do know what Ehler Danlos Syndrome looks like and how it has the risk of aortic dissection. My dilemma is that if I try to get him help through the university or a doctor associated with the university that if I get a chance to interview for next cycle my application will go in the round file for diagnosing someone without a license, even a rumor of that and my app will get tossed. Currently I'm considering calling a physician in the area who could help and asking them to charge me for the care and have the doctor tell that person that it's free. I can't really ignore my instinct, I just don't know how to help.

What would you do if you were me?

 

[Goro]

Just tell him to go see a doctor. You may know what Ehler Danlos Syndrome looks like and how it has the risk of aortic dissection...and you may have lots of clinical experience, but you're not a doctor either.

Adcoms aren't omniscient...how are we going to if you gave someone medical advice???

 

[wao]

I told him to see a doctor. Many times. I even offered to pay for it. I also made sure and told him many times that I'm not a doctor.

He lost part of his hand in a work accident and the surgeon basically told him that maybe he would lose a small part of his hand and when he woke up a lot of it was gone, from that experience he sees doctors as untrustworthy.

The reason the adcom would find out is because my only point of contact in that town in order to get him medical help would be to go through one of the University doctor's. I don't know what resources are available over there in the way that people in the University would. Also every hospital in that area is associated with that University, because it's a smallish town.

He would be the kind of patient that's borderline in trying to get treatment or counseling because he won't keep on top of it for himself, but if someone else does it then he'll get help. He might sit through and think he wants to get better, but if it's too complicated he'll leave, because he doesn't understand the ramifications to his health. In my experience that's when bad things happen.

My thinking is that if I can give him the contact info for 1 doctor and tell him that it's free he will go see that doctor and they'll to do the test and explain it to him. I just need to find a way to do it very discreetly so my name doesn't get mentioned anywhere and that's the problem I'm having.

Being able to become a DO is a dream of mine. It's taken me a long time to even get the opportunity to apply so I feel that I might lose my chance, but if I had to choose my dream or him getting treatment then I'd pick him getting treatment every time, people like him are the whole reason I'm trying to become a physician. I just need help trying to figure out a way that I can have both. Maybe I'm too greedy.

 

[BobbyKoch]

Many people use money as an excuse they don’t want to do something. So paying for it might not help.

Also, you can’t fix everyone. Especially if they don’t want help. Sounds like you’ve done a lot for this friend and you are now making mountains out of anthills.

 

[Osminog]

You can lead a horse to water, but you can't make it drink. If your friend is adamant about not receiving medical treatment, then respect his decision and move on. There's nothing you can do.

My dilemma is that if I try to get him help through the university or a doctor associated with the university that if I get a chance to interview for next cycle my application will go in the round file for diagnosing someone without a license, even a rumor of that and my app will get tossed.

This isn't a dilemma. This is delusional thinking on your part. Telling your friend, "I'm not a doctor but you should get your symptoms checked out by a physician since they could be caused by X" isn't practicing medicine without a license. It's friendly health-related advice, not a diagnosis from a self-described expert.

 

[wao]

I thought about it and I have a plan.

I'm going to tell the University that he figured out on his own using google that he has Ehler Danlos type 2 and that he asked me what he should do. Then I said I'm not a doctor and that he should get a proper check up regarding his concerns from a licensed physician. He said that he can't afford it and that he was not willing to take money from me to see one.

Then I will ask the University if they have any resources to help him.

I will tell him that if anyone asks he figured it out on his own.

I feel like that's pretty reasonable and then whatever happens after that isn't up to me, because I did my best.

 

[Osminog]

You already did what a concerned friend is supposed to do: you recommended that he see a doctor. If your friend doesn't want to see a doctor, then he doesn't want to see a doctor. That's it. There's nothing else to say. Don't get involved in your friend's health-related affairs, and don't use your limited knowledge to diagnose him with diseases that require careful medical history evaluation and clinical testing.

Frankly, this thread is a cringe-worthy and asinine. The fact that you're so confident about your "diagnosis" and that you're so prepared to personally interfere in your friend's private medical affairs seriously puts into question your level of common sense, humility, and social competence. Why are you creating this pointless dilemma for yourself?

 

[AnatomyGrey12]

I thought about it and I have a plan.

I'm going to tell the University that he figured out on his own using google that he has Ehler Danlos type 2 and that he asked me what he should do. Then I said I'm not a doctor and that he should get a proper check up regarding his concerns from a licensed physician. He said that he can't afford it and that he was not willing to take money from me to see one.

Then I will ask the University if they have any resources to help him.

I will tell him that if anyone asks he figured it out on his own.

I feel like that's pretty reasonable and then whatever happens after that isn't up to me, because I did my best.

Bro this is some serious mental gymnastics and you are making a mountain out of flat ground, it isn't even a mole hill. No one will give two craps that you think that you think someone has Ehler Danlos. No one is going to think you "diagnosed someone without a medical license." All you have to do is say this, "Hey university person I think someone I know might have Ehler Danlos but he can't afford going to the doctor to get checked out. Are there any resources I could suggest to him?"

That's it. Literally no one is going to think you diagnosed someone by you saying you think someone has X disease.

 

[wao]

You already did what a concerned friend is supposed to do: you recommended that he see a doctor. If your friend doesn't want to see a doctor, then he doesn't want to see a doctor. That's it. There's nothing else to say. Don't get involved in your friend's health-related affairs, and don't use your limited knowledge to diagnose him with diseases that require careful medical history evaluation and clinical testing.

Frankly, this thread is a cringe-worthy and asinine. The fact that you're so confident about your "diagnosis" and that you're so prepared to personally interfere in your friend's private medical affairs seriously puts into question your level of common sense, humility, and social competence. Why are you creating this pointless dilemma for yourself?

Either you didn't read what I wrote, or it was outside of your comprehension.

Regardless, thank you for your entertaining post. Your talents might better be better utilized as a stand up comic rather than as a physician.

 

[deleted915763]

1. You don't know what he has
2. There is no problem with asking the university for resources to help him
3. Maybe you should get yourself checked out too

 

[theLastprocastination]

I'm a non-traditional student, but I studied basic sciences in India many years ago and I've got more than 1300 hours of clinical experience. I applied to 6 DO schools this cycle and was able to get 1 interview. I'm not poor, but I don't have very much money otherwise I would have applied to more schools. Unfortunately I found out today via email that I was rejected from the 1 school where I interviewed. During the day of the interview I was reminded many times about it being illegal for students to diagnose or treat anyone without physician supervision. I fully understand that.

After the interview I met up with someone in the city where I was interviewing who does not trust physicians and discussed some health issues he was having and asked for my opinion. This person is from an undeserved community, and did not graduate high school. I told him that I could not give him a diagnosis because I am not a doctor or a physician and am only applying to medical school. He discussed with me some medical concerns anyway and one of them seemed serious enough to me that he should have it checked out properly. He told me that he didn't have the money for the copay so I told him I would cover it and he politely declined. Instead he told me that after I'm a doctor that he'll come and see me.

I might not meet the parameters to be qualified to attend medical school this year, and I don't know if I'll ever get in, but I do know what Ehler Danlos Syndrome looks like and how it has the risk of aortic dissection. My dilemma is that if I try to get him help through the university or a doctor associated with the university that if I get a chance to interview for next cycle my application will go in the round file for diagnosing someone without a license, even a rumor of that and my app will get tossed. Currently I'm considering calling a physician in the area who could help and asking them to charge me for the care and have the doctor tell that person that it's free. I can't really ignore my instinct, I just don't know how to help.

What would you do if you were me?

So, basically what you’re telling me is that you didn’t have enough money to apply for more schools but you’re willing to pay for this stranger’s copay?

In all honesty, I smell trolling.