Advice to young engineers: switch out

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Older engineers, what do you think (in a premed context)

  • No engineering

    Votes: 33 55.9%
  • Yes engineering

    Votes: 26 44.1%

  • Total voters
    59

Shredder

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in my lone act of selflessness :smuggrin:, i am trying to save you from getting in too deep to the point of no return. the problem isnt that engineering is hard, as medicine too is no piece of cake. its that its needlessly hard, meaning you put yourself into a bad situation without any benefit. now, well into my senior year, i wish i could have taken a major that would have taught me about society and people, like econ, psych, socio, or who knows--any other suggestions? rather, engineering is a trade school that produces people who are ready to jump out into the workforce and make 50k+ right away. you dont learn $hit about anything else except engineering concepts.

im just bummed out that my senior design project is requiring so much commitment. its one thing to put in hard work but its another to put in hard work and get nothing out of it in the long term, which i dont think future docs do (in an engr major). or future anything for that matter, except future engineers. i might gripe some and express regrets in my interviews if the topic is broached, i hope it is received all right as long as i clarify it

caveat: i could do well in engr given enough effort. and i do perform fairly well, just to clear that up so ppl dont think im a dunce. but the question is, why? why bother?

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Shredder said:
in my lone act of selflessness :smuggrin:, i am trying to save you from getting in too deep to the point of no return. the problem isnt that engineering is hard, as medicine too is no piece of cake. its that its needlessly hard, meaning you put yourself into a bad situation without any benefit. now, well into my senior year, i wish i could have taken a major that would have taught me about society and people, like econ, psych, socio, or who knows--any other suggestions? rather, engineering is a trade school that produces people who are ready to jump out into the workforce and make 50k+ right away. you dont learn $hit about anything else except engineering concepts.

im just bummed out that my senior design project is requiring so much commitment. its one thing to put in hard work but its another to put in hard work and get nothing out of it in the long term, which i dont think future docs do (in an engr major). or future anything for that matter, except future engineers. i might gripe some and express regrets in my interviews if the topic is broached, i hope it is received all right as long as i clarify it

caveat: i could do well in engr given enough effort. and i do perform fairly well, just to clear that up so ppl dont think im a dunce. but the question is, why? why bother?

Engineering and orthpedics go hand-in-hand. A lot of orthopods have patents, work closely with bioengineers, run labs with engineering grad students, etc. Conceivably, you could develop new materials for hip replacements, patent them, and reap the benefits while maintaining your practice. Applied knowledge is never futile.
 
I don't regret going through with it thus far. I've heard a couple of EEs from MIT describe the med school work easy compared to undergrad. I don't doubt it the slightest bit, with classes like electromagnetic fields & waves.. booo to that class. Overall, you can probably assume that it makes you a more interesting candidate.
 
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Shredder said:
in my lone act of selflessness :smuggrin:, i am trying to save you from getting in too deep to the point of no return. the problem isnt that engineering is hard, as medicine too is no piece of cake. its that its needlessly hard, meaning you put yourself into a bad situation without any benefit. now, well into my senior year, i wish i could have taken a major that would have taught me about society and people, like econ, psych, socio, or who knows--any other suggestions? rather, engineering is a trade school that produces people who are ready to jump out into the workforce and make 50k+ right away. you dont learn $hit about anything else except engineering concepts.

im just bummed out that my senior design project is requiring so much commitment. its one thing to put in hard work but its another to put in hard work and get nothing out of it in the long term, which i dont think future docs do (in an engr major). or future anything for that matter, except future engineers. i might gripe some and express regrets in my interviews if the topic is broached, i hope it is received all right as long as i clarify it

caveat: i could do well in engr given enough effort. and i do perform fairly well, just to clear that up so ppl dont think im a dunce. but the question is, why? why bother?

Shredder, I'm glad you're realizing these things now. I've been working as an engineer, and it's definitely not what makes me tick (or happy). Although the cash seems to make others happy, I'm sure it eventually wears off..

Luckily, there's no time like the present to realize these things, so just give'er.
:cool:
 
DrBuro said:
I don't regret going through with it thus far. I've heard a couple of EEs from MIT describe the med school work easy compared to undergrad. I don't doubt it the slightest bit, with classes like electromagnetic fields & waves.. booo to that class. Overall, you can probably assume that it makes you a more interesting candidate.

lol.. yeah, I've always wondered if med would be as tough as everyone says it is. As an engineering student, I routinely pull days and days without sleep, and many times had to drop certain assignments in order to have enough time to finish others.

Hopefully it *is* as tough as eng was - I kinda miss the lifestyle. Being hardcore is cool. hah.. :D
 
Everyone should look at me as living proof of what to do.

in hindsight i am starting to have second thoughts about engineering (I'm chemE). Getting good grades in engineering is possible but it comes at the expense of all the other crap med schools want you to do. I do some volunteering but simply don't have time to dedicate myself to campus orgs/other ECs to the extent that it would be worthwhile.

Maybe in my case (MD/PhD) doing engineering is attractive and I milk it for all it's worth, i really did become GREAT at problem solving and I think that's important for medicine, but in all honesty after receiving my first thin letter last week for obvious reasons I think it's clear that you're better off being the run of the mill bio major and getting to do the ECs. Make sure you get your grades first, though.
 
Shredder said:
in my lone act of selflessness :smuggrin:, i am trying to save you from getting in too deep to the point of no return. the problem isnt that engineering is hard, as medicine too is no piece of cake. its that its needlessly hard, meaning you put yourself into a bad situation without any benefit. now, well into my senior year, i wish i could have taken a major that would have taught me about society and people, like econ, psych, socio, or who knows--any other suggestions? rather, engineering is a trade school that produces people who are ready to jump out into the workforce and make 50k+ right away. you dont learn $hit about anything else except engineering concepts.

im just bummed out that my senior design project is requiring so much commitment. its one thing to put in hard work but its another to put in hard work and get nothing out of it in the long term, which i dont think future docs do (in an engr major). or future anything for that matter, except future engineers. i might gripe some and express regrets in my interviews if the topic is broached, i hope it is received all right as long as i clarify it

caveat: i could do well in engr given enough effort. and i do perform fairly well, just to clear that up so ppl dont think im a dunce. but the question is, why? why bother?


WTF? Is shredder a human being...? I thought...well...nevermind, I guess...
 
Indryd said:
WTF? Is shredder a human being...? I thought...well...nevermind, I guess...
human, alien, or machine (ghost, monster, etc), everyone has 24 hours in a day. and engr unnecessarily eats up more of those hours than another area of study would. i dont think med schools take into consideration the circumstances engineers face, but this is the subject of perpetual debate. they take it only mildly into consideration at best i believe, while grades and time suffer disproportionately more, meaning its just a poor choice for a premed. all credit to aspiring engineers and those who major in it for that reason, but they are distinct from premeds

its my senior year yet im looking into switching to econ even at this point, which would only require an extra summer--heh what a light major, plus all the extraneous classes ive taken over the years are now serving some purpose as many electives. im interested in health policy though, i encourage you all to do some looking into it to know about the system in which youll be working
 
I did not get a major in engineering, but I can say that there is a substantial number of people with engineering degrees in my med school class. Most of them do well too.
 
You do have an advantage applying to med school, with an eng degree. ADCOMS aren't stupid; they will give you some leeway on the GPA end, compared to say, humanities majors. As for why I picked eng, well... (I)the $$$... (II) there's no guarantee you'll make it into med school, so I thought, why not have something to fall back on? You can work yourself up the ladder doing buisness, but it takes time, and there's also a risk involved with investment; Donald Trump went bankrupt twice, I believe. It nots a bad idea in the long run to start investing with an MD degree in hand; you have plenty of capital, for one thing.
 
Wow... so all you engineering majors didn't choose it becuase it was the coolest major ever! Saddness. What is the world comng to? Honestly... subjects like physcology, biology, and sociology u can undertsand by just reading books.. but if you want to understand how all the miricles of modern technology work and are not a genius... u need to be TAUGHT engineering... u just can't pick it up by reading or studying it independently like u can with other subjects.
 
fabulous thread topic.

for those of you starting out, here's my take. i have a degree in aerospace engineering. besides being an absolutely horrendous topic of conversation at a bar, it is also a degree i'm not going to use. i agree that you learn invaluable problem solving and thinking skills in engineering school. without a doubt. but you also solve ****loads of equations that you will never remember and probably, if you're not going into engineering, ever even look up again. for me, i can't justify all that time and money spent learning about control systems.

additionally, i think it has taken me the past three years to pay off the sleep debt i acquired in college. honestly, it was exhausting and unfulfilling for me (but i do love a good challenge). but some people really love it. i say only do it if you love it (but i voted don't do it).
 
Shredder said:
in my lone act of selflessness :smuggrin:, i am trying to save you from getting in too deep to the point of no return. the problem isnt that engineering is hard, as medicine too is no piece of cake. its that its needlessly hard, meaning you put yourself into a bad situation without any benefit. now, well into my senior year, i wish i could have taken a major that would have taught me about society and people, like econ, psych, socio, or who knows--any other suggestions? rather, engineering is a trade school that produces people who are ready to jump out into the workforce and make 50k+ right away. you dont learn $hit about anything else except engineering concepts.

im just bummed out that my senior design project is requiring so much commitment. its one thing to put in hard work but its another to put in hard work and get nothing out of it in the long term, which i dont think future docs do (in an engr major). or future anything for that matter, except future engineers. i might gripe some and express regrets in my interviews if the topic is broached, i hope it is received all right as long as i clarify it

caveat: i could do well in engr given enough effort. and i do perform fairly well, just to clear that up so ppl dont think im a dunce. but the question is, why? why bother?

My take (as an M1 and with MSE BS and MS degrees): of course engineering requires some sacrifices, and it is true that you won't learn as much psych, econ, etc. as other pre-meds. Those other pre-meds, however, won't learn anything close to as much as you when it comes to analysis, seeing the big picture, linking concepts, applying/generalizing concepts, etc. In the middle of anatomy, I am suprised by how much I am able to use these skills despite the widely held belief that this class is nothing but pure memorization. These skills should be of even more use on the wards (I've heard attendings say engineers do very well in third and fourth year). Overall, if you have an interest in engineering, I think the benefits outweigh the downers mentioned by shredder...e.g. you can pick up some econ or psych own your own time, but I doubt the reverse is true.
(Caveat: engineering can wreck you GPA a bit, so if you are going to commit suicide if you don't get into Man's Best Medical School, perhaps you should ignore said benefits and pick an easy major).
 
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This is one of the problems Im having (in year 4 of 5 towards a nuclear engineering degree). The engineering material is interesting; however, it dominates all my "free" time. I just dont have the time for volunteering and ECs. Keeping my GPA high seems equal to 2 full time jobs for me.

SeventhSon said:
Everyone should look at me as living proof of what to do.

in hindsight i am starting to have second thoughts about engineering (I'm chemE). Getting good grades in engineering is possible but it comes at the expense of all the other crap med schools want you to do. I do some volunteering but simply don't have time to dedicate myself to campus orgs/other ECs to the extent that it would be worthwhile.

Maybe in my case (MD/PhD) doing engineering is attractive and I milk it for all it's worth, i really did become GREAT at problem solving and I think that's important for medicine, but in all honesty after receiving my first thin letter last week for obvious reasons I think it's clear that you're better off being the run of the mill bio major and getting to do the ECs. Make sure you get your grades first, though.
 
Shredder said:
human, alien, or machine (ghost, monster, etc), everyone has 24 hours in a day. and engr unnecessarily eats up more of those hours than another area of study would. i dont think med schools take into consideration the circumstances engineers face, but this is the subject of perpetual debate. they take it only mildly into consideration at best i believe, while grades and time suffer disproportionately more, meaning its just a poor choice for a premed. all credit to aspiring engineers and those who major in it for that reason, but they are distinct from premeds

its my senior year yet im looking into switching to econ even at this point, which would only require an extra summer--heh what a light major, plus all the extraneous classes ive taken over the years are now serving some purpose as many electives. im interested in health policy though, i encourage you all to do some looking into it to know about the system in which youll be working


Shredder,

At the least, look at this way. Those who do engineering, and do as well as you did in the engineering major, tend to do real well in things like standardized tests, as you did with the MCAT. Or with medical school work and what not, because of the way they are taught. It has some benefits. I'm sure you'll realize that when you are done and in medical school. Give it time, I'm sure you'll get in somewhere. :)
 
Im sorry, but i had to come forth and say something on this toppic. Im a Chemical Engineer and im so glad I went into it. As one person put it, there is no guarantee that you will get into medschool. I have so may friends that graduated with Art, Bio, Psy majors and are now applying for medschool. Many of them have been trying to get in for the past 2 years and for them med school is their only option. As an engineer, I think we have that safety net behind us that will save us if things don’t work out. In reality getting into medschool is really hard, and sometimes you have to face the facts. Furthermore, I think the skills that we learned as an engineer will stay with us forever, no matter what we do in the future. Skills such as problem solving, thinking outside the box and looking at the big picture are things you can’t learn from a book. I had a prof. at university who told me that as an engineer you are here to learn how to learn. I now know what he meant by that. I had never taken a bio course before but in the span of 2 months i think i have mastered the basics.
Anyways that’s my 2 cents on the topic. I think engineering is one of the best majors you can do. If you are really interested in arts, bio, psy, i think you should take some electives on the side.
 
hrmirzae said:
there is no guarantee that you will get into medschool.
theres even less guarantee if you do engr, so why put oneself in that boat. i think one should be a premed without full confidence and expectance to get in, lack of confidence will always lead to poor results and self fulfilling prophecies. nobody said you only get one shot to apply to med school too. hmm i see you addressed that--i guess it depends on how relentless one is about going the med route.

also gujudoc, im a good test taker and wouldve done well either way, as i did on SAT, PSAT and SAT 2s. however my verbal score was low, 10, i feel bc i dont get any exposure to that sort of thing in engr classes. writing too, at O. the bio and phys sections are covered plenty well in premed classes.

IMO engineering trains engineers, more so than any other major trains its students. i dont think it breeds scholars and thinkers, to me it seems most adept at churning out workers. engineers typically make fun of liberal artists, but more and more im gaining newfound respect for that area of study. most great leaders and figures in history were liberal artists at some point, but this is a tentative assertion
 
Yeah, engineering takes up a lot of time, but it is more about concepts and application. Usually, the work is necessary to understand the material.

With a typical liberal arts class there is much memorizing of material that could just be looked up. The classes that focus on writing, evaluating and critiquing the material are better because at least you are being taught to think on your own rather than memorize and this is similar to engineering.

Some people are just better at engineering than liberal arts/science. There are a variety of reasons for this. Some just don't want to put the time in to memorizing things that can be looked up. Others just prefer math. Others are like those described earlier that think liberal arts majors are 'dumb' or otherwise not intelligent.

There are options that require less time than engineering but are still good for those who aren't too keen on liberal arts/science. I would suggest something like Math or Physics which are difficult majors but frequently don't have the time demands of engineering courses.

I like my engineering background and it is a great conversation starter. More importantly, I would still have job opportunities if medicine falls through.

I'm not sure about pulling pre-meds away from engineering, though. If that is what one is interested in then they should, by all means major in engineering. So many of you are young, though, just leaving high school....I would think the best advice is to major in something you find fascinating. With a young person there are options if med school doesn't happen when you're 21 or even 25.

Well, my post was all over the place. Sorry.
 
I was an engineer in college (not planning on going to medical school to start with) and I can say that it was a wonderful decision.

I used to think that I should have learned more humanities, arts, etc. but eventually came to the realization that those are things I can and should be learning on my own. Those classes do not exercise your mind the way a good engineering, philosophy, or science class can. In my opinion, why pay $60,00 for an education that you can get out of a bunch of books and the internet? Plus, do you really think sitting in an anthropology class can teach you that much about humanity? Probably not. That usually comes with experience.

Also, engineering is great to fall back on. Right now, as I am applying to medical school, I am using my engineering degree and it has been very, very helpful.

I guess in the end it all boils down to what you are really interested in. Be warned though, if you want to learn about "life, the universe, and everything" a few humanities classes are not necessarily going to get you there.
 
hoberto said:
I like my engineering background and it is a great conversation starter
how so? you cant exactly pick up chicks by dropping lines about the latest feats of engineering. and, you cant dazzle crowds at more sophisticated events by engaging in discourse about the same. ppl discuss politics, economics, law, ethics and philosophy. nerds might discuss science. ppl dont really converse about engineering, its only good for getting jobs done.

and philosophy is a liberal arts major. i still dont see any merit to majoring in engr unless you plan on working as an engr. the backup notion is weak bc engr reduces ones chances of getting into med school since its needlessly difficult and lowers the gpa. med schools like liberal artists too.

as for young ppl majoring in what they find fascinating--if youre serious about medicine, i would think thats what you find truly fascinating. and thats not a college major. so i think you should major in whatever makes you a better doc or helps your chances of pursuing medicine. and engr doesnt really fit that bill. sorry im in a rush gtg
 
Off2Oz said:
lol.. yeah, I've always wondered if med would be as tough as everyone says it is. As an engineering student, I routinely pull days and days without sleep, and many times had to drop certain assignments in order to have enough time to finish others.

Hopefully it *is* as tough as eng was - I kinda miss the lifestyle. Being hardcore is cool. hah.. :D

Med school is definitley not as hard as engineering was. You do have to study a lot, but the material isn't hard to understand. Unlike you, I don't miss the hardcore lifestyle and the weekly all-nighters :p
 
I am happy that I chose chemical engineering as my major....i believe whatever one chooses, just be sure to put in the best effort and then wait for the results...I know I havent gotten into medical school becoz I am applying this cycle but I dont regret doing engineering....
 
Shredder said:
how so? you cant exactly pick up chicks by dropping lines about the latest feats of engineering.

Well, I'm a woman and when people find out I'm an engineer they either want to talk or get away fast. Those that are interested usually want to know what is engineering or what the classes are/were like and I like explaining.

Of course this doesn't lead to all night talks about he benefits of MATLAB over Maple or great engineering news but it does quickly eliminate those who can only talk about the latest pop stars and TV shows. It helps pick the nerds out of the crowd, too. We nerds have to stick together.
 
Shredder said:
in my lone act of selflessness :smuggrin:, i am trying to save you from getting in too deep to the point of no return. the problem isnt that engineering is hard, as medicine too is no piece of cake. its that its needlessly hard, meaning you put yourself into a bad situation without any benefit. now, well into my senior year, i wish i could have taken a major that would have taught me about society and people, like econ, psych, socio, or who knows--any other suggestions? rather, engineering is a trade school that produces people who are ready to jump out into the workforce and make 50k+ right away. you dont learn $hit about anything else except engineering concepts.

im just bummed out that my senior design project is requiring so much commitment. its one thing to put in hard work but its another to put in hard work and get nothing out of it in the long term, which i dont think future docs do (in an engr major). or future anything for that matter, except future engineers. i might gripe some and express regrets in my interviews if the topic is broached, i hope it is received all right as long as i clarify it

caveat: i could do well in engr given enough effort. and i do perform fairly well, just to clear that up so ppl dont think im a dunce. but the question is, why? why bother?

.<
 
Shredder said:
theres even less guarantee if you do engr, so why put oneself in that boat. i think one should be a premed without full confidence and expectance to get in, lack of confidence will always lead to poor results and self fulfilling prophecies. nobody said you only get one shot to apply to med school too. hmm i see you addressed that--i guess it depends on how relentless one is about going the med route.

also gujudoc, im a good test taker and wouldve done well either way, as i did on SAT, PSAT and SAT 2s. however my verbal score was low, 10, i feel bc i dont get any exposure to that sort of thing in engr classes. writing too, at O. the bio and phys sections are covered plenty well in premed classes.

IMO engineering trains engineers, more so than any other major trains its students. i dont think it breeds scholars and thinkers, to me it seems most adept at churning out workers. engineers typically make fun of liberal artists, but more and more im gaining newfound respect for that area of study. most great leaders and figures in history were liberal artists at some point, but this is a tentative assertion


The above bolded makes a real good point. My dad is an engineer, and you just described him to the tee. My brother is also an engineer, but he's one of those cases that have also read up a lot on things like philosophy, arts, mythology, etc. etc. so he's got a solid foundation in both.

I guess at the end of the day: Do whatever major you feel comfortable with is the key to success.
 
just curious, what specific fields of engineering is everyone majoring in? i think most engineering pre-meds major in biological/biomedical eng. i suppose there are probably a few chemE's as well. i am actually a computer engineering major and i know of only one other person who is doing the same; any other computer engineering pre-meds out there?
 
Honestly, to me, engineering simply wasn't worth it. Sure, you learn great problem solving skills, and its nice to fall back on, but it dominates so much time it's not worth it, especially if your engineering program is hardcore. Most engineer friends I know switched to business, and they're enjoying it more because they're landing jobs with higher pay and more benefits, while having a great social life and ample free time at college. From my experience, the physical science majors, like chem and physics majors, seem to be better in learning concepts and theory and applying them, while engineers seem to be more proficient if they have to solve equations. In my P-Chem class, my prof. focuses on the concepts, so all the engineers do really bad. :eek:

Like the others said, if you like engineering, go for it. However, be prepared to undergo the sacrifices that come with engineering. The work load almost feels like med school.
 
medisin said:
just curious, what specific fields of engineering is everyone majoring in? i think most engineering pre-meds major in biological/biomedical eng. i suppose there are probably a few chemE's as well. i am actually a computer engineering major and i know of only one other person who is doing the same; any other computer engineering pre-meds out there?

Computers here too...
 
If your goal is to just get a high GPA to get into med school, then you probably don't want to major in engineering. If you enjoy engineering, then, by all means, you should study it.

I totally disagree that there is little benefit to majoring in engineering if you want to pursue medicine. I was a BME major and much of the material we covered in our physiological foundations course is similar to that taught at my university's med school. The same BME professors teach the med students too.

BME isn't the only applicable field, either. Drug delivery and tissue engineering are fast-growing fields in ChemE and Materials Science. Developing medical instrumentation and modeling biological systems use a lot of EE and Computer Science.

To the poster who could not justify learning control systems, some of the latest vestibulocular research uses control systems to study how the eye remains steady despite external disturbances, and this research is being used to study diseases in otolaryngology.

So engineering has a big role in medicine today, though studying it seems to favor those who want to go into academic medicine or specialized fields.

Sorry for the long post, but I'm a firm believer that no knowledge is really wasted, and just wanted to give my input.
 
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