All science classes expire in 7 years??

[coquito]

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Please help if you know anything about this! I graduated in 2005 with a major in zoology and tons of upper level science courses. Since then, I did an M.A. in Latin American Studies, worked at an international health nonprofit, and I have been teaching biology and chemistry at an urban high school for 4 years. I just contacted Duke about their 7 year limitation on science coursework, and they told me that the limitation is for ALL AAMC SCHOOLS! See below:

You may have to consider a post-bac program but 7 years away from the sciences and no upper level science (Biochemistry, Molecular Biology, Cell Biology, etc.) would limit your chances of being considered.

FYI, this is not a "Duke" policy but rather a blanket policy that applies to all medical school that are members of the American Association of Medical Colleges (AAMC).

Hope this helps.



Duke University School of Medicine
Office of Admissions

Yes, I plan on calling each school, but what have you heard? I called UCSF last year about this, and they said I was fine. I figured it was just a Duke thing. Have you heard that all science coursework expires in 7 years?? I was about to submit AMCAS this week, and now I am quite distraught.

Thank you for replying!!!

 

[CuttingCorneas]

As long as you did well on the MCAT, I don't see why it would matter. Submit AMCAS as planned, and tell Duke they can suck it. Don't waste your money on them.

 

[phltz]

Please help if you know anything about this! I graduated in 2005 with a major in zoology and tons of upper level science courses. Since then, I did an M.A. in Latin American Studies, worked at an international health nonprofit, and I have been teaching biology and chemistry at an urban high school for 4 years. I just contacted Duke about their 7 year limitation on science coursework, and they told me that the limitation is for ALL AAMC SCHOOLS!

Yes, I plan on calling each school, but what have you heard? I called UCSF last year about this, and they said I was fine. I figured it was just a Duke thing. Have you heard that all science coursework expires in 7 years?? I was about to submit AMCAS this week, and now I am quite distraught.

It's certainly not the case that all science courses expire in 7 years. I graduated with a degree in physics, did a bunch of other stuff, decided I wanted to do med school, did a post-bacc, and then applied to med school. All of my physics classes were more than 7 years old, although I had worked as a physics teacher more recently. No school ever so much as suggested that my physics coursework was expired.

Now, if you don't have any science classes in the past 7 years at all, some adcoms may wonder if you've still got the science chops you'll need to succeed, or if it's all gotten rusty. Is your MCAT recent? How'd you do on that? Hopefully this will help make the case that you still know your ass from a hole in the ground, scientifically speaking.

Best of luck.

 

[coquito]

Got my MCAT yesterday. 12 on BS. 10 on PS (was expecting a 12 based on AAMC practices, but the calculations-heavy April 28th MCAT killed me, also both of my grandfathers died of cancer 3 weeks before so studying went a bit off at the end).

I am currently a biology and chemistry teacher at a public high school, credentialed in the state of California. My only BCPM courses in the past 7 years were two ecology courses in grad school (MA Latin American Studies, not science!), and a statistics course I took this semester since I never took statistics (got 100% and strong LOR from the stats professor about my current academic skills).

So, no recent science classes, but I teach biology and chemistry so I am not exactly out of science practice (except for physics, perhaps, hence the low PS score).

I did call 5 other schools, all of whom said that there was no definitive cut-off if my MCAT is good. I told them about the Duke email, and they didn't know what that was about. My MCAT was nearly 4 points lower than I expected (AAMC average of 36.5 with upward trend and 33 on actual) but decent.

cGPA with undergrad (2005), M.A. (2008), and teacher credential grad school (2010) = 3.88

Thoughts? Thanks!

 

[ccrone]

Please help if you know anything about this! I graduated in 2005 with a major in zoology and tons of upper level science courses. Since then, I did an M.A. in Latin American Studies, worked at an international health nonprofit, and I have been teaching biology and chemistry at an urban high school for 4 years. I just contacted Duke about their 7 year limitation on science coursework, and they told me that the limitation is for ALL AAMC SCHOOLS! See below:

You may have to consider a post-bac program but 7 years away from the sciences and no upper level science (Biochemistry, Molecular Biology, Cell Biology, etc.) would limit your chances of being considered.

FYI, this is not a "Duke" policy but rather a blanket policy that applies to all medical school that are members of the American Association of Medical Colleges (AAMC).

Hope this helps.



Duke University School of Medicine
Office of Admissions

Yes, I plan on calling each school, but what have you heard? I called UCSF last year about this, and they said I was fine. I figured it was just a Duke thing. Have you heard that all science coursework expires in 7 years?? I was about to submit AMCAS this week, and now I am quite distraught.

Thank you for replying!!!

Little friendly advice...

Are you a human being (as opposed to a robot)? Do you have reasonable social skills, compassion for those less fortunate than you, and a healthy understanding of the fact that you're not perfect?

If so, do yourself a favor and don't go to Duke. I live as close to Duke medical center as you can (without living on it), and *I* wouldn't go to school there. The medical care I get there is world class, and I'll gladly see their doctors. But I don't want to go to school there. Life is too short to put yourself through that. You know it's bad when the students and the residents tell you that it's a horrible place that will eat you alive, and to stay away if you value your life, health, and sanity. 😉

It's a sign. They're showing their true colors. I'm telling you: take the hint and just go somewhere else.

 

[coquito]

Thanks for the advice, all!

@ccrone: Good to know your perspective! I was really interested in their third year option to do maybe some sort of global health research abroad, but I definitely will not be prioritizing them if they're the only ones expecting me to take years worth of science classes over again!

And scoring two points lower on the actual MCAT than my lowest AAMC test sure reminded me I'm not perfect 🙁 And also I'm not a robot 🙂 So Duke might be off the list.

Just hope that they really are wrong about the 7-year expiration blanket policy!! Hope that's just a Duke thing, despite their scary email.

 

[fizzgig]

my oldest prereqs were starting from 10 years ago when i applied. but i am doing a grad science degree so maybe that changes things. duke still interviewed me fwiw (though i didn't get in), and i just can't see them bothering to do that if they stick to a hardline 7 year policy.

 

[Law2Doc]

First, this question has been asked and answered multiple times in the nontrad board over the years. It's more of a nontrad than preallo issue. At one point one nontrad poster had contacted numerous schools to try and learn the consensus. Only a couple of school, like Duke, had explicit rules. Most schools however, had vague expectations of "recent success" in the sciences. When I talked to a former adcom member years ago for advice, he strongly recommended retaking things older than 7ish years. Or at least take some upper levels.

 

[CopaceticOne]

First, this question has been asked and answered multiple times in the nontrad board over the years. It's more of a nontrad than preallo issue. At one point one nontrad poster had contacted numerous schools to try and learn the consensus. Only a couple of school, like Duke, had explicit rules. Most schools however, had vague expectations of "recent success" in the sciences. When I talked to a former adcom member years ago for advice, he strongly recommended retaking things older than 7ish years. Or at least take some upper levels.

100% this.

 

[SnowyRox]

Staying up to date in science by teaching it isn't the same as having sharp science study skills by taking recent classes. Can you fit in some summer classes with your current schedule? For the sake of my own sanity, I would prefer to take different upper level classes instead of retaking old classes I did well in the first time. Summer classes are fast-paced and keeping up with some tricky ones could help you prove yourself to the adcom (obviously don't overwhelm yourself).

 

[ccrone]

Thanks for the advice, all!

@ccrone: Good to know your perspective! I was really interested in their third year option to do maybe some sort of global health research abroad, but I definitely will not be prioritizing them if they're the only ones expecting me to take years worth of science classes over again!

And scoring two points lower on the actual MCAT than my lowest AAMC test sure reminded me I'm not perfect 🙁 And also I'm not a robot 🙂 So Duke might be off the list.

Just hope that they really are wrong about the 7-year expiration blanket policy!! Hope that's just a Duke thing, despite their scary email.

Keep in mind that's just my opinion. I live here, and understand a lot about the culture at Duke. As a general rule, those of us who live right around the Duke campus have sort of a love-hate relationship with the university (which I suppose is to be expected).

All of that is to say, don't take my word for it. If you really like Duke, come check out the area. Look around (or post) on SDN for the scoop on what other students and doctors say. I'm sure there are at least as many people that think Duke is a fantastic education, love the environment, and are happy as clams. 😉

 

[Slev]

Only a few schools have hard cutoffs for age of prereqs. Even Duke who claims to be hard on the 7 year expiration accepted my physics that was 12 years old (was offered an interview there).

One of the Philly schools I called claimed to have a 4 year expiration. I LOLd and didn't apply there. I guess they don't expect anyone to take prereqs freshman year and then take a gap year.

Sent from my HTC Glacier using Tapatalk 2

 

[coquito]

@Law2doc
I searched the forums and knew what people had asked before. I started a new thread to specifically address Duke's email about an all-AAMC blanket policy. If they had not made that comment, I would have stuck with the answers I got from reading other threads. Also, sorry if I am in the wrong forum; I am new to posting in online forums. 😳

I know it's not "upper level" and not even science, but does an A+ in my stats class (2012) and a strong LOR from it, along with a LOR from my mentor (and ecology professor) from grad school ("top 10" university) in 2008 mitigate the concern that I am rusty academically in sciences?

Thank you for your honest opinions. I still don't know if I can justify spending thousands of dollars and taking time away from the extra stuff I do as a science teacher and mentor in order to prove I currently have the study skills to get an A in epidemiology or physical chemistry.

 

[Elevencents]

It doesn't appear as if they truly expire after 7 years, they are stating it as more of a suggestion along the lines of "schools will want to see some more recent success with the sciences in order for you to have a strong foundation for the rigors of medical school". At least thats what I took away from it. Nowhere does it state that is a rule written in stone. From that perspective I can see the logic.